American Airlines Removes MD-80 Pillows

[Tab]

ORT WORTH, Texas - Say goodbye to pillows on American Airlines MD-80 jets.

The Fort Worth-based airline this week removed pillows from its 334 MD-80s in a move expected to save time and money by enabling workers to clean the cabins faster, said spokesman Tim Wagner.

"It will streamline our cabin service," he said.

Since crews won't be spending time picking up pillows, they should be able to make cabins cleaner, Wagner told the Fort Worth Star-Telegram for a story in Wednesday's editions.

Wagner estimated the airline would be saving "in the mid-six figures" because of the move.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=&e=2&u=/ap/20041117/ap_on_bi_ge/american_pillows

[MercutioATC]

1. Hey, one airline saved six figures by eliminating spoons.

Everything they served could be eaten with forks, so they eliminated spoons. They saved $300k+ per year on fuel costs.

Some of these major airlines fly a LOT of airplanes. Imagine what eliminating a 30-cent part in an F-150 would save Ford.

[Chimpanzee]

8. That reminds me of a pet peave of mine - SPORKS

They don't work well as a spoon or a fork! What's the deal with that!!

[VolcanoJen]

27. Sporks are an insult to fine cutlery.

They're entirely useless, to boot.

[LisaM]

52. Sporks are an insult to BAD cutlery

I hate them.

[ilovenicepeople]

65. I like the spork,mind you I also love corndogs.

HATE is such a HARSH term it's just a spork,what dida spork ever do to you?Theres just been to much anti-sporkism on DU lately.:cry:

[The Minus World]

62. This discussion of sporks offends me...

My old username was MagicalSpork.

I feel hated.

[CBGLuthier]

2. I know how to save AA a fortune

Don't fly on them.

Then they will not have to clean up after anyone or provide any services to anyone.


Seems like a competent business plan to me.

[damntexdem]

10. Seems reasonable, now that they've eliminated pillows.

On the other hand, I live in the DFW area, so it's rather hard to avoid American.

[Nashyra]

18. Right

So more people would be out a job, there is a difference between American Airlines the company and American Airlines the "family of employees"

[sui generis]

3. of all the aircraft that need them

their old MD-80s are like sitting in sacks of concrete, and that's just the seats that actually recline more than half an inch.

[iamjoy]

4. I Know How To Save 7 Figures

eliminate the bonus for the top executives. If the airline isn't profitable, they don't deserve bonuses or large salary increases, now do they?

Instead, while they enjoy their nice cushy headquarters, some poor flight attendants are going to be verbally abused by some one on a 18 hour flight who can't sleep.

[Nashyra]

19. Can't fly 18 hours on an MD 80

So it will be several crews of flight attendants

[high density]

31. The MD-80 has only about an 1800mi range

So it will not be going on any 18 hour flights. ;)

[SeattleDem]

5. They treated me like crap when I flew with my toddler recently

so, I'm already unofficially "boycotting" them. My husband, toddler, and I did not have seats together and they refused to try to help us at the gate! They told us to board and ask people around us to switch with us. Now, I'm traveling with a carseat, which is not easy to get installed, but they want me to wait to install it, in hopes that some kind souls will move around to accomodate us. So, that means I"m going to delay the take-off by the time we switch all around and get the carseat installed.

Then, they tell us that there is no early boarding for families with small children, that we have to wait until our numbers are called. Great idea, toddlers love waiting in long lines with lots of strangers.

Then, on the flight, they do not offer us drinks. They offered drinks to everyone around us, but pushed right past us! I was leaned over picking up a toy so I guess they pretended that I wasn't interested. They ignored my husband's attempt to get their attention.

so, they can keep their pillows and everything else. You don't treat three paying customers like that. We can take our money elsewhere and they won't have to worry about picking up after us.

[AndrewJacksonFaction]

7. I stopped flying them. They left us at the gate along with one of.........

stewardess'. They tell you to be there at the gate 1/2 hour before the plane takes off for some reason. Well we found out the hard way that cushion of time is so they can leave early if they so desire. Not to mention their pricing schemes are as old as the industry is. The majors pay to much attention to themselves and not enough to the customer. It is no wonder why the majors are failing, and they have to resort to trimming off pillows, food, drink, cheaper toilet paper, etc.. Which in turn makes it less comfortable for a passenger. With this move they will lose even more customers. I swear I could run an airline better than these jimmy jacks at the helm of these major airlines. Hope all the majors go Ch. 11 and are forced to examine their business practices, bastards!!!

