"WE ARE ALL TORTURERS NOW."

[rodeodance]

Very sobering.


http://slate.msn.com/id/2111886/

.......

The NYT mentions and the Post stuffs a new report in the New England Journal of Medicine that Army doctors helped interrogators carry out abusive interrogations. The WP has previously reported that the doctors had Gitmo gave interrogators detainees' medical files. But according to this latest report, which is based on interviews with doctors as well as those ACLU papers, the docs did the same in Iraq. (In other words, though the papers don't seem to mention it, this seems to be another instance of Gitmo techniques "migrating" to Iraq, where the Geneva Conventions were supposed to apply.)

Everybody mentions the military's announcement that it's launching an investigation into the abuse allegations detailed by the FBI, which the ACLU docs originally revealed last month. Question: Was the military given copies of the FBI memos back when they were written, and if so, why did it wait to investigate? Also, doesn't the FBI itself have the authority to investigate if any civilians might have been involved?

In a NYT op-ed, Mark Danner says there's something different about how the torture scandal has unfolded:



The traditional story line in which scandal leads to investigation and investigation leads to punishment has been supplanted by something else. Wrongdoing is still exposed; we gaze at the photographs and read the documents, and then we listen to the president's spokesman "reiterate," as he did last week, "the president's determination that the United States never engage in torture." And there the story ends.

The headline: "WE ARE ALL TORTURERS NOW."

[MSgt213]

1. Don't forget 9/11 changed everything. We bought then how come we are

not buying it now that everything has gone to shit. I think the person in charge of starting an investigation should have been the director of the FBI and he would have had to have approval from the Attorney General with cooperation from the Defense Dept. Anyone seeing that happen at a time when Donald was the darling of administration and Ashcroft was drunk with power?

[peacebird]

2. just a "few bad apples"

"and all of them reservists - not our fine career military, and certainly not our intelligence people. of course there was that one mercenary who was doing it, but those people are animals. And those ragheads don't deserve Geneva protections because they aren't real soldiers. Everything changed after 9/11. We have to stop them over there so they can't attack us over here. Didn't you people get the memo?"

<sarcastic rant off>

we are all torturers now. it is being done in our name, paid for with our tax dollars. why do i have the sneaking suspicion that the REAL reason for wanting to lock up the detainees at gitmo and elsewhere for life (without benefit of charges or a trial) is to prevent them from telling the world about their inhumane treatment? to stave off charges of heinous torture?

i want the heads of our govt and military up in the Hague facing war crimes tribunals.

[HamdenRice]

3. The truly teflon presidency

This was a truly excellent op-ed -- one of the best I've seen in the times in ages.

I think his point was not just that our tax dollars are being used for torture, but also that the torture has been disclosed to us and there was no outrage, no heads rolled -- in fact the guy who approved it is being promoted.

I just don't get it. If this had happened not just under Clinton, but under Reagan, it would have been a major scandal. What's happened to our country?

[bloom]

4. Mark Danner was interviewed on Democracy Now today

I expect it is available on their website.

Saying "WE ARE ALL TORTURERS NOW" seems appropriate. A lot of us have protested the torture our country is doing - but Americans in general - esp. the ones who are insistent on believing Americans to be better and more noble than other people - could use to hear "WE ARE ALL TORTURERS NOW" . Maybe it would make someone think.