I need some talking point for my radio show

[BlakeB]

Hey everyone, as some of you may be aware I am a regular guest on a radio program called FYI Lake Charles. It's a program featuring a Republican, Democrat (me), and Libertarian going over the day's biggest news stories on a local, state, and national level. The other day the Republican guy and I were debating the economy, and as I was giving it to him he brought up how raising the minimum wage was a bad thing that would hurt the economy. He's a business owner and he said if the minimum wage went from 5.15 to 7.00 he would be forced to fire a few people right off the bat to maintain a healthy profit. He said a raise in the minimum wage would be bad for the economy and for America. I countered with a few points, but the show ended before we could get deeper into the debate about minimum wage, so the host said we'd continue it after the weekend.

What I need from you guys, members of the smartest web forum on the internet, are some good talking points and reasons why raising the minimum wage is a good thing. I concede that while I have a good knowledge of the economy I know very little about the effects of raising the minimum wage. I know a good deal about it, but I want more info about it from you guys so the republican can't back me into a corner. Any help will be greatly appreciated and I promise I'll drop a name or two on the show Tuesday if you guys can help me out. Thanks everyone.

[mwb970]

1. There is some good info here...

http://www.epi.org/content.cfm/issuebrief201

[wryter2000]

2. They always say that

And it's never true.

Franken has had stuff on this recently. He mentioned a city in the desert southwest that had recently passed a "living wage" bill. Employment increased. I wish I could remember which city it is. It would be easy to google.

[mzmolly]

3. Here is an article which quotes the UK experience ...

Low minimum wages drive down the bargaining power of labour groups and make premium wages appear extravagant. While many in the business sector oppose raising the minimum wage for fear it will increase their labour costs and make it more difficult to obtain wage concessions from their workers, some business leaders recognize that there are advantages for business as well. Staff turnover and absenteeism would be reduced, as would hiring and training costs, and productivity-enhancing investment would be encouraged. Those employers who are committed to paying above the poverty line would also not be under-cut by less principled competitors paying poverty wages. An additional benefit for business, notes John Jacobs, is that “increasing minimum wages is good for the local economy. When people with low incomes get a raise, they tend to spend it on goods and services provided by local businesses.”

Right-wing groups such as the Fraser Institute warn that raising the minimum wages will lead to job losses. But experience in the UK, where minimum wages have been raised significantly in the past few years, has shown no net job loss, thanks to the economic activity generated by the increased purchasing power of low wage workers.

http://www.napo-onap.ca/livingwage/Case%20for%20a%20living%20wage.htm

Also in our OWN experience, under Clinton wages increased and unemployment was the lowest in decades.

Over 21 Million New Jobs. 21.2 million new jobs have been created since 1993, the most jobs ever created under a single Administration -- and more new jobs than Presidents Reagan and Bush created during their three terms. 92 percent (19.4 million) of the new jobs have been created in the private sector, the highest percentage in 50 years. Under President Clinton and Vice President Gore, the economy has added an average of 248,000 jobs per month, the highest under any President. This compares to 52,000 per month under President Bush and 167,000 per month under President Reagan.

Fastest and Longest Real Wage Growth in Over Three Decades. In the last 12 months, average hourly earnings have increased 3.7 percent -- faster than the rate of inflation. The United States has had five consecutive years of real wage growth -- the longest consecutive increase since the 1960s. Since 1993, real wages are up 6.8 percent, after declining 4.3 percent during the Reagan and Bush years.

Unemployment Is Nearly the Lowest in Three Decades. Unemployment is down from 7.5 percent in 1992 to 4.1 percent in March 2000 -- nearly the lowest unemployment rate in thirty years. The unemployment rate has fallen for seven years in a row, and has remained below 5 percent for 33 months in a row. African-American unemployment has fallen from 14.2 percent in 1992 to 7.3 percent in March 2000 -- the lowest rate on record. The unemployment rate for Hispanics has fallen from 11.6 percent in 1992 to 6.3 percent in March 2000 -- and in the last year has been at the lowest rate on record. For women the unemployment rate was 4.3 percent in March -- nearly the lowest since 1953.

http://pearlyabraham.tripod.com/htmls/bill-legacy2.html

Here is an excellent site with a vast array of information:

http://www.universallivingwage.org/ Click on the fact vs. myth tabs for starters.

[wryter2000]

4. Bingo!

http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0315/p01s02-usec.html

Santa Fe, New Mexico, as well as other cities.

I'll look some more, but if I were you, I'd challenge the Repug to cite facts, not his own personal example. Argument by example is almost always totally bogus. In fact, examples are only helpful in "fleshing out" facts that are proved.

I don't know how snarky your show is, but what he's saying is a perfect example of "truthiness." Things people know is their heart and gut that are not borne out by facts.

[wryter2000]

7. A supposed rebuttal to the success of the Santa Fe law

http://wwwx.oit.umass.edu/~peri/html/0/200.html

I somehow doubt your repug has done enough research to hear of a study by someone named Yelowitz that supposedly showed that the Santa Fe law led to lower employment and less time worked for people who kept their jobs. If he has, though, here's the rebuttal.

[boobooday]

5. Give him the 'ol Henry Ford treatment

If you don't pay the workers enough to purchase the goods and services they're creating, they won't have jobs anyway.

