Bush Using Drugs to Control Depression, Erratic Behavior

[seemslikeadream]

By TERESA HAMPTON
Editor, Capitol Hill Blue
Jul 28, 2004, 08:09


President George W. Bush is taking powerful anti-depressant drugs to control his erratic behavior, depression and paranoia, Capitol Hill Blue has learned.

The prescription drugs, administered by Col. Richard J. Tubb, the White House physician, can impair the President’s mental faculties and decrease both his physical capabilities and his ability to respond to a crisis, administration aides admit privately.

“It’s a double-edged sword,” says one aide. “We can’t have him flying off the handle at the slightest provocation but we also need a President who is alert mentally.”


Angry Bush walked away from reporter's questions.
Tubb prescribed the anti-depressants after a clearly-upset Bush stormed off stage on July 8, refusing to answer reporters' questions about his relationship with indicted Enron executive Kenneth J. Lay.

more
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4921.shtml

[truthspeaker]

1. Wouldn't suprise me at all if it's true

But this is Capitol Hill Blue's second story on this that no one has picked up. Which suggests to me that the White House is doing a very good job of keeping it secret.

[Fovea]

7. Man, I wish this were front page on the times

But this is Amerika we're talkin about.

[seemslikeadream]

9. Did you happen to see this? 300 posts

Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=602189

over 300 posts I believe




Although GOP loyalists dismissed the reports an anti-Bush propaganda, the reports were later confirmed by prominent George Washington University psychiatrist Dr. Justin Frank in his book Bush on the Couch: Inside the Mind of the President. Dr. Frank diagnosed the President as a “paranoid meglomaniac” and “untreated alcoholic” whose “lifelong streak of sadism, ranging from childhood pranks (using firecrackers to explode frogs) to insulting journalists, gloating over state executions and pumping his hand gleefully before the bombing of Baghdad” showcase Bush’s instabilities.
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4921.shtml

[fearnobush]

26. Just kicked it to all the media whores, may be one or two will bite.

This is a must kick story.

[Ganja Ninja]

2. If he's really taking this shit the public has a right to know.

This really is scary stuff.

[seemslikeadream]

149. He is really scary drugs or no drugs!

[phillybri]

3. Is this true???

Because if it is, man, the shit is gonna hit the fan!!!

[liberalmuse]

4. In many of his pictures...

he looks like he's three sheets to the wind. We can only hope they're drugging him to the gills.

[seemslikeadream]

150. It looks like some of his friends are a bit concerned

[Hoping4Change]

191. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLO

Way tooo funnnnyy

[SheepyMcSheepster]

5. interesting.....

“Keep those motherfuckers away from me,” he screamed at an aide backstage. “If you can’t, I’ll find someone who can.”

how reliable is capital hill blue?

[hermetic]

11. Interesting indeed,

but how reliable is your quote?

[HuckleB]

15. The quote is from the piece in question.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

52. it is from the article posted.

[HuckleB]

12. I don't know, but I don't trust this piece.

It feels and acts like tabloid trash from the word go. I wish people at DU would be more suspicious of such tripe. Nevermind how poor the author's knowledge of mental illness appears to be.

[Dhalgren]

88. The mental illness quotations

come from Dr. Frank's book. From everything I've heard and read about the doctor and his book they are both top drawer. This article names names and gives attributed quotations (even the unnamed aides and anonymous sources), if this isn't true, why is there no legal action pending? This is the kind of story that Rove and his ilk put out all of the time about Caligula's enemies and there is usually an immediate response - either a denial or a return attack. But with this story (and Frank's book) there has been no response at all. This, to me, lends credence to both.

[HuckleB]

142. Either those quotes were used out of context, or ...

Dr. Frank and his book are anything but "top drawer."

[yardwork]

207. I agree

For one thing, it's considered unprofessional to diagnose from a distance, without having examined the patient. Second, if he had examined the patient, the results would be confidential. Either way, the doc's got no business selling a book where he claims to have diagnosed the president.

The other problem is that his diagnosis sounds exaggerated and unscientific. Being an "untreated alcoholic" doesn't guarantee any particular behavior. It depends on a lot of other issues affecting each specific patient, which this doctor has no basis for knowing.

Finally, most antidepressents don't cause the odd behavior we've seen lately in Bush. If they did there wouldn't be millions of Americans taking them!

I think there is a germ of truth in this article, which is, I suspect, that shrub is taking some heavy prescription meds and maybe some recreational stuff as well.

[Doug Decker]

213. Don't legal trials have doctors give an opinion...

based on the doctor's review of documents pertaining to the case, without actually talking to the patient?

I am not doubting your post, what you say sounds reasonable and I have no reason to question it. Please don't take this as a criticism.

If you know, am I wrong about the legal use of doctor testimony?

Thanks.

[HuckleB]

224. No.

The psychiatrist does a full evaluation with the patient in psychiatric issues related to court.

[squidbro]

256. There is more than meets the eys

I am not meaning to diss psychiatrists, but psychiatry is a very inexact science. Two different psychiatrists examining the same patient can come up with two different diagnoses. I see it all the time.

Besides, there are clinical features to any illness that are specific and lead to a diagnosis.

One does not need to interview a person to make a diagnosis of likely Graves' disease. A simple observation is usually enough.

It is not uncommon for professionals to render an opinion based on distant observations either. The key is how the terminology is phrased.

Admittedly, the author of the article could have phrased it better. But the lay press is unaccustomed to medical terminology and the inherent uncertainties involved. It is likely that the psychiatrist said that such behavior is consistent with that of an alcoholic. Saying that something is consistent with, is not making a diagnosis, though the author may have thought that it was and reflected such accordingly in the article.

Regardless of the observations and quotes made in the article, bush is more than a little mentally unstable. The authorization of the abuses at Abu Ghraib, the total denial of the realities of the situation of the ground war in Iraq, the belief that he acts for "God" speaks of a delusional man.

In fact, it would be better if bush's mental instabilities result from the influence of drugs and alcohol. If he manifests such behavior while completely sober, he might have bigger problems than are immediately visible.

Whatever the case, he absolutely needs to be voted out.

[jamesinca]

259. I read the book by Dr. Frank " Bush on the Couch"

He starts the book off by letting the reader know that he has never had Bush in his office. He makes it clear that he is doing it from a distance based on biographies and autobiographies, televised interviews and press conferences, statements from people around Bush and facts that are known about him. "President Bush is not my patient, of course" (pg xiii)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
The opening two paragraphs of the book state it too.

"If one of my patients frequently said one thing and did another, I would want to know why. If I found that he often used words that hid their true meaning and affected a persona that obscured the nature of his actions, I would grow more concerned. If he presented an inflexible worldview characterized by an oversimplified distinction between right and wrong, good and evil, allies and enemies, I would question his ability to grasp reality. And if his actions revealed an unacknowledged - even sadistic - indifference to human suffering, wrapped in pious claims of compassion, I would worry about the safety of the people whose lives he touched.

For the past three years, I have observed with increasing alarm the inconsistencies and denials of such an individual. But he is not one of my patients. He is the president."

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I am not defending the ethics or motives of the book, but I will say he is up front from the beginning in letting the reader know that Bush is not a patient of his.

He states in the introduction that he is basing his analysis on the model set forth by Melanie Klein, the child psychoanalyst.

He also states that for years the CIA has been doing psychological profiles of other world leaders to help guide the U.S. governments approach to these people. In that same spirit and non-consented distant analysis he is doing this to George Bush.

Your comment about the alcoholism he addresses in the book in chapter 3 "Message in the bottle". He states clearly that Bush may have put a cork in the bottle and took care of the "alcohol" part, but there has not been anything that shows he dealt with the "ism" part. These will be hard to know simply because of the secretive nature of the Bush family. As he said in the introduction of the book, this is being based on interviews, press conferences, speeches, biographies and autobiographies that have been written him and the rest of the Bush family.

Be it tripe or dead on accurate, it is a fun read.

[NashVegas]

189. This is Shoddy Reporting

What stands out like a sore thumb is there the article contains no quoted source for the allegation, not even an anonymous source.

[drdtroit]

238. No, no, wait, it's a developing story, like Drudge!

[fearnobush]

6. Bush... a dry drunk - no kidding.

“President Bush is an untreated alcoholic with paranoid and megalomaniac tendencies,” Dr. Frank adds.

The White House did not return phone calls seeking comment on this article.

[saigon68]

126. paranoid and megalomaniac tendencies

FOR A CHIMPANZEE ---that's dangerous

[jdj]

198. or a wet drunk, and this is just the cover story.

edit: why would they admit this if it was true?

the only reason to say this publicly is that it is a big fat lie.

he's a maintenance drinker, well on the way to wet-brainhood.

[skypilot]

8. You know, somehow I actually...

...feel a little sorry for the poor sonofabitch.

[pagerbear]

33. Quite reasonable

Poor fella--totally out of his element, totally impotent, just a mouthpiece for an evil regime....

[jdj]

199. those are the sentiments it evokes, and that's why I don't believe it.

these people are master at planning feelings for the public.

Sorry, no bite.

Can you say wet brain, boys and girls?

I bet the only drug he is taking is antabuse.

[jdj]

200. They knew you would.

The truth, I'm sure, is actually much worse.

But this is the expertly crafted spin.

And if they are ADMITTING that the pres. is taking mood-altering drugs, then for all we know he could be a full-blown schizophrenic, or having cocaine pschosis every other day now.

On a re-run of "MadTV" yesterday, the one of the 'Reality Check' women said in one of her quips that "George Bush has snorted so much coke that when he farts snow blows out of his ass."

[yardwork]

208. I feel sorry for him until I remember the children in Abu Ghraib

and the thousand American troops who lost their lives, and thousands maimed, and the tens of thousands of dead Iraqis.....

and then I don't feel sorry for shrub anymore.

[drdtroit]

239. And don't forget all of the Americans

that he executed and ridiculed.

[David__77]

10. Whether true or not, it could become a story if properly promoted.

Does anyone remember how Lyndon LaRouche followers spread stories about Michael Dukakis in 1988--that he had a serious psychiatric condition?

Remember how Reagan, asked about it (by a LaRouchie reporter I think), commented "I don't want to pick on an invalid!" I needn't elaborate the irony of his comment.

The point is that this became a "story" when echoed properly. We need "echoers" to take such action when appropriate. Attack dogs, if you will.

"Is President Bush emotionally and mentally stable?"
"...allegations that President Bush is being prescribed powerful psychiatric medications..."

[Lefta Dissenter]

22. I don't want to sink to their level

If it's true, I hope with all my heart that it comes out as a legitimate news story. But to roll around in the gutter with KKKarl Rove by pushing stories of which we doubt the veracity - I just don't think that's what our country and our party are all about.

...not that I wouldn't be tempted - I'm not pure as gold, after all...

[DulceDecorum]

35. You doubt the veracity?

Heck,
just about everyone accepts that the boy is touched.

But you might just have a point.
He might just be working on the insanity defense
for when he gets hauled off in front of the International Court.

[reprobate]

73. Depression is NOT insanity. Not a defense.

[merh]

146. Criminal insanity as a defense is to not be able to comprehend

the difference between right and wrong at the time the offense was committed.

As his acts are continuous and as he knows they are wrong, the defense would never be available to him!

[David__77]

40. Luckily, you don't have to...

...there are others willing to take your place in the gutter. They fight, so that we might obtain victory. (I say this with a grain of sarcasm, but only a grain...)

[Dhalgren]

93. You are right!

If you want to kick a gutter-snipe's ass, then you got to go to the gutter to do it! I want these bastards gone and if getting dirty is the way to do it, then take off your shoes and roll-up you pant-legs, because this ain't no church social!

[seemslikeadream]

100. BUSH'S PLAN FOR PEACE IS THE PEACE OF THE COMMON GRAVE

EVERY DEATH CREATES NEW ENEMIES
MORE TERRORISTS
MORE DANGER
MORE DEATH
AND REMEMBER...

HE IS JUST GETTING STARTED...

BUSH'S PLAN FOR PEACE
IS THE PEACE OF THE COMMON GRAVE

http://www.bushflash.com/pax.html WATCH THIS VIDEO only takes 3 minutes

Wumpscut
Totmacher

sie ahnten nichts von mir
von meiner wilden gier
doch als du kamst zu mir
da wurde ich ein tier
kein gedanke an danach
als ich dir die knochen brach

tot tot tot ich mache dich tot
tot tot tot von blut alles rot

tot

fuer mein naechstes leben
schoepfe ich neue kraft
ich bin dem toeten ergeben
in der einzelhaft

tot tot tot ich mache dich tot
tot tot tot von blut alles rot
tot tot tot ich mache dich tot
tot tot tot von blut alles rot

ein dahinsichen
von gottes hand
ich kann dich riechen
und das denken verschwand

tot tot tot tot tot tot tot ich mache dich tot
tot tot tot von blut alles rot tot tot tot tot

ich mache dich tot ich mache dich tot
ich mache dich tot ich mache dich tot

sag mir was du willst
dass du meine sehnsucht stillst
ich mache dich tot fuer immerdar
von blut alles rot auf gottes altar

tot tot tot ich mache dich tot
tot tot tot von blut alles rot

ich mache dich tot fuer immerdar
ich mache dich tot glaub mir es ist wahr
ich mache dich tot fuer immerdar
ich mache dich tot auf gottes altar


TRANSLATION

Wumpscut - Deadmaker

They didn't expect me
never expected my wild lust
I turned into an animal
No thought about afterwards
When I broke your bones

Dead, dead, dead I make you dead
Dead, dead, dead stained from blood so red

Dead

For my next life (life after death in the religious sense)
I get the power I need
I’m a slave to the killing
In solitary confinement

("einzelhaft" (solitary confinment) has become part of the german vocabulary after the terrorist attacks of the Red Army Fraction during the 70's. It's used for people in prison, who are put into complete isolation not just from other people, but from all kinds of information. It's what might be known in the US as "sensual deprivation", a kind of torture-technique to destroy people's self.)