[Nashyra]

21. Glad I won't see you on one of my flights

And the majors are losing money because several reasons. Yes poor management style, but there pricing is the same as the others. When you utilize different aircraft as oppose to one type like the low cost carriers you have to have qualified crews, mechanics etc for all the different aircraft, and you can not go non-stop overseas without the larger aircraft. Try taking Southwest to London from new York. And then there is the fuel costs. For every PENNY that oil is over $30.00 per barrel it costs American an additional 1million a year, do the math and figure out how much that costs their bottom line, then figure out if your own company could take a hit like that and still make a profit.

[Puglover]

42. You don't know what you're talking about...

the reason the majors are losing so much money is they still are charging fare levels at 1979 prices. People like you want fine dining and free cocktails for 159.00 round trip dallas to london...
:eyes:

And as the poster mentioned. With oil at over 50.00 a barrel the majors are screwed.

[Tight_rope]

61. You are so right...I missed my flight because the plane got in early

dropped off picked up and left. They didn't follow the regularly schedule time. I had checked in early but went to get something to eat. When I got to the gate. They told me just missed it. But my bags were on the fight. Unfortunatly, there were no more flights leaving or connecting to go to DC that evening, so I had to go home and come back early the next morning. I cut my vacation by 2 days.

[Nashyra]

20. I have worked for American Airlines for 27 years

and not once have I worked or been on a flight that they did not have pre-boarding. Perhaps you were late to the gate or perhaps you did not arrive early enough, perhaps who ever did your ticketing did not pick seats. Most families that board with a car seat have pre arranged seats.

[SeattleDem]

25. nope, we were at the gate plenty early and told this was policy

and I was told both on the out-going flight and the in-coming flight that this was the policy (ie, no pre-boarding for toddlers).

We had pre-arranged seats, they just weren't together. I was the first customer in line at the gate desk when the gate agent arrived, so getting there even earlier would not have mattered. We had 3 seats scattered about the plane and they wouldn't help us. They told us there were no empty rows to put us in either, but when we boarded, nearly all of the last 5-6 rows of the plane were totally empty. They lied. We'd have sat back there.

As to pre-boarding again, other families with small children were also turned away from the front of the line and told to wait. This happened last month in Seattle and St Louis.

Maybe this is the policy but it's up to the gate agent to enforce or not??

[booksenkatz]

35. SeattleDem, in your defense

American did exactly the same thing with me a few years back, and yes, I also arrived early. I was traveling alone with a small toddler and they treated me about as well as the stuff that's on the bottom of your shoe, on both legs of the flight. They didn't offer to help me in any way, shape or form. They wouldn't let me pre-board. They didn't offer me squat. The skycaps were content to watch me lug all my luggage, stroller and the toddler by myself. So now I don't fly American any longer when I visit my folks in DFW. As you say, perhaps it is a gate agent decision, or a local problem. Hey, it's their loss -- my little boy and I are excellent flyers, always mindful of others' space and ability to withstand noise, LOL! Northwest Airlines appreciates us alot more.

[chiburb]

26. Nashyra...

I fly AA exclusively because of the extra leg room. I've heard that the new CEO/Chairman(?) has indicated they may be putting the removed seats back. If that happens, I'll have NO reason to fly AA solely...

If every airline is the same, what's the point?

[txindy]

36. I've been on several AA flights out of D/FW that did NOT have pre-boarding

Maybe it wasn't coincidental that the people working those particular flights also acted as if they were doing us all a favor by simply being there. :eyes: Yes, we were there in plenty of time. In two cases, nearly two hours ahead of time.

[Puglover]

43. Ive worked for NWA for 25 years

and Im with you, I've NEVER seen a flight that didn't preboard people with small kids. It's actually out of a courtesy to the other passengers to let the parent types get settled first. If you boarded everyone together it would slow up boarding big time.

[Obamarama]

56. Have you ever heard of this thing called seat assignments?

You can call the airline up to 90 days prior to departure and ask for seat assignments if you are concerned about flying together in the same row of seats. 30 minutes before departure at the gate for a flight that is probably oversold is no time to start begging for three seats together.

[SeattleDem]

58. did you read my posts?

ummm, what part wasn't clear? We had seat assignments. My 13 month old daughter was in a row by herself. Gee, sorry, but I didn't want to sit in my assigned seat in a different row. Didn't think that was fair to the other passengers in my daughter's row to have to watch her while my husband and I were seated elsewhere, according to the seat assignments we had.

I did what the airline told me to do, which was to inquire at the gate about changing our pre-assigned seats for this flight, which was not sold out.

So nice of you to write a condescending post when you clearly didn't read first.

