How US fuelled myth of Zarqawi the mastermind

[Barrett808]

How US fuelled myth of Zarqawi the mastermind
By Adrian Blomfield outside Fallujah
(Filed: 04/10/2004)

Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the terrorist leader believed to be responsible for the abduction of Kenneth Bigley, is 'more myth than man', according to American military intelligence agents in Iraq.

Several sources said the importance of Zarqawi, blamed for many of the most spectacular acts of violence in Iraq, has been exaggerated by flawed intelligence and the Bush administration's desire to find "a villain" for the post-invasion mayhem.

US military intelligence agents in Iraq have revealed a series of botched and often tawdry dealings with unreliable sources who, in the words of one source, "told us what we wanted to hear".

"We were basically paying up to $10,000 a time to opportunists, criminals and chancers who passed off fiction and supposition about Zarqawi as cast-iron fact, making him out as the linchpin of just about every attack in Iraq," the agent said.

"Back home this stuff was gratefully received and formed the basis of policy decisions. We needed a villain, someone identifiable for the public to latch on to, and we got one."

(more)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/04/wirq04.xml

[jab105]

1. GOLDSTEIN!!

n/t

[kayell]

3. Something I've wondered about Orwell...

Does Orwell apply so well to the BFEE, because totalitarian governments ALWAYS follow specific paths on their way up? or does the BFEE resemble Orwell because they all sat down and read 1984 and took notes?

Can't you see it now? "Hey Rummy, here's a great idea on pg. 87. We should try that"

[UpInArms]

22. I've read lots of Orwell

and imho, totalitarian regimes always follow the same playbook - read more here:

http://mars.acnet.wnec.edu/~grempel/courses/stalin/

http://www.historyguide.org/europe/lecture10.html

http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/animalfarm/3/

[UpInArms]

23. self deleted - double post

ISP problems :(

[kayell]

2. "We needed a villain, someone identifiable for the public to latch on to,

to replace Osama"

Look over there - it's Emmanuel Goldstein!

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

39. Wasn't Saddam Hussein last month's Goldstein? And OBL before him?

It's hard for a fella to keep up.

[UpInArms]

4. ahhhh - the invisible terrorist

Once upon a time, there were four people; their names were Everybody, Somebody, Nobody and Anybody. Whenever there was an terrorist job to be done,
Everybody was sure that Somebody would do it. Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it. When Nobody did it, Everybody got angry because it was Everybody’s job.

Everybody thought that Somebody would do it, but Nobody realized that Nobody would do it.
So consequently Everybody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have done in the first place.

[Dhalgren]

8. That was excellent! Thank you!

[Forkboy]

35. I have that on my fridge!

:)

[atreides1]

5. So

This means that the US bombings of Fallujah, based on "reliable" intel
is crap, and they really are just the US version of the SS killing
Iraqi civilians just for the hell of it.

[Disturbed]

6. SS killing

The bombings are meant to demoralize the population; to lessen the support for the Resistence. In order to force the population to submit to Colonization the US kills and destroys until the population is subdued.

Bush mentioned al Zargawi in the debate.

Al Zargawi
Bush and the Neo Fascists passed up three opps to assasinate al Zarqawi because he was part of their claim about terrorist ties to Saddam. They knew this was a fuckin' lie. Now if al-Zarqawi actually exists and is responsible for over 700 deaths, it is indirectly a responsibilty of the US Neo Fascists.

[atreides1]

9. It Didn't Work In Vietnam

I believe that the US tried this same tactic in Vietnam, and it didn't work there, now did it.

As for demoralizing the population, that doesn't seem to working to well either, the more they kill, the more hated the US military becomes, as well as American civilians, and anyone else working for the US.

As for Fallujah, it's receiving the same treatment that the Warsaw Ghetto received. Only this time it's the US military that keeps claiming to have "reliable" intelligence, like the good intel they had last week when they dropped a bomb on a house that they said did not have any civilians in it, according to their 'source'.

It was strange that they pulled out children from the targeted house, that wasn't occupied by any civilians, according to their source.

At least the SS was honest about why they were destroying the Ghetto.