Dead, dead, dead I make you dead
Dead, dead, dead stained from blood so red
Dead, dead, dead I make you dead
Dead, dead, dead stained from blood so red

Wasting away
By God’s hand
I can smell you
And my thought disappeared

Dead, dead, dead I make you dead
Dead, dead, dead stained from blood so red
Dead, dead, dead, dead

I make you dead I make you dead
I make you dead I make you dead

Tell me what you want
That you fill my longing (that you satisfy my desire)
I make you dead for evermore
God’s altar stained from blood so red

Dead, dead, dead I make you dead
Dead, dead, dead stained from blood so red

I make you dead for evermore
I make you dead believe me its true
I make you dead for evermore
I make you dead on God’s altar

http://www.bushflash.com/animation.html

[calimary]

190. Well...can't really argue with this point.

Besides, unfortunately we've seen all too frequently how decisively we win when we all take the high road. They never do. They fight dirty. And they keep winning.

If we're going to change the agenda, and the overall tone, it MIGHT help to win, first. Then, when WE have the power and control the game board and hopefully most if not all of the game pieces, THEN we can push for more civility.

But FIRST, we've gotta WIN. And I'm not above rolling up MY pants legs a little...

[Edmond Dantes]

212. I totally agree. (Reporting live from the mudpit.)

[colonel odis]

13. impair his mental faculties? what mental faculties?

and i suspect the powerful drugs he's taking are about 140 proof.

on a serious note, i feel like this article casts anti-depressants in an unfair light. they help those of us who have to take them keep plugging through the day without missing out on good parts of our lives.

bush, the dry drunk/asswipe/frat boy/nut job is more likely in need of anti-psychotic drugs. big difference.

[wrate]

41. The point is:

"The doctors also worry about the wisdom of giving powerful anti-depressant drugs to a person with a history of chemical dependency." This fact cannot be argued.

[Nancy Waterman]

58. Actually, it can be argued

Antidepressants are not addictive and can be given to people with a history of substance abuse with no adverse implications. In fact, they are often the treatment of choice. They are not drugs that can be abused. They also are not likely to cause mental impairment. The phrase "powerful antidepressant medications" seems a bit hyped to me, taking away from the credibility of the article.

But it is not clear from the article what drugs have been diagnosed. It mentions powerful mood swings which could imply that he is being given mood stabilizers, also not addicitive or easily abused, but potentially can be very sedating.

If he is being given tranquilizers, which he sure looked like during at least one press conferecne, then we have a real issue. These feed right into the substance abuse issue, can be abused, and can easily cloud thinking and dull reflexes.

[Dhalgren]

103. A friend of mine went through a series of

anti-depressants before she arrived at the medication that could help her most. But while she was taking some of these meds she would damn near hallucinate, seeing things that weren't there. She would become giddy and then sad in alternation. She would get very "shaky" and her eqilibrium would be "off". I'm not sure how these drugs would be catagorized, but from my friends experience, they can be very "powerful" and debilitating.

[smirkymonkey]

110. Thank you!

I am amazed at the persistence of the notion that anti-depressants are severely mind altering and addictive.

The general public is grossly misinformed on this topic. Thanks for addressing the subject realistically.

[Eloriel]

134. I dunno. Seems to me there's something to the "misinformation"

as you call it. At the very least, I wouldn't make a blanket statement about the NON-addictiveness (implying for everyone) of anti-depressants:

Google
http://www.google.com/search?q=antidepressant%20addiction

Some of the links from that google page:

Withdrawal from paroxetine can be severe, warns FDA
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/withdrawal-from-paxil-severe-warns-FDA.htm

World health watchdog warns of addiction risk for Prozac users
But the reputation of SSRIs as wonder drugs is being questioned. Research by Dr David Healy, at the University of Wales, appeared to show that two people in a trial group of 20 became violent after taking an SSRI.
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/Independent.htm
(And let's not forget, a very large percentage of the school shootings by school aged kids were kids who had been on Prozac)


Hard habit to break
Whether 'really needing' a drug constitutes a physical or psychological dependency, and whether experiencing withdrawal symptoms when that drug is not taken constitutes a true physical dependency is at the heart of a growing debate around the group of antidepressant drugs called Selective Seratonin Reuptake Inhibitors (SSRIs ) of which paroxetine is one.
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/Hard-habit-to-break.htm


AntiDepressant Facts
(several linked articles)
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/addiction-withdrawal.htm

Edited to add: I have a VERY strong anti-drug, anti-pharmaceutical bias. I prefer natural and alternative therapies where possible and drugs (which ALL have side effects) only as a last resort. Where depression is concerned, it often indicates unresolved spiritual and/or emotional wounds from the past and therefore for these cases therapy, not drugs (or drugs only as a temporary tool), is the suprior treatment. Drugs merely mask or suppress the problems. I do realize that there are legitimate physiological bases for some depressions, but even there I believe the physical causes should be sought out and corrected, where possible, instead of applying artificial fixes. I also realize not everyone sees it this way. :D

[TexasBushwhacker]

177. I don't see it this way!!!

You're free to have your opinion of course and I also encourage continued research into the CAUSE of these chemical imbalances in the brain that cause depression and other illnesses in the first place. However, people could die in the meantime. In most cases, the use of anti-depressants helps the person enough that they are much more successful in therapy. The problem is that most people, if they have health insurance at all, it doesn't cover outpatient therapy. If it does, there is a high deductible and or/a high co-pay. My insurance, for example, will only pay 50% for out-patient therapy and that's only after paying the first $2000 up front. They will pay for anti-depressant medication month, after month, after month.

[Occulus]

217. I guess it's far easier

to treat the symptoms than to find a cure?

What. A. Shock.

[TexasBushwhacker]

218. Cheaper for the short term

but keeps people sick for the long term, which makes the drug companies happy. Heaven forbid we should actually cure anyone of anything. Doctors, insurance companies and drug companies would prefer that we all have chronic diseases. That's what keeps all of them in business.

[Kelvin Mace]

188. They are not addictive

but God help you if you stop taking them cold turkey, your body will rebel and make its displeasure known.

[DaveFL99]

171. Strong enough to make you fall off a bicyle

or even a Segway ?

[sendero]

192. I'll have to reluctantly..

.... disagree with you. If you are talking about SSRIs, then I agree, But there are many other types of antidepressant drugs. And many of them have serious addictive potential, and other side effects as well.

And they are still prescribed.

[squidbro]

257. The terminology is too vague

Agreed.

I suspect that the term "antidepressants" is being used quite loosely.

It is unclear whether this might mean that the President is on an agent such as Zyprexa, an SSRI or even on a benzodiazepine.

It doesn't really matter in any case. We would be dealing with a mentally unstable leader or a leader under the influence.

If the word "antianxiety" agent were to have been used, I would be far more suspicious that the Pres. was being given a benzodiazepine. However, the Pres. could indeed be on a combination of agents such as an SSRI and a benzo. Then it could be accurately said that the President is indeed on an antidepressant which is true, but nevertheless, still deceitful.

[TrogL]

78. Really? You try functioning on Paxil

It probably is very good at preventing suicide. Your thinking is so messed up you couldn't put together a suicide strategy if your life depended on it (pun intended).

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

108. I take Paxil.

Do I exhibit those tendancies and symptoms?

[RedSock]

129. i've been on paxil for more than 7 years

paxil or prozac -- i have switched back and forth a couple of times.

i'm pretty together -- also was able to finish writing a book.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

120. Or a mixture of three anti-depressants

which is what it takes for me to avoid plunging into the Abyss of severe depression, an experience I would not wish anybody -- not even * -- to have. If I didn't have to I wouldn't drive. Everything seems dream-like. There's no way I would trust my abilities to make good decisions at this time. If * is on anti-depressants, I think we ought to know.

As it is, it scares the hell out of me to think of an unrecovering dry drunk having his finger on the largest nuclear arsenal in the history of the world. Especially one who believes he has been chosen to eliminate evil from the world, and that "God speaks through me."

[Liberal Veteran]

167. Paxil is an SSRI and doesn't really impair you at all.

I have been taking it for over 2 years and have a near perfect GPA.

[yardwork]

211. Millions of people take Paxil with no side effects

Everybody reacts differently, which is why everybody needs a competent psychiatrist to prescribe and monitor their meds.

If W is reacting like this from a prescribed SSRI like Paxil and he's still prescribed after a few days, he needs a new doc.

[quispquake]

14. Reminds me of the Star Trek "Nazi" episode...

Where they kept the "Fuhrer" completely drugged up so that his psycho first in command could be really running things...

I mean, this REALLY REMINDS me of this episode...

[Sabriel]

18. The main difference there is...

The "Fake Fuhrer" was actually a good guy, just a drugged good guy. Here, we all know that's not even close to true. Drugged or not, *'s still an evil Cheneyer.

[stopbush]

21. bush=John Gill, with the evil Melacon (Cheney) pulling the strings.

[DarthDem]

53. Patterns of Force

A really good "Prime Directive"/former official of the Federation, now-corrupt episode. Plus, they got to use all of Paramount's stock WWII uniforms and use the Nazis as villains - - remember that at the time, the conflict had only been over for about 20-25 years, or roughly as recent as some of Reagan's adventures.

Nice call on the connection there!

[Brotherjohn]

16. Please stop posting this nonsense. It's Capitol Hill Blue, for crissakes!

They NEVER check out. They are the Weekly World News of the political web.

That so many of you are posting on this non-story makes us look ridiculous and only gives the Repubs ammo to brand us as worse than them at rumor-mongering and personal attacks.

There are plenty or real, actual faults to criticize Bush about.

[wtmusic]

20. agree - let's leave CHB out of the equation

why wallow in filth like Repubs?

[Ganja Ninja]

37. Why not!

In case you haven't noticed the media hasn't been doing their job for a long time. Don't expect to hear this from any of the so called reliable media sources. The media is busy wallowing in the "Shove it" non-story. True or not really doesn't bother me anymore. We have to combat the dirty tricks and media manipulation any way we can. If there's any possibility this is true then Bush needs to come clean.

[wtmusic]

45. Wrong, wrong

So lies don't bother you anymore, huh? That's a good one. I'm not even going down that path.

[Ganja Ninja]

60. Do you know positively it's a lie?

Why dismiss it out of hand simply because the major media isn't covering it. Quite frankly I've become use to the media lying to cover for Bush's ass. I'm more than willing to entertain the possibility that this story is true because it's a Bush negative story and they aren't covering it. If FOX news tells me it's true than I'll have reason to doubt it.

[wtmusic]

63. AFAIK not one Capitol Blue "breaking story" has been confirmed

by another news source. Not one.

That should tell you something.

[Minstrel Boy]

84. That could tell you something

about the nature of "news" in the United States.

This and similar stories would be spiked by the mainstream press regardless of how well it checked out.

[HuckleB]

89. What about "The Nation," "Mother Jones," etc...

If these outfits could confirm stories like this, they would. Sorry, but Capitol Hill Blue is on par with The National Enquirer.

[Minstrel Boy]

98. Do you knowThe Nation endorsed the Warren Report? Do you know

Mother Jones fired Michael Moore as editor in the 1980s because he was considered too radical?

I don't have as much faith as you in the gatekeepers of America's "respectable Left."

[HuckleB]

101. Thanks for the cliches.

Moore's firing had far more to do with personality conflicts than with "being too radical." And, if you're going to use the Warren Report as a reason to dismiss the Nation, then you might want to check out Capitol Hill Blue a bit more often. I'm quite sure you'll find plenty of reasons to dismiss it because of some content or another at some point.

[Minstrel Boy]

104. I'm not dismissing The Nation, I'm just suggesting

you read with discernment. That means everything, includes Capitol Hill Blue. Regardless of its libertarian editorial policy, it does have sources.

I've found worthwhile and valid stories in the oddest of places (the Moonie Times, even), and crap where we should have expected better.

And Moore was fired for refusing to run an article he felt prejudicial of the Sandinistas. I remember well. It's when I let my subscription lapse.

[HuckleB]

116. Uh huh.

And part of that would be realizing that a publication that can't get any of its news peer reviewed and upheld is not a publication worthy of one's time.

