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emad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 10:35 AM
Original message
US sex abuse trial for ex-priest
BY Jane Little
BBC religious affairs correspondent

Paul Shanley has pleaded not guilty to the charges

A former priest at the centre of the child sex abuse scandal in the US Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Boston is to face trial on Tuesday.
Paul Shanley has pleaded not guilty to 10 counts of child rape and six of indecent assault and battery.

He is alleged to have raped and molested several boys from 1979 to 1989. He has since been defrocked.

His trial casts a spotlight once again on systematic cover-ups by the Roman Catholic hierarchy in Boston.

A former "street priest" who is alleged to have publicly advocated sex between men and boys, the 71-year-old Paul Shanley stands out for the number and gravity of the abuse claims against him.
More:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3736526.stm
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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. Ohhh man, this guy should FRY
I'm usually not for the Death Penalty, it's used too much; but THIS guy? Damn, a founding member of NAMBLA? A predator on hundreds if not thousands of children for DECADES?!

Fry him & fry him good! Just give him a taste of what's waiting for him; and I don't mean stupid South Park's Satan Hawaiian Picnics!
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TaleWgnDg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. no, Shanley was not as you say a "founder" of NAMBLA . . .
read the BosGlobe articles (below hyperlink) and your numbers are grossly overstated . . . sheesh.
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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Father Paul Shanly, according to Vanity Fair
Edited on Tue Oct-12-04 01:05 PM by MsMagnificent
was among the first pedophilic members ever to meet and start the group they then named NAMBLA.

Any search you make of Shanley and NAMBLA will bring over 500 hits, such as this from the Boston Globe:

http://www.boston.com/globe/spotlight/abuse/stories2/062102_shanley.htm

And no, from what I've heard first hand from people in the areas he lived and worked in, my numbers are NOT grossly overstated.

Sheesh. Know YOUR facts buddy!

****EDIT

I see you're quoting the same article. It reads:

"Shanley's personnel file was full of salacious and disturbing allegations, including those that he openly advocated sex between men and boys at a meeting attended by those who went on to found the North American Man Boy Love Association, or NAMBLA."

Vanity Fair (and many others) cite this meeting as the first NAMBLA meeting, and where and when the acronym was coined.

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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Additionally
Edited on Tue Oct-12-04 02:10 PM by MsMagnificent
(Am looking for the VF article - it's at least a year old so hope I still have the mag)

http://www.dailycatholic.org/issue/2002Oct/oct11coc.htm
The American bishops, on the other hand, do not even want to examine the problem of sodomy in the Church. Some of them, such as Bernard Cardinal Law, the Archbishop of Boston (and two of his auxiliaries at the time, Thomas Daily and William Murphy, who now serve, respectively as ordinaries next door to each other in Brooklyn and Rockville Centre) did not recognize that a priest, Father Paul Shanley, who had been instrumental in the founding of the North American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA)
was not fit ever to return to priestly work.


http://www.american-partisan.com/cols/2002/rollins/qtr2/0506.htm
"The connection between and the rape of young boys by rogue priests in America’s Catholic churches has regrettably become as common as Mom and apple pie; said connection can no longer be denied – even by those ardent defenders of America’s homosexual community. Information learned from the arrest of Father Shanley led to the disclosure that he was present in Boston at the 1979 meeting and was one of the founding members of the North American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA), an organization which I not only called for the destruction of in a previous column, but an organization I feel should have its members exterminated by whatever means possible"


http://www.fuckfrance.com/read.html?postid=19371
"The documents also show that the priest, Rev. Paul R. Shanley, spoke in favor of sex between men and boys at a 1978 meeting in Boston where the ``Man Boy Lovers of North America,'' which later became the North American Man-Boy Love Association, or Nambla, was founded. Shanley is now 71 and was last known to be living in San Diego. "