Minimum wage currently isn't enough to make a worker into a consumer.

I wonder if your debating opponent offers medical care to his $5.15 per hour employees? Does he expect them to be able to afford it on what he pays?

[JamesTee]

10. Another point about Henry Ford that goes unmentioned...

is that he instituted the $5 day to lower his turnover. Turn-of-the-20th century industries typically had an annual turnover rate of around 25% and Ford wanted to make sure his employees stayed put, that is, in his factories (According to Richard Shenkman in his book, I love Paul Revere...) This goes along with the idea that raising the minumum wage reduces turnover, absenteeism, and training costs. Henry Ford knew.

[Martin Eden]

6. I'm no expert

But aren't most minimum wage jobs in the service sector? If a business needs x-number of employees to flip burgers or stock shelves at at a retail store, raising the minimum wage won't change that. It may incrementally increase the cost of the goods or services, but at the same time it puts more money in the hands of those workers -- which goes back into the economy and creates more customers for those goods and services. Profits increae when consumers have more money to spend.

But the issue of the minimum wage goes beyond its potential benefits to the economy. It is a moral issue that goes to the heart of the American dream and what it should mean to be a citizen in the richest nation on earth. Right-wingers often disparage the poor as welfare slackers or lacking a work ethic, but the fact is that most poor people work very hard but can't adequately support their families because today's minimum wage isn't close to a living wage or to its relative value years ago.

American citizens who work hard and play by the rules deserve a living wage. Denying it to them neither helps our economy nor upholds national values.

[wryter2000]

8. More

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_3423303

Swamp him with facts, not truthiness.

[DaveinMD]

9. University of PA study

showed that when the minimum wage is raised, it helps the economy because more people enter the workforce. Also, there is less job turnover. This lowers the retraining costs for businesses to train new workers.

[Lefty48197]

11. Has he been hiring extra workers all these years that the minimum wage has

stagnated? Revenues typically rise annually for most businesses. If his revenue has been rising, and his labor costs have stayed steady due to the minimum wage not being raised in years, what has he been doing with all the extra money? Has he been "creating more jobs"? Has he been saving it for the time when the minimum wage rises, and he has to pay his employees more?

[BlakeB]

12. Not sure...

But I know one of his main arguments was that minimum wage jobs are just for entry level people and that as you stay with that company longer you will get raises and such. What do you guys say to that?

[Lefty48197]

14. Right wingers are so full of sh*t

They always try to claim that only entry level employees get minimum wage. Yeah, but guess what? A whole lot of the other employees make 25 cents over minimum wage, or fifty cents, or one dollar, or two dollars. This means that the wages of many other workers are basically indexed to the minimum wage, and they too will get raises when the minimum is raised.
Republicans think that graduating from $5.25 per hour to $6.50 per hour means you are well on your way to living the American dream.

[wryter2000]

16. Franken was all over that

Limbaugh claimed that 75% of minimum wage workers are entry workers (teenagers). Franken shot him right out of the water with that. I'll try to find the number.

[wryter2000]

17. From an interview with Franken

http://journals.aol.com/bmiller224/OldHickorysWeblog/entries/2991

He says he got the numbers from the Bureau of Labor Statistics www.bls.gov.

[NativeTexan]

13. This is an OLD argument that conservatives.....

....have always played in their hand of "fear". It DOES help in the increase of prices, eventually, but if was really the negative they always say, then how in the HELL did we have the longest non-wartime economic recovery in American history under Bill Clinton. With all past increases in the minimum wage, unemployment should have shot to dizzying heights, and business put out of business!

They, as always, use fear-tactics to try to keep as much money in BIG businesses pockets!

THE BIG LIE? Is that Republicans....the PARTY....cares absolutely NOTHING about small business! They just try to look like they are propping up "middle" America, when they would really like to COLLAPSE it. But they HAVE to have some "allies" in the non-upper one percentile, to get elected! Small business suffers like HELL under Republicans, but small businessmen listen to the BS and vote it, because they are wooed into believing that they are cared about!

[cap]

15. he will not fire workers

but will pass the price increase to the consumer... EVERY BUSINESS WILL HAVE THEIR LABOR COSTS INCREASE AND WILL BE DOING LIKEWISE> He will still make his profits.

Also, you've just increased consumer spending. Those at the bottom spend every dime they make. Their propensity to consume is the highest of all labor categories. ALso, everybody's wage will go up... When the janitor's make more, the skilled workers get a wage increase too. So do professionals and managers.

[wryter2000]

18. Another issue

At least one of the articles I linked to here pointed out that when people can afford to quit their second or third jobs, those jobs are available for other workers.

[johan helge]

19. The example of the Nordic countries

Increasing the minimum wage will probably reduce the demand for low wage workers - but not much: It will force companies to pay less to better paid workers.

As far as I know (please check it), in the Nordic countries, where the (effective) minimum wage is pretty high, the proportion of the population working is also pretty high. That is possible, because higher paid workers earn comparatively less than in the US.

(A higher minimum wage may increase the efficiency of the economy, because it forces firms to become more efficient, to be able to pay the higher minimum wage. The least efficient firms are forced out of business.)

[mvd]

20. If the Repukes really thought increasing..

the minimum wage is so bad, then why did they try to raise it in 1999? At the time, they would have accepted it as long as they rammed more tax cuts for their rich buddies through.