As for Moore, the story is far more complex than that, as I've already said.

[truthspeaker]

23. Why? The other side posts false stories all the time

Turnabout is fair play.

By the way, Karl Rove is gayer than a tree full of monkeys on nitrous oxide.

[HuckleB]

46. Yes! Let's help bring debate to its lowest possible form!

Just because the other side does it.

:eyes:

[truthspeaker]

74. OK, let's take the high road and continue losing elections.

[HuckleB]

85. You think this type of crap is going to win an election?

Think again. All this does is stigmatize those who truly suffer from brain disorders, whether or not Bush is among them.

[enki23]

137. yes, it defninitely could

and for good reason. people with brain disorders need our care and support. they do not, however, need to be fucking president of the united states of america.

[HuckleB]

140. Wrong answer.

This piece has nothing to back itself up. It looks like pure fiction at this point. That doesn't help a damn thing in terms of the election or of those with brain disorders, many of whom would make damn fine presidents, by the way.

[AlienGirl]

148. Don't let Lincoln hear you say that!

President Lincoln was a depressive.

Tucker

[HuckleB]

151. Thank you.

And, by statistics, it's likely that he wasn't the only worthy president who knew mental illness firsthand.

[enki23]

169. so am i. and so what?

lincoln didn't have his finger on a nuclear trigger, for starters. further and more to the point, there's a question of degree that hasn't been addressed. there's depression, and then there's *depression.* i would not want a severely depressed person to be president of the united states. you've got that absolutely right. that doesn't change even if we had a severely depressed person as president in the past, and even if said president were extremely successful. we haven't had enough presidents to significantly predict the actions of future depressive presidents. and this doesn't even begin to delve into the question of what depression really is, or the question of how similar one case of diagnosed depression is to another--even within the same official classification. there are some things, however, that we *do* know tend to go along with depression. and many of them might make us question the wisdom of electing, or reelecting a man who is known to be depressed enough to act out in public.

and in any case, this all silliness and conjecture anyway. my only point is that i would be more than willing, even happy to use something like this against bush if i thought there were any way at all to give it legs. period. and i wouldn't feel even a *little* guilty about it.

[HuckleB]

186. Well then, anyone with any physical ailment at all should go, I guess.

After all, we know that people with physical ailments are more apt to develop clinical depression, and we would never want to take any chances on anyone who happens to have, or might develop, a brain disorder being in the White House. Hmm. Maybe we should just give up this whole democracy with humans thing altogether and build a presidential robot! Yeah, that's what we should do! No bugs ever get into computers, after all!

:eyes:

[enki23]

194. way to argue against something completely different

not that it's a straw man argument. it's actually a whole company of straw men masquerading as a straw man argument.

and so, in the words of someone who might be more direct than me: "You said something I didnt say. Now Shove it."

[HuckleB]

196. What's different?

I've been on the same page the whole time, and now you change it in order to call it a "strawman"? It appears that it's your strawman who's the strawman.

How about addressing what I say, or can't you do that?

[enki23]

210. are you drunk?

.

[HuckleB]

223. Ah, so nothing's different.

You simply couldn't respond because your position no longer hold water, so you chose to call my argument names and then call me names by saying I'm a drunk.

How pitifiul. I do feel sorry for you.

[enki23]

229. i'll take that as a "yes"

.

[HuckleB]

250. I know you are, but what am I?

Sheesh. Grow up.

:eyes:

[truthspeaker]

158. This crap has been winning elections for the GOP since 1994.

So, yes.

[HuckleB]

160. Really?

Who won the presidential election in 1996? Who really won the presidential election in 2000?

Something's definitely wrong with your statement there.

[seemslikeadream]

161. Not presidential

Look at the Senate and House. Full of the Religious Right.

[HuckleB]

162. And they're there simply because they showed the voters bogus stories...

about their opponents?

Nevermind that this is a piece purportedly "about" Bush.

[drdtroit]

245. No, because they package their lies

and repeat them over and over with impunity. Remember that Cheney is still driving home the Sadam 911 connection.

[HuckleB]

251. Yup. And most Americans who matter know better.

He's only pushing away the fence sitters, because most of them know that his statement is hogwash.

So what's your point?

[smirkymonkey]

76. Boxer Rebellion....

I agree with you, taking the high-road when the opposition is using every dirty trick in the book hasn't been working for us. Idealism is nice, but it doesn't work for us politically. Think of the Boxer Rebellion in China

"A secret society, known as the Fists of Righteous Harmony, attracted thousands of followers. Foreigners called members of this society "Boxers" because they practiced martial arts. The Boxers also believed that they had a magical power, and that foreign bullets could not harm them. Millions of "spirit soldiers," they said, would soon rise from the dead and join their cause."

Though their cause was righteous and they had some minor success in their mission, ultimately the military might of the west proved too much for the warriors and their belief that "foreign bullets couldn't harm them" was a grave underestimation.

The point being, sometimes a righteous cause and a belief in the honor of one's mission proves no match for outright aggression and force.

[colonel odis]

131. henry clay, i believe, said "i'd rather be right than president."

sure enough. he never was .

if you're in a street fight, which i think we are for the future of this country, you do whatever it takes to put away you're opponent.

whatever it takes. period.

[seemslikeadream]

135. Can't play nice with fascists

[seemslikeadream]

27. I'll post whatever I want

if the source was credible enough for the mods here
Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=602189

over 320 posts


then please keep your censorship corralled

[Brotherjohn]

34. First, just b/c the mods leave a thread on doesn't make a story true.

(Neither do a thousand posts on it)

Second, if you want to take one posted reply asking that we "Please" stop posting this, and giving my opinion of it as "nonsense", as "censorship" then go ahead. I didn't realize I had that much power!

I simply saw three threads in quick succession on what I think is a completely unsubstantiated story, and I thought we here at DU were starting to look ridiculous, and desperate. I think there's no need to look ridiculous, and act desperate.

As I said above, there are plenty of actual, substantiated, faults of GWB that we can criticize him with, which would hold much more water. But if you want to go ahead with this, feel free. Don't get too frustrated if it continues to go nowhere, however.

[seemslikeadream]

50. Please don't worry about the level of my frustration

And I have plenty of things on my mind to worry about one story.

[Brotherjohn]

62. Sorry, that was more directed at all the posters (here and other threads)

... who are saying "Why isn't the media picking this up!!!" They sound very frustrated indeed. I'm just saying, based on this story, they're likely to continue to be so.

Listen, I accept that all this may be true. I read some of the posts you link to in the JohnOniellsMemory post (#49). But to me, they all amount to psychoanalysis from a distance. That, simply, amounts to rumor and innuendo. No reputable psychologist would diagnose a patient based on what they see and read in the news and in biographies about their patient. The only "source reporting" I see is quotes from a very suspect source (CHB).

Like I say, he may very well be psychotic, masochistic, extremely unstable person. I tend to think he is. But barring more evidence, pursuing that criticism of him anywhere beyond discussion groups at DU is likely to backfire. For instance, if the Kerry campaign took this issue today and ran with it, I believe they would lose the election.

[Snazzy]

102. Reminds me of the Kremlin

Remember we had teams of psychiatrists trying to decipher what Soviet leaders were thinking, what they were like. Sometimes even trying to ascertain who was really in power. (And the reverse applied to us. The prof. in my political psychology class insisted that we tried to make Reagan appear crazy enough to nuke something--I never thought it was an act).

So very similar.

Actually, isn't there a whole specialty called something like historical psychology, where you have no access to the subject? Seems to me there's many a paper on Hitler and Napoleon's inner motivations (unclear if there are good papers).

Ok, so ideally you want access to a subject, but you are not totally without methods should you not have it. There is a great dry drunk analysis by a practicing (and I thought reputable) psychologist that was probably linked in the other thread. It was posted on Counterpunch sometime back. Or even take the guy who wrote Bushisms, who, after starting with the premise the guy was just an idiot, having written the book came out with a thoughtful analysis from afar (observed behavior) that Whistleass was not necessarily stupid, but was mean. Don't know if he (Slate's Weisburg) has a background in forensic psycho-linguistics, or whatever that field might be called, but the argument was cogent. * can speak a complete sentence when he's being mean (Weisburg puts this better).

Kremlinology.

Anyway, if CHB nicely tweaks just one wingnut, adds a little stress their way, fine by me. By all means though, lets get another source!

[Snazzy]

119. Frank's book explains much same idea--Harper Collins

Bush On the Couch
Inside the Mind of the President

by Justin A. Frank, M.D



Chapter Excerpt

President Bush is not my patient, of course, but the discipline of applied psychoanalysis gives us a way to make as much sense of his psyche as he is likely ever to allow. At its simplest level, applied psychoanalysis means the application of psychoanalytic principles to anybody outside one's own consulting room. The tradition of psychoanalyzing public figures dates back almost as far as psychoanalysis itself; Freud based some of his most important theories on his observations of individuals he could never get onto his couch, Moses and Leonardo da Vinci most notable among them.

Indeed, if Freud were alive in the second half of the twentieth century, he might well have been recruited to offer his genius in the service of the U.S. intelligence effort. Somewhere in the bowels of the George H. W. Bush Center for Central Intelligence in Langley, Virginia, psychoanalysts are currently reviewing audio recordings, videotapes, and biographical information on dozens of contemporary world leaders, using the principles of applied psychoanalysis to develop detailed profiles for use by the CIA and the U.S. government and military. According to political psychiatrist Jerrold M. Post, M.D., who has chronicled the history of "at-a-distance leader personality assessment in support of policy," the marriage of psychoanalysis and U.S. intelligence dates back to the early 1940s, when the Office of Strategic Services commissioned two studies of Adolf Hitler. The effort was regarded as enough of a success that it was institutionalized in the 1960s, Post writes, first under the aegis of the Psychiatric Staff of the CIA's Office of Medical Services, which "led to the establishment of the Center for the Analysis of Personality and Political Behavior" (CAPPB), which Post founded within the Directorate of Intelligence.

As Post reveals, CIA psychological profiles of Anwar Sadat and Menachem Begin played an important role in Jimmy Carter's handling of the 1978 Camp David negotiations. And applied psychoanaly-sis continues to enjoy a privileged place in the intelligence universe.

"At the time of his confirmation hearings, Secretary of the Defense Donald Rumsfeld identified as his nightmare not understanding the intentions of dangerous adversaries," Post writes. "Accentuated by some of the recent intelligence ‘surprises,' the need to have a robust applied political psychology capability has been highlighted and increased resources are currently being applied to human intelligence and to the study of the personality and political behavior of foreign leaders, both national leaders and terrorists."

....

http://www.harpercollins.com/catalog/excerpt_xml.asp?isbn=0060736704

Psychiatrist, of course, not psychologist. And they like this sort of thing. Still, he's not a quack, at least to the extent that all psychiatrists are not quacks):

Justin A. Frank, M.D., is a clinical professor in the Department of Psychiatry at George Washington University Medical Center. Since 1980 he has been a teaching analyst at the Washington Psychoanalytic Institute. He is past president of the Greater Washington Chapter of Physicians for Social Responsibility. Dr. Frank lives and practices psychoanalysis in Washington, D.C.

[Eloriel]

157. Oh, please. He's got a bunch of problems even laypeople

like me can "diagnose." It doesn't serve any viable purpose, IMO, to NOT reveal these things about the most important public figure in America.

[Tansy_Gold]

67. I remember back in the Nixon days

that there were people saying -- and not in the mainstream media, either -- that Tricky Dicky was doing some kinda drugs. This notion was routinely pshawed.

We now know, of course, that he was on all kinds of meds, that he was frequently stumbling drunk, and heaven only knows what all else.

That people speculate on boosh's chemically-induced state of mind isn't so far out of the question, IMHO. There's been a lot of talk about boosh daddy's use of halcyon -- including the drug as being the cause of his sudden puking at the Japanese dinner. And there has been the comment from Colin Powell regarding another drug (can't recall the name) that's used by virtually everyone in D.C. these days.

There have been a number of professionals in the mental health field who have ventured public opinions on the state of boosh's mind (?) since before the 2000 election. Whether CHB has valid sources or not is always questionable, but the fact that MAYBE some people in the administration are trying to get information leaked is, again IMHO, valid food for discussion.

I don't think anyone is saying CHB is 100% reliable; not any news source has that kind of track record. But it's not exactly the Enquirer or the Star or any of those other rags that send my poor husband into hysterics at the grocery check-out. (He has a very warped sense of humor, and I've tried for 35 years to get him to stop reading them while standing in line, but he insists and it invariably leads to embarrassing fits of giggles.)

The revelation that Tom Eagleton had been treated for mental health problems contributed to the demise of McGovern's candidacy. We've been trying for at least that long to get mental health concerns respected at the same level as physical health concerns. i think questioning the mental state of the nutcase in the white house is valid at this time, and citing CHB as a source, even a questionable one, is equally valid. At least they're raising an issue.

Tansy Gold, who is quite certain the only normal people she knows are the ones she doesn't know very well

[TrogL]

80. Let put them all on E

there has been the comment from Colin Powell regarding another drug (can't recall the name) that's used by virtually everyone in D.C. these days.

