Mark this thread. I said it before. I will say it again. Bush won't run.

[TruthIsAll]

Ok, what do I know? I know this: The NYT, the WP and CBS are getting restless. Check out the subtle change in the editorials.

Check out 60 Minutes. 10 million viewers. Tonight, Paul O'Neill. This is for real. Blows the lid off the Mayberry Machiavellis. His book is coming out at the top of the charts. He's a Conservative. There are a lot of CEO's that are just like him.

Kevin Phillips. A moderate Nixon Republican. Very respected. His book uncovers the dirt under the BFEE rock.

Krugman. Conason. Ivins. Palast. Moore. They are just getting started.

The troops hate Bush. They want out. Now. Their families want them home. Now.

Ellen Mariani. Wants justice. Now.

Kristin Breitweiser. Nothing will stop her from getting the truth. Keane and and Kerrey and the rest of the 9/11 Coverup Commission can't keep the cover on, not with Kristen and Mindy and the rest of the wives watching their every move.

Joe Wilson. He has shown us what he is made of.

The CIA. They know who outted Valerie Plame. They know what happened. And they know this act can have only one ending.

Programmers. Losing jobs to H1B's and India. Losing unemployment benefits.

The establishment sees all of this. They won't let Bush run. He's a loser. There is no question about it. They are looking at their options right now. Bank on it.

Is John McCain waiting in the wings?

I like John Buchanan. He's the 9/11 candidate. Right now, he's my candidate. He might surprise us in New Hampshire.

It's about to hit the fan. The perfect storm. No WMD. Fact. No imminent threat. Fact. No jobs. Fact. Plenty of lies. Fact. Plenty of casualties. Fact. Big deficit. Fact.

MIHOP? Maybe. LIHOP? Of course.

No, Bush won't be impeached. The coward will quit long before that. He'll get the same sweetheart deal Neal got with Silverado Savings and Loan. And the one Poppy got with Iran Contra.

[Catherine Vincent]

1. Oh please. You're dreaming.

I wish that bastard would quit, though.

[hellhathnofury]

27. I like the sig pic.

[K8-EEE]

2. Thanks!!

Really I see so many signs that the gig is up -- I sometimes get discouraged by all the defeatest "Bush Can't Lose He Has Too Much Power/Money" posts. I think he can lose, and for all our sake, he must lose.

[kysrsoze]

13. Oh, he'll run. But I'm just waiting for the Presidential debates

He's gonna get destroyed by whoever ends up being the Democratic nominee. NOTHING he or his cabal have done has turned out with positive results. I seriously think he is going to lose, but it won't be a landslide b/c of all the stupid @ssholes who support him without any independent thought.

[kath]

16. Debates???! There won't be any debates.

[brainshrub]

55. I hate to agree with you...but I do.

I think they will duck out of the debates... the Republican convention isn't until September & the election is in the first part of November.

There probably won't be any time for a debate.

[Granite]

78. They have to debate

I mean, they don't HAVE to debate, but I think that this would fire up even the most apathetic out there. The debates are the first time that most people start paying attention to the campaigns. Some even use them to make up their minds. Even if their anlaysis is in the "he seemed to speak well" level, people do look forward to the seeing the candidates debate. I think that weaseling out of them will be horrible for BushCo.

Just MHO, but whoever the Dem candidate is, s/he should DEMAND to debate - and if Bush* won't do it, they should HAMMER him on it repeatedly.

[americanconfusion]

83. sure there will!

they were just talking about the coming up debates over the summer. Bush better be well prepared or he should just not even show up.

[americanconfusion]

81. ya man i agree the debates could be a comedy

thanks for bringing this up i agree, he will run because there are still tons of moderate to hardcore republicans that suport this guy enough to run through a brick wall. But i would have to agree he has focused his whole presendency on the war so when other topics are discussed he while be smoked by i think any of the democratic canidates. I would love to see a REv Al Sharpton v.s G.W debate that could be hilarious. Even Imagin Bush going against Dean or Clark it could be a devestation for the Bush Family that controls their robot.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RandomKoolzip]

4. What about all that money he's raisin'?

I think you're wrong here, TIA. He wouldn;t be sucking so much corporate cock if he wasn't depending on their influence in this election.

[Warpy]

17. Think CONGRESS

I think the rich and powerful know the jig is up with Bush, that he's done as much damage to us as he can get away with. I honestly think they're planning to stick a Democrat with the mess Bush made, lie to the dummies in the public (50% of whom are normal or below normal in intelligence) that it's all the Democrat's fault, and run Jebbie in 2008 to continue the class war. I think Bush's war chest will be devoted to congressional races, and that Diebold will help the whole thing along.