[LTRS]

71. Aw, they aren't that bad!

I fly twice a month, minimum. Used to fly a variety of airlines, now just stick to AA. They ALL suck and all have nasty people working for them. There is no industry I know of that is worse about customer service than the airline industry. That said, AA sucks less in my opinion. I'd rather have extra leg room than pillows anyday. And they don't rip you off for non-stops like other airlines. Or at least not as often, anyway. They aren't as late as often as others either, and are VERY accomodating when it comes to finding a way to get you home that night when things are all backed up.

AA hasn't had pre-boarding for a while now. If you want seats together you have to CALL the airline in advance of the trip - well in advance. Lots of people booking online now and they seem to think if you don't choose seats during the online booking you are still gonna get seats together. No, you're not. You're dealing with a computer, not a person when you book online. It doesn't know or care that you want to sit together. If you book online, call AA (or any airline you booked on) immediately after you are done and request the seats. Or, in the case of AA, go to their web site and pick your seats. Don't trust picking seats on Expedia either. I have had these wiped out more than once and AA claims it was Expedia's doing.

AA would be stupid to get rid of the extra leg room. I get to fly mostly first class or exit row since I have so many miles now, but I orginally went with them for that reason.

They fired the CEO who gave out the exec bonuses while laying off the rank and file, by the way. As they should have. Some employees have told me that the new guy listens to employee suggestions a lot more. I hope so.

[Obamarama]

74. What I meant was.....

The time to request different seat assignments is as far before your departure date as possible, especially if you want to ensure being seated together. The best time to get specific seat assignments is when you make the actual reservation.

I guess the point I am trying to make is that you knew being seated together was important to you. Yet, you waited until you were about to board the plane to worry about it, and then expected the airline to make it their priority. You didn't worry about trying to change your seat assignments until the last possible moment, but yet you expected the airline to accomodate your lack of planning.

I fly maybe 40 to 50 times a year and in all my flying experience I have never encountered these horrible, nasty, unhelpful airline employees everyone seems to whine about. My observation has been that disgruntled, whining passengers who have recieved brusque treatment from airline employees have received that treatment because they have been unreasonable, rude, or just plain stupid when dealing with airline employees.

[flygal]

67. That's total B.S. on the early boarding...

They do it - you unfortunatly got a bad agent. The biggest problem with the airlines is they pay their gate agents the lowest. And these are the people responsible for getting people on the flights. I know our agents in San Fransisco were paid less than $10/hr. Obviously you don't live in the city on those wages. Who would commute to work for that?!

[LTRS]

72. No they don't - haven't for many months

In fact, when they first ended early boarding they announced it - "we no longer board families early. We board by group numbers only."

[GarySeven]

6. Seats being replaced with wooden benches ...

Passengers will have to share one Readers Digest from 1967.

[Chimpanzee]

9. Don't forget the ropes for seat belts - It worked for Jethro!

[BuelahWitch]

40. Wasn't that an old sketch on the Carol Burnett show?

Tim Conway flying "no frills" with a rope for a seat belt and brought his own lunch...

[flygal]

70. LOL - I thought the same thing

we actually had to watch that during flight attendant training. The FAA requires so many hours of training and since we had a small class we watched all sorts of videos. That one was my favorite.

[Chimpanzee]

77. Could be, but the first flight the Clampets took was on an old

plane (they thought they were on a bus - surprise) they had ropes for seat belts.

[musette_sf]

11. Didn't you hear about the magazines on AA?

True story:

I flew from SFO to EWR on AA for business. Of course no non-stop direct flights, so the trip was a torture combo of MD-80s and 727s that looked, smelled, and felt like they had seen service during the Nixon administration.

Return flight was EWR/DFW/SFO, which is a torture slog with 1000 miles and several hours needlessly added. I brought 3 new magazines and the Sunday NYT. There was a big delay at EWR, so by the time we landed at DFW I had completed the crossword puzzle and read all of the Times and the magazines.

I asked the flight attendant for a magazine. She gave me this snide look, and said "Don't you know we haven't had magazines since September 11th?"

I must have missed that part where the terrorist bonked the pilot in the head with a copy of Vogue. :-) Besides, I've flown United since then, and they still have mags. What a crock.

AA sucks, and I wouldn't fly them again unless I absolutely had to. On the next trip to New Jersey, I took JetBlue into JFK. The drive on the Belt Pkwy on the way to NJ was miserable, but it beat being treated like shit by AA.

[Tight_rope]

63. That flight attendent lied about the magazines!

I've flown AA several times past few years since 9/11 and they have had updated magazines on the planes. She/he was being a bitch to you, is all I can guess.

