US forces storm into Western Falluja

[JoFerret]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=1&u=/ap/20041108/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

NEAR FALLUJAH, Iraq - U.S. forces stormed into western districts of Fallujah early Monday, seizing the main city hospital and securing two key bridges over the Euphrates river in what appeared to be the first stage of the long-expected assault on the insurgent stronghold.

An AC-130 gunship raked the city with 40 mm cannon fire as explosions from U.S. artillery lit up the night sky. Intermittent artillery fire blasted southern neighborhoods of Fallujah, and orange fireballs from high explosive airbursts could be seen above the rooftops.


U.S. officials said the toughest fight was yet to come — when American forces enter the main part of the city on the east bank of the river, including the Jolan neighborhood where insurgent defenses are believed the strongest.


The initial attacks on Fallujah began just hours after the Iraqi government declared 60 days of emergency rule throughout most of the country as militants dramatically escalated attacks, killing at least 30 people, including two Americans.

<more>

[lovedems]

1. This is going to be a repeat of Somalia

It is going to be ugly.

I am depressed again.

it's going to be a massacre

thousands of innocents are going to die brutally.

[lovedems]

5. Somalia was a no win situation

Do you think it will be like that in Fallujah? I keep seeing in news articles that the marines will win. I don't share that optimism. I think we are going to find out where all of those missing explosives are.

Not to diss the marines at all. This is urban warfare and it never turns out the way it is suppose to.

A massacre indeed. For both sides.

19. I think the worst thing that the insurgents could do....

Would be to try and fight positional warfare against the Marines. They should seriously avoid direct frontal battles and stick to hit and run. But the reality is that the Marines are going to do Fallujah like the Nazis did Warsaw and probably much worse. I'd be surprised if the insurgents hold out more than a month as a large organized force. Although fighting will probably continue for years to come on some level. But you're right there is always the possibility that the U.S. will get torn to shreds in Fallujah. Perhaps it'll be more like Grozny than Warsaw.

What I meant by a massacre is that entire blocks and families will be destroyed. The Marines are going to shoot and ask questions never. That means anyone in that city is a target. That includes hundreds of thousands of civilians. BTW while around 19 americans died in Moqadishu thousands of Somalis were killed. Remember all those nameless africans in "Black Hawk Down"?

[lovedems]

23. Points taken

I guess we are sending more troops into Fallujah then we did Moqadishu. I guess I am just looking at how the rest of this war has been so poorly planned so am of the mindset that this invasion of Fallujah won't be any different. Every single thing this administration's war planners have done in Iraq have been totally screwed up. Nothing ever works out the way it is "suppose" to. Their incompetence has no boundaries. I don't know if I am being realistic or just a plain old pessimist about how this whole thing will work out. I know one thing, it isn't going to work out at all for the innocent in that town.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[lovedems]

29. Yeah, but not at the marines expense. They probably don't want to

be there anymore then we want them there. Bush should have suffered his defeat at the hands of the American people (and he quite possibly did) but I can't go so far as to say the marines should suffer nor the innocents in Fallujah. I want him to lose some other way. A way in which HE pays the price for his failures and not another living soul.

[Comadreja]

46. reports are they are HOOO RAAH ready

These are fresh troops eager to engage. They must have joined since the whole soory spectacle was started. I don't pity them....they want to kill Iraqis and probably voted for WarChimp.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[daleo]

Nobody will win but the worms

And their worm-god Bush.

[Jack_DeLeon]

55. We would be lucky....

if this ended up being like Somalia...

It would atleast mean that the loss of life on our side would be relatively low.

[Kenergy]

18. Yes, but abortion is wrong n/t

[alittlelark]

22. Yes, abortion is evil

wait until they are at least 12 to kill them.

[AngryOldDem]

36. This may be Tet...

...the battle that opens everyone's eyes.

It is going to be bad.

[jmcgowanjm]

67. Chechens 'break Grozny siege'

Tuesday, 11 January, 2000, 17:18 GMT

Chechen sources say they have broken the Russian siege
of Grozny, and inflicted heavy casualties on federal
forces.