They'd do less harm sitting and looking at the pretty colours than they are now.

[truth2power]

96. Ambien. n/t

[LifeDuringWartime]

105. just to clear things up

ecstasy is not a hallucinogen. i dont know from experience, but they'd be more apt to walking around hugging eachother.

[seemslikeadream]

86. If it had come out in 1974 would you have believed it?

Alright read this transcript from Nixon - If it had come out in 1974


would you have believed it?
Saturday 29th May 2004 :
The Kissinger Tapes - Nixon, Chile, Cambodia and more ...
1 comment(s).
After a long legal battle, the National Security Archive has succeeded in winning the release of a large volume of telephone conversations taped by Henry Kissinger during the Nixon Presidency. The NSA web page with the transcripts of the conversations, streaming recordings of selected conversations and much supporting material can be found at http://www.gwu.edu / nsarchiv/


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Haig Said Nixon Joked of Nuking Hill
Transcripts of Phone Talks Are Released by Archives

By Michael Dobbs

Washington Post Staff Writer

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A58802-20...

President Richard M. Nixon jokingly threatened to drop a nuclear bomb on Capitol Hill in March 1974 as Congress was moving to impeach him over the Watergate scandal, according to transcripts of telephone conversations among his closest aides that were released yesterday.

"I was told to get the football," White House Chief of Staff Alexander M. Haig Jr. told Secretary of State Henry A. Kissinger less than five months before the president's forced resignation, during a conversation in which the two men exchanged stories about Nixon's increasingly erratic behavior.

"What do you mean?" asked Kissinger, who had called Haig to express concern that the president might unwittingly unleash a Middle East war with his new, get-tough policy against Israel.

"His black nuclear bag," replied Haig. "He is going to drop it on the Hill."

The March 20, 1974, exchange is among 20,000 pages of transcripts of telephone conversations that Kissinger deposited in the Library of Congress in 1976 with the stipulation that they remain secret until at least five years after his death. Kissinger turned the transcripts over to the National Archives in February 2002 after being threatened with legal action by the National Security Archive, a nonprofit group that campaigns against government secrecy. The National Archives reviewed the transcripts for national security and privacy purposes and released almost all of them yesterday.

The transcripts shed light on the extraordinarily complex relationship between Nixon and Kissinger during a turbulent period in American foreign policy, from the bombing of Cambodia in 1970 to the Yom Kippur war of 1973 and diplomatic breakthroughs with China and the Soviet Union. Even as Kissinger attempted to convince Nixon of his loyalty, he adopted a sardonic tone in conversations with Haig and other aides.

In the March 20 transcript, neither Kissinger nor Haig seems alarmed by threats to bomb Congress or "to go after the Israelis" after "he is through with the Europeans."

"He is just unwinding," Haig told Kissinger. "Don't take him too seriously."

On other occasions, as in December 1970, when Nixon proposed an escalation in the bombing of Cambodia, Kissinger and Haig felt obliged to humor the president while laughing at him behind his back. During that episode, Kissinger was still serving as national security adviser, and Haig was one of his deputies.

The Air Force is "not designed for any war we are likely to have to fight," Kissinger told Nixon after the president railed against U.S. pilots for "farting around doing nothing" over Cambodia and "running goddamn milk runs in order to get the air medal." Both men suspected North Vietnamese guerrillas of using Cambodia as a sanctuary and supply line to South Vietnam.

"It's a disgraceful performance," Nixon went on. "I want gunships in there. That means armed helicopters, DC-3s, anything else that will destroy personnel that can fly. I want it done!! Get them off their ass."

"We will get it done immediately, Mr. President," Kissinger replied.

After talking to Nixon, Kissinger got on the phone with Haig to pass on the president's orders for "a massive bombing campaign in Cambodia," using "anything that flies on anything that moves." The transcript then records an unintelligible comment that "sounded like Haig laughing."

The transcripts include several episodes that appear at odds with Kissinger's version of events, such as his claim that Washington had nothing to do with the September 1973 military coup in Chile that toppled the democratically elected, leftist government of Salvador Allende. "We didn't do it," Kissinger told Nixon, "I mean we helped them. created the conditions as great as possible."

Peter Kornbluh, a Latin America specialist at the National Security Archive, said the passage appeared to mark an acknowledgment by Kissinger that U.S. policy paved the way for the coup that brought Augusto Pinochet to power. "It's diametrically opposed to the account he provides in his memoirs," Kornbluh said.

The transcripts show Nixon and Kissinger congratulating each other on the overthrow of "a pro-Communist . . . anti-American" government in Chile. The president agreed with Kissinger's assessment that the American press was guilty of "unbelievable, filthy hypocrisy" in expressing concern over Allende's overthrow while calling for the outlawing of the apartheid regime in South Africa.

more
http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=1134

[demoman123]

97. More evidence that Kissinger was "Deepthroat"

"...telephone conversations taped taped by Henry Kissinger during the Nixon Presidency."

[KurtNYC]

172. I thought Pat Buchanan was deepthroat

[demoman123]

185. We'll find out when Deepthroat dies.

I still suspect Henry. Hirsch's book is full of stories about Kissinger trading information for favorable press coverage.

What makes you suspect Pat?

[Hoping4Change]

193. Deepthroat did die today.

[Tansy_Gold]

180. Would it have been believed then?

I honestly don't know. But I do think we can learn from the history -- that maybe it's just possible that a man who has a history of substance abuse is abusing again, regardless what the source of the rumors is.

The whole Nixon administration instigated a lot of changes in the way the US government functioned and the way Americans view the government. For some, like Grover Norquist, government became something to be abolished, a throwing out of the baby with the bathwater, since the rich would always have their own baths anyway. For others, the scandals of Watergate prompted a suspicion of the way government operated but not a dislike for its existence. For still others, Nixon's downfall precipitated a fortress mentality: once we get power again, we're never gonna let go.

So we ended up with Clinton impeached over something that had no bearing on government function whatsoever, while boosh gets away with high crimes and misdemeanors a blink of an historical eye later.

So whether we would have believed "the truth" about Nixon then or not isn't really the point I wasd trying to make, but rather that we shouldn't be quite as dismissive of the rumors. Skeptical, perhaps, in the scientific way, but not dismissive.

[smirkymonkey]

114. Great last line!

to a very informative post! :)

[Bernardo de La Paz]

261. Shrub Nixon

The Shrub Bush Presidency has more in common with the Nixon Presidency than with any other.

that there were people saying -- and not in the mainstream media, either -- that Tricky Dicky was doing some kinda drugs. This notion was routinely pshawed.

We now know, of course, that he was on all kinds of meds, that he was frequently stumbling drunk, and heaven only knows what all else.

Tricky Shrub: Foreign war gone wrong, law and order orientation, paranoia, tight control on leaking, ...

[Spiffarino]

99. Breaking Story from CHB: Hannity and Coulter's Love Child!

[area51]

216. "Hannity and Coulter's Love Child"

"(Ins)annity and (Manthrax) Coulter's Love Child"? I think I'm going to :puke:.

[2plus2]

109. so they're not credable?

Because I'm really ready to run with this...it's groundbreaking, I've checked out the Dr. he exists, that's all there needs to be said...look the fact of the matter is we're up against a 4 armed freak with 1 hand tied behind our backs...how can we win? By untying the one hand and GROWING 4 MORE..it's the only chance we have at this stage in the game, I'm in Houston and I've forwarded the link to Howard Stern and he says he'll try verifying it and sticking it on his show.

[seemslikeadream]

111. Did you give him the first thread?

Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=602189

[2plus2]

122. Yes I did, but he did say he's recieved..

similar stories (1) from CHB and he put it up on his site (??) but nobody reacted to it. Like as if they weren't suprised..I need that list of CNN contacts

[Almost_there]

127. Gotta agree...

CHB is just like Drudge Report, or Weekly World News. At least with Weekly World News has Aliens, and Drudge gives links to Dave Barry and other fine articles, such as "cartoons", and "more cartoons".

I can't buy this until it's verified by the Weekly World News, The Enquirer, or possibly some real news source.

~Almost

[hyphenate]

165. Actually, I used the link

to post that article to another board I frequent. There are two rabid right wing nutjobs there that constantly--and I mean, EVERY DAY--post from World Net Daily, Ann Coulter, Drudge, Real Clear Politics and some other sleazy rightwinged source. So tit for tat, I say--they want to share tabloid shit and claim it is real news, attacking with their own brand of crap is worth it just to get a reaction.

[John_H]

214. When will dems learn?

Politics is not a Rhetoric 102 essay.

One of the reasons the rethugs have the White House and the congress is they have Dozens of capital hill blues. Hundreds of doctored mp3's. Thousands of sources that "never check out." Will God outlaw these tactics on Perfect Earth v1.2? Probably. But we live in v1.0.

Tell you what, you post only the sources worthy of your finely tuned sense of propriety and we won't complain. If someone wants to post CHB, how about you allow readers to use own internal editor?

[seemslikeadream]

17. Please take a look at background thread on this - 320 posts

Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=602189

[priller]

24. This background is also based on Capitol Hill Blues

supposed "reporting". Brother John is right, as entertaining as this sight is, it's just rumor-mongering and innuendo -- the same things we gripe about the Freepers for doing.

[Brotherjohn]

28. Yes. "Just rumor-mongering and innuendo". As are most of the 320 posts.

The rest are posts questioning the veracity of Capitol Hill Blue.

[seemslikeadream]

30. You could have not possibly read that whole thread

There is quite a bit of information there not just CHB.

[Brotherjohn]

39. So, are you saying there are other, more reputable sources?

Yes, it is difficult to read the whole thread. I, like this other poster, just browsed it and saw nothing that jumped out as further proof. I saw mostly what I point out above. I clicked a couple of links that purported to give further evidence, but only found more hearsay and innuendo.

Could you help us please (seriously), and point to a couple of the 320 posts that might give us something more substantial than a CHB story as evidence?

[seemslikeadream]

61. You know what Brotherjohn I have been extremely busy lately

maybe you can take a few moments and answer your own question.
And it's not all rumor mongering!

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[Brotherjohn]

69. I'm trying to be nice, but the burden of proof is upon you.

You made the initial post, and accusation. And the best and first link/evidence you cite is the Capitol Hill Blue story, a highly suspect source that, I'm sorry, just doesn't hold water (and I know many here agree with me on that). Are we to believe Bush said "Keep those motherfuckers away from me", directed at the press, on July 8th, and NO ONE (not even left-wing blogs), covered it, save for CHB? The mainstream media was all over Cheney's use of the word "fuck". I'm sorry, but CHB simply makes stuff up.

If there is better evidence, you should have included it in your intial post. If you are so familiar with the topic, and the background, and someone politely asks for more, you should be able to provide something. And I didn't ask (nicely, BTW, and as I said, "seriously") until I did a good bit of looking through the posts you had put up elsewhere. I can't go though every single post you've made to attempt to glean the evidence for the main accusation you are making.

Again, the burden of proof is yours.

[seemslikeadream]

77. Excuse me, I made no accusation!

I posted an article with a link. PERIOD! I don't have to prove anything to you or anyone else.

[Brotherjohn]

You posted a link that made an accusation. So okay, you "promoted"...

... an accusation. On a "discussion" board.

We're discussing it.

My part in the discussion is to say, "that story seems suspect" and I believe it makes us look (needlessly) ridiculous and desperate, and that it could backfire. You took issue with my (and others) challenging the veracity of the story, and produced links to hundreds of posts on the subject. I have asked you to call out some of the better evidence, and also independently looked at many of your links and others', and found nothing to substantiate this story.

No, you don't have to prove anything to anyone. But if you start a discussion thread, you are going to get discussion, and it will not always agree with your post.

My closing entry in the discussion is this:
"I think the story is bunk. Pursue it at your own risk."

[progressivebydesign]

43. Capitol Hill Blue normally leans right...

.. I remember when the first article came out, how surprised we were that it would be so brutal toward Bush. Like the supermarket tabloids, there is usually a lot of truth buried in the rumours.. He looked positively drugged up the other day at that speaking event. I admit it was hot where he was speaking, but he was in air conditioning.. his eyes were glassy and bloodshot.

[jdj]

201. good place to plant a story then.

wake up people.

There is a difference between being drugged and ON DRUGS.

Who can stop him? He's the freaking president.

I can see the book coming out in ten years by the secret service guys: "I scored coke for George W. Bush."

Reagan kept jelly beans on his desk...Bush has a coke spoon.

[colonel odis]

19. why doesn't the press make this a story?

hound the little bastard to release his medical records. claim it's in the national interest to know whether or not the commander-in-chief (god, i hated typing that) is taking medication that could affect his judgement.

and if, in fact, he is, insist that he step aside until his mental problems are cleared up.

ride that theme for the next 90 days. we've all known for a long time he's a nut. but let's hammer that theme until ida and phil in des moines believe he's a nut.

[bif]

25. Well, I Snoped it and there were no entries.

So who knows.

[UpInArms]

29. does anyone else remember when Poppy was taking

halcyon?

