Geneva Conventions Protect Wounded in War

[maddezmom]

GENEVA - Protection of wounded combatants is a basic rule in the universally accepted treaty on warfare applying to the U.S. investigation of the videotaped fatal shooting of a wounded and apparently unarmed Iraqi combatant, international legal experts said Tuesday. But there is debate on whether self-defense could apply.



Coalition forces in Iraq (news - web sites) said the U.S. military was investigating whether the Marine who shot the man "acted in self-defense, violated military law or failed to comply with the Law of Armed Conflict."


Charles Heyman, a British infantry veteran and senior defense analyst with Jane's Consultancy Group in London, defended the Marine shown shooting the wounded Iraqi in a mosque in Fallujah.


"In a combat infantry soldier's training, he is always taught that his enemy is at his most dangerous when he is severely injured," Heyman said. There is the danger that the wounded enemy may be determined to "take one with you," with a hidden firearm or grenade.

more: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20041116/ap_on_re_mi_ea/marine_shooting_legal&cid=540&ncid=1480

[htuttle]

1. Although they've only caught one or two of these on film

You gotta think that it happens a lot more often. On the film the guys watching didn't seem shocked or anything -- like they'd seen that sort of behavior by a fellow solider everyday.

Just like Vietnam, I guess. I'm sure that in 40 years time, somebody somewhere will be claiming that there were no atrocities or crimes committed by US troops in Iraq.

[maddezmom]

3. ;(

Marines interviewed on Tuesday said they didn't see the shooting as a scandal, rather the act of a comrade who faced intense pressure during the effort to quell the insurgency in the city.


"I can see why he would do it. He was probably running around being shot at for days on end in Falluja. There should be an investigation but they should look into the circumstances," said Lance Corporal Christopher Hanson.


"I would have shot the insurgent too. Two shots to the head," said Sergeant Nicholas Graham, 24, of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. "You can't trust these people. He should not be investigated. He did nothing wrong."


The military command launched an investigation after video footage showed a U.S. Marine shooting a wounded and unarmed man in a mosque in the city on Saturday. The man was one of five wounded and left in the mosque after Marines fought their way through the area.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=586&ncid=586&e=5&u=/nm/20041116/wl_nm/iraq_falluja_investigation_dc

[halobeam]

4. We already have a "soldiers against the Iraq war"...

haven't checked how many more joined lately. Bet it's more everyday.

[bushisanidiot]

2. Maybe AWoL's first book will be titled "Justifiable Genocide"

how the HELL can they justify shooting wounded civilians?

[One_Life_To_Give]

5. For Perspective

Toward the end of fighting on Guadacanal. When the Japanese start using suicide charges. It was usually necessary for Marines to run a bayonette thru each fallen Japanese soilder to make certain they were not waiting for the Marines back to be turned.

The specifics of this case could go either way. All that is certain is that the case in war is not as Black and White as we might imagine.

[htuttle]

6. Ehem...The Japanese attacked us first

The people we are currently slaughtering are the ones that we supposedly went to 'save' from Saddam Hussein.

Not a good analogy at all.

[One_Life_To_Give]

8. War is War

So if we attacked Japan first, the Marines should have just walked past enemy soldiers lying on the ground. And taken a knife in the back because they had it coming?

[htuttle]

10. These aren't brave Marines in WWII fighting the Japanese on some island

The troops in Iraq are killing unarmed civilians, women and children, often in their own homes.

There's just no equivalence at all. Your attempt to do so disgusts me.

[ElectroPrincess]

16. Yeah, it's a judgment call ...

If you're Christian, guess the final judgment will be passed to Saint Peter as this Marine arrives at the gates of heaven.

The bottom line is that * FORCED this war on many of us. It was a war of choice. All the horrific consequences make it that much more detestable ONLY because we did NOT have to be in Iraq to keep the USA safer from terrorists.

[Malva Zebrina]

7. It will fade away like Abu Ghraib

has. Nothing to see here and do not dare accuse an
American Marine or the mighty military of the US, of murder or of policies that encourage murderous animalistic behavior from troops gone nuts.

I have read more people excusing this behavior on various grounds, than not.

There are also reports of a hospital being captured/bombed and doctors fleeing the mess killed by the onslaught as well as people being pulled out of their sick beds and handcuffed, although the source of that report is questionable.

But what source isn't questionable? Not our own, that is for certain.