[Sin]

15. In other news

American Airlines has determined that it could boost profits into the black by hundreds of millions by Eliminating passengers from all flights essentially grounding all plains. When a top American Airlines official was asked how they expected to make money the response was that customers would buy a ticket and service Representative would instruct them on the quickest Driving rout to there destination. :)

I bet there going to have scales soon at the flight check in soon so if your over a set weight they will tack on additional fees for fuel cost. If they keep Eliminating things from plains people might start to think the Us postal service might be a better option. lol

[Laughing Mirror]

24. And with most of its pages ripped out

there having been a unexpected shortage in the outhouse down the aisle.

[TahitiNut]

12. Looks like I'll have to carry my own lumbar support.

Those pillows were the only relief I could get for my sciatica in the crappy excuse for seats the airlines use. Those seats don't offer either the thigh support or the lumbar support a full-sized adult needs, let alone the space one requires for minimal freedom of movement.

[Ima]

13. oh brother

By that reasoning, my house would be easier to clean, and therefor somehow 'magically' cleaner, if I got rid of my refrigerator. Any one got a pickup?

[TahitiNut]

16. Did you click on the wrong 'Reply' hyperlink?

I think so. :shrug:

[Ima]

32. TahitiNut

yes it looks like I did. My comment had nothing to do with your post.

[sui generis]

33. ha haha hahahahah

that was good - of course I've NEVER done that myself :hi:

[txindy]

37. Those pillows saved my lower back on many flights

I know what you mean, TahitiNut. It's a good thing I rarely fly these days or I'd have to carry around my own pillow. Those seats are so painful without support. :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown:

[yellowcanine]

14. Why not remove the seats and just hose down the cabin between flights?

[CityDem]

17. I never use those pillows

Most unsanitary things around. Each time the flight attendant asks me if I want one, I think about the guy/gal that just used it and drooled on it for the past 4 hours.

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[henslee]

23. Anyone fly independent air? - super cool, no frills east coast regional.nt

[Bluebear]

29. Independence is already in financial trouble :(

(Buffalo, NY, November 11, 2004) - - Its only been in the air 4 months, but Buffalo's newest Airline is already in financial trouble.

The parent company of Independence Air says its growing debtload may soon force it to file for Chapter 11 Bankruptcy Protection. The low cost carrier lost more than 82 million dollars in the 3rd quarter and blames much of that on soaring fuel costs and competition with other Airlines.

http://www.wivb.com/Global/story.asp?S=2553238&nav=0RapT1Vb

[TahitiNut]

28. Delaying the inevitable: Nationalizing the airlines.

The airline "industry" (at least the transnational and international common carriers) is ripe for nationalization. This has been realized in most western nations. The public (taxpayer) pays for terminals, air traffic control, IATA, and wide variety of subsidies. The (easement) use of airspace is a function of eminent domain. Liabilities are beyond anything the private corporations are able or willing to bear. The billions in corporate welfare (without corresponding equity) has done little more than enrich the executives, investment bankers, and major shareholders.

Nationalize 'em! Set an "umbrella" for service standards and prices - and regulate the rest.

[Hekate]

55. Silly goose: this is the "ownership society"!

The corporations own everything, no matter how bankrupt, no matter how badly run. And here's the neatest part: the corporate owners regulate themselves! After all, we couldn't trust those government bureaucrats with anything as dangerous as a loaded regulation in their hands.

Hekate

[Lydia Leftcoast]

30. Why I fly as little as possible:

(and I used to love to)

1. The seats are narrower and crammed closer together than they used to be. I don't recall feeling claustrophobic on a plane before about 1994. I'm 5'10" and afflicted with stubborn middle aged spread. Passengers complain about people who grab the back of the seat in front of them to stand up. Well, between my height and my arthritic knees, that's the only way I CAN stand up.

2. Airlines that were once capable of serving edible full meals (really good meals on international flights) suddenly can barely manage to hand out three pretzels. On airlines such as Northwest, which pretends to serve meals, the food is so bad that they may as well not even bother. On my flight from LA two months ago, Northwest gave me a dry sandwich of reconstituted chemical luncheon meat, a chemical choclatoid candy bar, and a bag of baby carrots, some of which were rotten.

3. They cancel flights that aren't full enough. In September, I flew from MSP to LAX to NRT. Since I make a point of not flying U.S. airlines overseas, I bought a ticket from MSP to LAX on Northwest with the intention of transferring to All Nippon Airways (ANA). On my original schedule, I had four hours' layover.

At 8PM the night before I was scheduled to leave, I did the computerized check-in-from-home routine and was delighted to see that I could get a whole row to myself. Less than a half hour later, I got an automated phone call telling me that my flight had been cancelled and that I had been automatically rebooked on the next flight out. This would leave me two hours to transfer. I wasn't happy, but oh, well, I could live with that.