As the Russian military campaign appeared to be running
into difficulties, the acting President, Vladimir Putin, said
he wanted to rebuild Russia's military might and
economic strength in order to recover its power in the
world.

Russian military officials say they have retaken the town of
Shali, scene of fierce fighting since a counter-offensive
by Chechen rebels on Sunday. This claim cannot
be independently verified.


"Our aim is not to take settlements but to strike as heavy a
blow as possible and then pull out," said Selim
Abdulmuslimov, a spokesman for Chechen President
Aslan Maskhadov, on Monday.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/598554.stm

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

2. Bush celebrates victory by killing loads of Arabs

[Amaya]

8. Gotta keep the fundies happy

[Kenergy]

11. Yes,

If the Arabs don't want democracy, we'll kill them until they do.
Viet Nam Part 2.

[PsychoDad]

25. After seeing what passes for "democracy" here...

Would you want it forced on you?

[maddezmom]

24. while on another vaca at Camp David

:eyes:

[VegasWolf]

3. "Bring them on!" , screeches Drunken Monkey.

[Placebo]

4. Good, We Need To Kill The Terrorists.

n/t

[Brundle_Fly]

6. Somalia, was a slight error in judgment.

this is going to be monumental.

[unblock]

14. somalia was a trap set by one political party for the other

iraq was a trap set by shrub for himself.

[unblock]

15. somalia was a trap set by one political party for the other

iraq was a trap set by shrub for himself.

[livinbella]

49. very astute

[The_Casual_Observer]

7. Apparently chimp is doing a pontius pilot on this thing

"U.S. commanders have said it would be his responsibility to order the storming of the city"

They haven't done anything like this since Field Marshall Ky in Vietnam.

[Brundle_Fly]

9. it's okay....remember

"We're not going to have any casualties."

[DemoTex]

10. Fallujah will either be empty of any resistance, or it will be Hue '68.

The former is scarier than the later. I hope to God that those US Marines are well-equipped, well-trained, and well-lead. They are walking into the mouth of the cat of death. Been there, done that. I was not a Marine, but I worked with them enough to be able to say: Semper Fi Mac!, USMC/Fallujah. Semper-fucking-Fi!

[mhr]

21. It's Not The Boys Fault - They Are Being Led By A Reckless Leader.

He is to blame for everything.

[DemoTex]

27. Thank you ...

It is never the boys fault. Except with Abu Ghraib. And My Lai. If the truth had ever been told about My Lai, beyond Seymour Hersch's Pulitzer-winning article, Colin Powell would have spent 20 years in Leavenworth. Or he would have been subjected to a trial in the Hague. War-fucking-criminal. Then. Now. And times between.

[0007]

70. You got that one right about Colin Powell

.....and John Negroponte would still be in prison.

[JoFerret]

31. The so called "boys"

are caught up in the collective delusions of patriotism, blood-lust, religious zealotry and the cause.

They will do the dirty work of destroy and maim and kill. And continue to pay the price for ever. And for what?

[KeepItReal]

34. They may be caught up, but they are just doing a job they swore to do

If any of them are delusional, it is the fault of the civilians in D.C. (and nutjobs like Gen. Boykin) misinforming them with propaganda and giving them "lawful" orders they are duty-bound to follow.

'Luck troops.

[JoFerret]

75. Without doubt - it is the fault

Without doubt - it is the fault of those who spun the lies to create the collective delusion. And wrapped their impulse to war in patritism and a falsehood about a just cause. And for those who belief they will face their maker and be held to account in this world and/or the next? - beware the whirlwind.

[PROUDNWLIBERAL]

58. Just doing Their Jobs

Let us remember that the guys dumping the cyclon-B into the showers were just doing their jobs. I'm tired of the cop-out of JUST DOING OUR JOBS. that job is killing people if yopu all hadn't noticed. People are dieing and that is wrong. I cannot support somebody just doing their job when it kills people!!!!!!

[NorthernSpy]

60. I pray no one ever does such a "job" on me

Remember Nuremberg.

[Jackpine Radical]

65. I went through Hue about two months after Tet, after the Marines

had reclaimed it. A very apt comparison between Hue and what is about to happen in Falluja. Not to mention what has already happened in Falluja.