There was one quote that I will never remember - he called the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band "Nitty Gritty Great Bird"

here's a link (where they fluff over all the "mis-speaks" of the BFEE

http://www2.sjsu.edu/depts/linguistics/news/bush.htm

It could just be fatigue, but it also coule be genetic. The governor's father was known for verbal missteps during his White House years. The former president once referred to the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band as the "Nitty Ditty Nitty Gritty Great Bird" He called the spotted owl "that little furry-feathery guy."

In a slip with Freudian overtones, the elder Bush summed up the state of his presidency at one point by saying, "We have had triumphs, we have made mistakes, we have had sex." Translators said he meant to say "setbacks."

[Holly]

44. Correct me if I'm wrong

Didn't Pappy suffer from hyperthyroidism. My husband had the same condition also known as "Graves Disease", (at the same time that *Bush's* daddy was being treated). It tends to run in families, although it's not hereditary. The condition causes erratic behavior, inability to concentrate, restlessness, depression, paranoia, insomnia, weight loss, poor balance and mental instability. Slurred speech is also common. My husband was very unstable during this period, lacked judgment and was incapable of even the smallest task.

[UpInArms]

59. here's the medical records of Poppy

http://www.doctorzebra.com/prez/t41.htm

excerpt:

While jogging at Camp David on a Saturday afternoon (May 4, 1991), Bush developed shortness of breath, chest tightness, and a general feeling of fatigue. A White House physician discovered Bush had a rapid irregular heartbeat, ultimately diagnosed as atrial fibrillation due to hyperthyroidism (see below). <5>

<snip>

Graves disease was diagnosed immediately after the occurrence of atrial fibrillation. Bush had been feeling increasingly tired over the preceding two weeks, had lost nine pounds in two months, and had seen his handwriting deteriorate. Physical examination disclosed a fine tremor of his hands and slight enlargement of his thyroid gland (goiter). Bush was hyperthyroid. <5>

"President Bush and the team of physicians caring for him agreed that his hyperthyroidism should be treated in the safest, fastest, most definitive, and permanent way possible. Therefore, he took an oral dose of radioactive iodine a few days after being admitted to the hospital" <5>. Two days later Bush began a ten day course of potassium iodide (SSKI), four drops three times a day, to prevent a rare complication of radio-iodine therapy called "thyroid storm" (extreme hyperthyroidism).

...more...

[2plus2]

125. right...

But, your Husband is not THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES!!

[TexasBushwhacker]

178. Barbara had Grave's too

and it does tend to run in families. I disagree with the depression though. It's much more likely for depression to be caused by hypothyroidism (low thyroid) than by high.

[madrchsod]

31. from the bullshit stories

about his bike riding and heart rate pumping ,little Georgie getting his kicks from endorphins..yes natures high..then he`s pissed and surly when he`s off the flow..see he still hasn`t kicked his drug habit...

[DulceDecorum]

32. "Why is this man in the White House?

The majority of Americans did not vote for him. Why is he there? And I tell you this morning that he’s in the White House because God put him there for a time such as this.”
-- Gen. William “Jerry” Boykin

One long-time GOP political consultant who – for obvious reasons – asked not to be identified said he is advising his Republican Congressional candidates to keep their distance from Bush.
“We have to face the very real possibility that the President of the United States is loony tunes,” he says sadly. “That’s not good for my candidates, it’s not good for the party and it’s certainly not good for the country.”
http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_4921.shtml

CONCLUSION:
God likes Looney Tunes.


I tawt I taw a terrawist.

[seemslikeadream]

143. ttttterrrrrissssssssst!

:hi:

[stepnw1f]

206. Do You Own That or is a Pic you found?

[seemslikeadream]

244. Just borrowed it stepnw1f

Isn't it great!

never know what ya'll find if ya dig deep enough

great site
http://www.lazygranch.com/nosepic.htm

[stepnw1f]

254. I love that pic

[Laughing Mirror]

36. Will insanity be his defense when tried for war crimes

Interesting how they bring up Reagan and says how his aides "managed to conceal" his onslaught of Alzheimer's. They did? It was very apparent to anyone paying even casual attention to Reagan in first and especially second term (answering question reading notes off flash cards, shaking his poor weary old head and not remembering what went on during Iran-Contra private meetings, etc.) that he had already crossed over into Alzheimer country.

[progressivebydesign]

38. Paranoia? That would be a good guess...

.. I've read that he obsesses over every detail of his attacks on Kerry, while blowing off important matters. His outburst after the July 8th incident also seems very plausible. Do any of you believe that these things are trickling out because there are staff members around him that are more afraid of what Bush will do to the Country, than afraid of what will happen to their jobs when he loses if all this is found out???

[seemslikeadream]

42. Firing Tenet?

[reprobate]

83. I half expect to see him rolling steel bearings in his hand.......

....and shouting "No one gets shore leave until the strawberries are returned".

With apologies to Herman Wouk.

[DaveFL99]

176. Oh

That's good.

[Norquist Nemesis]

47. Where's that email list of editors?!

Especially the TV and cable news networks? Which one would like to break this story wide open by putting Theresa Hampton on the show for an interview? Hmmmm? Copies to all of them?

[truthisfreedom]

54. start by sending it to drudge (make that sludge.) he's got a little window

on his page where you can send him tips... it only takes a second. i'd love to see this in the headline on sludge.

[Norquist Nemesis]

64. stay tuned...

[nolabels]

48. This why they put on the kid gloves for the guy?

I am betting this is a B.S. story to the max (more dirty tricks)

[seemslikeadream]

49. Extremely important post from JohnOneillsMemory

Psych profile+fascism receptivity+Lakoff's family framing concept links.


This is entirely predictable. Bush* suffers from severe mental illness as has been well documented. We're experiencing Columbine High School on a global level.

Georgie was abused by his mother, shadowed by his father, shamed for mourning his sister's death and belittled in general. He became a self-destructive alcoholic with a cruel streak.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1033904,00.html
(So George, How Do You Feel About Your Mom and Dad?)

His 'authoritarian personality' matches what researchers discovered to be a marker for 'fascism receptivity' when the phenomenon was researched after WWII.
http://www.anesi.com/fscale.htm
(The F-factor questionnaire)

More recently, researchers have analyzed the components of the conservative personality. Their findings point to the fear-based tendencies that are similar in fundamentalist religious views and fascism receptivity, again the 'authoritarian personality.'
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml
(What Makes Up a Conservative Personality)

This family experience modeling sets us up for how we view all our relationships at work and in government, too. Linguist George Lakoff explains how this 'framing' is used in political language and propaganda.
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/10/27_lakoff.shtml
(Lakoff Explains Framing as Key to Thinking)

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=12&ItemID=4294
(Lakoff Explains Gender Language in Promoting War)


more
Bush's Erratic Behavior Worries White House Aides
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=602189

[nolabels]

55. A big help for him would be retirement

:-)

[Spiffarino]

107. Great links

They give a different look into the Shrub's head, and that is scary stuff indeed.

And hey, there's nothing wrong with posting stuff from questionable sources. Just don't be surprised by those of us who value credibility knocking down sources, no matter how much they favor our points of view. To paraphrase one poster, there is plenty of well-documented evidence to convict Bush of being the worst president ever.

[truthisfreedom]

51. lock up the football. we don't need this madman starting WWIII, again.

fooking freak.

[psychopomp]

56. "Feels good."

n/t

[RamboLiberal]

57. Now while I don't put a lot of stock in CHB

We all saw the photos and it did happen the idiot boy stomped off when the press had the "balls" to ask him about Ken Lay when they had to know the ? was legit and would be asked.

And John Dean in his book says there are rumors about Bush on Prozac and drinking again.

We know the guy is a former alchoholic and that he probably did some drugs, probably cocaine.

And we know he substitutes heavy exercise and gets a high from that.

And the idiot sure falls down a lot and ends up with facial and other bruises.

And there sure are some strange mannerisms, emotional highs and lows, facial expressions, sometimes looking shit-faced.

Plus we have all this time he is away from the WH at Camp David and the pig farm.

I have to believe we're not getting the full truth from the WH on his physical and mental condition. Nor his emotional state.

Something smells very rotten. I hope someday we get the truth.

But I wish our idiots in the media would start to ? this before our idiot population possibly re-selects this idiot. I fear for this country.

Hell I was more comfortable with Nixon in the WH! And we found out later about him that he was being somewhat drugged and was drinking under far more stress than this idiot boy is under!

[KoKo]

91. Good Post "rmpalmer." (n/t)

[74dodgedart]

65. Maybe this is why he can't stay on his bike

He's doped up and keeps losing his balance.

[AndyTiedye]

66. That Would Be Consistant With A Lot of What We Have Been Seeing

like the report that historic photographs in the White House that had
been hanging for decades or even centuries have been
gradually getting replaced with photos of His Usurperness.

...and of course his appearance at some recent press conferences.

[HuckleB]

68. TEN THINGS YOU CAN DO TO FIGHT STIGMA

TEN THINGS YOU CAN DO TO FIGHT STIGMA
http://www.naminys.org/factsheets.htm

"3. WATCH YOUR LANGUAGE. Most of us, including mental health professionals and mental health consumers, use terms and expressions related to mental illness that may perpetuate stigma. We use psychiatric labels to disparage, such as when we complain about aggressive drivers and call them "nuts" and "lunatics." We also depersonalize sufferers of mental illness by referring to them generically as "the mentally ill" or as "a schizophrenic." We can avoid contributing to stigma by avoiding such language and by using People First language to refer to individuals with psychiatric disorders.

4. MONITOR MEDIA AND REPORT STIGMATIZING MATERIAL to any of a number of organizations. The National Stigma Clearinghouse, the National Mental Health Association, and the National Alliance for the Mentally Ill protest such material by contacting the people -- authors, editors, movie producers, advertisers -- responsible for the material.

5. RESPOND TO STIGMATIZING MATERIAL IN THE MEDIA. Write, call, or e-mail stigmatizers yourself, expressing your concerns and providing more accurate information that they can use. The organizations mentioned above can help you figure out who to contact."

[soleft]

70. I can't use Bush on antidepressants to convince my Mom to vote for Kerry

Because I've spent the last two years trying to convince her that there's nothing wrong with taking anti depressants, which she must be on.

[sallyseven]

71. Lets get our own October Suprise.

The word gets out before the election too late to pick someone else,

[HuckleB]

72. Huh?

[MODemocrat]

75. This would be a very delicate subject f or today's media

I can't see the Bush-loving media delving into this one, even though our country could be at stake. This must be why all the spinning is so rampant about every little move the Democrats make. They're using us as a distraction. If it's true, it's pretty sad to think he's going untreated for such a serious problem.

:scared:

[cal04]

79. maybe this is also part of the reason, maybe

he knows his days are numbered and the truth will come out


Developing story on rawstory,
Investigation into Bush Guard service reveals five invalid substitute trainings; possible payroll fraud... Developing...
---INVESTIGATION GOES BEYOND ALABAMA CAMPAIGN IN 1972; RECORDS SHOW BUSH VIOLATED AIR FORCE'S REGULATED TIME FRAME OF 15 DAYS BEFORE SCHEDULED TRANING FOR FOUR WEEKENDS IN 1973; HIS WERE 35, 60, 33, 66 DAYS BEFORE....MORE...

[seemslikeadream]

82. and Uncle Jonathan going on trial for funding terrorist

and money laudernig for Pinochet, he just might be starting to shake!

[democrat_patriot]

81. Kick!

[demgurl]

87. I found this article interesting:

http://www.counterpunch.org/wormer1011.html

"Dry Drunk" Syndrome and
George W. Bush


CounterPunch

October 11, 2002

Addiction, Brain Damage and the President
"Dry Drunk" Syndrome and
George W. Bush
by KATHERINE van WORMER

-snip-

It was when I started noticing the extreme language that colored President Bush's speeches that I began to wonder. First there were the terms-- "crusade" and "infinite justice" that were later withdrawn. Next came "evil doers," "axis of evil," and "regime change", terms that have almost become clichés in the mass media. Something about the polarized thinking and the obsessive repetition reminded me of many of the recovering alcoholics/addicts I had treated. (A point worth noting is that because of the connection between addiction and "stinking thinking," relapse prevention usually consists of work in the cognitive area). Having worked with recovering alcoholics for years, I flinched at the single-mindedness and ego- and ethnocentricity in the President's speeches. (My husband likened his phraseology to the gardener character played by Peter Sellers in the movie, Being There). Since words are the tools, the representations, of thought, I wondered what Bush's choice of words said about where he was coming from. Or where we would be going.

-snip-

What is the dry drunk syndrome? "Dry drunk" traits consist of:

Exaggerated self-importance and pomposity
Grandiose behavior
A rigid, judgmental outlook
Impatience
Childish behavior
Irresponsible behavior
Irrational rationalization
Projection
Overreaction

-snip-

Very interesting article, I think!

[Terran]

90. One problem with this article:

Dr. Justin Frank did not "diagnose" Bush in his book, as the articvle states; he has never met Bush nor treated him for anything, therefore no true diagnosis could have been performed. He's only examined records and video--which in his profession would not be considered adequate to perform a diagnosis. I don't believe he claims it to be a diagnosis, either.

