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" irresponsible behaviour of men is caused by women": John Paul 2

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emad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 11:48 AM
Original message
" irresponsible behaviour of men is caused by women": John Paul 2
Quote from:
The Pope in Winter: The Dark Face of John Paul II's Papacy, by John Cornwell, is published on Thursday by Viking-Penguin

Sunday Times article, 7 November:

Prudish pontiff

The papal biographer John Cornwell reports
Wives are to blame for violent husbands. Condoms don't work, and Aids is 'a pathology of the spirit'. Has the Pope's view of sex and gender brought the church to its knees?

Snip:
Before his decline into the late stages of Parkinson's disease, Karol Wojtyla — Pope John Paul II — was noted for his sunny, alpha-male persona, his athletic physique, his cinematic good looks and his ease with women. One of his first decisions when he became pope was to build a sauna, a personal gymnasium and an Olympic-size swimming pool at his summer palace. He was the first pope to take skiing holidays. Here was a pontiff who seemed comfortable with his body.

During an audience with the Pope in 1993, I saw him hugging, very gently, with striking intimacy, a diminutive nun. When he was involved in the theatre in his youth, and as a young priest, he loved the company of women, and there were even rumours of a love relationship in his student days. He used to say: "I am in love with love!" Yet John Paul's attitude towards women, sexuality and the body has been anything but easy and uncomplicated. He has proved himself the most puritanical pope in the modern period, with an obsessive horror of any form of sexuality that transgresses the narrow bounds of what he terms the "norms of sexology". His attitude towards women is medieval in its patriarchalism. Earlier this year he published an attack on feminism as if the women's movement had barely progressed since the bra-burning days of the 1960s.

In 1994, John Paul startlingly revealed, and not for the first time, a misogynistic side to his character when he met Dr Nafis Sadik, the Pakistani head of the UN Fund for Population Activities. The pontiff had invited her to the Vatican to talk about family planning. Dr Sadik, then in her early forties and dressed in a sari, attempted to make their meeting a discussion rather than a one-sided papal lecture.

"In many societies, and not just in the developing world, women don't have equal status with men," she told the Pope. "There's a lot of sexual violence within the family." Suddenly, as Sadik recalled, "John Paul burst out angrily, ÔDon't you think that the irresponsible behaviour of men is caused by women?'" This was long before his Parkinson's disease could explain such intemperance. In fact, Sadik thought he appeared "taut as a spring". She has said: "I found myself thinking: why is he so hard-hearted, so dogmatic, so lacking in kindness?"
End snip
More:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspaper/0,,176-1334302_1,00.html

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ladjf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
1. There you go, women, the original scapegoats.
Apparently Bush wasn't the first leader to blame everything on someone else. What a bunch of disingenuous wimps!

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marew Donating Member (854 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 11:53 AM
Response to Original message
2. Why I have not been a Catholic for many years... n/t
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ExclamationPoint Donating Member (422 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-04 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. As i
Men have always been afraid of women coming to power, of being equal, and while some have understood the total and utter wrongness in sexism, some men, such as the pope, have retreived that alpha male status, accepting only stepford wives as relatively 'sinless' women. This article has angered me.
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nickinSTL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. What is this, the F*cking Middle Ages?
The Catholic Church was saying this kind of sh!t 500 years ago!

Isn't it about time they grew up?

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orwell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
4. Inquisition II
Prepare for the *-Cabal led Inquisition II - coming to a parish near you.

Starring:

Pope John Paul II as Jesus
Mel Gibson as Peter
The News Media as Pontius Pilate
and
George Bush as Judas

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MsAnthropy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 02:06 PM
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5. Well, that explains everything!
The Church will always be 500 years behind, that was the last time they were relevant.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-04 06:03 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. They blame Eve for the Fall of Man
Yet Eve was not privy to Adam's chats with the Almighty, her role was one confined to picking up Adam's socks and doing the laundry and providing sex on demand. Just who in the hell you think wrote the stupid Bible, but men that hated and feared women.
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MsAnthropy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-04 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. I'm agreeing with you!
are you always that hostile to people who agree with you or do you not recognize sarcasm?
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ExclamationPoint Donating Member (422 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-04 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. So true!
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smirkymonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 06:10 PM
Response to Original message
6. Fuck the Pope!
The sooner he's gone, the better.

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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
7. Another sad chapter in the history of the Papacy
At least this Pope is not a Nazi like Pius XII.
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-09-04 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
10. I'd Like To Quote Diana Galbadon
a fabulous author of historical fiction: (it's my best recollection, since I don't want to go look it up) (she writes HUGE books)

"I used to think that 18th century women fainted frequently because of the tight corsets, but I've decided it was due to the stupidity of 18th century men..."

Same story, different century.
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-10-04 12:33 AM
Response to Original message
13. If one of the African bishops becomes the next pope,

as many have suggested, people will long for John Paul II's moderation. That probably applies to the South American bishops as well. The rest of the Christian world, Catholic or not, is much more socially conservative than America and Europe.
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