[Straight Shooter]

12. My cynical side says, "Are the boys playing Burn, Baby, Burn"?

This is only for bush, all for bush. I can't bring myself to outrage anymore, the pattern is so evident of what's going down.

[annabanana]

13. It looks like they're following the successful "Bagdad" model..

And we know how well THAT'S turned out.

[pinto]

16. God, the enormous f*ck up called Iraq has cost the worldso many lives. n/t

[Ladybast]

17. From those being stormed . . . .

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7233.htm

The Psychopaths and Fallujah Resistance

By Ghali Hassan

11/06/04 "ICH" -- As the hubris of the American election is passed, the people of Fallujah are under new massive US assault. The world “only” superpower is posed to flatten the city of 300,000 people in order to pacify (kill) its citizens because of their opposition to US Occupation. This new massacre is sold by the Bush Administration and mainstream Western media as a “necessary step to hold election” in Iraq.

The US took over the main hospital and converted to a military hospital. In other words, the people of Fallujah no longer have a hospital to treat injured men, women and children. The US Occupation forces are currently preventing men of age 14-60 years from leaving the city. It is a crime against humanity to massacre unarmed civilians. US forces are also preventing journalists from entering the city to report on the ongoing massacre of innocent civilians.

As I write, the BBC reports that the US strikes on the centre of Fallujah have completely destroyed the Nazzal Emergency Hospital in the centre of the city. There are no reports on casualties of a criminal attack on a hospital in the centre of the city. Can you imagine this happening in Manchester or Boston?

In April 2004, the first US massive attacks on Fallujah killed more than 1300 Iraqis, mostly innocent women and children, reported by AFP. The heroic Iraqi Resistance forced the Marines to capitulate, and Fallujah became the symbol of Iraqi Resistance to US Occupation.
(more)

[Occulus]

54. link not working

it appears to be down

[0007]

72. 'Tis working now.

[Zhade]

57. NAZIS. This is insanity.

I want to leave the country - I do NOT want my taxes paying for this!

[maddezmom]

20. from earlier link- NYT article

http://nytimes.com/2004/11/07/international/middleeast/07cnd-iraq.html?hp&ex=1099890000&en=3eb8ca737af5890f&ei=5094&partner=homepage

Thank you FreshAir and welcome to DU. :hi:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x967882

[Divernan]

28. Rumsfelds "precision, pin-point bombing - of emergency hospital

What evil lurks in the hearts of neocons? The shadow knows!

[maddezmom]

30. related link: U.S. Marine Tanks Prepare for Falluja Offensive

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20041108/wl_nm/iraq_dc&cid=574&ncid=1480

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

32. Inanity

Immorality, insanity, immorality, insanity, immorality.

God the humanity.

[DemoTex]

33. 3rd Marine Tanks in Hue, 1968 (sorry, graphic but famous picture).

Ask DUer JohnnyYawl about this battle. Ask my dead cousin who was on that tank (he did a second tour then died of the drink). Ask any Marine in the world about this picture. It is the epitome of the battle of Hue, Tet 1968. The Bu$h regime has no connection to this picture because they have no connection with Vietnam, Republic of. For that reason they are totally fucked. Ergo, we are totally fucked. Do a right click/properties/highlight the URL, and save this picture. It will be representative of future pics from Fallujah.

[DemoTex]

37. Let me add one more bitter comment ...

This is a real war. It will only get worse. If we don't get control of the public opinion quick, we are screwed.

[Minstrel Boy]

39. Picture saved,

and I'll remember.

Thanks.

Christ.

Fucking hell.

[yellowcanine]

42. Flag Decal Heaven - by John Prine seems to be an appropriate response here

Your Flag Decal Won't Get You Into Heaven Anymore
© John Prine

While digesting Reader's Digest
In the back of a dirty book store,
A plastic flag, with gum on the back,
Fell out on the floor.
Well, I picked it up and I ran outside
Slapped it on my window shield,
And if I could see old Betsy Ross
I'd tell her how good I feel.

Chorus:
But your flag decal won't get you
Into Heaven any more.
They're already overcrowded
From your dirty little war.
Now Jesus don't like killin'
No matter what the reason's for,
And your flag decal won't get you
Into Heaven any more.