I got to the airport the next morning, only to find that this second flight was delayed and that we would not be leaving till an hour later. Getting worried, I phoned ANA's reservation center to find out what would happen if I missed the flight, and they told me that I'd have to go the next day, since they had only one flight per day on that route and my class of ticket wouldn't allow transfer to another airline.

When we finally boarded, the plane was packed down to the last seat. Both the other people in my row had been bumped off the earlier flight and had been looking forward to a nice, spacious plane. Instead, it was sardine city.

When they announced the estimated time of arrival in Los Angeles, I got real worried. I'd have 45 minutes to claim my baggage and high-tail it to the international terminal. I mentioned this to the people in my row, and the young woman next to me, bless her heart, offered to run ahead to alert ANA that I was coming.

I hurried to the baggage claim, quietly had an anxiety attack while waiting for my luggage, and then race-walked to the international terminal, since I couldn't risk waiting for the shuttle. ANA was ready for me, thanks to the kindness of my fellow passenger, and escorted me through security so that I made the flight with only minutes to spare.

Once I was on the ANA flight, my troubles were over. I had leg room, a seatback TV screen, real food, continual beverage service, and the world's sweetest flight attendants. On the way back, an overnight flight, they set up serve-yourself beverage and snack bars in the galleys, so that passengers who preferred to sleep wouldn't be bothered by questions about whether they wanted anything, while the insomniacs could have nighttime snacks.

When I lived in Portland, I knew two people who worked for Delta, another troubled airline. They told me about the various ways that Delta was nickeling and diming both passengers and employees.

4. A fare system that makes about as much sense as one arrived at by throwing darts. Flying between Minneapolis and Portland, one might pay as much as $2100 or as little as $198 for the same coach seat. Why not just charge one price like a normal conveyance (higher than the cheapest advanced purchase, lower than so-called "full coach"), with maybe one lower price for advance purchases?

Can you imagine trying to take a city bus that charged you on the basis of how full the bus was, whether you were going to a frequently used stop, and how far ahead you had decided to ride--say, $1 if you decided two months in advance or $10 if you decided to board at the last minute? That's what the airlines do.

Because of Items 1, 2, and 3, I refuse to pay more than I have to. Hey, airlines, get a clue: this is why people are seeking out low fares. It's stupid to pay $700 (the "bereavement fare") from Portland to Minneapolis when the person next to you may be paying $200 and getting the same straitjacket of a seat and the same inedible "meal."

I would happily pay $700 for a comfortable seat, a real meal, and flight attendants who didn't look as if they might start slapping you around if you asked for a second cup of coffee.
---------
Because of a horrible flight on Pan Am in 1978, I was not the least bit sad when they went under, other than feeling sorry for the people who lost their jobs. I will not weep for Delta or Northwest or U.S. Air or United. (I haven't flown on American since 1975, so I'll reserve judgment.)

As one who remembers what it was like to fly before deregulation, I would welcome reregulation of the industry. They are obviously incapable of managing their own affairs.

[llmart]

38. In response to your last paragraph.....

I've been flying since 1967 and you are correct. I'll never forget my first flight - I had just turned 18 - and it was wonderful. I had a full course meal with real cutlery. The seat were plenty comfortable. Everything changed after that idiot Reagan touted how wonderful deregulation of everything would be for us "consumers." Yeah, right. Those of us who have been around long enough to remember, know that the average consumer didn't profit at all from any deregulation.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Puglover]

44. Ill bet you had about 26 flight attendants on AllNippon...

Any idea of what these people are paid? So what do you want? American airline employees to make 5.00 an hour so we can staff the planes with cabin attendants to rub your feet? I get soooo sick of people who have never worked for an airline in their life comparing American carriers to Asian. It just shows your ignorance.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

49. There were six in coach

on a full-size plane with seating 3-5-3 across.

It would be better to ask how much the executives made--probably less than the self-congratulatory bunch in Eagan. I don't think Japanese airline employees make $5.00/hour, not when I saw retail and restaurant help wanted signs for between $8 and $10.

No one rubbed my feet. It WAS still coach, after all. In fact, since I had enough leg room, I didn't need my feet rubbed.

But they didn't have this, "Oh, damn! We've got passengers on this flight!" attitude that I've seen too often in the U.S.

I live in MSP, so I know NWA all too well. I knew I didn't want to be in sardine hell for however many hours it takes to fly non-stop from MSP to NRT.

[Puglover]

50. "I live in MSP; I know NWA well"

in every city in the US that is home to a major it is like a sport to beat up on them. Jesus, it's so fucking tired.
And FYI, the Asian flight attendants make crap for money. You can believe what you want but that's the facts.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

78. "In every city in the US that is home to a major it is like a sport

to beat up on them."