[daleo]

7. If al-Zarqawi didn't exist, they would have to invent them

Actually, it turns out that they did. Great deal for an unscrupulous Iraqi though - score a few bucks and get rid of an enemy by declaring al-Zarqawi is staying at his place. Same m.o. as Chalabi. Of course, you need willing and/or gullible fools for it to work.

[pinniped]

10. Pay me 10,000 USD and I'll tell you it was al-Zarqawi

What a surprise.

The guy is all over the Middle East cutting off heads, kidnapping civilian workers, organizing car bombs, suicide bombers, roadside bombs, safehouses and media a/v tapes. Plus he's involved in many more activities too numerous to list.

Does he even have time to pray five times a day?

[bemildred]

11. He's been dead over a year.

But apparently his ghost is a very effective organizer ...

[Disturbed]

13. Neo Fascist LIES

These scum lie about anything and everything that either makes them look, makes their opposition look bad, discredits the oppostion etc. The Neo Fascists spew out lies and count on the concept that no one will check up on the their statements of half truths or blatant lies. The only way to combat their lies is for high level people to counter their lies with proof of the actual facts.

[Barrett808]

15. I've often thought so -- is there a link that proved this? n/t

[bemildred]

16. No proof I know of.

Jihad Unspun reports it. What they say exactly is that while there
are resistance groups fighting in his name, he's been dead over
a year. I dunno why they would say that if they didn't think it true.

But, If he was alive, I'd expect him to try to obfuscate the
situation, so you cannot rely on much. I mainly believe he is dead
because I remember the report of the bombing, and when you get first
person reporting out of Iraq, it always says the "foreign fighters"
are a miniscule presence, whereas he is dragged out by the coalition
on any and every convenient occasion.

Now, if you were going to pick a boogey man to use for PR purposes
would you not prefer a dead one, so as to be sure he would not
queer any of your propaganda ploys? One wants "Emmanuel Goldstein"
not some real guy that might show up and prove you a liar.

[Minstrel Boy]

24. a couple of links

Iraq militants claim al-Zarqawi is dead
Al Qaida-linked extremist suspected of planning attacks

The Associated Press
Updated: 6:31 a.m. ET March 4, 2004BAGHDAD, Iraq - A Jordanian extremist suspected of bloody suicide attacks in Iraq was killed some time ago in U.S. bombing and a letter outlining plans for fomenting sectarian war is a forgery, a statement allegedly from an insurgent group west of the capital said.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4446084/


Evidence tying an Al Qaeda-linked terrorist to the latest Iraqi
bombings is murkier than U.S. officials are letting on
WEB EXCLUSIVE
By Rod Nordland
Newsweek
March 07, 2004

March 6 - The stark fact is that we don't even know for sure how many
legs Abu Mussab al-Zarqawi has, let alone whether the Jordanian
terrorist, purportedly tied to al Qaeda, is really behind the latest
outrages in Iraq....
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4466324/

[Barrett808]

30. Cool, thanks. n/t

[Nlighten1]

12. And the American media played right along.

We really, really, really need to get a Kerry administration to bust up this corporate media.

[Disturbed]

14. Corp. Media ...

needs to be prosecuted for their complicty with the Neo Fascists. Charges of their lies, half truths, misrepresentations, diceptions need to be brought forth.

[G_j]

17. Cheney & Bush Mislead About Hussein/Zarqawi Connection

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2454381&mesg_id=2454381

Cheney & Bush Mislead About Hussein/Zarqawi Connection


THE DAILY MIS-LEAD
< www.Misleader.org >
===============================

Vice President Cheney and President Bush have repeatedly claimed that al-Qaeda had a working relationship with Saddam Hussein which justified the invasion of Iraq. The key piece of evidence Cheney and President Bush have used to support this claim was that Hussein harbored Abu Musab al Zarqawi - a suspected associated of al-Qaeda. For example, on 6/21/04 Cheney said "Mr.
Zarqawi, who is in Baghdad today, is an al Qaeda associate who took refuge in Baghdad, found sanctuary and safe harbor there before we ever launched into Iraq."<1> President Bush said on 6/15/04 "Zarqawi's the best evidence of a connection to al Qaeda affiliates and al Qaeda."<2> One problem: there is no evidence to support these claims.