Paper ballots! Make sure you vote absentee ballots!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

64. DO NOT VOTE ABSENTEE BALLOT!!! they do NOT get counted unless

the vote is close in that state or district....absentee's in most states are NOT even opened unles like i said it is a close race....and write in are even "illegal" and never considered in many states...know your state election laws inside out before you deside absentee ballot....

[Eloriel]

57. And the voting machines n/t

[economic justice]

5. Bookmarked!

I have given a lot of the conspiracy people a lot of grief here. I probably should apologize. I've been reading some stuff that a fellow DUer sent me and, I must say, wow. I've been reading at whatreallyhappened.com Is that site credible? Is there another source that might be better? I still can't bring myself (yet) to believe in MIHOP or LIHOP, but I am sure beginning to ask more questions.

[RandomKoolzip]

10. The somewhat anti-Semitic overtones of whatreallyhappened.com

kinda turn me off, but the rest of the stuff on there is QUITE credible, and scary as shit. I used to read that site more than DU before the dude running it put one too many Holocaust denial stories on the board...I only visit there once a week now.

[BigDaddyLove]

49. Anti-semetic? You really think so?

I certainly recognize the anti-Israeli flavor of the site, but I don't think he posts stories that aren't anything but the truth with regard to it's brutality and underhandedness.

[starroute]

60. Some of the things he links to are a bit over the line

I don't think the site itself is anti-Semitic. But I've followed certain links he posted -- especially some relating to the origins of Zionism and the Jewish settlements in Palestine before World War II -- that had a rather unsavory, Rothchilds-out-to-rule-the-world tonality.

I value whatreallyhappened.com because I find stories there I don't see anywhere else, but I definitely don't trust some of his more blatantly right-wing sources.

[Mike Niendorff]

30. (reference)

Go to http://www.cooperativeresearch.org and click on Paul Thompson's 9/11 timeline.

Regardless of your pov, the compendium of references he's put together there is amazing -- far beyond anything I've seen anywhere else. As with anything 9/11-related, though, it's a good idea to (1) read his disclaimer first, and (2) to proceed with due caution before forming conclusions.


MDN

on edit: here are a few more links

Bookmark Recovery Thread: 9/11

list of 9/11 links and references (posted as part of a longer thread)

Hope the links prove useful :)

[Minstrel Boy]

31. some sites to check out:

The 9/11 timelines and outlines of DUer Paul Thompson are an amazing resource:
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/index.html

http://www.911review.org/
http://unansweredquestions.org/
http://globalresearch.ca/articles/11SEPT309A.html
http://www.communitycurrency.org/9-11.html

A site to support 9/11 families search for the truth:
http://www.septembereleventh.org/

And most of the above provide links to other exceptional resources, too.

[Jim Sagle]

33. Here's a site with a different outlook:

www.tenc.net

[economic justice]

73. Thanks everyone!

Thanks for the suggestions on 9-11 sites.....it's hard to separate the wheat from the chaff, so these links really help. I have found some of the timelines to be absolutely stunning. Some of these things, when I read them, I literally get goose bumps. Thanks again for the help!

[ochazuke]

6. Can you give us a time frame for this?

Johnson gave his speech in like March, wasn't it? But shrub is still over 50% in the polls and just last week the media consensus was "invincible".

I'm thinking that things will fall apart so slowly that there won't be time for the chimp to drop out.

It may be so slowly that he even gets reelected. But there's no way that this insanity can go on much longer -- it's just like the Internet bubble. Let's call it the Bush Bubble.

[Zan_of_Texas]

84. You don't have to believe this ...

but I read an entire LBJ speech at that time, and I said to my family, "I don't think he's going to run again."

No one was picking up on it, no pundit was saying that, but it was between the lines in that very long speech.

Every once in a while, someone will tip their hand, if you just look beyond the 15 second sound bites on the news.

I don't have a feel for who is really in that scripted puppet president we have now -- can't tell if there any free will person in there making decisions based on any reality but "what Condi tells me"? I don't know.

[mike_c]

7. even if you're wrong...

...every point you made IS another nail in dumbya's political coffin. And does anybody really think the boy has a real golden parachute waiting in the wings? He'll probably get lots of cushy offers for name recognition alone but no one in their right mind would trust him with any job more important than being introduced at cocktail parties.

on edit: I predict that he'll run, but I also predict a landslide defeat. Even rabid republicans have got to have their bile churning by now....

[spanone]

8. They will cheat, rob, lie and steal for re-election. Bush will run.

These bastards don't care what the people think. Their arrogance will make them run bush especially if he's a liability. Pricks!

[adadem]

14. I think you're right.

Nothing will happen...the pugs control everything. The only way is if "the people" demand it. Even then, ain't gonna happen.

[sendero]

43. A difference between Dems and Repugs..

...is that Dems lament the lack of involvement and awareness of the average American, the Repugs take advantage of it.