Well, I went to the bank this morning
And the cashier he said to me,
"If you join the Christmas club
We'll give you ten of them flags for free."
Well, I didn't mess around a bit
I took him up on what he said.
And I stuck them stickers all over my car
And one on my wife's forehead.

Repeat Chorus:

Well, I got my window shield so filled
With flags I couldn't see.
So, I ran the car upside a curb
And right into a tree.
By the time they got a doctor down
I was already dead.
And I'll never understand why the man
Standing in the Pearly Gates said...

"But your flag decal won't get you
Into Heaven any more.
We're already overcrowded
From your dirty little war.
Now Jesus don't like killin'
No matter what the reason's for,
And your flag decal won't get you
Into Heaven any more."

[Lisa]

53. oh, but we at FOX can't show that picture ...

That would be undermining the morale of the troops, by causing doubts and dismay on the home front! If we won't show soldiers who are neatly packaged in flag-draped transfer tubes, or propped up in hospital beds with nice clean linen -- why would we want to show messy corpses or untidy troops who are crying and bleeding? See how much nicer and more palatable war is, when we snip out all the awkward ugly photos?

We must support the Emperor -- er, we mean, President!

[saigon68]

64. WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGE WARNING

YOU MEAN LIKE THIS NOT HAVING FUN FOR HALLIBURTON PHOTO?



OR THIS GUY SCREAMING HIS LUNGS OUT?

wouln't want Mommy seeing this one either---why she might not let Jr Enlist to do this

[jjanpundt]

79. If these photos or a collection of photos of wounded

soldiers and the murdered Iraqi children were on the nightly news, there might be a chance for a real anti-war movement. As long as war is kept "sanitized" by the media, anti-war protesters will be considered a "fringe" group.

My nieces and nephew thought the most powerful part of Fahrenheit 911 was the sequence of peaceful Iraqis going about their business and then the showing of the aftermath of our bombing campaign. They were crying for the dead and wounded innocents.

[Zero Gravitas]

35. It could be worse

Gays could be getting married in California!

[Zorra]

38. Hundreds, if not thousands, of innocent people are going to die in this

assault.

Collateral damage will be extensive - Bu$h feels he has a dictatorial mandate now and does not have to worry about re-selection, so the indiscriminate killing of civilians will not be a concern in any more of the actions by the US military in Iraq.

[ausiedownunderground]

40. Islamic media reporting Marine offensive stopped?

Islamic media is reporting that the initial marine offensive has been stopped by heavy resistance from the Guerillas. Fighting in the Jolan industrial suburbs is reported as intense. Ac-130 Spectre gunships shooting at everything - i hope they can tell the difference between their troops and the opposition forces? Friendly fire deaths could number quite a few. Islamic media is reporting several marine casualties already, but has not said how many Guerilla casualties? We'll probably get a better idea of what the Guerilla commander tactics have been within the next 24 hours. It'll be interesting to see how the marines rear goes as well. I hope they didn't forget to leave a few troops back at the Base!!! Don't want those Guerillas sneaking up behind you! Anyone else with up to date info whether real or Psych-ops keep us posted - Could be an interesting battle.

[Julien Sorel]

41. The Iraqis are making a silly mistake, from what I can tell.

Asymmetrical Warfare 101 says you should never go toe to toe with a superior opponent. The Republican Guard did the smart thing in melting away during the actual invasion; why these guys are choosing to fight now and get the crap knocked out of them makes no sense to me.

[mike_c]

43. *they* did not choose to fight....

They are under attack. They were imprisoned in Falluja by the siege, and now they are going to be killed. That was the plan from the very beginning. The coalition forces and the provo gov't want a slaughter.

[saigon68]

44. ONLY A FEW ARE STAYING--The Main force melted away

days ago. There are a few who volunteered to stay and defend the "Alamo"

This modern day Guernica will be on the lips of every Muslim child for the next 400 years.

Hundreds of Martyrs will be created and Millions of Muslims will swear vengeance to their memory.

This little adventure is giving Osama's recruiting department a HUGE WET DREAM as we post.

