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"We are all BLUE AMERICANS Now" (The Guardian UK)

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liberalpragmatist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 03:12 AM
Original message
"We are all BLUE AMERICANS Now" (The Guardian UK)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Columnists/Column/0,5673,1353696,00.html

American blues

Our liberal cousins are in despair. Defenders of the Enlightenment unite!

Timothy Garton Ash in San Francisco
Thursday November 18, 2004
The Guardian

...When all that has been said, the fact remains that America is now one of the most deeply divided countries among all the liberal democracies of the world. Looking at the unfolding debate on the website I have set up in connection with my book, Free World, I'm struck by the fact that the fiercest, most bitter arguments are not between Europeans and Americans but between Americans and Americans.

<snip>

Battle may soon be joined to preserve the strict separation of church and state that the founding fathers intended. Or, to put it another way, to defend the legacy of the Enlightenment. No wonder liberal Americans have been feeling so blue. But there is one silver lining to the cloud hanging over them. Overstated though the dichotomy is between red and blue America, it does mean that no one who is at all well informed can believe that America is Bush and Bush is America. If the west is divided, the dividing line runs slap-bang through the middle of America.

And, on the other side of the pond, through Europe. We don't have so many Christian fundamentalists any more. Compared with the American religious right, Rocco Buttiglione, the withdrawn Italian Catholic candidate for European commissioner, is a dangerous liberal. But we do have Islamic fundamentalists, in growing numbers. And, I would say, we have secular fundamentalists: people who believe that to live by the tenets of Islam, or other religions, is incompatible with what it is to be fully human, and want citizens to be educated and the state to legislate accordingly. While I have been in America, the possible consequences have been played out on the streets of prosperous, pacific, tolerant Holland, with the murder of the filmmaker Theo van Gogh, and the counter-attack on an Islamic school. If America has its culture wars, its Kulturkampf, so do we. And ours could be bloodier.

So the expressions of European solidarity after the September 11 2001 terrorist attacks ( "Nous sommes tous Américains" ) should acquire a new meaning and a new context after the November 2 2004 elections. Hands need to be joined across the sea in an old cause: the defence of the Enlightenment. We are all blue Americans now.

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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 03:23 AM
Response to Original message
1. And as the freeway blogger says,

"We're all wearing the blue dress now."

Which sounds like a flippant sexual reference at first, but a deeper meaning is that, like Monica's infamous blue dress, we are stained by the sins/ crimes of this administration.

"Nous sommes tous Americains bleu."
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Peanut Gallery Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. What a great quote
n/t
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DELUSIONAL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 03:37 AM
Response to Original message
2. Wasn't it a massive world wide depression that fueled the
backward movement to Fascism?

The way bush is going -- driving America to bankruptcy with his wars and tax cuts and then more people out of work and not able to buy all the junk being imported from China and other third world countries .. . these countries can no longer buy US debt bonds . . .

A massive world wide depression > people respond by turning to Fascist leaders.

Yep liberals around the world must stand together.

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sushi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 03:46 AM
Response to Original message
3. Has anyone seen
the new map of America, in which red America is called "Dumbf...istan?
I got that in an email a few days ago. The blue parts are called America.
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Ha! A friend and I were just talking earlier (in the

so-called real world) about the various versions of red state/ blue state maps we'd seen. She saw one with the United States of Canada -- all the blue states + Canada in blue, and the red states labeled Jesusland. I'll have to e-mail her about Dumfuckistan, being as we're both True Blue Americans in a strange red land.
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readmylips Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 04:01 AM
Response to Original message
4. Wait for 2008 when Nazi Ahhnold will be elected...
cry for America. I will vote for Nazi Ahhnold, he'll get those crazy kkkristians into a hot oven after they elect him. That's one way of getting rid of them.
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frustrated_lefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 06:49 AM
Response to Original message
5. This is a dupe
but well worth reading.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-19-04 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
8. A chance for an international movement! eom
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hollywood926 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-20-04 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
9. Blood on the turkey!
I love this line:

When the children go back to their parents' homes for Thanksgiving next Thursday, there'll be blood on the turkey if they turn to politics.
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