The Harm of Porn: Just Another Excuse to Censor

[benburch]

http://www.fiawol.demon.co.uk/FAC/harm.htm

The Harm of Porn: Just Another Excuse to Censor

An article by Avedon Carol

In spite of a long-standing anti-censorship tradition in the women's liberation movement - and indeed, a specific hostility toward sexual censorship - the view has become widely accepted by the media and therefore the public that feminists uniformly accept that pornography should be banned. This view has intensified as an increasing number of purportedly feminist campaigners have presented highly emotive speeches and documents, often backed up by spurious representations of scientific data, in support of the case for censorship.

Interestingly, the media has generally proven to be entirely uninterested in consulting long-time feminists with respected credentials, such as the former members of the feminist Red Rag collective or the current membership of the Feminist Review collective in Britain, all of whom oppose censorship. In America, Congress and the media were startled to discover that an attempt to introduce federal anti-pornography legislation was opposed by some of the best known names in modern feminism, ranging from Betty Friedan and Kate Millett to Karen DeCrow, Wendy Kaminer and Jamaica Kincaid.

How, then, did the anti-pornography position come to be seen as the only possible feminist position? A look at the history might be illuminating.

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[Warpy]

1. Porn does do harm

in that young guys who are probably the most avid consumers spend their teens, twenties, and part of their thirties thinking real life women are really like that and that real life women secretly enjoy that kinky stuff but would never admit it because they wanna be good girls. Guys, some of that stuff is downright painful! Ask us what we like. We'll tell you. Don't rely on your extensive porn reading to tell you about us. That stuff is mostly written by other men, and they've never asked us, either.

However, telling sons the truth about porn is up to fathers, not the government. There should be no censorship of erotica, period. Some of the violent stuff that hurts women and children should probably be attacked on that level and assault charges filed against the producers of it, but there is no reason to censor any of the erotica out there, as silly as we women find much of it. Hell, some women actually enjoy some of the porn out there.

Censorship of anything that some beholders find offensive is a dangerous path to take in any society that prides itself on its freedom. Where does it stop? I'm offended by Thomas Kinkade paintings and think the world would be a better place without those saccharine daubs. Other people are offended by anything that makes them think.

Being a grownup in a free society means tolerating things we don't approve of as long as they're not doing us harm. Porn is one of the prices we pay for a (theoretically) free press.

[benburch]

3. A question and a comment.

Have you never known women who *do* like that "kinky stuff"? I think there are more than you imagine and less than the fantasies of some guys would hope. I am guessing about 3-5% of the adult female population based on what I have seen as the doorman/bouncer at certain clubs.

And you are exactly right as to who needs to control children's access to porn. Children should NOT have access to porn at all, IMO. That is for adults, as are guns, property ownership, drinking, voting, etc. But somehow all the censorship arguments seem to be based upon the unspoken assumption that parents are powerless in such matters.

[Warpy]

7. That's why I suggested a guy ASK the woman he's with

what she likes. It's amazing how many guys out there ASSume they know what women like because of what they've read in porn. That's the problem, not the porn itself.

I don't give a shit about anybody else's consensual sex life. I DO give a shit about mine, and any guy who ASSumes anything about me without asking and without listening is going to find his ASSume kicked to the curb.

And that is the point.

[benburch]

8. And a good point it is. nt

[roseBudd]

9. Proof of that is falafel O'Reilly thinking a loofah would be a turnon...

Hey Bill why not try sandpaper?

[mongo]

10. My question

If young men learn about (and emulate) sexual relationships from porn, what about other aspects of culture.

Do they learn driving skills and how to behave on the road from video games?

Do they learn their relationship skills from "Married with Children"?

Do they learn interpersonal skills from the latest Hollywood shoot-em-up?

My point is porn is FANTASY. Most people can understand that. People that can't have other problems besides the messages they get from porn.

That is not to say that there are no practices in porn that I don't approve of. There are a couple of things that are common (I won't list them here), but are unsafe and there should at least be some understanding of what goes into making this type of scene.

[depakid]

11. I too am offended by Thomas Kinkade paintings- LOL

Seriously. And the libelous tabloids in kids' faces at the grocery store racks- it pisses me off that stores put them there- and I've complained about it over the years. Not that it would do any good- they get paid big money for that placement.

You make several interesting points, that seem to me ought to be common sense. Personally, I don't think it's porn that does any harm, per se- but dysfuntional relationship and interpersonal communication skills. Those, one would hope, improve over time.

The feminist divide over porn reminds me of the divide about prostitution. Some groups take a wholly intolerant (and IMO unrealistic) approach- and won't allow any public health efforts toward harm reduction. The other camp sees prostitutes as sex workers and tries to empower women, encourage condom use, cut the pimps out of the equation, etc. And I think it's probably a fair criticism to say that enables (encourages?) prostitution.

Personally, I don't take a moral stance on it- it's one of those things that people are going to do regadless, so it makes sense to try to create some understanding about all of the underlying issues- like- as you mentioned, having fathers, peers or other role models clue people in.