And for good reason. The majors have a near monopoly in their respective hubs, and they act like it.

When I moved from Portland back to Minneapolis, NWA wanted to charge me $1100 for a one-way flight, even purchased 2 months in advance. I guess since they have the only non-stop on that route, they feel as if they can get away with that, and I have swallowed their high prices for sardine seats and chemical food on occasions when I've needed to be in MSP on time for a family event.

But this time, I had no schedule to keep, so I went on the Internet. Frontier was willing to take me for $298, even though I would have to sit in the Denver airport for four hours. Well, this time I had no schedule to keep, so I decided that for $800, I could waste an afternoon. And to top it off, I got better seating and encountered more pleasant employees.

Oh, and those several remarks about how Asian flight attendants "make crap for money"? Never mind how true it is--Japan is no longer a low-wage country, by the way--you seem to be saying that it's okay for U.S. flight attendants to be surly because they're well-paid and that the Asian flight attendants are pleasant because they're like slaves. :eyes:

[Puglover]

83. Boy,

did you once upon a time apply with NWA and not get hired? You sure seem to have a sore spot with my company. You haven't addressed one of my points. You simply keep going on about how horrible NWA is.
Back at you with the :eyes: Whatever....

[Lydia Leftcoast]

84. You haven't addressed any of mine, certainly

:shrug:

I'm not sure which points of yours I failed to address, other than that you seem determined to defend the stupid policies of your company's managers.

[Puglover]

46. You call yourself a democrat and yet you say

"other then feeling sorry for people who lost their jobs. (wow how big of you!) "I will not weep for Delta or Northwest etc"....all because you had a bad flight or two. Wow...now there is a progressive attitude.
If NWA goes under and I lose my home the fact that Lydia is "feeling sorry" somewhere for me will give me much comfort. Okay...stepping down from soapbox. It just completely pisses me off when I see how much NWA gives Minneapolis in money and jobs etc etc to see someone bash them so easily. I wonder in the US how many cities the size of Minneapolis/St Paul have nonstops to Toyko, London and when the long runway is done Hong Kong? Do you have any idea how much business that brings to Minnesota? Geez

Does managment make asinine decisions? Of course they do. Do the pilots need to tighten up their work rules and HUGE salaries...I believe so. And mostly does oil need to come down? Yes. I fly alot and still whenever I get up in the air Im mightly glad I get to where Im going safely. Have I had some uncomfortable flights? You bet! But I throw on my walkman, I have a good book to read and I ALWAYS grab something to eat at the airport. MSP is like a shopping mall now and there is much to choose from.

On edit add last screed.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

47. Try a bad flight or a hundred

:-(

[LTRS]

73. Well if you work for an airline....

please, please, please tell me why their workers are so sh*tty to their customers. I go out of my way to be courteous and pleasant to every person who provides services to me, but airline employees are just down right rude. The whole industry needs a customer service overhaul. And if people who work in the airline industry don't like their jobs (and it sure seems like they don't - and I don't blame them) they should do something else. Not take it out on their customers.

[Puglover]

76. I agree with you totally..

however I think you are painting with a very broad brush. I was an agent during the merger between NWA and Republic. (I've since left the customer service area as it was simply too stressful)At one point I was pulled away from a urinal and thrown up against the john door by a pissed off passenger, simply because he saw my uniform. You have to be very tough as just by the nature of travel so many people are stressed to begin with. And then when something goes wrong they freak out. I could be firm with passengers (I always gave it to them straight and truly that seemed to work the best) I remember once they didn't cater a 757 going to EWR with anything but ice pop and booze. It was supposed to be a dinner flight. To wait for food would have been a two hour delay. I got on the PA and put it to the passengers...want to sit and wait for two hours to eat din din or we'll give you a voucher for something in EWR. Unanimously they elected to push and go. I found out later that less then 1/2 took the voucher and noone was pissed. When I was a supervisor I wouldn't put up with my agents that were consistently rude with passengers. When you say "airline employees are just down right rude" it isn't much different then saying "French people are all rude" Fact is some are and some aren't.

[LTRS]

85. Sorry, but it fits

I fly at least 50 times a year, which is roughly 150 flights. And the fact is that you are lucky if they are just unfriendly. For some reason airlines put up with employees who are so rude that if they worked at McD's they wouldn't last 3 days. I mean it when I say that the airline industry has the worst customer service of any service oriented business people deal with. It's not even a close contest as far as I am concerned. And they make travel even more miserable than it already is.

[ThoughtCriminal]

34. I'll bet the genius who suggested this gets a bonus

that eats up the savings over the next few years.

