The Decline and Fall of Conservatism

[NVMojo]

From the Libertarians but still a good read.

There are few experiences more unpleasant to endure than the irrational rants of fear-ridden people. This is particularly annoying when the anger arises not out of an immediate physical danger, but from a perceived offense to an abstraction with which they identify. The curse "may you live in interesting times" reflects how easily our judgments – and actions – can be rendered perilously foolish by turbulence in our world.

We live in interesting times, whose stormy inconstancy may prove to be both a harbinger of, and catalyst for, creative change. But change is accompanied by uncertainty, particularly regarding the forms and practices from the past whose continuing usefulness might be called into question by innovation. For example, having attached ourselves to institutions – not out of clear thought but out of habit – what will be our response to transformations that may render such agencies obsolete? This, I believe, is the condition now before us. Like such periods as the Renaissance, the Enlightenment, and the Industrial Revolution – each of which brought into question the prevailing systems and beliefs – our "interesting times" may prove to be quite beneficial, if only we confront their dynamics with intelligence.

I have written of these current processes of change that manifest themselves, in part, in decentralizing social systems and behavior. But many fear such changes, mainly because they have so fervently identified themselves with institutional systems that are now called into question. Having attached themselves to such abstractions out of unexplored habit, such people begin to experience a sense of personal-identity death: "if my sense of being is inextricably tied to the nation-state, who will I become if that institution should become extinct?"

more...

http://www.lewrockwell.com/shaffer/shaffer114.html

[The Doctor.]

1. Yep...

Those with egos anchored in obsolescence can become pretty dangerous.

When one's identity becomes his life... he belongs to the temporal world.

{eo-typefaster than think}

[Stand and Fight]

2. Kick

:kick:

[MikeH]

3. Interesting

I find it interesting that some of the principles that he mentions, such as the inviolability of privately owned property, and the marketplace being almost sacrosanct, and the idea that government power is to be regarded in a negative light (i.e. even social safety net programs) are things that are very debatable.

But whether one might agree or disagree with some of the principles that he mentions, we can certainly agree with the main points of his article.

Some of the things he values are very debatable, but most of what comes from today's so-called conservatives is very far from debate in any healthy sense of the term but, as he says, "angry name-calling, threats, factual ignorance, and assorted forms of irrationality".

[Pierre Trudeau]

4. whether you like it or not....

As this article demonstrates, it behooves progressives to reach out and make common cause with libertarians, at least for the purpose of hoofing out this administration. Sure, there might be sharp differences of opinion about the role of the state, and so forth. But AT LEAST these are people who can discuss these matters with you in a respectful, rational way. They are as appalled at BushCo as the rest of us, and they aren't going to hurl the usual simpleton rejoinders like "you sympathize with the terrorists, you hate america" etc.

Furthermore, most libertarians are likely to agree with the following sentiments:

- It is a woman's right to choose whether to carry a child to term.
- Gay people have the same rights as everyone else. If they want to get married, why not? It's their business.
- It's none of the government's business what drugs I use, as long as I act responsibly and don't operate a motor vehicle while stoned. People who need medical marijuana should be able to get it, from a local small business. :D
- Neocons suck, big time.
- The PATRIOT Act really sucks.
- The hysterical posturing around Terri Schiavo was a disgrace.
- Karl Rove would look fabulous in leg irons. (OK I don't know if they'd say that but... well, who wouldn't?)

No need to stare, yes I even harbour some libertarian tendencies myself. But I'm a Canadian libertarian, so that puts me somewhere to the left of Kucinich. Ironic how our supposedly socialist mothering welfare state seems to allow more freedom and respect for individual rights than the "land of the not-so-free-anymore-if-it-ever-was".

Anyway, the point is, better not to think of libertarians as "the enemy". With the mess things are in right now, it might be wise to set aside the doctrinal disagreements and pool your efforts against the main enemy: Bush, Cheney and their cabal of PNAC imperialists.

[ixion]

5. I agree with you, Pierre

I've got some libertarian leanings myself, and I feel that we should all work together to root out fascism, because it's something we can all agree on. Sure, there are going to be disagreements. That's part of it. It's listening to each other, respecting each others opinions and having an unbridled debate on what would be best.

oh, and welcome to DU! :hi:

[MikeH]

6. I fully agree with the above

I am reminded that I have heard it said that if everybody in a coalition working toward a common end is comfortable with each other, the coalition is probably too small.

And BushCo is a real enemy.

The above covers quite a bit of important common ground.

[K-W]

7. Libertarians are confused liberals.

They have been hoodwinked by American mythology and conservative propaganda into an intellectually bankrupt concept of libertarianism.

[bemildred]

8. Let's get the government out of our private lives and end militarism.

Then we can argue about what to do with corporations and economic policy, democratically.