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Sen. Levin's False History & Logic By Robert Parry

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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:35 AM
Original message
Sen. Levin's False History & Logic By Robert Parry
http://consortiumnews.com/2007/062107.html

consortiumnews.com

Sen. Levin's False History & Logic

By Robert Parry
June 21, 2007

If you’re wondering why the Iraq War is likely to continue indefinitely despite mounting public outrage and a failed military strategy, part of the answer can be found in two words: Carl Levin.
Levin, a low-key Michigan Democrat who chairs the Senate Armed Services Committee, has wedded himself to a line of thinking that is both historically wrong and logically unsound. Yet, his faulty reasoning, if maintained, virtually guarantees that George W. Bush will keep winning every war-funding round with Congress through the end of his presidency.

On June 21, Levin spelled out his thinking in a Washington Post op-ed entitled “Lincoln’s Example for Iraq.” Levin asserted that he is modeling his Iraq War position on Abraham Lincoln’s stance on the Mexican War, launched by President James Polk in 1846 after a declaration of war by Congress.
“In his only term in Congress, Abraham Lincoln was an ardent opponent of the Mexican War,” including voting for an amendment that called the conflict “unnecessary and unconstitutionally begun by the President,” Levin wrote...Yet, Levin noted, “when the question of funding for the troops fighting that war came, Lincoln voted their supplies without hesitation.” Levin likens Lincoln’s anti-war position to his own, since the Michigan senator opposed President Bush’s war resolution in 2002 but has vowed to continue voting money for the troops as long as they remain in the field.

But what Levin doesn’t tell you is that the Lincoln example is by no means an historical parallel to Levin’s position on the Iraq War. For one, Lincoln wasn’t even in Congress when the war with Mexico was declared on May 13, 1846. Lincoln took his seat in the House of Representatives on Dec. 6, 1847. By then, the war with Mexico was already won. The decisive battle of Chapultepec was fought almost three months earlier, on Sept. 12, 1847, and American forces entered Mexico City on Sept. 14. Though there was a delay in negotiating a final peace treaty due to the political chaos in the Mexican leadership, the war was effectively over. So, Lincoln’s readiness to supply the troops was not a vote for continuing an indefinite war with Mexico; it was simply to send supplies while a final peace treaty was negotiated.

Clueless Senator

Besides Levin’s bogus history lesson, the five-term senator also seems to misunderstand how Congress works. Having ruled out a termination of war funding, Levin suggests that the only viable course for ending the Iraq War is to convince enough Republicans to join Democrats in setting a date for withdrawing and repositioning U.S. forces...But Levin’s logic is wrong again. While his proposal – to impose a troop withdrawal deadline – would require 60 votes to stop a Republican filibuster and then would need 67 votes to overcome Bush’s certain veto, the same is not true for a war-funding cut-off. To secure the money to continue fighting the war, Bush is the one who needs majorities in both the House and the Senate. Indeed, arguably, he would need 60 votes in the Senate to end a filibuster if anti-war senators mounted one. In other words, if the Democrats were to hold firm against giving Bush another blank check – as their leaders vowed to do in early 2007 – Bush would have to decide between accepting some strings, such as a withdrawal timetable, or getting no money at all, thus forcing an end to the war...Indeed, Levin appears to have unfurled what looks like a perpetual white flag of surrender. In his Post op-ed, he declared that the only option he sees is to wait until enough Republicans abandon Bush and join in overriding the President’s veto of another timetable bill.




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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
1. kickie poo
and a nod
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saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
2. I have followed Senator Levin's career for some time now and
fiercely agree with his constituents' clear-headed decision to return him to the U.S. Congress.

If I'm fielding a team of reliable Democratic votes for a constitutional republic, I definitely want Levin on board.

And last I checked, it was the George W. Bush administration who instigated this war and then proceeded to fuck it up after lying out of both sides of their mouths from the onset.

Let's put it where it goes, folks.
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dave_p Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Not just W
Sen Levin may be a good man for all his faulty history. But Congressional Democrats joined Republicans to authorize this war. Laying it solely at the Administration's feet is a recipe for more of the same in future. If Democrats don't come clean, why should their opponents, who we know have embraced dishonesty as a party ideology? Of course they were lied to, and placed in a difficult position. But they were sent to Washington to see beyond the lies and expediency. "It was all down to W" is wearing a bit thin.
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saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Last evening on DU came a post which quoted a Brownstein piece
in the L.A. TIMES regarding the historic success rate of parties whose presidents are wildly unpopular in the months preceding the vote.

It's W who's wearing thin. Not Democrats' blame of W for what's gone wrong in Iraq, New Orleans, health care, education, and so on.

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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. Democrats have come clean -- you forget that W lied us into this war, and repugs are still
promoting the lies.

If you want to continue living in the past that is fine.