[bunkerbuster1]

41. Anyone else read this headline as "M-80 Pillows?"

I was thinking, well yeah, you don't want explosives on board, what're they thinking?

Anyone? didn't think so.

[montana_hazeleyes]

54. I did too

LOL

[CHICKEN CAPITOL USA]

68. yeah , same here--that's why I looked

They'd better ban all M-80's on all planes!!

[IndianaGreen]

45. Let's get rid of seats and install benches

that would make it easier for the cleaning crews to get more work done in less time.

[LisaM]

53. Ha ha ha

thanks, I needed a good laugh.

[pinniped]

48. Oh, I thought they were removing the "smothering" capability.

.

[karlrschneider]

51. Urk...that was my first thought too! "Do as I say, or I'll shove this

pillow in your face!"
:eyes:

[LibDemAlways]

57. All US carriers suck - some worse than others, I suppose.

What was at one time a reasonably pleasant experience has degenerated into no more than a ride on a dirty flying bus. Hostile gate agents and surly crews frequently await those who have survived the nightmare of TSA screening. Service has been cut to the bone. Meanwhile execs. continue to make the mega bucks while the carriers struggle to attract customers willing or forced to put up with being treated like cattle being herded into a pen. It's awful.

[Zerex71]

59. I know what will save them a lot of money --

Me not flying on their sorry-ass airlines, that's what.

[Divine Discontent]

60. TOOK MY ELDERLY FATHER

to the airport, 1st time I've been to one in 5 years when I flew last, and EVERY employee was rude and inconsiderate except the guy outside with the wheelchair. He didn't even expect a tip, and when I turned around to give him a five after he gratiously wished me well from distance, he was stunned and said God bless you. Everyone inside the airport were stodgy, looked at me like I was doing them a horrible disservice by being alive.
I am extremely nice to strangers when I'm asking questions. So frustrating.

Today, at Winn Dixie Supermarket the guy at the CS desk never smiled and was rude too, what is WRONG with people? Can't we send them to finishing school if their parents didn't raise them to be nice?

I hope to have only one more flight in my lifetime, the one that gets me out of America.

[RevolutionStartsNow]

64. I find myself making extra efforts to be nice to people

Not for any particular reason, just because it's polite and easy and makes a big difference in your day.

I have never been intentionally rude to people who I have short encounters with (checkers at the store, etc.) but I suppose I am often distracted and in a hurry; it's easy to not make eye contact and just mumble something before moving along. Recently I've been making an effort to say a genuine "Thank you" to people who serve me in some way at the store, the airport, etc., and to smile and make real contact.

I think there is definitely something wrong in this country -- people range from detached to just plain rude. I'm trying to wage my own little personal war against this by being extra nice to people. It won't change the world but it makes a difference in my life and hopefully in the lives of people I encounter every day.

[Divine Discontent]

66. nice!

I'm going to start saying thank you more to the regular folk who are nice, I feel I do it, but I will try to do it with 'realness'.

[mike_c]

69. comment for airline industry folks...

Since I've seen several post in this thread. I'm nearly 50, and I've been flying for over 30 years. I once loved it, and flew frequently. Now I hate it. It's gotten to the point that I avoid flying if at all possible-- literally avoid it, as in I no longer attend meetings that I have to fly to, visit people I can't drive to, and rarely travel internationally except by car (Mexico and Canada). Clue for the airline industry-- I'd rather spend 20 hours driving than 2 hours flying (which actually means 6 or 7 hours in and out of airports, etc.).

The entire experience has become painfully uncomfortable, from airport shakedowns to maximal packing treatment on the planes, surly flight attendents and airport personnel, and awful schedules that change unpredictably when you're 1,000 miles from home. I'm not criticizing any particular carrier-- the entire industry sucks, in my experience, at least for domestic travel. I don't wish anyone ill and I hope everyone keeps their jobs, but you've got to understand that when you alienate people who genuinely enjoy traveling you've shot yourself in the foot, bigtime. Airline travel was a real pleasure twenty-five years ago. It was not much fun, but expedient ten years ago. Today it is torturous, a terrible burden to be endured only in the most extreme circumstances.

[Obamarama]

75. I don't know what you people expect....

First of all, no, I am not an airline employee. I just fly a lot and feel qualified to speak out on this issue.

You do make a good point that the airline experience is not what it was 25 years ago. You can thank the good old, Reaganesque, Republican airline deregulation for THAT.

I don't know if I am just extremely lucky or what, but I fly maybe 40 to 50 times a year and I just don't run into these horrible attitudes from airline employees.

Granted, some of them aren't exactly overflowing with sugar and spice but I have never felt like an airline employee has ever gone out of their way to be rude or unhelpful to me.