[Algomas]

47. Their Full Spectrum Incompetence is shocking...

The rest of the world must be in awe at our stupidity. The Fuhrer has crafted a brilliant plan. If we flatten Fallujah we will indeed be committed to endless war. If we are repelled and back down after this build-up we will be humiliated.

What is the "Yellow Rogue's" next move???

[harpo]

45. this just makes me ill

[berni_mccoy]

48. The Grave

The grave that they dug him had flowers
Gathered from the hillsides in bright summer colors,
And the brown earth bleached white at the edge of his gravestone.

He's gone.

When the wars of our nation did beckon,
A man barely twenty did answer the calling.
Proud of the trust that he placed in our nation,

He's gone,

But eternity knows him, and it knows what we've done.

And the rain fell like pearls on the leaves of the flowers
Leaving brown, muddy clay where the earth had been dry.
And deep in the trench he waited for hours,
As he held to his rifle and prayed not to die.

But the silence of night was shattered by fire
As guns and grenades blasted sharp through the air.
And one after another his comrades were slaughtered.
In morgue of marines, alone standing there.

He crouched ever lower, ever lower with fear.
"they can't let me die! the can't let me die here!
I'll cover myself with the mud and the earth.
I'll cover myself! I know I'm not brave!
The earth! the earth! the earth is my grave."

The grave that they dug him had flowers
Gathered from the hillsides in bright summer colors,
And the brown earth bleached white at the edge of his gravestone.

He's gone.

Lyrics from "The Grave" by Don McLean

[LightTheMatch]

50. This will accomplish nothing.

I can't believe they even care about this. Holding territory isn't relevant in this kind of warfare. It's not like the opposition/rebel/insurgent/whatever you want to call them forces have any kind of "base" or something that you could "capture". It's not that kind of conflict!

[burrowowl]

51. seizing the main city hospital

:wow: :grr:

WAR CRIME!?

[Zhade]

56. Using gunships from my dad's old squadron...fucks with my head every time.

Damn them to hell for all this killing!

[maddezmom]

59. updated story 38 insurgents killed

Iraqi troops killed 38 people and captured four foreigners when they swept into the first objective: Fallujah's main hospital, which Prime Minister Ayad Allawi and the U.S. military said was under insurgent control.


Iraqi soldiers stormed through the facility, blasting open doors and pulling handcuffed patients into the halls in search of gunmen.


Allawi said he had given the green light for international and Iraqi forces to launch the long-awaited offensive against Fallujah, considered the strongest bastion of Iraq (news - web sites)'s Sunni insurgents. "We are determined to clean Fallujah of terrorists," he said.


Throughout the morning, artillery and mortars pounded targets in Fallujah and on its outskirts, and a U.S. jet swooped low to fire rockets at insurgent positions. An AC-130 gunship raked the city all night long with cannon fire, and and before dawn, four 500-pound bombs were dropped, raising orange fireballs over the city's rooftops.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=540&ncid=716&e=1&u=/ap/20041108/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

thought this was carried out without a shot?? How do we know the insurgents weren't civilians killed in the bombings?

[jmcgowanjm]

68. Hospital wasn/t defended

At 22:30 Makka time Mujahideen foiled an attack and
have inflicted heavy casualties on occupation forces, with
reports of at least 25 marines killed in the western
outskirts alone. Other damage reported includes three
Abrams tanks and four Humvees. Fighting is still going on in
the eastern and northern parts of the city. Mujahideen are said
to be currently holding their positions in all areas. No reports
on Mujahideen casualties have yet been
received.

Notice how the attack has been imminent since last Tuesday?

Almost ready, we're in the staging area, troops massed,
this indicates attack wll start in 2-24 hrs, & on & on.

It seems as if Grozny is to be completely destroyed and
the defenders worn down before Russian troops will move
in. Russian Defence Minister, Igor Sergejev, has stated that
he expects to take Grozny by the middle of December, i.e.
after six to seven weeks of continuous bombardment.
Other Russian officers have said, that Grozny should not
be rebuild after the war, thus indicating a wish to see the
city completely destroyed.

http://www.caucasus.dk/publication1.htm

The only way we win-fuelair explosives.
And then we're dead.