If I may draw a vietnam parallel (SP)

When Gene McCarthy worked his ass of to try to end the vietnam war,

Nobody wasted time screeching "BUT HE VOTED FOR THE WAR!!!!!!!"

It is time to get behind the Dems who are trying to end this war.

It is time to pressure the REpublicans who are trying to prolong it.
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dave_p Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. But there's more
I agree that "It's time to get behind the Dems who are trying to end this war" - I even went easy on Pelosi & Reid when others were shrieking for their heads.

But we also need to look beyond Nov '08. This isn't another Vietnam from the policy process point of view. That was a gradual entanglement whose implications weren't foreseeable at each successive step into the mire in 1950, 1954 or 1961 - maybe even in 1964. True, by 1965 there was little excuse.

This time it's different. This was a war of choice, clearly presented as part of an open-ended strategy. Democrats need to face their shared responsibility for this debacle and address the associated policy failings in their own ranks if they're not to become enmeshed in a neocon grand strategy of war without end.

I'm not unforgiving of those who acquiesced in this disaster. But I want to know they're not going to make the same mistakes again when the path's been so neatly prepared for them by the outgoing Administration. Right now the signs aren't promising.
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
16. Not Only That--The Future of This War Was Seen Very Clearly Before the Fact
at home and abroad, inside the Beltway and outside, and THEY STILL LET IT HAPPEN! DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS! And they are still letting it continue!
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. DEMOCRATS were promised that diplomacy would take its course
Colin Powell assured them -- Just a little sabre rattling was all they needed -- At the time he seemed trustworthy. but he of course was out of the loop.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #6
21. More than one hundred thirty Democrats voted AGAINST the war as a last resort
Edited on Wed Jul-18-07 12:49 PM by mzmolly
resolution. Contrast that to TWO Republicans. What's dishonest is equating the two parties on the war.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:47 AM
Response to Original message
3. There is more than one way to skin a cat, we're in phase one.
Cutting funds is the last resort as it SHOULD be. But, I never tire of the "Democrats suck" stuff, keep it coming!!! :sarcasm:
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 11:49 AM
Response to Reply #3
14. If cutting off the funds is the last resort, what, pray tell, remains between
now and that option? Are there gambits remaining that we haven't tried?

Other than impeachment, which strikes me as being the last option.

It is obvious they are just trying to run out the clock - if we allow that, it will fall into our laps in a year and a half, and WE will be blamed for 'losing Iraq'.

Cut the funds, then release targetted funding specifically for the withdrawal of the troops. We could end the war in three months.

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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Uhm, you are paying attention to the current issue in the senate I presume?
:shrug: We just forced a vote on a 120 day withdrawal deadline.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. You mean THIS vote?
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/07/18/us.iraq.ap/index.html

Uh, WE LOST!

That is a screaming success?

We continue to persist in doing what cannot be done, in favor of doing what CAN be done.

Cut the funds and the withdrawal HAS to follow.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. And we'll LOSE if we play chicken with the troops.
Edited on Wed Jul-18-07 12:21 PM by mzmolly
Period. Oh and by the way, we didn't LOSE, we forced a vote and we had a majority of Senators voting for an END to the WAR.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. Did the bill pass? No. Is the bill still being debated? No.
Is the war ended? NO!

That is NOT a victory.

We LOST. We did nothing the get the troops out. We did nothing to end the war.

Cutting the funding is not 'playing chicken'. It is a pro-active move to terminate this misadventure.
It is the duty of the congress to control the funds of the military, and if congress says they will only allocate funds for a withdrawal, then the commanders need to make that happen - and if they don't make that happen Congress can strip them of their commissions and put people in place who will make it happen. If you think that is imposing on the Commander-in-Chief's perogatives, the law clearly says that he is CinC in wartime - and congress has not declared war. That means his authority to wage war ended 4+ years ago, because he can only wage war without the permission of congress for 90 days.

Though I don't believe it is legally necessary, congress could even hold a vote revoking the IWR. A simple majority vote. Just like the simple majority that we had here. THAT would end the war. Why won't they do that?
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. I don't know why you think Bush will end the war if we play with funding.
He'll strip other programs and blame Democrats for every death. "They didn't give us enough money to protect the troops." The MAJORITY of Americans wish to see an end to the war yet they oppose cutting funds. To suggest doing so is suggesting that we go against the will of the people.

How long have you observed the political process? These things don't happen overnight.

Regarding a vote to revoke war powers, we've got such a bill in the works we have to take this in stages and getting a MAJORITY of the Senate and the house to support an end is a WIN.
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RaleighNCDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. The US budget is not the president's checking account.
He CANNOT move funding around. Attempting to do so is an impeachable offense. He may get away with shifting already allocated military funds, but he can't take from Medicare, or social services to pay for the military. He has no such authority.