I understand the BBC ran the story first.

We have see no woundeded Iraqis either except for heartbreaking pictures of small bewildered and maimed Iraqi children.



In the future, as the continuing, everlasting wars go on, look to see the internets being squelched of all free intercourse.

[wickywom]

9. I think our Gov. doesn't care about the wounded issue because

we probably won't be fighting in situations where mass numbers of our soldiers
could become hostages.

We have the big gun and bombs.
It seems to me that this is the war policy of tyrants.

[atreides1]

11. Nothing Will Happen

This marine will not be punished, the campaign to pressure his chain of command to do nothing has already started. It was on CNN this morning, and his buddies think the circumstances should be considered,
the reporter who was there is even saying things were confused, and now some Brit who works for Jane's is justifying what was done.

We have become no better then the SS and the Einzatzgruppen. The next time that an American soldier is captured, don't count on the Geneva Conventions having any meaning.

And just for arguments sake, if this Iraqi had been booby trapped, this marine could have been responsible for the deaths of the other marines who were in range of an exploding grenade, but he would be dead as well. I'm sure the survivors wouldn't be singing his praises then, would they?

[Oreo]

12. Isn't that quaint?

What Geneva Convention? It doesn't pertain to this situation :puke:

[cosmik debris]

20. Thank you for that information

It seems that some people have not been paying attention or they would know that the Geneva Conventions do not apply to us because we are so goddam righteous and they are so "quaint" That is what we hired Alberto Gonzales for! To tell us that we are above the law.

[CHICKEN CAPITOL USA]

13. justifying it and defending it

just makes it look like you do it all the time.
Gives a really bad image.
The least they could do is to act a little shocked

Rebublikkkan Moral Values.
Would JESUS have "applied" two "shots" to the head?

What kind of Church says it's "justified" to shoot an unarmed "native" who's been bleeding for two days insided his CHURCH ?
These troops initially took out the hospital then proceeded to blow up the place block by block with tanks and air support.
What the hell did they think they'd do with the wounded?
They had no intention to provide any sort of medical assistance to any "enemy" (residents of the city they were invading)
They knew right from the start it was "kill anything that moves"--


The corporate media would have you believe that all citizens were gone and only "terra-ists" remained to fight-
-Don't they realize that it's obvious to readers and viewers that If that were the case they would have just leveled the place with airstrikes til every buiding was demolished...and suffered zero American casualties.

[arwalden]

14. Screw The Geneva Conventions!! They Are TERRORISTS!!!

They knocked over our buildings so GOD tells us we can kill them. All of them. None of them are innocent. Get out of the UN! God bless America! Turn the desert to glass! Nuke the hell out of them. Kill kill kill! They aren't human. These colors don't run. Pray for our troops. Remember 9-11. It's a new world. Things have changed. Hey, you can't stop us... WE'RE AMERICANS!! Get over it!!

[cosmik debris]

21. Amen brother

Praise the lord and pass the ammunition!

[cknope]

15. Other Iraq atrocities

A few months back I saw two video clips of US soldiers shooting unarmed people. One was a group of men walking in the street and soldiers trained their sights on them from a helicopter and started shooting. The other was of a soldier shooting a wounded or captured prisoner and he and his buddies laughing about it. I can't remember where I saw them, does anyone have links to these clips?

I'm wondering why this latest is receiving so much attention when the others did not?:(

[newyawker99]

17. Hi cknope!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[lawladyprof]

18. Because the election is over--eom

[Bragi]

19. So much attention?

Cknope asked: "I'm wondering why this latest is receiving so much attention when the others did not?"

Is it receiving that much attention? I don't think it's getting all that much play in US media, who, as usual, seem content to think that it's not clear if this is an atrocity, only time will tell, etc. etc.

My guess is that it will quickly disappear from US coverage, just like every other atrocity story out of Iraq. In a week or two the military will then announce that it was self defence, and no charges will be laid.

The murderers juiced marine buddies will then chant "Hoo ah", and everyone will move on, except for a few right wingers who will see this "baseless" allegation as yet another instance of irrational anti-Americanism.

And so it goes, unless someone credible fastens on to it, like, say, the new UN Human Rights chief, Louise Arbour, who has already made a statement on it.

I hope she stays with it, since even an attempted investigation by her will at least keep the world outside the US informed about what is really happening in Iraq.

People who depend on US media for their information will, of course, remain clueless.