Not that I think Frank is wrong or anything. I'm just saying this casts some doubt on the credibility of capitolhillblue, for me.

[nolabels]

106. Often your enemies come to see your weaknesses better than your friends

(maybe that's one reason Jesus said "love your enemies")




Castro responds to Bush’s prostitution charges


Claudia Daut / Reuters

Cuban leader says president is ‘sinister’
Cuban President Fidel Castro delivers a speech on Monday marking the 51st anniversary of the attack on the Moncada military barracks in Santiago de Cuba that launched the start of the Cuban revolution.
By Mary Murray
Producer
NBC News
Updated: 11:02 a.m. ET July 27, 2004

HAVANA - An indignant Fidel Castro used a live television appearance Monday night to respond to White House charges that his government encourages child prostitution.


Speaking in the central province of Villa Clara on a national holiday marking 51 years since he launched his revolution, Castro depicted President Bush as “sinister” and his charges as “irresponsible statements by the president of the most powerful nation on the planet.”
(snip)
(snip)
Psychoanalysis from Castro
On Monday Castro demanded evidence for the attacks on his country. Castro questioned, “How it is possible that such unspeakable, foul slander is hurled against Cuba?”

The answer, said Castro, comes from inside the mind of the president —the subtitle to a book by psychoanalyst Dr. Justin Frank, called “Bush on the Couch.”
(snip)
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5526645 /


Bush on the Couch: Inside the Mind of the President
by Justin A. Frank
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0060736704.01._PE32_PIdp-schmooS,TopRight,7,-26_SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/006073670...

[Pastiche423]

123. In a review by HarperCollins

on Dr.Justin Frank's book, Bush On the Couch - Inside the Mind of the President:

Among the other subjects Frank explores:

* Bush's false sense of omnipotence, instilled within him during childhood and emboldened by his deep investment in fundamentalist religion

* The president's history of untreated alcohol abuse, and the questions it raises about denial, impairment, and the enabling streak in our culture

* The growing anecdotal evidence that Bush may suffer from dyslexia, ADHD, and other thought disorders

* His comfort living outside the law, defying international law in his presidency as boldly as he once defied DUI statutes and military reporting requirements

* His love-hate relationship with his father, and how it triggered a complex and dangerous mix of feelings including yearning, rivalry, anger, and sadism

* Bush's rigid and simplistic thought patterns, paranoia, and megalomania -- and how they have driven him to invent adversaries so that he can destroy them


At once a compelling portrait of George W. Bush and a damning indictment of his policies, Bush on the Couch sheds startling new light on an administration whose record of violence and cruelty seems increasingly dependent on the unstable psyche of the man at its center. Insightful and accessible, courageous and controversial, Bush on the Couch tackles the question no one seems willing to ask: Is our president psychologically fit to run the country?

http://www.harpercollins.com/catalog/book_xml.asp?isbn=0060736704">HarperCollins

[seemslikeadream]

166. He volunteered for a beer run

[seemslikeadream]

92. The man is responsible for this? So we supposed to play nice?

http://www.bushflash.com/year.html WATCH THIS VIDEO only takes 3 minutes

Enveloped in a sentiment,
A sound that rushes over me.
Engage an impulse to pretend
I have a faith as pure.
Not forgetting what it means to dream.
Indulging everything.
Entertaining thoughts that I've the strength
Of those I yearn to be.
Cheers and tribute greet the saviours.
Reckless thoughts survive.
Anachronistic and impulsive.

And what will happen?
Will I dream?
I am too scared to close my eyes.
For a second please hold me.
None can change in me these things that I believe.
But I don't know what happens now.
I am too scared to close my eyes.

Legion
Vnv Nation

[Claire Beth]

94. explains why he can't stay on his bike too. n/t

[iconoclastic cat]

95. Maybe he'll go off his meds for the debates!

He'll give that famous Charles Manson speech!

[drmom]

112. Why not just not mention these articles, but say to the current admin...

...that with W's history of chemical dependency, and some obvious public erratic behavor, the voters would like to have W's medical record made public? I know it wouldn't happen, but it's a reasonable way to bring it to light without us looking like we're playing their game. We're just concerned citizens who want to know the truth.

[truth2power]

113. Throw this into the mix

Whether or not CHB is a credible source on this, WE ALL KNOW SOMETHING IS TERRIBLY WRONG. We know this just by what we've observed regarding his behavior. His snottyness, "divine right of kings" attitude, inappropriate remarks i.e. telling that guy he had a nice face or something, <strange>, all of it.....

We're being asked not to believe our lyin' eyes here. It's not as if the CHB piece comes out of nowhere. There's a foundation for these allegations. It's not as if they're accusing, lets say, Jimmy Carter of having some serious mental illness. We'd probably say, "Where's the evidence?" Even those who are not mental health professionals know there's a disconnect of some kind with Bush, even if they can't put a name to it.

IMO, that puts it a step up on the credibility meter. SOMETHING IS MENTALLY WRONG WITH DUBYA. You don't have to be a psychiatrist to figure that out.

I think it was Harriet Goldhohr Lerner who said, "See what you see and know what you know." She was speaking of women being invalidated by abusive spouses, but it applies here as well.

[emc]

115. why ignore this story

Why, should we ignore this story as not being reputable----what if it is ---are we going to sit back and wait months when if finally comes out and the election is over----dont we as amerikans deserve to know if there is any truth to this story??

If this story were to hit the main press, there would have to be some sort of reply from the white house and it would have to be somewhat turthful for the simple reason that if it were not, then there would be more damage done-----you have, as has been discussed here, people who work for the president, but who are more concerned about the country then their jobs----I would guess there are still some high minded republicans----but sometimes I wonder---

And for the CHB article---the republican who made the comment about distancing himself and fellow republicans from bush----this guy would have to finally come out---there is someone who knows who made this statement and if enough pressure is put on the subject---something is bound to break-----

[HuckleB]

117. Considerations on the Stigma of Mental Illness

Considerations on the Stigma of Mental Illness
http://www.cpa-apc.org/Publications/Archives/CJP/2003/november/guesteditorial.asp

"Stigma, prejudice, and discrimination are closely related and tightly interwoven social constructs. These constructs affect many, based on age, religion, ethnic origin, or socio- economic status. However, a person can potentially move out of these groups, if not physically—as in age or ethnic background—then by moving up the social ladder, which makes the affected person less of a target. Conversely, stigma, prejudice, and discrimination against those with mental illness cut across all classes and social groups, and, to the extent that many mental conditions are chronic and incapacitating, those affected can hardly migrate out of the grip of negative social attitudes. The result is social annihilation that constricts the lives of those with mental illness, preventing them from fully reengaging in their communities and participating in the social activities of their groups of reference.

The general public most frequently makes contact with mental illness through the media or the movies. Unfortunately, the media often depict patients as unpredictable, violent, and dangerous (1), and movies usually follow the popular “psycho- killer” plot (2) long exploited by the cinematographic industry. Associating mental illness with violence helps to perpetuate stigmatizing and discriminatory practices against mentally ill persons; it is only one of many negative stereotypes and common prejudicial attitudes about them.

...

Prejudice often stems from ignorance or unwillingness to find the truth. For example, a study conducted by the Ontario Division of the Canadian Mental Health Association in 1993–1994 found that the most prevalent misconceptions about mental illness include the belief that mental patients are dangerous and violent (88%); that they have a low IQ or are developmentally handicapped (40%); that they cannot function, hold a job, or have anything to contribute (32%); that they lack willpower or are weak and lazy (24%); that they are unpredictable (20%); and finally, that they are to be blamed for their own condition and should just “shape up” (20%) (17). Similarly, a survey among first-year university students in the US found that almost two-thirds believed “multiple personalities” to be a common symptom of schizophrenia, and a poll among the general public found that 55% did not believe that mental illness exists, with only 1% acknowledging that mental illness is a major health problem (18). Some of these myths also surfaced in a study conducted in Calgary during the pilot phase of the World Psychiatric Association (WPA) project Open the Doors (19). Respondents to this study believed that persons with schizophrenia cannot work in regular jobs (72%), have a split personality (47%), and are dangerous to the public because of violent behaviour (14%) (20).

...

Sensational media reports (24,25) reinforce beliefs instilled by movies that depict mental health patients as “uncontrollable killers.” Relatives of the mentally ill assert that the way they are depicted in movies is the most important contributor to stigmatization (26). Movies have stigmatized not only those with mental illness but also psychiatrists, often extending negative stereotypes to portray them as libidinous lechers, eccentric buffoons, and evil-minded, vindictive, and repressive agents of the social system—and in the case of female psychiatrists, as loveless and sexually unfulfilled (27)."

----------

For further reading on the papers brought up in this editorial, see:

Stigma and the Daily News: Evaluation of a Newspaper Intervention
http://www.cpa-apc.org/Publications/Archives/CJP/2003/november/stuart.asp

Interventions to Reduce the Stigma Associated With Severe Mental Illness
http://www.cpa-apc.org/Publications/Archives/CJP/2003/november/gaebel.asp

Determinants of the Public’s Preference for Social Distance From People With Schizophrenia
http://www.cpa-apc.org/Publications/Archives/CJP/2003/november/angermeyer.asp

[Minstrel Boy]

118. Did the "respectable" press inform Americans of Reagan's alzheimer's?

Of course not. Even though the evidence was in everyone's face for years.

Look, we know Bush is sick and that there is something impairing the man. We see it everytime he's before a microphone. It's reflected here in thread after thread of "OMG, did you just see...?"

Don't be surprised the mainstream media isn't touching this, and don't wait for their confirmation. It'll come years after he leaves office, if then. It's only independent "muckrakers" like Capitol Hill Blue that will touch such stories. It's not because the stories are false, it's because the stories are too true.

[Karenina]

184. Really.

The *dauphin is so obviously hanging out on the fire escape BLITZED TO THE TITS. He is unable to construct a sentence extemporaneously. Who ya gonna believe, the *corp media or your lying eyes? Meine ficken Fresse.

[seemslikeadream]

187. Isn't it strange how many people still love to watch the trains

roll by



:hi:

[lil-petunia]

248. which makes some of the nasty comments here kind of funny

considering that this is one of the few posts of reality on the net.

I've read over the readers' section there, they seem to have a wide range of opinions, but they actually seem to be pleasant to each other. That is weirdness in itself.

For the moment, I'm with CHB's opinion piece. It explains so much of how he acts and talks.

[seemslikeadream]

121. DEMOCRATICUNDERGROUND

Is that the name of this place? Or am I at the New York Times?

[Emboldened Chimp]

124. Capitol Hill Blue site now down...

Hmmmm....

[reprobate]

128. It's up now.

[nolabels]

130. Worked for me

“We have to face the very real possibility that the President of the United States is loony tunes,” he says sadly. “That’s not good for my candidates, it’s not good for the party and it’s certainly not good for the country.”



http://www.melonbones.com/cgi-bin/auction.cgi?collectibles_comicbooks&1079473904

[Fridays Child]

132. CAREFUL...the same reporter trashed Bill Clinton in 2000.

And Doug Thompson, the CHB publisher, was, up until a year or so ago, a well-respected freeper. I'm not saying the drug story isn't true. In fact, I'd be amazed if Chimpy were not heavily medicated. All I'm saying is be careful.

[nolabels]

141. The wording in the quotes do sound made up

"Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
Author: Mark Twain

http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/Twenty_years_from_now_you_will_be_more/215220.html

Never trust a story too good or awful to be true

[KamaAina]

133. It'd be nice if some muckraker could find out which drugs

are involved.

If he's eating an Ambien now and then, well, you know, "everyone in D.C. is doing that". Sort of like a "grownup" version of peer pressure. Did you know that over half of politicians have been offered drugs? Take some time to talk to your politician about drugs. Do it today. :-)

If, on the other hand, they've got him on Thorazine, which is entirely possible...

:scared: :scared: :nuke:

[w4rma]

136. Whether this is what is really going on behind the scenes. Bush is psycho.

Bush is totally nuts. Bush is off his rocker. Bush is 5 cans short of a six-pack. Bushh has lost his marbles. He's bonkers and has been bonkers for some time, imho.

Bush, and the whole Republican leadership who has blindly followed the litte-Nero, must be tossed out of power on November 2nd.

[BadGimp]

138. This article seems like Total BS

The quotes are too over the top.

But if they were true I guess the Rovian Mind Control Squad would have been able to keep it under wraps.

IF it is true and it gets out, Bush is finished. Completely finished.