And the only reason the "majority of Americans...oppose cutting funds" is because our congressmen and senators are not getting out there and explaining to them the truth, that it doesn't mean that our guys will be left over there begging for food and trying to hitch a ride back to the states. Cutting the funds mean only one thing - there is ONE operation to be funded, and that is the withdrawal.

The ONLY thing a bully can understand is someone getting in his face. Cutting the funding is getting in the hawks' faces and saying "we are taking our ball and going home". When faced with strength, bullies back down.

Do you really think ANY repuke believes that today's vote was a Democratic victory? They stopped us cold. Unless we come back with something stronger, they will point to this as a victory for THEM.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. The majority of Americans are opposed to cutting funds at this time.
I've nothing more to add.

However if you think this is a victory for "them," you should let them know as they opposed the vote due to the fear that they would lose. They were right, they lost.

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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #14
27. Find the votes kiddo and you may have a plan. As of now, all you have is a wish.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
4. Focus your anger where it belongs -- the Republican senators who are still covering for Bush.
Edited on Wed Jul-18-07 10:52 AM by emulatorloo
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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
5. If Carl Levin were the sole determinant on whether this war were stopped
it would have been over and done with 3 years ago. Sadly, he is not. Carl Levin has been a good senator for Michigan for years.

The blame for all of this lies with the Bush admin. and the republicans. At least Levin is responsive to his constituents and tries something, as opposed to nothing. The republicans bellyached the Dem's had no plan, Levin puts one together and its still bitchfest time.

I just don't get it.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. The Republican's "talking points" and "parliamentary challenges" are soooo coor-dinated. One look
at CSPAN tells it all -- thank you Carl Levin. To Hell with you KARL ROVE>
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MichiganVote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #7
26. Murtha, Levin, even Byrd...these guys have something called a heart.
Not so any of the bastards in this administration.
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
9. I have to agree that the history lesson is bogus.
Edited on Wed Jul-18-07 10:58 AM by Kagemusha
I was reasonably familiar with the decisive battle of the Mexican "war" but I had no idea when Lincoln entered Congress to put two and two together.

I don't think that should have any great bearing on the other debate, but I also agree that 67 votes would be required, and Levin will not be getting those. It's hard to understand any rational reason why he would.

Whatever the public thinks or doesn't think, it's simply an article of faith among Levin's generation (edit: of politicians) that you don't cut off money to troops in the field.
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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 11:01 AM
Response to Original message
11. Is Sir Parry jumping ship or is Sir Parry solidifying his position
by finding an honest mistake and making hay with silly rhetoric?
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Strawman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
12. I do not agree with Carl Levin on this but he is a fine Senator
Edited on Wed Jul-18-07 11:27 AM by Strawman
And he is definitely not a "Clueless Senator."

And keep in mind that he voted against authorizing this war when many of the current crop of presidential candidates so many on this board worship uncritically didn't have the guts to cast a similar vote. He didn't cast a vote for what anyone with half a brain knew was a green light for Bush to start a war and then qualify his vote with a speech to make it seem like it wasn't. He didn't hedge his position to make sure he was in good political shape either way the war turned out like Clinton, Kerry and Edwards did.

But I disagree with Carl here and I think he is being disingenuous. The only leverage Congress has to try and compel cooperation is the power of the purse. They don't have to pass a bill to cutoff funds as he suggests. They just have to not pass appropriations bills the administration sends to Congress. That's how you cut off funds. I have written Carl myself to suggest that he take that course of action.

My suspicion is that what Carl Levin believes and can't say openly is that if they don't pass the appropriations for the troops, this administration is so stubborn and cares so little about the troops that they will not feel compelled to compromise and adopt a policy that sets a timetable for withdrawl or redeployment, but they will continue to try and fight on a shoestring and use the spectacle of our troops unfunded and helpless in the field to make a political point. I wouldn't put it past Rove and Cheney. If that is the case, the next best option is to plug away and apply pressure until we have enough Republicans to get 67 votes to pass Levin-Reid and override a veto. That is what they're trying to do. I am skeptical about their chances for success, but if my suspicion is correct, I can understand why that is the strategy rather than defunding.

I have met Carl Levin once. During his brief conversation with myself and a group of sutdents, I recall him talking about how he and his brother used to volunteer down at the old Veterans hospital in Detroit. I don't reall the specifics, but I do recall thinking that there was nothing remotely phony about what he was saying. Alot of politicians might craft their nice little soundbytes about supporting the troops or walk around sticking their thumbs out to try to look like Bobby Kennedy while trying to position themselves as the "anti-war candidate," but I know that Carl is a guy who not only talks the talk, but walks the walk when it comes to caring about our troops and veterans. If there is one politician who ever gets the benefit of the doubt from me on this issue, it's Carl Levin.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-18-07 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Thank you.
A very nice post. :hi:
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