On the other hand, I have seen some pretty rude, unreasonable, disgruntled passengers make comeplete and utter asses of themselves by having tantrums, tirades and meltdowns when dealing with airline employees. I think that those who carp about rude treatment from airline employees probably had it coming.

Air travel is tedious and time comsuming. You have to spend a lot of time going through security checkpoints. You might not get that window seat you want if you have waited until to get to the airport to request it. If the prospect of having to be stuck reading the airline's inflight magazine for entertainment is such a huge issue to you, part with a few scheckels and buy a couple magazines to take with you on the flight.

In short, have common sense. It seems to be in short supply with the flying public these days.

[Laughing Mirror]

82. It was Jimmy Carter who deregulated the airlines

But the happy results of that came during the Reagan years.

[reprobate]

81. I know exactly what you mean. 25 yrs ago we went to switzerland.

We travelled on SwissAir and it was a pleasant experience. Good food, good service, and wide enough seats for a comfortable crossing. By comparison our domestic return flight from NY to orlando was on delta. When we were preparing to land in orlando I couldnt even get the cabin attendants to pick up my drink glass, they were too busy chatting up some guys forward in the cabin.

I had to stuff the glass, drink dregs, and ice chunks in the seat pocket in front of me. I'm sure a rough landing would haveput it in my lap.

And that was Delta, the big rival to Eastern, number one at the time. Oh, Eastern Airlines, where have you gone?

Personaly, I'm one who grew up fascinated by flying. My early toys were those little black, bakelite models of WWII aircraft that were used for aircraft identification during the war. My father brought them back from his duty on the carriers, and I appropriated them. Flying was fun and adventure back then. Adventure? You haven't lived until you're screaming down the runway for takeoff in a Constellation and watched quart after quart of engine oil pouring out of the inboard port engine. For a 12 year old on his first flight by himself, that was adventure. Stuck alone for six hours in the tiny Jacksonville airport, adventure was soon replaced by boredom. On the plus side, all the stews who passed thru were very solicitous of my welfare. Too bad I was only 12. That was 1953.

All that having been said, I WILL NOT fly anymore. Barring family emergancies ( which I don't expect since my only relatives live right here) if I can't drive or take the train (now those were some good trips) I'll just stay right here.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

79. I work in a service industry as well

I'm a free-lance translator, and my livelihood depends on satisfied customers. If I don't do a good job, or if I blow off my customers, I know that they will go elsewhere, and if I don't price my services appropriately, I'll lose money no matter how hard I work.

Unless a customer is truly obnoxious (and I've had maybe one or two in nearly twelve years as a free-lancer), it is not my job to get defensive when a customer has a complaint, as the airline employees in this thread seem to be doing. If I screw up, the customer gets either a deep discount or a freebie, no question. (Perhaps I've absorbed the Japanese customer service ethic here, but that's the way I operate.) The prospect of losing money serves as an incentive to provide good service, and I have customers who have been with me since 1994.

In doing my work, I'm expected to provide the finished product in the format that the customer desires and also to be available for feedback and consultation afterwards. Now suppose I were to hit an economic rough spot (as I did during the Asian currency crisis of 1997, when a major customer went bankrupt) and to react like an airline, by telling customers that I would no longer submit anything but plain text files and would charge extra for feedback and consultation.

They would rightfully tell me to go to hell, and then they would hire someone else. I would not complain that the other person they hired was "paid crap" and therefore could afford to be nice.

The point is, you don't react to loss of revenue by doing things that alienate your customers. What I did during the Asian currency crisis was cut way back on personal expenses that didn't affect my customers, such as buying books, CDs, and clothes. Maybe, instead of trying to wring concessions out of the rank-and-file employees, the executives should forego bonuses, or in the cases of the top executives, forego their salaries for a year (surely they could live off their savings), to create a "we're all in this together" type of atmosphere. In addition, they should be required to fly coach on several long-haul flights. After 8 hours in a narrow seat with their legs jammed into one position and nothing to eat but reconstituted mystery foodoid, they might gain an understanding of why customers are no longer willing to pay higher prices.

I know that Nashyra and pjeffery and other low-ranking airline employees are not responsible for management decisions, but I sense a bit of the Stockhold syndrome at work here, trying to justify the bosses' wrong-headed policies.

[Unstuck In Time]

80. Just as an FYI, American is very GLBT-friendly

They're "gold" level sponsor of the Human Rights Campaign...

http://www.hrc.org/Content/NavigationMenu/HRC/Get_Involved/HRC_Sponsors/Corporate_Sponsors/National_Corporate_Sponsors.htm