[nolabels]

155. The easy thing to figure on these folks is use of stolen ideas and

poor implementation of how to make them work (partly because they are so cheap and lack imagination) If you haven't figured out where the impetus for this one, you haven't read much. I like to take heart with it though, Disinfo needs the story to be mostly true to work :-)

Disinformation.com

Posted by JonKatz on Tue Feb 19, '02 11:25 AM
from the the-web's-great-promise dept.
Sure, we are being lied to by bloated, corporatized media all the time. What else is new? The great promise of the Net and Web has always been more truth: a great, hyper-linked network of diverse, individual expression, a vast, linked alternative subculture. There is hope. You can go to the Disinformation Web Site to see that idea in action, despite the AOL-ing and MSN-ing of cyberspace. This trove -- its content ranges from "The X-Men" and "Space Mutation" to "The Matrix" to pieces on the Real Jesus and Radiohead -- is what the Web is really about. It offers perspectives you definitely won't find anywhere in the mass media. Don't miss Marty Beckerman's "Death to all Cheerleaders 1." (Marty, whose piece became a book, was canned from a daily newspaper for observing that cheerleaders were "a urine stain on the toilet seat of America.")

The site's left-of-center-pieces -- with generous links to other POVs -- vary wildly in quality and usefulness, but you can find some real gems on disinfo.com. Taken together, the stories on this important, possibly even landmark site are a sharp indictment of the humorless and tepid way the popular media screen out opinion and commentary that's different, provocative or original.
(snip)
http://slashdot.org/features/02/02/18/201219.shtml?tid=149

[hyperboleking]

139. The ends

justify the means, I guess... doesn't matter if it's true if it works, eh?

[2plus2]

144. my point exactly

[hyperboleking]

147. You're a big fan of ...

Herr Goebbels, I take it, who said (essentially) If you tell a lie often enough and loud enough, eventually it will be believed.

Is this an ideal you share? I hope not, friend.

[2plus2]

153. I don't share it.....

but aren't you tired of losing? Can you still believe that one day the "dumbed down" will begin to READ and learn things for themselves? It's a scary thought right...to fight the monsters you become a monster, but when that monster controls everything around you..what else can you do? It's as I said in my earlier post...we're fighting a 4 armed freak with 1 hand behind our backs....

[seemslikeadream]

156. Next stop, Fallujah!

gonna need that handbook, big time!


buycitgo

[DaveFL99]

173. I agree

not only should we fight fire with fire but in this case we all know that * does have some serious mental impairment. That's the difference between this and the Drudge story on Kerry's intern.

[wrate]

247. You have to be smarter than the monster for a victory worth the fight.

If you become the monster to beat the monster, you're still left with a monster once the fight is over.

It is very romantic, I know, but we have to be smarter than that. Smart enough to hold a silver sword in one hand and be able to sever all the monster's arms, and it's head without losing ourselves.

Clinton, Gore, Kennedy, Edwards all gave extraordinary examples of how to do it a few days ago.

IMHO

[seemslikeadream]

154. I know what you mean, hyperboleking, like this?

[Lisa]

145. HE'S depressed and anxious?!

Thanks to him, the rest of us are in need of treatment!

[struggle4progress]

152. Useless, even counter-productive, unless in mainstream press. eom

[AlFrankenFan]

159. Wouldn't surprise me

I would be depressed if I knew I was losing my job come November, too!

[Nashyra]

164. Why can't the Dem's "nicely"

demand an update on his health because he has been "falling" off his bike so often and then say that the public has the right to know what this "pResident" has been or is taking considering he did not disclose his drinking offenses until the last days of the last election. He has taken us into war on poor intelligence and the American people have the right to know what kind of mental condition their president is in. He has admitted that he has abused alcohol and the rumors should be put to rest so that it does not become a problem like his "military records" If the Dems approach it like they are trying to be nice it will force the Repukes to take action and if they want to shoot the messenger they just bring more attention to the question. IMHO

[DaveFL99]

174. 47 years

and I've NEVER fallen off my bike. How many is this for Bush ?

[lovuian]

163. Tremendous Stress, and Bush's not able to cope with it

His conscious probably is giving him so much trouble


Plus the Greed can't be satisfied

[Zech Marquis]

168. hate to say this but

I'm not surprised at all, just that word is starting to leak out like THIS :wow:

[DaveFL99]

170. maybe the best timing on this would be for it to hit in early October

but I definitely think it needs publicity. this isn't going negative it's bringing the truth to light.

[djg21]

175. It's being discussed on Hannity's Board.

It's pretty funny! Please contribute liberally and drive the wingnuts crazy.

http://www.hannity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=75117

On edit: excuse the pun!

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

179. Maybe Bush Shouldn't Have Given Up Drinking

Maybe he functions better when he's completely ripped. I took a film production class at UCLA from film producers Peter Guber and Peter Bart and they told me that George C. Scott, one of America's greatest actors, had to be ripped out of his mind in order to be able to say his lines. The alcohol helped him to get everything else in his life out of focus and concentrate on his work. It is also said that Winston Churchhill could have floated a small warship in all of the Cognac he'd drunk in his life. I don't trust people who don't drink at all, especially for religious reasons. I think Bush's erratic behavior may be attributable to the fact that he's unable to function now without alcohol after having lived on it for years. Maybe getting completely drunk out of his mind in the Oval Office would help Bush at least to be a bit less of a brainwashed zombie puppet. At least he couldn't do any worse than he has been doing in the last 4 years if he were bombed. He might even be more fun. Can you picture a drunken George Bush at the GOP Convention after he's loosened up with a few belts? ... "F#@k ya'll, America! F#@K ever last one o' ya! Hahahahaha"

[Th1onein]

181. Loony tunes!

Bush is loony tunes! Doesn't the irony of that just reach up and grab ya in the ass? Here, all along, Republicans have been using their own ploy of calling Dems crazy and strange and weird, and their own guy is "loony tunes"!

Fucking bastards! How does it feel to have a LOONY TUNES president, boys?

[sofa king]

182. "We also need a President who is alert mentally."

I couldn't have said it better myself. That's why I support John Kerry.

[tlcandie]

183. I thought rich people were never diagnosed or termed

crazy or insane only eccentric? :shrug:

I repeat what someone else said earlier on another thread, "Nov 2nd isn't soon enough...let's just hope it isn't too late to get him out of office!"

[steely]

195. I heard that they were rather large suppositories.

eom

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

197. Thomas Eagleton was diagnosed with depression

was hospitalized 3 times and underwent electroshock therapy. It cost him a Vice Presidential candidacy due to the media uproar. If Bush has been medically diagnosed with chronic depression, it should also be a fact made known to the American public. The potential for a President's mental breakdown, especially in a time of war, is an issue that is just about as big as it gets. Unlike sex scandals or blow jobs, mental problems affect the ability of the President to make decisions. Bush's need for constant vacations, his frequent glazed looks on his face such as during the 7 minutes in the classroom on 911 just might be signs of mental breakdown. Why this isn't a major issue in the media amazes me.

[TexasBushwhacker]

204. I'd forgotten about Eagleton

As someone who's lived with depression my entire adult life (it runs in my family BTW) the stigma of "mental illness" bothers me, but one has to question whether or not someone dealing with depression is up to a job as strenuous as President. I had the same question about Cheney being fit because of his heart problems, not that I would have voted for Bush in any case. This presents an interesting conundrum though. A big deal is made every year about the President getting a physical, but when their ability to make sound judgements is certainly every bit as important as their physical health, should they be given a clean bill of mental health each year as well?

[johnfunk]

202. To the skeptics here: CHB story should be taken seriously...

It rings completely true with regard to the behavior of an untreated dry drunk. Bush has never sought recovery from his alcohol addiction.

Also see:

Dry Drunk -- Is Bush making a cry for help?

Bush and Dry Drunk Syndrome

Bus(c)h Country -- Bottoms Up to the Dry Drunk

[jdj]

203. I believe there is something wrong, just not this p.c. crap.

I W. thinks he's depressed he should try to imagine how the families of the 900 soldiers he had slaughtered feel.

[DrBB]

209. Lots of things "ring true."

Hm, let's see, what would it take for a story like this to actually matter?

The issue is not whether a bunch of tinfoil-hatters eager to believe the worst about W (I count myself in that group) will jump on the story, but whether there's any thing substantial enough to puncture the semi-comatose daze of the public and the media. The kind of iron-clad, concrete evidence that would be required to jam this story through that thick defensive barrier of obliviousness is not going to be found short of Bush dropping into a drooling DT frenzy live on national TV.

I guarantee you Capitol Hill Blue, with it's rather dubious credibility record, ain't gonna do it. Do I believe it? Hey, I'm an easy sell, as are most of the people on this board--so what? Capitol Hill Blue talks a good game, but ultimately this is pure left-wing masturbation material.

[Minstrel Boy]

205. Bush to Amish: "I trust that God speaks through me"

As Molly Ivins says, with considerable understatement,

"President Bush’s slightly alarming claim to the Amish on July 9 that God speaks through him — that’s what he said, God speaks through him —raises some troubling prospects."
http://wvgazette.com/section/Columns/2004072714

Was that God saying "keep those motherfuckers away from me"?

[lakeguy]

215. Hey, God speaks through me too!

He told me Bush is toast:D

[BuckeFushe]

219. Downers, bummer

I guess Cheney really is running the country.

[saigon68]

233. Cheney IS running the country

take it to the Bank

[Tight_rope]

237. That's why Haliburton got another contract on Monday...Not surprised!

[saigon68]

258. Just Follow the $$$$$$$$

That's why I am so angry. I have seen this SHILLING before. It is so open and brazen and the SHEEP go on caring about Kobe, Michael Jackson, Scott Peterson and the newest "victim" forget her name from Utah.

[groovedaddy]

220. Read: "Bush on the Couch"

by Justin Frank, M.D. (shrink)
http://www.harpercollins.com/catalog/book_xml.asp?isbn=0060736704

[daleo]

221. Nixon, Reagan, Bush - is there a curse on recent Republican presidents?

Nixon - "It also brings back memories of Richard Nixon’s final days when the soon-to-resign President wondered the halls and talked to portraits of former Presidents. The stories didn’t emerge until after Nixon left office."

Reagan - "Veteran White House watchers say the ability to control information about Bush’s health, either physical or mental, is similar to Ronald Reagan’s second term when aides managed to conceal the President’s increasing memory lapses that signaled the onslaught of Alzheimer’s Disease."

Bush - "Although the exact drugs Bush takes to control his depression and behavior are not known, White House sources say they are “powerful medications” designed to bring his erratic actions under control."

[opihimoimoi]

222. The man is a nut case//// OMG... "Houston, we have a nutcase

in the White House......Could ya get the exterminators???"

[emad]

225. Awesome post! Here's Fidel Castro's opinon, as cited in Pravda:

From:

Fidel Castro's speech about the implications of Bush been a "recovered alcoholic"
07/28/2004 13:01

:

SNIP:
"Dr. Justin A. Frank in a now famous book called "Bush on the Couch"
.... begins by saying that it is important to scientifically define whether Bush was an alcoholic, or if he still is one........


Continuing his analysis, Dr. Frank indicates:"Two questions that the press seems particularly determined to ignore have hung silently in the air since before Bush took office: Is he still drinking? And if not, is he impaired by all the years he did spend drinking? Both questions need to be addressed in any serious assessment of his psychological state". (p.48)

With regard to the first question, he points out the possibility that Bush is managing his anxiety with medication to keep him off alcohol and he makes special reference to his strange behaviour at press conferences. On this point he says: "In writing about Bush"s halting appearance in a press conference just before the start of the Iraq War, Washington Post media critic Tom Shales speculated that "the president may have been ever so slightly medicated".
SNIP END

More more more:
http://english.pravda.ru/world/20/91/368/13573_Castro.html

[emad]

226. Junior does a line of coke with Cretin............

[seemslikeadream]

252. Thanks for that pic, emad

definetly needs a tiny bit of photoshop!

[On the Road]

227. If It's Something Like Paxil, It's Not too Worrisome

OOH, if by "powerful" drug they mean something like Thorazine or Stellazine, that's another story. That can freeze your cognitive abilites and put you in a zombie-like trance. And God knows, GWB can't afford to have his cognitive abilites get any lower.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

228. "a zombie-like trance"

Maybe someone wants The ManChimpian Candidate to get all hyper and then bring him down into a zombie-trance. It might make him easily influenced and manipulated. The person who administers drugs to a President is hopefully someone acting solely in the interest of the United States.

[nolabels]

230. It's very easy to produce episodes with this stuff

It kind of looks like a drug induced manic-depressive type thing to me.



(snip on third page)
Two years later, in July 1992, another article appeared, this time in the Archives of General Psychiatry. Again, the article had two senior researchers among its authors, one of whom was a leading expert on akathisia. The psychiatrists stressed in the report that, prior to going on Prozac, none of their patients had a history of significant suicidal behavior. "All described their distress as an intense and novel somatic-emotional state; all reported an urge to pace that paralleled the intensity of the distress; all experienced suicidal thoughts at the peak of their restless agitation; and all experienced a remission of their agitation, restlessness, pacing urge, and suicidality after the fluoxetine was discontinued."

The finding that these problems emerge soon after an SSRI drug is taken, and then disappear soon after the drug is withdrawn, provides compelling evidence that the problem is often the drug and not, as the makers of SSRIs have insisted, the depression. Anthony Rothschild and Carol Locke, also of Harvard Medical School, reported three such cases in the Journal of Clinical Psychiatry in 1991. All three individuals had previously attempted suicide while being treated with Prozac – in fact, each had jumped from great heights and had managed to survive. In turn, all three had been put back on Prozac, only to complain of the same strange desire to kill themselves.