Knight Ridder reports "a new CIA assessment undercuts the White House claim that Saddam Hussein maintained ties to al Qaeda, saying there is no conclusive evidence that the regime harbored terrorist Abu Musab al Zarqawi."<3> According to a senior U.S. intelligence official "The evidence is that Saddam never gave Zarqawi anything."<4> Ironically, the assessment was requested by Cheney.<5>

Sources:

1. "CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown," CNN, 06/21/04, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=1333383&l=60800 .
2. "Bush stands by al Qaeda, Saddam link," CNN, 6/15/04, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=1333383&l=60801 .
3. "Iraq-al Qaeda tie called unlikely," Miami Herald, 10/05/04,
http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=1333383&l=60802 .
4. Ibid, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=1333383&l=60802 .
5. Ibid, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=1333383&l=60802 .

Visit www.Misleader.org for more about Bush Administration distortion. »

[Steelangel]

18. So in other words,

we need to call Ghostbusters to catch that 'invisible terrorist'!

[leftchick]

19. So much for that "flood of foreign fighters"....

<snip>

However, fresh intelligence emerging from around Fallujah, the rebel-held city that is at the heart of the insurgency, suggests that, despite a high degree of fragmentation, the insurgency is led and dominated not by Arab foreigners but by members of Iraq's Sunni minority.


Human intelligence about Zaqawi is minimal
Pentagon estimates have put the number of foreign fighters in the region of 5,000. However, one agent said: "The overwhelming sense from the information we are now getting is that the number of foreign fighters does not exceed several hundred and is perhaps as low as 200. From the information we have gathered we have to conclude that Zarqawi is more myth than man. He isn't in the calibre of what many politicians want to believe he is.

"At some stage, and perhaps even now, he was almost certainly behind some of the kidnappings. But if there is a main leader of the insurgency he would be an Iraqi. The insurgency, though, is not nearly so centralised to talk of a structured leadership."

Military intelligence officials complain that their reports to Washington, are largely being ignored. They accuse the Pentagon of over-reliance on electronic surveillance and aerial and satellite reconnaissance carried out for the CIA.

[PATRICK]

20. Iraqis skeptical but supportive

Maybe another goal was to make a Zorro myth that would lure new resistance recruits into traps, something the Germans did in their occupied territories. Funny, when NPR talked to various Iraqis they had no firm conviction there was such a person and certainly no contacts or proofs.

But not in the Land of Make Believe. Here it is Gospel and that is definitely the main purpose, for American consumption.

This is one of many consistent Bush myths that lead one to suspect that Osama is dead, not provable, but easily assumed, and any attempt to discredit those ludicrous tapes and and infrequent messages never gets to the forefront of the American brain.

They love their bogeymen. They should have a Hall of Fame, librul wing, terror wing, ethnic stereotype wing, etc.

[lucky777]

21. One-legged dead guy really gets around!

First they said he had one leg, then they said that he was dead, then he was beheading people on videos. He's really Johnny on the Spot.

[robbedvoter]

25. This guy's name will come up a lot tonight - a Zarkawi thread (death,

lives, limps) would be most welcome.

[Art_from_Ark]

26. Speaking of myths and masterminds...

I seem to recall something about some guy in a cave in one of the most isolated places of the world that was able to devise a highly sophisticated plan that would confuse the entire US government on a certain late summer morning not so long ago...

[peterh]

27. Ahhh yes….more myth than man…..

Is he a one man or a group….
Does he have one leg or two….
Is he in one place or everywhere….
Is he part of al-Qaeda or separate….


Well, if there’s one thing we know for sure….it’s that Rummy has no friggin’ idea himself…..


http://www.peterbergen.com/clients/PeterBergen/pbergen.nsf/Web00002Show?OpenForm&ParentUNID=332E4ACF3A857A2E85256EBF0063AB66

"The central question the administration has failed to answer is: Was there guidance or direction from the Al Qaeda leadership to Zarqawi?" Mr. Cressey, the former counterterrorism official, told me. "The evidence presented so far is there was not." At a briefing on June 17, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld seemed to agree with that assessment, saying of Mr. Zarqawi that "someone could legitimately say he's not Al Qaeda."

