shrub's Mars nonsense = funding Heavy Lift Rocket for the USAF

[Capt_Nemo]

and getting a reliable manned capsule. Once those systems are developed
the whole thing will be called off:
- The military will have the heavy lift expendable booster they need
for ressurecting Reagan's SDI.
- NASA will get their capsule so that they can return safely to
putting humans on low earth orbit, so that the US doesn't fall
behind Russia and China in this field.
- A contingency plan will be made for manned moon missions in the
case the chinese try a moonshot, in order to get americans there
some months earlier, exclusively for propaganda purposes.

Nothing more will come out of it. Meanwhile astronomy and planetary
exploration robotic missions that produce REAL science will be
scaled down or killed in order to make way for this propagandistic
ego-boosting white elephant.

The only thing that might make sense in this idiocy is the capsule
system. As for manned exploration of the Solar System it is something
that only a cooperative endeavour at a planetary scale can achieve,
just like other global problems that are maybe more urgent for us
to tackle.

So what should the Dem candidate say? Like Dean he should say that
the "go it alone" aproach from the bushies will either mean higher
taxes or the ruin of the US economy (this could happen anyway
without this dumb plan, the way things are going). The other thing
that he should say is that space exploration is indeed necessary
but resources should be spared (because they are needed elsewhere)
by spreading the costs and responsabilities in a cooperative
space exploration initiative with the other space faring nations on
Earth. This I have yet to hear from any candidate.

[SpiralHawk]

1. What Generals does Shrub hang out with? If any?

I seem to recall reading somewhere that he -- and all of the BFEE -- are tied in especially tight with the Air Force. Anyone know?

[Capt_Nemo]

3. The neocons plans fit well with some ideas popular within the USAF

There is this long term strategy proposal from the USAF that I heard
about called "Vision 2020", that lays out a scenario where the Air
Force will ultimately become the preeminent armed service by efectively
being able to project power globaly from the US territory by air
and space weapon systems.

That's pretty much what the neo-cons promissed them and it seems
they bought the top-echellon USAF support with their ideology...

[HereSince1628]

4. And yet more evidence to the thinking of Curtis LeMay

The manner in which Rumsfeld and Co. return to the ideas of their youth suggest not so much that that was a time of vision, but rather that Rummy hasn't had a new idea in half a century.

Satellite surveillance did such a great job of exposing Saddam's WMD's and OBL's hiding place. How could anyone challenge the idea of the militarization of space and the American seige of planet USA?

[Capt_Nemo]

6. The systems are NOT required to work

They are just required to fill the pockets of pork intensive industries
like LockMart, Boeing or NorthGrumm.

Those ultra-expensive toys will be usefull against small bankrupt nations, will underperform against big power's arsenals and will be
useless against determined madmen with boxcutters.

Pretty pathetic, isn't it?

[meti57b]

2. the bush administration moon/mars thing is just another way to bankrupt ..

the federal government for years into the future, so that healthcare for those who don't have it, financial assistance to the poor, the disabled and the elderly, financial assistance to the states, etc, can never be funded. The bush administration realizes their lies and corruption in general have been even more exposed with their Iraq war so they are looking for peaceful means to bankrupt the federal government and the space thing is it.

[Boo Boo]

5. Yup. Mars mission is just a cover story...

for the militarization of space. They appointed that AF guy as head of the JC for this reason. They'll build some sort of vehical, perferrably single stage to orbit, calling it an orbiter, but, Bob's your uncle! suddenly it'll be a bomber that can strike anywhere in world inside of an hour.

Count on it.

[PATRICK]

7. (on edit) Mostly agree

I think, according to their stated priorities before election year raised its ugly head, very well define their parameters in space. All else will be the same empty promises and cons that have lured the idealistic into going along in every single one of Bush's positive sounding policies.

Is this a "No Astronaut Left Behind" program? Unfunded, misdirected, actually harmful policies mask the true intention.

They want to erase "competition" in outer space and not just spy satellites. They want shields Buck Rogers weaponizing, as a tool of intimidation and dominance as well as a future damp on the threat of disseminating opposing views(aka the truth) via telecommunications and the Internet. SDI, the atomic shield, this is the Fortress Fascism dream nowadays with the poor and foreign levies doing the necessary outside dirty work among those populations our puppets can't control or milk properly. This is what they have ranting about while cutting NASA funds and total silence about this current "bold" Kennedyesque initiative.

The only way to get a man on Mars is through international effort such as has been going on in Germany and Japan in specific areas and partition of labor for some time. Hot-dogging it for the glory is simply too expensive for the Bush Scrooge dynasty. International cooperation! Science! Non-military uses! The trade-offs if we were to take this garbage seriously would be ruinous and just another way of crippling democracy. This is the Arsenal of Democracy turned against democracy itself- even from outer space.

It's like watching the Devil pray. It's the Big Lie and it's still not polite to accuse Bush in public.