http://www.americamagazine.org/catholicnews.cfm?articleTypeID=29&textID=1719&issueID=369
"At a meeting in Milwaukee in 1978, he said the church’s call for homosexuals to live celibate lives is unrealistic. In 1979 Cardinal Humberto Medeiros, then archbishop of Boston, transferred Father Shanley to parish ministry after receiving complaints about the priest’s appearance as a speaker at a Boston conference on man-boy love that has been described as the founding conference of the North American Man-Boy Love Association (Nambla). In that talk Father Shanley reportedly spoke approvingly of a sexual relationship between a man and a boy and criticized society for treating such relationships as crimes. “We have our convictions upside down if we are truly concerned with boys,” a local gay newspaper quoted him as saying."

http://www.cornerstonemag.com/cart/repressed2002.htm
Boston, Massachusetts: Paul Busa says that he was reading his newspaper when an article about a priest molesting a child suddenly opened the floodgate. Busa for the first time remembered abuse by a priest that he says went on for years, darkening his life from six to thirteen years old. The priest he accuses is none other than the Rev. Paul Shanley, who is also alleged to have attended the founding of NAMBLA (the North American Man-Boy Love Assocation). Such cases as Busa's raise the issue of whether he really 'forgot' the abuse or in fact did remember it while choosing not to think about it. The whole issue of memory repression gets more complex the more it is explained, as the term "repressed" can be defined in various ways.


http://www.inoohr.org/judithlevinebook.htm
One connection between advocacy and action was revealed on April 8 when court documents showed that a Catholic priest accused of repeatedly raping a boy was present at the founding of the North American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA).


I have more, this should suffice at least for starters.

I live in Rochester, NY and was at that talk back in 1977. I also have (Catholic) family all through Massachusetts, especially Brockton. They know the families (thank God my cousins in Brockton are female)! The few dozen who are suing, they say on very good intelligence, are but the tip of the iceberg... there are many families and now grown men who will not sue just to not have to dig up all those horrendous memories and let the country, if not the world, know what they think is *THEIR* shame!
And that is as great a sin as Shanleys' -- thinking they were responsible.

Or perhaps you'd like to argue that, too?

I can't help but wonder why you're even bothering to defend this pedophile priest...

***EDIT: Fixed typo
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emad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. No arguing with that, Ms Magnificent, thanks for an excellent
post.
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TaleWgnDg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-13-04 02:44 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. I stand by what I've stated . . .
Your original post in question was highly emotional and speculative, followed by other postings that contained sarcasm directed at me.

"Ohhh man, this guy should FRY. . . . Damn, a founding member of NAMBLA? A predator on hundreds if not thousands of children for DECADES?! . . . Fry him & fry him good! Just give him a taste of what's waiting for him; and I don't mean stupid South Park's Satan Hawaiian Picnics!" --- your original post

As a child's legal advocate and one who has practiced family law in Massachusetts for more than 38 years, including this area of law, I say this: Shanley will be tried in a court of law. A criminal court of law. Hopefully, the State will get pertinent information from Shanley to assist, if possible, in other criminal cases relating to this issue or other issues.

In America we don't "FRY" people. And in Massachusetts we do not have the death penalty under any circumstances. Massachusetts is in touch with the rest of planet as to the death penalty unlike other states across America who retain the death penalty.

As for your allegation that Shanley was "a founding member of NAMBLA," you nor your source material as cited do not know this as fact. Any inference that I would favor NAMBLA is also erroneous. It's a crime, plain and simple. It also is highly immoral and of deep psychological damage to any child. I've had such clients.

Btw, if it were not for trial attorneys -- plaintiffs attorneys -- who challenged the Roman Catholic Church and the Boston Archdiocese including, then, Cardinal Bernard Law, the archbishop of Boston, together with the expose of the Boston Globe newspaper's investigative reporting (see my prior cite re Boston Globe) for more than a year or so, there would have been no exposure of this horrendous chapter of sexual abuse of innocent children. Boston's attorneys exposed this for all to see. And it was damn difficult. Other cities across America followed. Across Europe, attorneys had been exposing this and continue to expose it, e.g., Poland, Ireland, England, Spain, Scotland and other EU nations. Canada has cases as does Australia, and other parts of the world. (So much for Bush's "tort reform"!)