Mr. Zarqawi's connections to Saddam Hussein are equally tenuous. After fleeing Afghanistan, he probably spent as much time living in Iran as in Iraq. What Mr. Cheney described as the "poisons factory" Mr. Zarqawi ran was actually in the Kurdish area of northern Iraq, an area protected by American jets since 1991. Mr. Rumsfeld had more control than Saddam Hussein over that part of Iraq.

As for the medical treatment Mr. Zarqawi supposedly received in Baghdad, for some time American officials thought it was a leg amputation. However, the footage of Mr. Zarqawi in the video of Mr. Berg's execution seems to show a man in possession of both limbs. And last week Mr. Zarqawi released an audiotape on a jihadist Web site containing a blistering critique of Saddam Hussein, whom he described as a "devil" who "killed the innocent."

Mr. Zarqawi is a ruthless murderer, and capturing or killing him would be a major step toward pacifying Iraq. But if he is, as President Bush has said, the "best evidence" of a link between Saddam Hussein and Al Qaeda, the administration's case is a weak one.

[Disturbed]

28. Is there any real proof...

of the allegation that the Bush Admin. had the opp to attack the "terrorist camp" in the Kurdish territory three times and passed on this opp?

[krkaufman]

29. It would've been nice to have this a couple of days ago...

... given Cheney's continued flailing Zarqawi's name during the debate.

[Barrett808]

31. Yes, it would have been nice for Edwards to rub his nose in this n/t

[Supersedeas]

32. Bush desire to find a villain and an October event to tout?

[progressivebydesign]

33. He'll be our October surprise!!! I guarantee it!

Because the Bushies have spent so much time and money propping this guy up as the worst thing next to Osama Bin Forgotten, and Bush will NEVER kill or capture OBL, because of his relationship with OBL's family and the Saudis.. The Zarqawi guy is the new OBL. Though he supposedly is missing a leg, and was ill last year, he's been quite active.. so they said.

THey're setting us up! He'll be the BIG find. Too bad OUR media doesn't write these things. Damn.

[bloom]

34. "But let's look at what we know about Mr. Zarqawi." - Cheney 10/5/2004

"We know he was running a terrorist camp, training terrorists in Afghanistan prior to 9/11. We know that when we went into Afghanistan that he then migrated to Baghdad. He set up shop in Baghdad, where he oversaw the poisons facility up at Kermal (ph), where the terrorists were developing ricin and other deadly substances to use.

We know he's still in Baghdad today. He is responsible for most of the major car bombings that have killed or maimed thousands of people. He's the one you will see on the evening news beheading hostages.

He is, without question, a bad guy. He is, without question, a terrorist. He was, in fact, in Baghdad before the war, and he's in Baghdad now after the war.

The fact of the matter is that this is exactly the kind of track record we've seen over the years. We have to deal with Zarqawi by taking him out, and that's exactly what we'll do."

_____

[donkeyotay]

36. Yes, let's look at the knowable knowns

1) "We know he was running a terrorist camp, training terrorists in Afghanistan prior to 9/11.

But we did nothing. See #6.

2) We know that when we went into Afghanistan that he then migrated to Baghdad. He set up shop in Baghdad, where he oversaw the poisons facility up at Kermal (ph), where the terrorists were developing ricin and other deadly substances to use.

Even tho we tracked his migration, and despite the vast investigation into WMDs, we did nothing. See #6.

3) We know he's still in Baghdad today. He is responsible for most of the major car bombings that have killed or maimed thousands of people. He's the one you will see on the evening news beheading hostages.

But we haven't caught him. Perhaps we need him on the evening news. See #6.

4) He is, without question, a bad guy. He is, without question, a terrorist. He was, in fact, in Baghdad before the war, and he's in Baghdad now after the war.

I thought he was in Afghanistan, but no matter. See #6.

5) The fact of the matter is that this is exactly the kind of track record we've seen over the years.

See #6.

6)We have to deal with Zarqawi by taking him out, and that's exactly what we'll do."

When?

[bloom]

37. and these people make "Americans" feel "safer"

:eyes:

[struggle4progress]

38. kick kick kick

:kick: :kick: :kick:

[leftchick]

40. and kick again...

:kick: