Platoon defies orders in Iraq

[Ruby Romaine]

A 17-member Army Reserve platoon with troops from Jackson and around the Southeast deployed to Iraq is under arrest for refusing a "suicide mission" to deliver fuel, the troops' relatives said Thursday.

The soldiers refused an order on Wednesday to go to Taji, Iraq — north of Baghdad — because their vehicles were considered "deadlined" or extremely unsafe, said Patricia McCook of Jackson, wife of Sgt. Larry O. McCook.

http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20041015/NEWS01/410150366/1002

[Misunderestimator]

1. WOW! Now what we need is to let the rest of the troops over there

know about this... they couldn't arrest ALL of them, after all. SEVENTEEN members of the platoon... that's serious stuff! :thumbsup: soldiers, for knowing that your lives are not worth sacrificing for oil.

[detroit]

92. Freduhms on da merch!

Freduhms on da merch! Freduhms on da merch! Freduhms on da merch! Freduhms on da merch!

Bush should be SO ashamed. And he would be if he were capable of feeling shame.

[Born Free]

179. Support the Troops!

We need to support our troops! All the troops !

[Rhiannon12866]

208. But we know that he has a real problem dealing with shame

or showing compassion. That's the reason that he still can't pronounce Abu Ghraib.

http://www.bushflash.com/quicktime/3Strikes_hi2.mov

And he is also incapable of admitting to ever making a mistake. Al Franken keeps hammering away at this. This is one very dangerous man. I am terrified what he could do in four more years, and so is almost everybody else I know.
:scared::nuke:

[anarchy1999]

136. Mutiny on the Bounty!! It is far past time.

Let all our brave soldiers refuse illegal orders. It is far past time.

[Amigust]

161. This is a good one for letters to the editor.

A lot of people can relate to it. It's their kids he's shoving out unprotected into enemy fire. And the kids have the good sense and courage to say "NO".

He's as cold blooded and heartless about our kids in Iraq as he is about our kids in his brain dead — and deadly — anti-condom, abstinence-only sex education programs.

[skylarmae]

2. maybe we ought to jump on this before it becomes one of the stories that

just disappears off the radar screen because they just don't want us to know about it.

[Ruby Romaine]

3. yes!

[jwirr]

130. Yes and they need our

support - contact your legislators.

[Skie]

146. kids

These kids have got to be scared sh*tless. Frantic calls to parents tell me they haven't got a clue. Why are we sending our kids over there to die for this crap?

Skie

[Media_Lies_Daily]

4. Sounds similar to stories out of the Vietnam War....

...and the longer this war goes on, the more the troops will resist becoming a casualty statistic for the betterment of their NeoCon Overlords.

[Eloriel]

96. YES! And you can't imagine how

utterly and completely THRILLED, AWED, ECSTATIC I am by this news. I haeard it earlier briefly on MSNBC and went "WHOAAAA. This is great."

God bless these troops for their courage.

What if they gave a war and nobody came?


I'm also SO proud of them for valuing their own lives more than Halliburton, and more than the military values them, and THINKING FOR THEMSELVES!! Woohoo! Freedom really IS on the march, just not where George Bush says it is.

[jwirr]

131. What if they gave a war and nobody came:

This is the full Carl Sandburg poem:

The little girl saw her first troop parade and asked, "What are those?"

"Soldiers."

"What are soldiers?"

"They are for war. They fight and each tries to kill as many of the other side as he can."

The girl held still and studied.

"Do you know...I know something?"

"Yes, what is it you know?"

"sometime they'll give a war and nobody will come."

[Eloriel]

145. Thank you -- perfectly, totally wonderful

I really must read more Sandburg some day.

Actually reminds me of when I was a teen in h.s. and the FULL realization dawned on me that we were fighting a real WAR in Vietnam. I was stunned. War seemed so anachronistic to me (WW2, having ended 3 years before I was born, being ancient history, dontcha know). "Aren't we as a species beyond that by now?" I asked myself.

Apparently, no. But soon. Soon, now.

Thanks again.

[Zhade]

173. Indeed. These combat refusers are heroes.

HEROES.

[htuttle]

5. "Yet our best trained, best educated, best equipped, ..."

"...best prepared troops refuse to fight. " -- MLK

Deja vu all over again

[maxsolomon]

21. as a matter of fact, its safe to say

they would rather SWITCH than fight.

thank you MLK & PE.

[Dhalgren]

6. I was waiting for this.

It was only a matter of time before these overused, mistreated troops started saying "go fuck yourself". This happened in Vietnam, too, and it's overdue for Iraq. These 17 are troops that I am PROUD to support - and it's about damn time...

[coalition_unwilling]

44. Support our Oops :)

Seems to me I remember something like this happening during the Russian Revolution also (troops refusing to fight), but can't remember the specifics

[goodboy]

139. HA! "support our Oops" priceless.

[Ruby Romaine]

7. What can we do to help them?

[Indiana_Dem]

8. Email the article to your congressmen and ask for

them to address this issue. I did that the other day.

[WorseBeforeBetter]

109. Operation Truth

http://optruth.org

I haven't seen anything posted to this site yet, but I imagine there will be soon.

[No2W2004]

124. Isolated incident????

http://optruth.org/main.cfm?actionId=globalShowStaticContent&screenKey=hear&htmlId=1042

Let me explain... KBR is now requesting, and the army is allowing, US soldiers to ride "shot gun" in KBR convoys hauling KBR goods all over Iraq. KBR is afraid to be out on the roads alone and want our US soldiers to risk their lives riding shot gun for their missions. KBR is currently staffed by mainly non US international personnel along with a growing number of Iraqis. Most do not speak English, none have had military training on defensive driving, proper convoy operations, avoiding ambushes, navigating around IED's, proper procedure for calling in support or medivac or fire support, procedures to follow after taking enemy fire, the list goes on. These drivers are simply paid drivers that are making roughly 5 -8 times our wages and get paid whether the freight arrives or not. KBR is requesting that US soldiers risk their lives at the hands of inexperienced and improperly trained individuals to provide them with security. Now there is no doubt that we need to protect KBR's missions but we have suggested and to date have been denied the opportunity to run the convoys with properly modified and equipped military vehicles. We have suggested that we run in the convoys with every third vehicle being a US Army gun truck with proper drivers and fire support. With this arrangement KBR can still haul the freight in their vehicles but we would run the mission and deal with any situations as they develop the way we have been trained to. This is the only way that most of us want the missions to be run, the others are just afraid to be opposed to the decisions our leadership is making.

[gratuitous]

9. Ohmigod! Now even our military hates America!

We absolutely must elect George W. Bush in November! He is the only person who can possibly fix what his horribly screwed-up administration has inflicted on the country. He's such a good Christian man, you know.

[Jacobin]

10. Jackson, Mississippi newspaper, by the way

Vietnam alllllllllll over again.

I expect the fragging will start soon.

[gratuitous]

13. The fragging will start soon?

Somehow, I feel that it has already begun.

[Jacobin]

19. Haven't read any reports of that yet, but it can't be far away

:-(

So damn sad.

[DulceDecorum]

22. What says Hackworth?

he seems to a finger on the pulse of the American combatants in Iraq and Afghanistan.

[VegasWolf]

43. Next group will be smarter, don't go to jail for 5 years,

just take out the lieutenant.

New Information Shows Bush Indecisive, Paranoid, Delusional

[Skarbrowe]

105. I knew of people who SAID they had to take out their LT in Viet Nam

It's been many years ago, I served 4 years right after the Viet Nam, and at the time I didn't take them seriously. Now I know it's the truth. I was told that there was this one "90 day wonder" fresh out of college officer that was getting his guys killed. He wouldn't listen to any of his seasoned non-commissioned officers. They ended up pushing him out of a helicopter. I heard a lot more than that.

Young officers that are sent into a war zone absolutely HAVE to listen to the grunts that have been there before them.

I'm glad these guys didn't go on what was obviously a god-awful suicide mission. This totally uncalled for war is turning into more of a nightmare every second we are there. All so * could get to Saddam Hussein. I bet Bush doesn't even care what happens now. He got his man, got his trophy. F the world now, right *?

I truly hate the man. He's nothing more than a mass murderer.

[goforit]

144. They will be known as the Platoon that saved America and the World!!!

[llywrch]

167. I Doubt There will Be Fragging

Keep in mind that many of these units are National Guard & Army Reserve -- probably both commissioned & non-com ranks. Right now the only friends many of these guys have close at hand are in their own unit -- the Sergeant, lieutenant & even the helpless screw-up every unit seems to have; they're watching each other's backs, & praying they won't be kept there one day longer than promised -- while knowing that it's likely they will be there twice as long.

On the other hand, all bets are off if some newly-minted 2nd lieutenant is sent to command them, & demonstrates that he has about as firm of a grasp of the situation as Shrub does. I'm hoping that doesn't happen: there is no honor in killing your own fellow soldiers.

Geoff

[Rose Siding]

11. This kid had asked Mom what happens if he decks his CO-

Bless his heart, he's worried about consequences.

snip>
Harris said conditions for the platoon have been difficult of late. Her son e-mailed her earlier this week to ask what the penalty would be if he became physical with a commanding officer, she said.
----------------

This is a Gannett publication. Check out the implausible "balance" at the end:

snip>
But Nadine Stratford of Rock Hill, S.C., said her godson Colin Durham, 20, has been happy with his time in Iraq. She has not heard from him since the platoon was detained.

"When I talked to him about a month ago, he was fine," Stratford said. "He said it was like being at home."

[Jacobin]

17. And so the fragging thoughts begin

[arikara]

said it was like being at home

"When I talked to him about a month ago, he was fine," Stratford said. "He said it was like being at home."

Sounds like a nice kid who doesn't want to worry people perhaps???

[AtTheEndOfTheDay]

41. Makes me wonder what it's like

"being at home"

[saigon68]

48. Being at Home in the single wide-- drinking a 12er of Pabst tonite

Sounds like Lynndies House--- You know stripping a few "Rag Heads" and then Pissing on them

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

12. I want to know what color the 17 members were on this suicide job

Anyone taking wagers on how many white guys are in the group?

[Maddy McCall]

99. I would imagine it would be about 50/50

In my area, there are just as many white kids enlisting as black. I do know that McCook is black, but his is the only photo in the paper with the article.

[southlandshari]

156. Honesty is refreshing

As politically incorrect as it may be, I'll bet your inference is right on the mark. If I'm wrong, I'll be the first to say so and to apologize. But I'd put money down (if I had any to spare) on the prediction that at least half of this unit is African-American.

[Ripley]

14. Jesus! Five years confinement!!!!!!

And those sadists from abu Graib got one year or so! :crazy:

[tblue37]

72. I agree they should not have to be imprisoned,

but if it were my kid, I would say do the time. At the end of the five years you would still be alive. If it comes to it, do the time--do not do the suicide mission.

I hope the Kerry campaign does something with this, since Bushie keeps lying that he makes sure the troops have everything they need, and that it's K/E who voted not to properly supply them.

[Tigahs_]

153. truly representative of how evil

society can treat its true heroes.

[Jacobin]

15. This should be MAJOR news

This is the defining point that makes this a Viet Nam clone war.

Fortunately, all the talking heads are busy tsk tsking John Kerry for saying that Cheney's daughter should be respected for her sexuality.
/sarcasm

[cthrumatrix]

18. you are assuming we have "the old media" ...not the new corporate owned

[Jacobin]

20. sigh, I'm old enough to remember when there was a media

:-(

[leftchick]

31. me too Jacobin...

nothing will stop this madness until we see a repeat of the nightly news fro 35 years ago. Dead and dying soldiers and burnt civilians on TV is what it will take to wake the AmeriKans... :(

[TankLV]

79. Ahhh yes - dinner and death. I remember it well.

Eating supper with the TV in the background with all the reports of the killing fields.

Don't even remember how we got thru that - had some very fine discussions then - thanx to my good democratic parents.

[glitch]

157. Waking up to breakfast and bodycounts on the radio.

Don't sweat the thundershowers.

[Tigahs_]

154. aint dat da truth. . .

"nothing will stop this madness until we see a repeat of the nightly news fro 35 years ago. Dead and dying soldiers and burnt civilians on TV is what it will take to wake the AmeriKans..."


I completely agree.

[Tigahs_]

155. double post, my bad.

[Rose Siding]

27. This and 20 troops dead in the last 4 days should both be news

http://icasualties.org/oif/Details.aspx

We shouldn't hold our breath.

[tsuki]

176. No, the most important issue facing America is...

what happened 35 years ago. DUH

[barb162]

168. it's pretty near the top of the MSNBC web site

[JoFerret]

178. Just have a little patience

It is, it will be. Already we have black faces all over the news. And someone somewhere is no doubt is starting the film script.

[DulceDecorum]

16. SERUV !!

January 2002, a group of Israeli reserve officers and combat
soldiers returned from their duty in the Gaza strip, and drafted a letter that would change they way Israelis conceive the military
control of the occupied territories. This document came to be
known as the Combatant's Letter.

* We hereby declare that we shall continue serving in the Israel Defense Forces in any mission that serves Israel’s defense.
* The missions of occupation and oppression do not serve this purpose – and we shall take no part in them.
http://www.seruv.org.il/defaulteng.asp

Courage to Refuse nominated for Nobel Peace Prize
http://www.couragetorefuse.org/English/default.asp

[enough]

23. kick

Very important story. Thanks for the post, Ruby.

[havocmom]

24. Contaminated fuel refused at one base, returned, sent to another base?

Which contractor supplied this contaminated fuel? Bad enough troops used to ride shotgun for Halliburton subsidiary convoys, but to have to lay it on the line three times for one load of contaminated fuel somebody is desperate to foist off on our troops?

America, have no doubt, your sons, daughters, husbands and wives in the military are being held hostage by American Corporations who are engaging in foreign policy for profits AND war profiteering in the wars they created themselves.

There is a reason all those retired high ranking military personnel are supporting Kerry. They know the Pentagon is run by and for corporate policy makers.

And think about this: Many men and women serving in Iraq have seen F9-11. They are not stupid. They were lied to but the truth is out there for them and the world to see.

Then think about this: That some personnel in Iraq saw F9-11 indicates that officers there either allowed it to be seen or actually made it possible for it to be seen. There must be officers who have had enough of the lies from the neocons. There are honorable officers who are tired of sending people to die for the lie.

We need to make sure our troops' ballots are counted accurately and by the precincts they actually hail from and not in some room in the Pentagon but the likes of Perle.

We need to get this on our local newspapers. A new barrage of LTTE is in order TODAY.

We need to hammer media about this story TODAY.

The troops are dying in unsafe vehicles so that Dick Cheney's pals can pawn off contaminated fuel on unsuspecting US bases. The choice for our service personnel is to be targets while serving as flunkies for corporate greed or face imprisonment.

Get the word out TODAY

[AndyTiedye]

26. And If the Base Accepts and Uses the Contaminated Fuel

Their humvees are going to die somewhere, and very likely so will
those riding in them.

Was the platoon in question also forced to use the bad fuel?

If so, they probably would never have made it anyway.

[southlandshari]

162. The irony in all this

is absolutely gut-wrenching. I feel like throwing up.

Maybe I can paste a picture of Bush or Rumsfeld or (pick your favorite villian in this f#$%-up administration) to the toilet and feel some small relief in both my physical AND my emotional reactions to all of this...

[wishlist]

25. We need to demand our TV stations cover this story (esp Sinclair ones)

Here in North Carolina, this story is very important and needs to be publicized. Everyone, please email or call your news departments at your local TV stations (especially in Southern states where these soldiers are from) and demand that they investigate and cover this story.

[Dhalgren]

28. I just emailed the story to my

local TV news. I hope it gets attention. I emailed it to WHNT-TV, Channel 19 in Huntsville, AL. We'll see what happens...

[Mandate My Ass]

29. I'm going to email Michael Moore

He and some other benefactors are providing free legal assistance to soldiers who refuse to return to Iraq but I think this issue is serious enough that it will get his attention, and hopefully his help.

[Dhalgren]

30. Excellent idea!

We have to support these troops now! This is what being an American is supposed to be all about.

[barb162]

169. M. Moore on Leno tonight said he had 3000 letters from US

soldiers basically asking what the hell are we doing here? The troops are fed up!

[RaleighNCDUer]

32. This is BIG. I've said all along it would happen eventually.

And these aren't reluctant draftees! This is our all volunteer, professional army.

This will spread.

What if you gave a war, and nobody came?

[vogonity]

33. Wow. One way that Iraq is different than Viet Nam...

Is that the soldiers fighting in Iraq know what happened in Viet Nam. They have seen Platoon and Apocalypse Now, and Full Metal Jacket, and countless documentaries covering things like the Tet Offensive. They have seen the footage of the helicopter taking off from the US embassy in Saigon. They know about My Lai, they know about body counts.

I think that soldiers in Iraq will say, "fuck this" much sooner than they did in Viet Nam.

And what happens after that is the fault of George Walker Bush.

[Ruby Romaine]

34. this story is posted in 3 places now

Jackson Clarion Ledger
Navy Times
Buzzflash

[Ruby Romaine]

36. now in Hattiesburg American & -Marine Corp, Army,Navy & A.F. Times.com

http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/news/stories/20041015/localnews/1420516.html

[indie_voter]

37. Kos has it too. n/t

[Ruby Romaine]

38. fantastic!

[barb162]

170. MSNBC aso

[GliderGuider]

35. A comment from another Web board

If the facts are as reported, the order they defied was more imprudent than illegal. As a result they probably "deserve" punishment under the UCMJ.

The important aspect of the story, as others have noted, is that this is the first example of American soldiers saying "screw this noise" publically. It will snowball to other units, though, and for that reason these 17 kids are gonna feel like a house fell on them in the coming weeks. However that won't unspill the milk, get the horse back in the barn, or any other "fait accompli" metaphor you care to use.

[fishnfla]

39. maybe steve earle is their muse

He has a song on his new cd about a driver carrying a load of fuel in the war zone.

"if i ever get home to Houston alive, I wont drive a truck anymore..."

[politick]

40. Talk About Mixed Messages!

Maybe if they stopped to think, even for a moment, of how that would make our President feel, they would never have been in this position. Bush worked hard to get this invasion of Iraq, and it sends him the wrong message for troops on the ground to show dismay and disobey orders like that. It's bad for his morale! It's hard work being the President with an unpopular war, and he needs all the support he can get. This is just dispicable, and I wish they'd consider his feelings a bit more next time.

[reprobate]

45. To avoid being flamed to a crispy critter......

......it's prudent to label sarcasm as such.

[Emboldened Chimp]

66. Um, that's Mexed Missages...

[AntiFascist]

84. Certainly, we wouldn't want the Bush administration.....

to have to consider the possibility that it might be the best thing for America if they lost the election.

[chimpy the poopthrower]

42. When the troops start rebelling...

...you know things are very, very bad.

Could this be called "mutiny" or is that strictly a ship term?

[RaleighNCDUer]

86. Mutiny is not specific to naval services.

Don't forget, it was the mutiny of the russian army in WWI that directly led to the russian revolution.

(on edit) Not that I'm predicting or advocating revolution or any other illegal activities. (for ashcroft)

[jmowreader]

141. Mutiny is a service-wide term

This is Article 94 of the UCMJ:

894. ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION

(a) Any person subject to this chapter who--

(1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;

(2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;

(3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.

(b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

This is kinda like Article 81 (Conspiracy) plus Article 90 (willfully disobeying a direct order), and they can shoot you either way.

[pop goes the weasel]

46. this callous attitude toward the troops

affects our boys and girls even stateside. My nephew hasn't even been sent to Iraq yet (he is scheduled to go) but his entire unit was forced to take part in an "experimental" skydive that ended with serious injuries to 17 members of the unit. And they were told they'd have to do it again. I haven't heard back yet on round 2 of Operation Drop Our Troops From a Great Height and Maim Them. I hope for the best, obviously.

[krkaufman]

71. What? Any more info on this training anywhere? n/t

[Eloriel]

98. What the HELL is "an experimental skydive"??

Have you AND his parents called your CONGRESSPEOPLE about this?

Holy criminy, get on the phone, NOW and make some NOISE. That's demented and barbaric.

[pop goes the weasel]

147. we did

and so far, he hasn't been sent out again, though they do seem to have had their orders to go to Iraq sped up. I have no idea if there is a connection. But he'd rather go to Iraq than make jumps with improper equipment, which should give a good idea of what the jump was like.

The obvious truth is that our men and women in uniform are being treated like so much cannon fodder. My nephew says that the general feeling in his unit is "don't vote for Bush."

[Kanary]

152. Have you seen "Need for Speed"? About the pills pilots etc are

REQUIRED to take.

Yup, amphetamines.

I saw it on LinkTV, unfortunately didn't record it.

It's DAMNED scary, and that means whatever else is going on that we don't even know about is HORRENDOUS.

It's damned high time some of them started saying "NO".

Kanary

[illuminaughty]

166. Great program. Some of what their taking is a pill called

Provigil. I have multiple sclerosis and have been on it for three years. And three years ago even the pharmacist wasn't familiar with it. Now it's becoming a drug of choice. I read that they were feeding them these during the initial invasion to Baghdad to keep them awake.

We take them for chronic fatigue and if you have a normal immune system this is not a drug to be taken haphazardly.

[Kanary]

187. Thanks for the reminder of one of the pills. What they're doing to those

troops is likely to have some very bad consequences for them in the future.

If I remember right (I only saw the documentary once) it wasn't just during the initial invasion..... it's an ongoing thing to take all these pills. And, they take a bunch of different ones. :mad:

Some of the stuff they are forcing on them also creates emotional reactions.

What more to say..........it's worse than Vietnam!

Kanary

[orangeotter]

47. extremely newsworthy

lets keep it kicked up and email it all around people need to now about the horrible administration of this needless war

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

49. Smart people. Jail is safer. (nt)

[Bandit]

58. When was the last time you were in jail?

:shrug: Look what went on with the Iraqi prisoners. They were mostly innocents. What do you think they will do with GIs that refuse to fight?

[Berserker]

149. I have been in a Military jail

and it's better than being dead!

[leftchick]

50. Woo Hoo It Made Yahoo!

Rate it up! Hopefully it will make the nightly news...

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041015/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq_unit_investigation

[noonriser]

90. Done. n/t

[mbperrin]

106. Done!

Damn it!

[Ima]

114. 4.23

done

[othermeans]

119. Let's get it on the news its still 4.23 when I voted. Needs to be a 4.9

[Days Between]

113. done

rating 4.23 of 595 votes

[acmavm]

140. Done. but down to 4.12

.

[Invalence1]

201. Done!

[meganmonkey]

51. Link to Guardian story about it

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4553379,00.html

[tranche]

52. Ann Coulter calls it "cleaning the swamp"

Coulter last night on McEnroe's show describing fighting in Iraq.

As bad as McEnroe's show is, it was refreshing to see them interview Coulter last night. Unlike the better paid corporate anchors in cable news it showed that McEnroe just didn't get her. She came off as looking like the nutt case that she is and you could see it in McEnroe's and his guest's face.

It amazes me as to how she is taken with any bit of credibility by the cable news anchors and not laughed off the show as she should be.

[barb162]

172. I have been watching her venom lately on a lot of shows

can you imagine if there were a Dem this venomous? Would ANY show have the Dem on?

[seventhson]

53. I Sent it to DRUDGE and GUESS WHAT??? It made FRONT PAGE!!!

I am sure I am not the only one to send it. But I do love that feature of his site because he LOVES scandal as it sells (even if it hurts Bush).

I also sent Drudge the Osama in China story which is VERY interesting.

[leftchick]

60. Osama in China???

Hi seventhson! :hi:

I missed that one, do you have a link?

[seventhson]

137. Osama in China was on LBN earlier today, I think

Bin Laden is in China

(Used with permission)

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7077.htm

NEWS YOU WON'T FIND ON CNN




Bin Laden is in China

This confirms Gordon Thomas, a journalist with contacts in the most important intelligence services. The terrorist had reached an agreement with China, which now negotiates its surrender with Bush. It is his greatest electoral trick.

Translated from El Mundo

Gordon Thomas

10/13/04 "El Mundo" -- During the home stretch of the Northamerican elections, Osama bin Laden could prove to be the ace in the sleeve of president Bush. As we speak, Washington is negotiating a highly secretive agreement with Beijing, the Chinese capital, for the eviction of bin Laden from his sanctuary in the turbulent Muslim provinces of China, in the Northwest of the Great Wall nation.

More than five million people, many of them fanatic followers of Osama, live in that region, which can be called one of the most volatile regions of Earth. Thousands of them work for the mafias who specialize in the trafficking of humans and drugs to the West. Last summer, Bin Laden sealed an agreement with the authorities in Beijing, in which he was granted asylum in return for his guarantees that the guerilla war of the Muslim Chinese against the Chinese nation would end.

Over the years, tens of thousands of troops of the Popular Liberation Armee had been sent to the region with the intent to squash the insurgents.

Since the arrival of the Saudi Osama Bin Laden, the region has been relatively quiet, and the Muslims who live there are allowed to continue their trafficking of humans and drugs.

However, Bin Laden could now see himself trapped in his refuge, if an extraordinary agreement between Beijing and Washington would come to pass, in which China would hand over to the United States the most wanted terrorist in the world.

The capture of Bin Laden would virtually guarantee the reelection of George Bush Jr., as it would confirm to the millions of undecided voters of the U.S. that the war against terrorism was judstified after Bin Laden had authorized the attacks of 9/11 against New York and Washington.

"A new administration Bush would present China as its great new ally in the war against terrorism. China would enjoy in Washington the status of a most favored nation with all of its facets. Contracts worth hundreds of millions of dollars would be approved by fast track. The history of human rights violations in China would be ignored," confirmed last week a high-level representative of the Pentagon. He added that only a small number of "members of very high rank" in the Bush administration knew about the plan to "seize Bin Laden in exchange for a special relationship with China." With almost certainty, among them would be the vice-president, Dick Cheney, and the defense secretary, Donald Rumsfeld.

[sam sarrha]

194. China gets away with Genocide in Tibet, now with protecting Ben Forgotten

they will get rewarded with the rest of our jobs..

[Kimber Scott]

54. This sounds "heroic" on the surface, but what about the guys they left

hanging waiting for fuel?

I'm split on this one. I was a truck driver in the Army, the Army National Guard and the Army Reserves. There is a big difference in the equipment used by the Guard and Reserves, as compared to the Regular Army. Most Guard and Reserve vehicles could be considered "deadlined." They're pieces of shit. But, vehicles can be deadlined for minor things like turn signals, lights (you don't use headlights in combat - there are smaller lights for combat operations, but you really don't need those, once you get your eyes adjusted and now, I guess they have night vision goggles), emergency brakes and windshield wipers. The deadlining does not always affect the safe operation of the vehicle in the REAL world.

I can sort of understand where the sergeant was coming from on that issue, but on the other hand there were people depending on his platoon to bring them what they needed. Him not fulfilling his mission put the lives of the soldiers waiting in Taji in jeapordy. The fact another platoon in the same company was able to fulfill his platoon's mission with the company's vehicles makes it appear he, and his soldiers, cowered. How would those soldiers' (in Taji) mothers feel knowing they died because this guy was unwilling to risk the trip? (Which again, the fact somebody else made it, really makes him look bad.)

Combat is dangerous. Soldiers are soldiers and whether they agree with the war, or their chain-of-command, soldiers only have each other to depend on. This is one of those situations where more facts are needed before judgement is made.

[Mizmoon]

64. But I wonder if the ones who made it

had better equipment or not. Were they "regular Army" and therefore had body armor and an armored vehicle?

[Kimber Scott]

81. They said they were another platoon from the same company. They

would have drawn from the same motor pool. Again, I want to stress, this story needs to be fleshed out before any fair judgement can be made about the situation. The sergeant could have been very right in what he did. Or, he could have been very wrong. Not being there, it's really hard to know.

[AndyTiedye]

73. But the Fuel Was Contaminated Anyway

Why are we making our soldiers risk their lives transporting contaminated fuel?
Their trucks may be "deadlined" from trying to use it themselves, btw.
Why are we paying top dollar for contaminated fuel in the first place?

[Kimber Scott]

82. Good question, especially in Iraq. nt

[TacticalPeek]

75. I agree in theory, somewhat, but the article mentions no other platoon

making it.

You also seem to presume some wise judgement by their CO, which I have found to be sometimes there, but ofen not.

I'm with you on 'more facts', but I'll park my sympathy with the troops since there's not a drafted hippie among them.

[Kimber Scott]

83. Facts supercede stereotypical assumptions everytime.

I presume nothing and I don't make judgements based on rank, etc. People are people. Some are good. Some are not. Some make good judgements. Some don't. There is nothing in the article to allow me to make any sort of judgement. I'm withholding that for now.

But, anyway, I read the Guardian article. The link in the original post didn't work for me.

"The mission was carried out by other soldiers from the 343rd, which has at least 120 soldiers, the military said."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-4553379,00.html

[atreides1]

80. Contaminated Fuel

The fuel had already been refused by one unit, what merit was there in trying to dump the same contaminated fuel on another unit.

And being a former NCO, I don't buy it that the NCOIC refused to go because of something as minor as a turn signal. Lights, turn signals, wipers are all safety deadlines, and the commander can sign off on those. But since we do not know exactly why the vehicles were deadlined we should all reserve judgement until the investigation has been completed. And if security was not being provided, as has been stated, that's another thing that needs to be considered.

As for the NCO looking bad, we don't know what was provided to the second group to make them take the fuel delievery.

And if the contaminated fuel causes the unit vehicles in Taji to break down, especially if they get caught up in a fire fight, does the military punish the ones who delievered it or the commander that wanted it delievered. I would think that providing contaminated fuel to the unit in Taji was a more criminal act.

Would you have provided contaminated fuel or out of date MRE's to another unit, and still felt that you had done the right thing.
Only to find out later that your dedication to your duty resulted in
broken down vehicles and soldiers who got food poisoning?

As I said I'm not going to judge these troops until the whole story has been told.

[Kimber Scott]

85. we should all reserve judgement until the investigation has been completed

What I said.

[chrislrob]

102. atreides1, I agree that

an NCO does not make the decision to not follow orders lightly. I highly doubt that this is a case of a platoon just abandoning a bunch of soldiers to their fate.

And I don't think it matters (much) that some other soldiers were eventually able to make the delivery. Especially, since, as you said, we don't know how the new guys were equipped for the mission.

And I know that equipment can be deadlined for minor issues, but it can be deadlined for major ones too and once you factor in the lack of escort...

We'll see.

As for the fuel, I presume they either replaced the contaminated fuel. But what do I know?

Except that I'm not taking a jalopy through the desert, with no escort, to re-supply anyone with contaminated fuel without a reason that involves nuclear proliferation.

[RaleighNCDUer]

89. Are those soldiers better off with the fuel for raids and patrols

where they get shot at and ambushed, or better off not getting contaminated fuel that might leave them stranded in hostile areas? For that matter, if the fuel was contaminated, were these drivers depending on the same fuel they were delivering?

They can lawfully refuse illegal orders, which doesn't appear to be the case here. But there's a reasonable argument that they cannot be expected to make themselves sitting ducks. I think the people that ordered them to take on a "suicide mission" should be the ones up for courts martial.

[Kimber Scott]

121. According to CNN the CO has issued stand-down orders for all the

company vehicles so they can undergo inspection. They said there could very well be an issue with the equipment and there may not be. Apparently, he is going to make sure - one way, or the other. Again, I'm reserving judgement. As if my opinion counts for anything in this situation, anyway. The only reason I said what I said in the first place was to get people to slow down with the back-slapping. These guys are either heros, or cowards. One way, or the other, we're going to know when they finish their investigation.

[CHICKEN CAPITOL USA]

165. halliburton tanker escorts

the people on the other end "waiting" were not our troops--those corporate carpet baggers are not the resposiibility of the American troops but somehow they 're being suckered into it. Refusal to cooperate is justified and I hope all others involved would be so smart as to realize this.

[walldude]

175. According to the article they are usually

escorted by Humvees and Helicopters but they were pulled off this mission. Combat may be dangerous but there are ways to make it as safe as possible. Blaming them for not wanting to risk their lives because someone did not want to spend the money to properly equip and escort them isn't right. Granted what they did might not be heroic but they aren't criminals or traitors either. I'd bet that they have been dealing with this shit all the time and finally got fed up. Bush spent alot of time during all 3 debates claiming there were enough troops and they had the equipment they need. He needs to be called to the table to explain this..

[sisenor]

181. But don't you think that the commanders who send these guys on dangerous

missions, count on that pressure? It is true you want to be there for your fellow soldiers, and that is the motivation for most platoons to keep on, not to let each other down as individuals and as platoons. But at some point, if the top commanders are not doing enough for the troops (ie, sending them on dangerous missions without enough protection, not even providing them socks or enough food), don't you think that it is time to take a stand?

I mean how long can they keep obeying orders when the ones giving the orders (and take that all the way to the top, Rumsfeld and Bush) show that they have no fucking idea what they are doing there.

I support our troops, and I am not surprised that this happened. This war has been poorly planned since day one, and the system is now starting to crack.

[Cheswick2.0]

183. Waiting for contaminated fuel?

why was it so important to get contaminated fuel?

[dansolo]

197. The fuel was contaminated

It was worthless, and wouldn't have done anyone any good, except giving the insurgents new target practice.

[henslee]

55. the link to this story is not working 4 me. (clarion ledger link)

[Ruby Romaine]

57. their server crashed? too much traffic?

this link works
http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20041015/NEWS01/410150366/1002

[henslee]

59. Barbara Starr, CNN -- HAS PLATOON REFUSES ORDER STORY NOW!!!

A google search for this story comes up empty. Fuck big media.

[Ruby Romaine]

61. i just got 84 hits on google news so the story is getting out!

[Ruby Romaine]

56. Great work DUers!!!! 57 hits in Google News as of now

Boston.com
Guardian
ABC News
Newsday
etc...

[shrdlu]

62. Send over the War President...

...to lecture on the importance of obeying orders. He can take along some "support Our Troops" bumper stickers and a batch of flag decals for use in patching the trucks.

Meanwhile, use the national media list in Campaign Discussion to flog the hell out of this story. It could be a hole in the Rosie Scenario dike.

[Zak]

63. Being passed around Canada Too!!!

Great post.I knew it was a matter of time before this happened. I sent a copy of this article to a few Canadian sources as well. National Post, Toronto Globe and Mail, CBC, and CTV. Hope it helps.

[JohnOneillsMemory]

65. Kick for personal responsibility.

Time for everyone to stop and say "this sucks. Changing course immediately. Hang on."

Ah, fantasy.

[krkaufman]

67. So what!!

How is this story relevant... relative to the atrocity of John Kerry commenting on the Vice President's daughter being gay?

[AntiFascist]

87. bawahahahahahah!

it demonstrates the growing irrelevance of cable news.

[krkaufman]

68. If their story turns out to be true -- that they weren't properly equipped

... then it will be "interesting" to see how the issue is handled.

If they *were* sufficiently equipped, I'm not sure I can wholly support their action -- regardless of what I think about Bush's War.

[geniph]

69. I've recently talked to several guys freshly back from Iraq

and all were extraordinarily frustrated about getting assignments to drive around deadly dangerous areas in lightly armored (or completely unarmored) vehicles, while at the same time being required to chaffeur Halliburton employees around in heavily-armored vehicles. I said then that it's only a matter of time before one of those units "takes a wrong turn" and "oops - I don't know what happened to the guy from Halliburton - he musta fallen out the back or something."

If we want to talk about 'mexed missages', what the hell kind of message (missage?) does it send our troops in the field when we send them out with no protection, but Halliburton employees get the maximum protection available?

[barb162]

174. tht they are dirt and worthless? I was watching some vets

who were injured and returned. One guy with no arms left and he got so little in disablity pay he couldn;t afford ANYTHING! Another was sleeping in a car. It was disgusting. That's what they get for risking their lives for their country and beng patriots.

[davepdx]

70. Aaron Brown responded to my email

His response corrected for typos (he was using his BlackBerry):

"I'm aware of the story. I'm not sure I agree with your conclusion or know enough about the facts. We are working on it."

My conclusion, FWIW, was:

"This issue needs to be made public, fast! These soldiers should not be
prosecuted in any way for being ordered to go on a suicide mission."

[0rganism]

76. Since you've got his electronic "ear"

could you please ask him when they're going to cover Dick Cheney's own various outings of his lesbian daughter on the campaign trail in 2000?

[davepdx]

78. I'll give it a try

Organism:

His email addy is: [e-mail]

I really didn't expect him to reply. I was pleasantly surprised in getting one that was not an automated response.

[Zhade]

177. He's an egotistical dick. I had fun with emailing him recently.

He eventually stopped responding. I really got under his skin. It was great.

:)

[serryjw]

209. NIGHTLINE TONIGHT!!!!

[Pluvious]

74. But it was OK for Boosh to refuse a direct order

...as a reservist (to get his medical checkup),
so why can't these men follow our Leader's example,
and refuse a suicide mission ???

_________________
"The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress."
-Frederick Douglass

[TomClash]

77. Somehow they'll try to spin it as Kerry's fault

He didn't vote for the $87b and Mary Cheney is a Lesbian.

[Maddy McCall]

88. I AM SO FUCKING PROUD OF MY HOMEBOYS AND GIRLS!!

Now, all of you who ridicule my homestate, what do you have to say for yourselves???

Go Mississippi soldiers!!!

[Dhalgren]

91. Hey, I grew up in Alabama

and we always knew - "when you go to Mississippi pack two pistols, you'll need 'em." I don't say nothin' bad about Mississippi folks.

[Maddy McCall]

95. LOL!

Cheers to the Alabama soldiers in the platoon. Saw at least one was--a woman from Alabama. :toast:

[Eloriel]

108. Blessings, thanks, hugs, kisses to ALL of them

I'm so proud of them too! They are heroes, period.

[CarinKaryn]

93. Maybe they'll be the start of the end of the war

if every soldier would refuse to obey unlawful, immoral orders to kill innocent civilians, the US military would have to pack up and go home.

I'm afraid they'll hit these early adopters hard, hoping to set an example with them.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

94. I have heard from

guys who are over there that several little mini-mutinies have already occurred, completely unreported.

They also describe Iraq as a pressure cooker they are amazed hasn't already blown wide apart and a few told my husband that the general American public doesn't know 1/10 of what is really going on over there. Said it is absolutely horrible. No apparent distinction whatsoever between combatant and noncombatant, which we've seen indications of in stories carried here and there, but not, apparently, to the extent it is actually happening. The war has poisoned many of them.

[Maddy McCall]

97. The only reason this one was reported is because the guys...

like Larry McCook called home and told their relatives, who, in turn, alerted the press.

If those phonecalls had not gone through, none of us would have heard about this.

[southlandshari]

160. You are so right - and it is scary

to wonder how many other stories like this there are out there, happening in places where those involved have no access to computers, telephones, etc....

Does anyone really believe this is an isolated incident?

[Eloriel]

100. CNN PICKING IT UP -- NOW / 5 pm eastern

"Full report" coming up with Blitzer -- tune in!!

[Eloriel]

101. The CO ordering a "safety stand down"

WooHOO!!!

Bah. Blitzer wants to know if there was "a political" statement involved. Sheesh. What an ass.

[kodi]

103. per UCMJ, you can refuse illegal orders and suicide missions

other than a few incidents in the recent past, i am surprised more fragging has not gone on, but i bet its about to increase dramatically

[chrislrob]

116. Don't think you can refuse suicide missions...

per the UCMJ. Do you have a cite? I didn't think it was in there and called a friend of mine that was Navy JAG and he doesn't think it is either.

Not an attack, just think it sounds logical but it isn't in the UCMJ.

Hamburger Hill was not only a suicide mission, it was an utterly pointless exercise.

But permitted by the UCMJ.

[kodi]

127. you wont be convicted for disobeying an order that surely gets you killed

otherwise you could be ordered to jump out of a plane without a parachute or onto a grenade and be courts marshalled for disobeying a direct order.

did your friend simply consult the UCMJ index under suicide mission, not find it there and assume that's all there was to the issue, or does he really understand military law and its nuances?

[chrislrob]

195. Well ain't this a bitch?

Don't know what your problem is, Ace, but I think you're full of shit. I was trying to be courteous by powwowing with someone else and then gently pointing out the fucking stupidity of your statement.

Don't know if you've served in the service or not.

But I was enlisted Army. My friend was a Navy LAWYER, you dumbass. "JAG" get it? Like the T.V. show?

The enlisted don't typically get to decide for THEMSELVES that a mission is a "suicide mission", you dick. Otherwise, there'd be a WHOLE lot less fighting going on.

War is dangerous. Many, many soldiers have been ordered into hot combat zones where the likelihood of being killed ran pretty damn high. Haven't heard of many of them invoking the UCMJ's unwritten, unspoken "suicide mission" clause.

Storming the beaches of Normandy was no picnic, but I don't recall anyone being punished for sending those men into their "suicide mission".

Now show me proof that this fuel run was more dangerous than that.

Damn, your post is so stupid I should report you to the moderators.

No, no one will fault you for being ordered to jump out of a plane with no parachute. But you WILL find yourself standing at fucking attention in front of your superiors if YOU say a 'chute is unsafe to jump but THEY say it isn't. Happens all of the time, but the UCMJ doesn't save you.

P.S. What military experience do YOU have that makes you the Learned Hand of the UCMJ? And where's my fucking cite?

[FlemingsGhost]

104. Bravo! The bravest thing done in Iraq thus far.

I have to believe word has spread amongst some of the troops. And right about now, there are frightened, demoralized service men and woman weighing their options.

Seeds have been sown ... Grow, grow!

[lfs5]

107. Could this be October surprise?

Given the possible political ramifications--national news coverage, political protests in support of--and no doubt against--the unit, THIS could really cause political winds to shift where the war in concerned.

And bravo to them! It's time somebody stood up and said, "We're mad as hell, and we're not going to take it anymore! Give us the protection we need, or we'll refuse to fight!"

My hopes and prayers are with them and their families. Better locked up than dead. They're absolutely right. Let's hope the revolt spreads through the ranks!

[lfs5]

110. Addendum:

PROPERLY EQUIP OUR TROOPS OR BRING THEM HOME!!!

ALL sides should be able to agree on this. Parents should NOT have to be buying body armor for their kids...ALL vehicles should be properly armored. etc. LETS BUILD UP AN AVALANCHE OF RIGHTEOUS OUTRAGE! IT'S OVERDUE, AND THIS IS THE PERFECT OPPORTUNITY!

[GoldenOldie]

111. Can anyone recall seeing a special on a Arkansas Guard Unit

that was documented from their initial orders through their actual deployment into Iraq. This documentary, reflected that their vehicles were of Vietnam vintage and would barely operate during stateside duty. They knew that they would have trouble with these vehicles getting from Kuwait into Iraq and it actually showed the broken down vehicles being wired together or towed. It also showed the Guard members attempting to salvage metal to place a little protective armor on the very same vehicles.

These troopers deserve all the acclaim they can get and every Congressmen/woman should be brought out and publically horsewhipped for their abandonment of our military.

[Eloriel]

112. Right --

And even tho they may not have expected to ever go to war when they signed up to be Reservists, they still had to know in the dark recesses of their minds that they might someday have to put their life on the line.

BUT there has to be some reciprocality in their "contract" with the government (i.e., don't ask us to do insane or illegal stuff AND give us some reasonable approximation of the protection we need when we ARE putting our lives on the line) -- which I was happy to see the UCMJ basically supports.

[ikojo]

115. CBS news played a voice mail left by a soldier on her

mom's phone. She asks her mom to contact someone IMMEDIATELY and raise PURE HELL. Said they were being sent to Fajii (above Baghdad) and were not adequately protected.

Wow! Pray for these folks (or send them positive vibes if prayer is not your thing). Whatever these BRAVE and COURAGEOUS Americans deserve our support.

Watching the report on CBS News makes me wonder how * can even be close to beating Kerry?

[knight_of_the_star]

117. Just got an msnbc news alert about it

The media is not sleeping on the job here.

ON EDIT:

Link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6255918/

[misscoko34]

122. speechless

this is some serious BS! Gosh how I wished this had happen last week so that the empty head president can answer to this!

[struggle4progress]

118. There's a reason brave generals traditionally LEAD the troops ...

... down the paths of glory.

In the last year and a half, we have heard rightwing chickenhawks constantly reiterating tired old WWI slurs about French courage, based on a famous mutiny involving French WWI soldiers who ignored orders from officers (far in the rear) to jump out of their trenches into raking machine gun fire and certain (and pointless) death.

Ordering people to commit suicide was stupid in WWI, and it's still stupid today.

[4dsc]

120. Memorable Quotes from The Outlaw Josey Wales

Josey Wales: Dyin' ain't much of a living boy.

Good for these men and women..

[Sugarbleus]

123. Thank God! They took a stand!.......BRAVO!!

Just like in VN.....at some point, human beings have to rebel against what they know is the wrong thing to do...even in war.

LET THIS SPREAD THROUGHOUT THE UNITS IN IRAQ!!

They will have a price to pay, (though that can be lessened with intervention by people like us) but it is worth it. They did the right thing.

What an exciting and encouraging bit of news!!
:bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce:

[vs the introvore]

125. PMCS

This is horrible. Every day in another LDRSHIP-themed briefing/meeting does some NCO usually mention a couple of the Army Values (a credit card-sized plastic reminder of the 7 army values is in fact, part of the uniform) to facilitate 'esprit d corps' and to plainly remind the soldiers that they volunteered for this and know that there exist strict standards for behavior.

This acronym is LDRSHIP. It's even painted on battalion buildings in blatantly plain view of the entire formation which is frequently held behind the building in the battalion parking lot. let's see if i can recall. Loyalty, Duty, Respect, Selfless Service, Honesty, Integrity & Personal Courage. Hooah.! I do remember. (For 5 points on the soldier-of-the-moth board, define all 7. of course in exact words!)

Okay. More procedure. If any army property is assigned (and that means you do sign for it) to your care; you are fully responsible for the Preventative Maintenance Checks & Service. PMCS. This applies to vehicles as well. You must complete the accepted PMCS for your vehicle with an official TM (training manual) for that vehicle type. It is you responsibility to note all deficiencies and submit a form to your assigned maintenance personnel. certain faults should be noted if their repair is not necessary for safe vehicle performance. these should always be included even if they do not "deadline" the vehicle, to at least, CYA (cover your arse).

If you find a major deficiency that requires repair it is your job to make sure you do note that in the form and deadline it with a X. This is for safety of personnel as well as your own pocketbook. Would you want to pay for a totaled 5-ton even though you could NOT keep it? But hey the army's run by businessman; they understand that.

Yet it should not be assumed that it's that easy to get out of your duties, just deadline your vehicle for something, you can find some fault with every vehicle. what soldier would rather skip his/her primary MOS duties and better spend time on a post-wide police call, or staff duty, or head-count? Don't even think it.

Because it's not like a deadlined vehicle cannot be circle-X-ed by an officer. The Platoon or most likely Company Leader can sign for responsibility of specified vehicles and get them back on mission. But this is not abused. It is just a check so that in needy times, calls can be made through the chain when immediate action is deemed appropriate by an officer.

So maybe somebody is accusing the platoon of submitting false documentation on the status of the vehicles or perhaps even sabotaging the vehicles to deadline. If not, that platoon better be getting some apologies and a vacation! let's get back to the army values.

This platoon was supposed to be delivering fuel. so they are 77 Foxes-fuelers. these soldiers drive large tankers full of fuel. through the dust storms of 0 visibility, at night black-out drives, in convoys where you cannot even see the vehicle ahead of you, sometimes. They are not driving cushy freightliners down recently re-paved I-5. and they are not getting paid 30 cents a mile to start!
anyway, i believe these soldiers are constantly reminded of the army values as well as the standards and expectations as fuelers.

I never even saw any combat. i was stationed at NTC near Barstow California. We constantly 'played war' there at Fort Irwin-training for war in the desert. But I did have an odd chance to require the skills of a 77 Fox and did so experience the exhaustive wait for these fuelers to arrive before we returned to the motor pool and closed out the day. this was on post, in completely friendly area where rules were followed habitually. Drip pans down, fire extinguishers at the ready, ground guides for each vehicle, imperceptibly slow speed limits, safety goggles and helmet(Kevlar or safety) required while introducing the fuel to the tank of the waiting vehicle- is this boring yet??? let me sum up. despite the attempts to cover all bases with procedures -and remember, still no enemy fire- did unexpected malfunctions occur? did accidents happen? did the pump rarely operate efficiently? did the fuelers in fact frequently lock on the high idle switch to increase the flow and cut the fueling time by a few seconds? did some drivers sometimes let the vehicles engine run while being fueled?

it takes leadership to ally the entire platoon to this decision. i bet they are handing the LT his arse. while this young officer stands up for his troops against what must be great gossip of ridicule and disgust. although that's not a stated value, i am hopeful that they stayed together- as a unit. they should be commended.

I personally score the platoon with some unnecessary ribbon for upholding army values.

1. For bearing true faith and allegiance to the army, your unit and other soldiers, by recognizing and correctly acting in accordance with army regulations, each soldier in this platoon displayed loyalty to the unit the army and other soldiers.
2.the soldiers of this platoon did in fact, appropriately exercise their duty as 77 Foxes who are all responsible for their own safety and the other government property assigned to them. if the army cannot effectively maintain vehicles to its own standards, the error and fault lies with the impossible budgeting for war.
3.I bet these soldiers are presently the most squared-away and respectful unit in the army.
4.I am even going to have to stretch the meaning of selfless-service, but since they acted as a unit then each soldier was individually responsible for 'putting the welfare of your subordinates before your own.' so they all acted selflessly, to protect the privates the NCO's had to abide by the AR and ensure the welfare of the soldiers.
5.As the next media poster kids unintentionally serving now as high risk ambassadors for the army, they are going to be hit hard by accusations of dishonor. it will take a lot of honor to stand up to a court martial.
6.without a doubt, the platoon did what was right, legally and morally. They are the ones who know of their mission readiness. they know what they are capable of achieving with their vehicles. and they feared for their safety. the mission was compromised by the state of the vehicles not the decision of the soldiers. the soldiers and their equipment function symbiotically. if the army cannot arm, equip, feed and transport the soldiers then the systems already broken, man. the platoon showed integrity while dutifully discovering and reporting the vehicle faults. the soldiers themselves are functioning nominally.
7.they already have been 'facing fear , danger and adversity(physical or moral) since they have been deployed to Iraq. then the rejoicing welcome committee broke for lunch and the soldiers had to face greater fear, danger and adversity. Now these very soldiers are exploring their vast reserves of personal courage as they must fight to demand that the US government validate it's end of the contract for, "the best-equipped, best-trained soldiers on the planet."

i guess that the demand for war equipment is so high that the infinity-trillion US$ military budget prevents the defense contractors from competing in the world market and they just can build one-time-use equipment more profitably than they can build actual gear. i hope Donald Rumsfeld gets to meet with these soldiers so he can explain how the next-generation drone-fueler will keep them far from harm so that they can better accomplish their new primary MOS 66 Xray- peace corps recruiter.

[Iceburg]

138. Thank you VS for taking us into the mind of a responsible

intelligent soldier and his/her duties. Further than you for driving home the point that "the mission was compromised by the state of the vehicles not the decision of the soldiers". To War "on a lie", and on the cheap will be this admin's legacy.

[Technowitch]

164. Thanks, PMCS, for this really excellent viewpoint -- and welcome to DU!

[janx]

185. Thanks for the thorough post.

And it's not just the equipment, I think, but also the lack of escort that really made this mission a suicide one for these troops. The contractors get escorts. Other troops get escorts.

We know (from the hideous photos we've seen) that those fuel trucks are prime targets for rocket propelled grenades, etc.

[captain disgruntled]

192. Thanks, VS--you were obviously

one strak troop.

I'll second that--the Army is, probably unavoidably, invariably playing catch-up with these issues: when they first phased in BDU's, for example, to replace the fatigue uniforms, we got the only version available--temperate woodland, even though I WAS STATIONED IN THE TROPICS, thank you very much, because we were still anticipating a Russki attack.
Likewise, our unit was required to haul our metaphoric asses over the mountainous spine of Oahu every month for 'tactical training', and half these sorry trucks would invariably break down by the side of the road--their engines were pitifully underpowered to haul their empty chassis, and when you added our mapping equipment, the elevation, and the heat? Fuggedaboudit.
I'd submit that even if these reservists are driving Regular Army vehicles--as we were--they have not been appropriately modified to handle the extremes of temperature or the inescapable sand and dust, and that they are not being provided with parts, etc. on any kind of timely basis either.

Sounds like BuShit to me--point me to the Legal Defense Fund for these poor bastards!!! And just what WAS anybody supposed to be doing with that contaminated fuel??????

[lovuian]

126. Good for them!!!

This is what is happening to our army the men are starting to rebel
They aren't going to give their lives up for Bull!!!

We have a 100,000 men who did that its a Big lesson

[flordehinojos]

128. my letter to jeremy hudson reporter for the Clarion Ledger

Brava! for Sgt. Larry O. McCook and the rest of the platoon who refused to go on an order to commit suicide!

Send Babs to lead the way, escorted by Poppy Bush himself and the twins Jenna and Barbara! go see how fast they say “we’re ready to answer the call”!

Brava! once again for Sgt. McCook and the rest. Someone has got to start standing up to the Bush criminal empire.


XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

[jwirr]

129. I am proud of these young men and women.

because it takes as much courage to stand up and say no as it takes to fight a war. They have decided that enough is enough. When I was In college in the 70s one of my profs who lived in Germany during WWII told a story to illustrate the difference between US soldiers and German soldiers.

The US Air Force was bombing an airbase inside German territory. It was blatantly clear that they had won this particular engagement, even to the Germans. The German soldiers still ran out to the planes and got in. They could not get them off the ground because they were already too heavily damaged. Yet most of the pilots sat in those damaged planes until they were killed.

This was not to illustrate that they were dumb since they were not. It illustrated that they took orders without question. Military leaders might tell you that it is imperative that a soldier follow the orders of the commanding officer but the kind of single minded obedience that was practiced by these pilots is also the same unquestioning obedience that allowed Hitler to rise in the first place.

Our soldiers have been placed in this war by lies, illegal distortions, manipulations and greed. They have minds and should use them. No one should be sent into combat without adequate equipment and a reasonable assurance that the action is part of a winnable plan for truth and justice. They sign into the military to protect our nation but the nation has no right to use them for reasons other than our national safety.

[Robeson]

132. Nicely said....

....and eloquently put!!:thumbsup:

[Robeson]

133. Link Unavailable?

Everytime I've tried to click on this link it says "Service Unavailable". Anyone else experiencing this problem, or am I the only one?

[KG]

134. good on them.

:thumbsup:

[nedbal]

135. May 24, 2004 Guardsmen Speak Out on Reassignment in Iraq

National Guardsmen Speak Out on Reassignment in Iraq
May 24, 2004


Members of a Missouri National Guard unit say guarding convoys for private contractors in Iraq puts them at much greater risk than when troops were hauling equipment, food and water for the Army themselves.

The 150-member 1221st Transportation Company has been reassigned from its hauling duties to providing security for convoys operated by defense contractor Kellogg Brown & Root (KBR) — a subsidiary of Halliburton Co. — which has about 24,000 workers in Iraq and Kuwait.

Formerly headed by Vice President Dick Cheney, Halliburton has contracts to do everything from providing meals and mail to troops to taking trucking equipment, food and water to bases — the job the newly deemed "security" troops are trained to do.

Members of the 1221st were perplexed about what was gained in the new arrangement, because the new assignment forced them to let their own trucks sit idle. They also felt angry about being used as free labor for a highly profitable private defense contractor hauling the same types of supplies.

Most importantly, Sgt. Donald Curttright said the orders have members of the 1221st worried they’ll be spread so thin that they could be easily outgunned in a firefight.

"There might be 30 trucks, and we’ll have six or seven of us riding shotgun armed with M-16s," Curttright said. "If we’re attacked, we’re expected to protect the whole thing. I don’t know how we’re supposed to do it."

Gov. Bob Holden wrote a letter this month to President George W. Bush protesting the use of Missouri guardsmen as labor for a civilian contractor. Holden pointed out that the 1221st is trained as a trucking company<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<


http://www.wwdmag.com/wwd/index.cfm/powergrid/rfah=%7Ccfap=/CFID/691849/CFTOKEN/54336292/fuseaction/showNewsItem/newsItemID/7157

[0007]

142. Our allies see the futileness of this endeavor and now our

troops are beginning to question and resist.

[goforit]

143. OMG!!!!!..........This is INCREDIBLE!!!!.........I salute those guys!!!

Those Humvee's are overpriced pieces of tinfoil!!!!

[BeHereNow]

148. Yes...Yes...YES...

For the first time in a long time-
I feel hope.
YES
YES
YES

Now the question before us, my fellow DUers is this:
How do we find the contact information for these
fine young Americans, these defenders of the Constitution
and Truthspeakers?
They need our support, now; and by giving it
we will encourage others who have, until now, only thought
of what these brave young men and women have done.
YES.
YES.
Yes.
BHN

[Insider]

150. photo from yahoo/ap

why are they showing this man in a mug shot-type photo??? i'm sure they were under pressure to get an image out quick, but DAMN. he is a deputy in a detention center. is there no pic of him in either uniform, army or corrections?




edit:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&e=2&u=/ap/iraq_unit_investigation

[southlandshari]

151. Salon.com has a story on this unit of reservists

here:

http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/10/16/soldiers/index.html

if you aren't a subscriber, sign up for a free day pass - watching a 30 or 45 second internet ad is relatively painless and the content of Salon is worth it!

[Ruby Romaine]

189. thanks for the tip- good article-Salon has more details.

n/t

[southlandshari]

158. 12.3.03 Charlotte Observer story on this unit's deployment

Reservists, families say farewell

Troops could leave for Iraq in 3 weeks or several months

SARAH ROTHSCHILD

Staff Writer


ROCK HILL - Tears welled in Jennifer Whitlow's eyes as she kissed her fiancé, David Regan, on Sunday.

Whitlow, 20, of Lincolnton, is one of about 119 Army reservists in the 343rd Quartermaster Company, which has been called to active duty in Iraq. Family and friends of the reservists attended a mobilization farewell ceremony at the American Legion in Rock Hill.

snip

The reservists will undergo training at Fort Stewart in Georgia later this week. Col. Hugh Barclay said the troops could leave for Iraq in as few as three weeks or as long as several months.

Barclay said members of the company -- who hail from states including North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama and Tennessee -- will support American combat units by overseeing logistics, such as ammunition supply.

more:

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/observer/2003/12/08/news/local/7440175.htm?1c

[Amigust]

159. Self Deleted

[sr_pacifica]

163. Mississippi congressman will start a congressional inquiry

From the same article in the Clarion-Ledger:

U.S. Rep. Bennie Thompson said he plans to submit a congressional inquiry today on behalf of the Mississippi soldiers to launch an investigation into whether they are being treated improperly.

"I would not want any member of the military to be put in a dangerous situation ill-equipped," said Thompson, who was contacted by families. "I have had similar complaints from military families about vehicles that weren't armor-plated, or bullet-proof vests that are outdated. It concerns me because we made over $150 billion in funds available to equip our forces in Iraq.

"President Bush takes the position that the troops are well-armed, but if this situation is true, it calls into question how honest he has been with the country," Thompson said.

[Rhiannon12866]

171. Once the story of this gets out, this will become much more common

I have discussed this breaking story with a couple of friends and they both said that Bush* will say that these soldiers don't have the state-of-the-art equipment and armored vehicles because John Kerry voted against the $87 billion supplemental. But the bill passed, despite Kerry's vote. Kerry needs to anticipate this and go on the offensive. People will believe what they're told and Kerry can't let Bush* blame him for this, as he has been doing with so many distortions of the issues.:grr:

[JoFerret]

180. The Daily News: Probe Iraq mutiny - "Suicide mission"

Has some more details.

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/242827p-208098c.html

[ezekiel333]

182. Amber McClenny

Amber is from Dothan, Alabama, about an hour north of us here in the occupied Panhandle of Florida. Her mother, Teresa Hill, was on the local news last night and they played her daughters phone message. Amber has been released from custody and is awaiting the outcome of the investigation to see if she will be charged. Her mother has contacted her Senator and Congressman, both of whom have already requested status reports from the Army.

There is an article about the situation in todays Dothan Eagle: <http://dothaneagle.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=DEA/MGArticle/DEA_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1031778564479>


Ambers phone message -----------snip-------

"This is a real, real, big emergency. I need you to contact someone. I mean, raise pure hell," McClenney said in her message. "Yesterday we refused to go on a convoy to Taji, which is above Baghdad. We had broken down trucks, non-armored vehicles and we were carrying contaminated fuel ... I want you to call up CNN. Get somebody on this. I need you now mom. I need you so bad. Please help me. This is very serious."

-----------------

Gotta love the "I mean, raise pure hell" request. For my Southern born wife that was a call to arms from a sister of the South and she is spreading the word far & wide. Pure Hell will be raised.

[Tigerlily]

184. kick

[T Bone]

186. these threads in GD

keep them together and keep them kicked up?

Read all these threads, they are all linked:


Reservist calls Mom at home for help in Iraq
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2498461

The first FACE of the order defying platoon in Iraq 'Murka will see
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2498483


and keep them kicked to the top together !!!

CNN reporting mutiny by unit
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2495132


All posts in all these threads are RELEVENT.

[ezekiel333]

188. KICK! RAISE PURE HELL!!! eom

[wabeewoman]

190. This just saddens my heart

All these brothers, sisters, daughters, sons over there in these conditions and 1/2 of the voters are willing to re-elect the scrum who put them there. All the death and destruction and it was apparent to most of us here and the rest of the world it was a mistake.

[ezekiel333]

191. Their concerns may be 'valid,' Army spokesman says...

From the Clarion-Ledger:

------
"Army commanders reassigned five members of an Army platoon, including two Mississippians, who refused a mission in Iraq earlier this week because of faulty equipment, a military spokesman said Friday.

Dov Schwartz, Army spokesman, said the commanding general of the 13th Corps Support Command has initiated an investigation into actions by 17 members of the 343rd Army Reserve Quartermaster Company. It was an "isolated incident confined to a small group," Schwartz said, but preliminary findings show the soldiers raised "valid concerns."

<http://www.clarionledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20041016/NEWS01/410160365/1002>

------

We still need to raise pure hell over this so the Army knows we are watching.

<http://floridapatriots.com/raise_pure_hell.htm>

[Rex]

193. This is outragous!

These troops were ORDERED to deliver fuel in deadlined trucks!?!?! OMG! And yet they are under arrest...not the commander who issued the order? UGH!!! This really pisses me off!!!

[Lizzie Borden]

196. I'm proud of these people...

When you're in the military, it's difficult to take your own stand because you get punished for doing so. They so discourage thinking. But going to jail for awhile sure beats death.

[Endangered Specie]

198. I'm suprised that no one else has refused to go...

Damn our troops can take alot of shit... but only so much.

[freeminder]

199. the true will of the people will prevail,

it always does. Even if takes a revolution.

Which can be as simple and yet courageous as saying NO.

by the way, only 11 hits on google news for "platoon defies orders in Iraq", I saw more mentioned up-thread, is this story being killed?

And can someone be so nice to explain the background of "fragging" to me, I play Q3A all the time and so I frag but I gathered from comments I do not understand the true significance.

thanks!

On edit : http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=171992 ABC has "Unit That Refused Iraq Duty Said Released" as a headline. I found it in international headlines, so pretty far up top.

[Rhiannon12866]

200. This story seems to be taking off, which can only be a good thing

I heard it mentioned on three or four cable news shows that I happened on today. My friend said that, once this gets out in Iraq, it will become widespread. General Sanchez sent a letter last December, recently released, that said that our troops didn't have the proper equipment or spare parts. The Pentagon claims that this was taken care of. Apparently, not. Big surprise, these guys lie.:grr:

As for "fragging," I've heard the term, but am hardly an authority on the subject. I looked it up in the dictionary.:shrug:

n.

A fragmentation grenade.
tr.v. fragged, frag·ging, frags

To wound or kill (a fellow soldier) by throwing a grenade or similar explosive at the victim: "He got fragged. Blown away" (Bobbie Ann Mason).

[freeminder]

202. Well I hope it gets legs - I can find it all over the net on the left,

but not at the major "media" outlets.

And thanks for the frag definition, I was aware of that - just thought there was a deeper meaning (as in fragging oneself in order to get home)

[Rhiannon12866]

206. I heard this story covered on MSNBC,

both on "Countdown with Keith Olbermann" and "The Abrams Report" last night. And, tonight, Chris Matthews was supposed to have the mother of one of the soldiers involved as a guest. I missed all but the end of his show, so I'll try to catch the repeat.

As for "fragging" oneself in order to get home, the situation in Iraq has become just so horrific, I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is happening.:-(

[Rhiannon12866]

210. The story was also the subject of an opinion piece in today's NY Times

That's about as mainstream and widely read as you can get.:-)

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/19/opinion/19tue1.html?oref=login

[JSJ]

203. 17 member unit does not a movement make...

Most of the shit-kickers and gangsters in Iraq as troops love it there- they are absolutely in their element and wouldn't give up their chances to kill for nuttin'!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

205. WTF do you know about it?...

...Have you ever been in the military?

[Rhiannon12866]

207. I've seen interviews with soldiers

and my friend knows an 18-year-old who was in Iraq until last week. A few may be as you describe, but most of our troops over there are just scared kids, like these.;(

[Paleocon]

204. Good for them....

If only all of our troops were this smart...