[The Icon Painter]

13. I agree with you ...

especially about the Thomas Kinkade paintings. (Did you notice you can't spell 'Kinkade' without 'kink'?) As an adult, I am perfectly competent to choose my own reading and viewing material. Parents once had the responsibility and power to keep their little one's hands and eyes off those things which were inappropriate for them. I do wish they would take charge of their own families again. I do not want to raise their young'uns or have our entire society sanitized in order 'to protect the children'. Damn it! What real adult wants to live in a kindergarten?

[applegrove]

16. I think it is dangerous for kids. Particularly little guys. First sexual

experiences are mind blowing and mind forming. Porn is not the same thing as stealing your father's palyboy. It is a much bigger experience. And I think it is important to keep sexual content out of the hands of little kids. Till they are 18 and have had a few years to grow into themselves. Games too are dangerous if they have a sexual/violent quotient: even if it is not described as "porn". Comics too.

Fact is you can create a sadist out of a kid - for no other reason that porn or violent games.

[mongo]

20. I agree with you that porn is not for kids

but I don't think it is exposure to the wrong movie or video game that creates a sadist, masochist, dom, sub whatever.

Parents/family are a much greater influence in our lives. Exposure to some adult entertainment is not going to change the foundations built at home.

[papau]

2. Should come with a warning label "Practice Sex is 75% less fun than

Sex with a friend"

Seems some scientist released there findings a few day ago that show the pleasure chemical release is 4 times as strong when you have a partner as compared to the release in practice sessions.

[benburch]

4. LOL!

But almost anybody who has ever been with somebody they really liked knows that.

[papau]

5. It did seem like a wasted research grant that only proved the obvious!

:toast:

:-)

[MrPrax]

6. Undated references...

This is not entirely accurate--there was a strong anti-porn bias in the feminist movement in the 80s especially. Some womens' group openly advocated 'direct action' against porn dealers

I DISTINCTLY remember when attending university where, INDEED, campus feminist groups were trying to purge mens' magazines from on-campus shops and there were heated discussions on this worthless shit in the political groups I and many others belonged to leading some to believe that the 'womyn/wimmin' pushing this stuff must have been spooks or at best, boring lapsed catholics.

In fact a hell of a lot of time was wasted on this nonsense (the 'name' game, non-confrontational meetings, gender voting, sex assualt politics, sex trade politics, etc) and I know quite a few men and women, myself included, that argued against the censorship aspects of feminist movement and it's demands for 'exclusivity' in virtually every aspect of campus life. I even saw screwball proposals where study area were to be segregated.

I'll be more than happy now to accept apologies from those many women who in later years went off to their patriarchical marriages, their patriarchical houses and their patriarchical income leaving nothing more than bad feelings and little in the way of consciousness raising.

This article is being a little disingenious.

[mongo]

12. Great article

and one I hope that a few specific DU'ers read.

But in Britain, where pornography is already more restricted than it is anywhere else in the English-speaking world or in Western Europe, sexual media is easily smeared for an audience that is seldom given an opportunity to see what really is sold under the name of "pornography". Tales of a seamy underworld where everything - and everyone - can be bought and sold play well to an uncritical press that is never interested in tracking down support for such claims. Thus, anti-pornography activists are free to inform the media that you can buy images of women being raped and tortured to death in any shop, perhaps under the counter, when in fact it would be difficult to find such materials anywhere - even in America, where there are no restrictions whatsoever on the amount of violence that can be purveyed in "adult" venues.

Thanks for the post!

[benburch]

14. Avedon is a great writer!

Here is her blog; http://sideshow.me.uk/

[ThomCat]

15. How many people who say they are against porn

Have porn collections? I'd bet it quite a few.

I smell hypocracy. They just want to keep other people from having porn, or keep people from having porn they don't personally like.

[benburch]

17. They bust Republicans with kiddieporn collections on a regular basis.

So maybe it is just the ADULT porn they don't like?

[ThomCat]

18. Too True.

:argh:

[sarcasmo]

19. Once they ban Porn, where will they go next, books, stories, News.

A multi billion dollar industry will never be destroyed their is to much demand. Our Religious Taliban in this country want to push this and next strip clubs and before you know it our country has become the Taliban.

[benburch]

21. The fact that Feminists aid and abet this...

they are giving oxygen to the people who think they shouldn't vote, own property, have jobs, education, etc...

But they blind themselves to it.

An America not safe for porn is an America where Feminism is dead.

[mongo]

22. *Some* feminists Ben

I've heard from some really good ones here at DU over the last 2 days.

Bumping heads with would be censors and enablers of those who would censor -- under the banner of "feminism" it's easy to lose sight of the big picture and the majority of folks on DU.

Also by not quantifying you give creedance to the idea that feminism is being anti-porn.

[benburch]

23. Agreed. Some do.

And they are hardly Feminists in the first place, are they?