[daleo]

74. I wonder what really happened

Remember how this will read elsewhere in the world: troops storming a hospital, pulling sick and wounded out of bed, and lining them up in the hallways. Somehow 38 people die. Hmmm.

"Allawi initially said 38 people were killed in the hospital seizure, but the U.S. military said no one was killed in the hospital operation. A military spokesman later gave a figure of 42 dead across the city since the Fallujah assault began." (from the link)

It looks like message control is a little loose still.

"One key reason to take Fallujah hospital early was likely to control information: The facility was the main source of Iraqi death tolls during the first U.S. siege of Fallujah in April, and U.S. commanders accused doctors there of exaggerating numbers."

Only one version of the story is to be allowed.

[maddezmom]

80. agree with ya, here's a couple of links

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x969096

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=969090&mesg_id=969090

[Englander]

61. After an interval of 700 years,the Crusades return....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3989639.stm

"The marines that I have had wounded over the past five months have been attacked by a faceless enemy," said Lieutenant-Colonel Gareth Brandl.
"But the enemy has got a face. He's called Satan. He lives in Falluja. And we're going to destroy him."


A number of people were taken prisoner in the raid on the hospital

Iraqis prepare graves for relatives killed in air strikes on the city.

Thousands of civilians have left the city - but many remain, living under US bombs which, as one doctor told the BBC, cannot tell women and children from militants.

This little injured boy lost his father to US bombing, hospital officials said.

[llmart]

62. Our media will tell us.....

how "successful" this operation is. They will tell us how we "killed thousands of insurgents without one US casualty." They will tell us that "we have won". They will never tell us the truth, that's for sure.

[Az_lefty]

63. Most of the insurgents have left town, they'll be back later.

[mike_c]

77. lots of civilians left to murder, however....

[bluedog]

66. Resistance over Fallujah Builds Up in Baghdad

thoughts from this Iraq :


IRAQ:
Resistance over Fallujah Builds Up in Baghdad
Dahr Jamail

BAGHDAD, Nov 8 (IPS) - .......................

The sharp increase in attacks on U..S. and allied forces has been only the most violent form of rising hostility. But it is not an extremist few that are becoming more and more strongly opposed to the occupation and now a U.S. assault on Fallujah.

What Iraqi people are saying could be even more worrying to the occupation forces than the attacks.

”The Fallujans should fight for their city,” says Mahmoud Shakir, 80, former commander of the Iraqi police in Baghdad. ”They are not terrorists, and there has been no proof of foreign fighters in Fallujah. And if there are Arabs there, they are more accepted than the Americans and coalition forces. In the name of liberty, they must fight.”

.......... ”Fallujah will be completely destroyed and the people will be killed because they are asking for independence and to be rid of the Americans.”

Ali al-Mishidani who returned to Iraq after the overthrow of the regime of Saddam Hussein said at the crowded al-Khulifa'a mosque in Baghdad that ”the Americans did something good by getting rid of Saddam Hussein. I believe there are terrorists there who are killing Fallujans and the Americans. But there are also Fallujans there who are fighting for their houses and their honour, and it is their right to do this.”

His views are mild compared to those of many others in Baghdad.

”The people of Fallujah have the right to fight for their city, because if the Americans are invading their city they have to defend it,” said Nisan al-Samarra'i, a 55 year-old trader in the Karrada district of Baghdad.


http://www.ipsnews.net/new_nota.asp?idnews=26184

[cal04]

69. Al Jazeera is flashing a large explosion

in central Baghdad
no report yet
OMG, when does it end
:mad:

[Carolinian]

71. Fallujah: Smoke-screen for election fraud.

[Rush1184]

81. My thoughts EXACTLY

[On Par]

73. A Random Interruption.... Falluja/Fallujah ?

Why is it that CNN spells it "Falluja," while everyone else, including the original quoted article in this thread spell it "Fallujah."

Okay, back to your regularly scheduled programming.

OP

[mike_c]

76. sooner of later, U.S. killers....

http://www.usmlo.org/archive2003/2003-05/photos/mayday/030501.iraq,%20fallujah.03.jpg

[RummyTheDummy]

78. This should be bloody

Thank God it's not our problem.