"I tried to kill myself because of these anxiety symptoms. It was not so much the depression," said one of the individuals, a 25-year-old woman. Another, a 47-year-old man, complained that "this is exactly what happened the last time I was on , and I feel like jumping off a cliff again." Reflecting on these cases, the Harvard researchers stressed that patients need to know that such overwhelming symptoms are the side effects of medication, and are treatable. "Our patients had concluded their illness had taken such a dramatic turn for the worse that life was no longer worth living."
(snip)
http://www.prozacspotlight.org/lillysuicidestour/index.html

[TexasBushwhacker]

231. Say what you will about the source

The fact of the matter is that we cannot trust the mainstream media to be straight with us about something like this if they know about it.

Some things are disturbing about the whole anti-depressant thing. One is the issue of the depression itself. As a born again Christian, Bush would likely be resistant to taking psychoactive medication in the first place, no matter how necessary. It's much more likely that he would try to deal with his depression and anxiety through his religion. That is all well and good if it works, but if it doesn't, it just postpones the process of getting well.

Another thing is the possibility, as a recovered alcoholic, that anxiety and depression have caused him to start drinking again (assuming he really quit in the first place of course). It is BAD to combine alcohol with any psychoactive drug - anti-depressants, anti-anxiety, tranquilizers, etc. The combination of alcohol with these drugs is synergistic, and could account for lack of clarity in his thinking, lack of balance (the falls off the bicycle), etc.

As the daughter of a bipolar (manic-depressive) father, I can't help but wondering if that's Bush's problem. In their manic phase, bipolar people can be VERY confindent and charismatic.

Symptoms of mania include: excessive euphoria; extreme irritability or distractibility; racing, rapidly shifting thoughts; quick, pressured speech; decreased need for sleep; unrealistic or grandiose beliefs in abilities; increased sexual drive, risky sexual behavior; reckless, impulsive behavior; abuse of drugs or alcohol; and in extreme cases, hallucinations, delusions or paranoia.

[cthrumatrix]

232. i agree...lesser sources have broken "factual stories" the mainstream

will not touch.

[nolabels]

234. "we cannot trust the mainstream media" (repeat till hurling occurs)

My take is for what ever it is they are reporting on, you can bank on that there is something diametrically opposed to it that they are not reporting about on purpose.

The biggest reason for corporate mainstream media existence is the cover(protection)it provides for the people that don't want others to know what really is going on.

Without that little hair pin holding up the mix, it would disappear like a vapid puff of smoke in a tornado.


http://soupnazi.org/misc/

[seemslikeadream]

235. Take a look at these postings from Voice of the White House

at this link, go to the archieves to find them all.

http://www.tbrnews.org/index.htm
May 31, 2004

“Bush has told the CIA chief to either resign or be forced to take the entire blame for the Iraq prison scandal. It is always pleasant to see how much trouble you can cause and still not get into trouble yourself. You have been posting my comments (but not all of them…why?) and one of the staff in the White House replied. You posted his objections, gave me the courtesy of rebutting him and it all went up. This fellow made the mistake of putting down his DoD address at the White House with disastrous results. His address was on the DISA system and after your posting, the system was immediately attacked from outside and there were serious problems. Their Niper and Sniper nets were put in danger and there is now hell to pay here. They still haven’t found me, not for want of trying, but they do hate your site. Someone here said you were a “Satanist Communist bastard” with “no respect for what our wonderful President is trying to do.” That’s a direct quote, by the way. I have it on my pocket recorder in case you are interested. Bush had a Rose Garden Experience with the tame members of the press. Questions, known in advance, were asked of him and he responded with his coached answers. He didn’t look very good all in all. Someone asked him about rising gas prices and like some small child, he squalled “It’s all the fault of Congress! They wouldn’t pass my wonderful energy bill so blame them.” Pathetic. We have rising gas prices because the Bush people have invaded an Arab country, declared a religious Crusade against the evil Muslims and generally behaved like a bull in a china shop. Since Muslims control most of the world’s oil, we wonder why they took so long to retaliate. The poor Saudis are caught between the rock of Arab fundamentalism and the hard place of American business needs. When they announced that they were unilaterally going to increase production at Bush’s strong demand, the fundamentalists attacked foreign workers there, killing quite a few and scaring the shit out of the rest. The survivors are now fleeing in huge numbers, causing terrible damage to Saudi oil production. This was a shot across the Saud family bows and now we have to see which way they will jump. If they support Bush, they will also suffer more “incidents” and eventually be toppled. If they support the fundamentalists, the Bush people will threaten to invade them. Of course Bush can’t do this because he can’t even conquer Iraq so this is an idle threat and the Arabs know it. If gas prices continue to escalate, Bush is doomed in November. In my opinion, he is doomed anyway. If this trend isn’t reversed, people here are afraid of criminal actions, impeachment proceedings (which are unlikely now) and other, less pleasant things. The Bush people hate anyone who does not agree with them and slavishly obey the President’s every wish, tolerate the British, love Israel and detest China (a growing business rival.) The security people are now having a full plate and people like me who leak have dropped a notch on the screen but we are still there. You will see a lot more very serious leaks before it is over and it won’t be over until November, we all hope. Nixon had the character (?) to resign when he saw he had lost the game but they will have to drag Bush screaming out of the Oval Office. The rest of them will all flee to Israel where they will be safe from prosecution. That’s Israel’s problem in the end. Arab suicide bombers on one side and the Neo Cons on the other.”

June 4, 2004

“Here is an interesting conundrum for you and your people to chew on: The Pentagon is hastily moving US troops stationed in Europe and Asia either to Iraq or to nearby areas like Italy. They are moving two divisions from Germany, one from South Korea and others from different areas. Also, main headquarters is being shifted from England to Italy. Now couple this information with the extension of tours of duty of all American military units now on active service, Kerrey’s “backdoor draft” and we have an interesting situation. If Bush wants to withdraw from Iraq within a month, why all of these troop movements? I had dinner with a friend of my wife’s whose husband is a civilian with the DoD and from that source I learn that we are not going to get out of Iraq. Loud proclamations that we are going to leave will be made but at the very last moment, the new puppet régime there, bought and paid for by the US, will make an “impassioned appeal” to Bush to allow American troops to remain “for just a little while” until the fledgling new and democratic Iraqi government can get safely off the ground. This request, as I understand it, was written in the White House, sent to the Pentagon and forwarded to Iraq. The scenario has been carefully scripted, down to the last “sad but resolute” GI interview from a soldier that really wants to go home but realizes now that our beloved President has the vision and compassion to assist the growth of democracy in an area where it has never been before. Sounds just like something Josef Stalin would order done. No, we are not going to get out of Iraq at all; we will be there for at least five more years according to three sources who ought to know. Recruitment has effectively stopped so the military won’t release those men whose tours are over. They will stay in either until Bush is defeated in November or, if he is reelected, he can institute the draft he and his people have carefully planned for all along. When I said a few days ago that the witch hunt for leakers has died down, I was wrong. It has just gone underground but is still just as intense. Bush is in a crazy rage about all the resistance he has been facing. He believes very firmly that he is acting on the orders of God Almighty and that anyone, be it the head of the CIA or some rogue reporter, must be punished for daring to thwart the Will of God! Some of the saner staffers here are becoming distinctly edgy and some are thinking of quitting but God help any of them who quit and talk! They have signed agreements to never, never discuss anything that they have learned while in the White House. I said before that Bush was a mean, vicious man and it is starting to slop out of the Presidential bedpan into the halls of power. I said there is something really wrong with this man (I personally think that he is as crazy as a loon…an unscientific diagnosis but given what I have seen and heard of him, not inaccurate) and events will prove me right!”

Who knows but it is interesting!

[nolabels]

243. "Crazy Monkey and the rest of posse knows it's days are numbered.........

If something drastic is not done and they knew it many moons ago. I really don't think it matters if he crazy as loon like he is (they really kinda use that as a tool). It is the cabal around him that are running everything that is the problem(they might go to Jail or worse with the right kind of prosecution). Time and time again the 'Crazy Monkey' gets set out to do his work while the plans a set in motion by the cabal for this Bushit stuff to go down

The negatives even with a whole lot of corporate spin are too deep (and I know, most people know that,duh). You have to take them by N*ts, they set their plans and continue on, public opinion doesn't detour them much. If anybody has not noticed by now, 'WAKE UP'

Kerry 'will not change foreign policy'
By David Rennie in Boston
(Filed: 29/07/2004)

America's allies expecting a shift in United States foreign policy from a President John Kerry should think again, his top advisers said yesterday.


Instead, members of Mr Kerry's inner circle could promise only "stark contrasts" of personality and style between President George W Bush and their candidate, who they vowed would be a "hands-on, engaged, diplomat-in-chief".

Rand Beers, the national security adviser to the Kerry campaign, opened a high-level briefing with a warning: "In many ways, the goals of the two administrations are in fact not all that different."

Mr Kerry has come under growing criticism from foreign policy commentators for failing to offer more than the blandest proposals that he would restore frayed alliances and behave more respectfully of allies and international bodies.

But yesterday another top adviser, Richard Holbrooke, offered no details on policy questions ranging from Iraq to the Middle East or America's withdrawal from the Kyoto Treaty and the International Criminal Court
(snip)
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/07/29/wus129.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/07/29/ixnewstop.html

(he has to run this way, for various reasons, if you haven't noticed)

[goclark]

240. What are we waiting for!!!

After reading this thread and others, we KNOW Bush has major,major mental problems. We can call it all the fancy names but what the public should know by now is..Our President is hanging on for dear life.

We all KNOW that he is nuts. A 2nd grade child could see his Goat Episode and KNOW that there is a huge problem.

What are we waiting for? There is a mental case set to push the button and we are trying to wait until the correct news source tells us it is true.

Hello! the New York Times will never tell us it is true.
Rush will never tell us it is true.

Even if we just go on the fact that he SAT in a chair and did nothing while New York was on fire PROVES that there is a real mental problem.

Think about this,we Democrats let Rove tell the world that he set there because "he didn't want to upset the children." He wanted to "keep them calm." We KNOW that is a LIE!

Yet, we sweet wimpy Democrats are afraid to say it LOUD and CLEAR...
"What sane person,that was responsible for this country, would sit and read a book to children while we were ON FIRE!!!!!" :mad:

[seemslikeadream]

242. TRUTH TO POWER TRUTH TO POWER TRUTH TO POWER

[goclark]

246. That is one awesome photo!

May I live to see that day!

[Tight_rope]

236. I believe this is all true. "THE TRUTH ALWAYS COMES OUT IN THE WASH"!

[goclark]

241. What year will the Wash Come Out?

If the wash is not exposed before this election,a mental case will remain in the WH for 1,2,3,4 more years.


Our country deserves better than that,they need to know this now.

[lil-petunia]

249. They hid FDR's illness

They hid Kennedy's illness
They sure seem to be hiding Bush's problems. Why else do they script press conferences and not call on aggressive reporters? AND WHY THE HELL does the media let him get away with that shit?

the more I read, the more this article seems acccurate.

[TexasBushwhacker]

253. True, strictly to keep America's confidence high

The press had a genteman's agreement that FDR would not be shown in his wheelchair. We know now that JFK was pretty medicated, but when did that info come to light? Nixon's paranoia didn't really get talked about until after his resignation. It wasn't until Reagan's second term that people openly started questioning who if THE PRESIDENT was really the one in charge. Even so, I don't think the mainstream press ever went after him aggressivly. Quayle was Daddy Bush's VP and was so incredibly weak that there was no question that Bush Sr. was calling the shots. While Hillary's influence on Bill Clinton pissed many people off, I think most (love him or hate him) still felt he was in charge. The press's willingness to cover Clinton's blowjobs in minute detail shows where their priorites are.

So that brings us to Bush. The question is, how much does the mainstream press know about the President's health, when do they know and when do they report it? So far, I would say they probably always know, they know pretty early and they never share the info with us. They've yet to prove otherwise.

[goclark]

255. Good pts. but this was before the Internet

Now that people can instantly click into information,it is a new day.
It is so much harder to keep secrets now.

And as far as Bush is concerned,why should we letthem take a pass?

If they could expose Clinton's private parts we can expose the Bush Boys disabilities to lead this nation for 4 , that's 1,,,2,,,,3,,,4 more years.

[PATRICK]

260. Sounds like credible fiction

Something about the breezy way the tell-all sources give details that perhaps only a closely watched clique of personal physicians should know.

Better than "conspiracy theory" that relies only on credible guesses, something almost tongue in cheek compared to the rants about the Clintons assassinating Foster.

Something to file away in waiting for future revelations which would be unusual but not unprecedented for the GOP. (Ike's affair)

The source sounds pretty calm for someone an assassin would be stalking by now. And the reporters don't seem all that concerned- or excited- about pressing their claim to authenticity. More like fishing the lazy river.