Overall, I strongly urge you to slow down and not jump to emotional and erroneous conclusions in the future. That being said, however, it is good that you do have a strong negative view against child sexual abuse. It is insidious. Overall, we seem to be on the same side of the fence, sans the speculation and high emotion.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Nah, Just Send Him to Prison
Maybe he will gain some insight into the "prey" side of that
sexual-prdedator thing.
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TaleWgnDg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. The Boston Globe has done an excellent job of turning over
this rock to discover through trial attorneys the list of priests-as-sexual-abusers of Roman Catholic children left in their care.

http://www.boston.com/globe/spotlight/abuse/
(as last visited Tuesday, October 12, 2004)

Instead of the BBC "shock and awe" approach, try the BosGlobe's extensive, insightful, and many months of investigative coverage. I highly recommend it. And, yes, it includes Shanley too (he's expressly depicted/linked on the top of the left column).
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justjones Donating Member (596 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. OMG! I would say the opposite...
If comparing the BBC to the Boston Globe's article. There is far more what one would consider "shock and awe" on the Boston Globe's website, with their interactive links and such compared to the the BBC, who are just reporting the straight story.

However, I don't think there is enough "shock and awe" that compares to what these predator priests did to those children and their families. These stories need to be shouted from the rooftops with as much "shock and awe" possible if it means that parents will be more diligent as to who has contact with their kids. After all, these crimes aren't committed by some stranger down the street, it's usually committed by someone the family knows and trusts.

What better facade can a monster hide behind than that of a priest? How sick and twisted is that? Talk about "shock and awe"...let's worry about the "shock and awe" and the havoc this monster has wreaked on these people's lives. May Shanley rot in jail for the remainder of his worthless life!
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TaleWgnDg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-13-04 03:32 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. The BosGlobe investigative reporting worked extensively . . .
Edited on Wed Oct-13-04 03:35 AM by TaleWgnDg
on exposing the sexual abuse of children within the Boston Archdiocese u/ Cardinal Law as well as prior archbishops of the Boston Archdiocese -- going back in time more than 40 years. The newspaper coverage awakened an entire community and broke the so-called "silence" of the Roman Catholic Church. The BosGlobe, thereby, "assisted" other sexual abuse victims to come forward by its mere public exposure of these insidious acts against children. One may say that the BosGlobe did a "public service" to victims.

And, yes, that particular BBC article was sensationalism ("shock and awe"), as such poor journalism. A few paragraphs of sensationalism doesn't equate in any way w/ the BosGlobe's painstaking, thorough, concise, and well documented news coverage.

Apparently, you didn't read the BosGlobe's coverage -- it was more than one year's newspaper articles. The BosGlobe's url site I've included in this thread.

There's no question that sexual abuse of children is insidious, deeply psychologically damaging to the victim, and extremely troubling when the alleged perpetrator is a member of the clergy. Unfortunately, sexual abuse is very difficult to prove, legally, which is, in part, why I tip my hat to the owners of the BosGlobe and their reporting of this matter.


*************************
edited to place a "d" in archdiocese
*************************
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-13-04 05:06 AM
Response to Reply #2
13. Its the Ugly "Trial Lawyers" fault
Just a couple of confused fathers who have now seen the error of their ways and have repented. </sarcasm>
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Catfight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
6. He pleads Not Guilty? What a slap in the face for the victims and their
families. At least he could be moral and apologize and serve his punishment in prison until he takes his last pathetic breath on this earth. Better yet, send him as a shield for some soldier.
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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-12-04 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. He advocates it's the BOYS who are the seducers!
And it's the poor men who are the victims!!!

Oh yeah - this "Man of the cloth" is a REAL piece of work!

:puke: :puke: :puke:
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