[Kazak]

9. That would be so sweet!

:nuke:

[wuushew]

11. How much money you got riding on this?

because I will take your bet.

[NashVegas]

12. Unless There's an Impeachment, He Will Run

His sense of entitlement demands he run.

But I do agree it's starting to look like the jig may very well be up.

Just the fact that what O'Neill said was said on mainstream, network TV says more than most people realize.

[Silverhair]

47. And impeachment? Of a Rep POTUS by a Rep congress?

What have you been smoking?

[kerry-is-my-prez]

62. Yep - party over country every time for them. They're morally bankrupt

I like to think the Dem Party is somewhat better - although after some of the hyocritical things I've seen happen in this election - I'm not so sure....

[terrisel]

15. Agree

I hope he doesn't resign though and let Cheney take over for several months ---we may not survive several months of a total Cheney presidency.

[RainDog]

21. We've been living with a Cheney presidency for 3 years

The Chimp is merely the friendly face of fascism.

as far as your post, TIA, I cannot see Bush or Rove going without being frogwalked...which is my greatest hope, and which would be justice anyway.

Maybe Phillips' book wil give some pause to those in our highest levels of govt who let Reagan and Bush Sr. slide on Iran-Contra, Iraqgate, and The October Surprise.

Maybe they will FINALLY realize that they cannot let this sort of thing go without damaging our nation for a long time-- the consequences of accountablity for them--as far as our nation losing confidence in its leaders and govt-- has proved FAR WORSE for us by not telling the truth when they should have.

If they had outed Reagan and Bush Sr. for the criminals that they are, we would not be dealing with this Chimpy/Cheney junta now, and our nation would be much, much better off for it, and also far less divided, and thus stronger.

[Beaker]

34. another, less talked about, part of the Clinton legacy-

Thanks, Bill.

He let Poppy Smirk off The Hook for IranContra and the xmas pardons of the Weinberg Six- all "for the good of the nation"...

look where that got us.

for future reference for future Dem Presidents- when there's a cancer on the soul of the country, it's best to carve it out and expose it to the light of day, not sew it shut and hope for the best.

[KoKo]

53. It all started with the Nixon pardon. He should have been Impeached and

frankly thrown in jail. All this crookery started with that guy getting off. It just emboldened them. Made G. Gordon Liddy that piece of work, a talk show host with an influence second only to the Rushbo.

[Malva Zebrina]

69. and made Ollie North a hero--another Republican serial fascist liar

[candy331]

22. I must say that since he claims to be a Christian

and reads his Bible that perhaps he has not read in the book of Daniel that God says that he sets up and he takes down so since he and his Christian friends believe God set him up they should know that God might be ready to take him down. I sure hope so!

[moof]

18. This is so similar to tricky dick in 72

There was so much information that it seemed like there was no way he could stand for election but he did & " They " said it was a landslide.

It is just stunning to have people talk about what a dirty trickster Dick was & anyone can see all the advances that have been made in the last 30 years but, stealing elections, no, no posibility that the black arts have made similar advances.

[GiovanniC]

61. There's a Difference Though

In the early 70s there was a media that knew it was their job to hold our elected officials accountable.

Now, the media believes that their job is to lovingly caress Dubya and protect him from all harm.

From being asleep at the wheel on 9/11, disastrous foreign policy, unimaginable irresponsibility in environmental standards, blatant cronyism, the reverse Robin Hood act of stealing from the poor and giving to the rich, the outing of a CIA agent, the lying about Iraq's ties to Osama bin Laden and weapons of mass destruction, the failure to capture Osama bin Laden, etc... there are a lot of reasons to kick Bush to the curb.

BUT MOST PEOPLE AREN'T AWARE OF THESE THINGS!

Part of it is that people are lazy and not intellectually curious (much like *). But another very large part of this is that the media AREN'T DOING THEIR JOBS!

[Insider]

19. if not, it's only because he won't have to

thanks to diebold and others. oh he WILL be in office though

[SeveneightyWhoa]

20. Of course Bush'll run again. You know why?

Because he has nothing better to do.

[RainDog]

24. We'd be much better off if he were just bankrupting companies

instead of our entire nation.

surely Poppy can find some "make work" for him.

I know I could-- I hear that license plates are a good source of employment for criminals.

[Insider]

35. was THIS his make-work

"son, i want you to go work with dick and colin and condi for a little while"

[hellhathnofury]

28. Watch baseball.

[Mike Niendorff]

23. You are assuming Bush and his gang are amenable to reason.

They are not.


MDN

[Zomby Woof]

25. LOL!!!!

Really, you should post the comic material in the Lounge. :crazy:

He already kicked off his 2004 campaign by the way, so he IS running, as we post.

Still no toast anywhere yet, but you make me laugh, so that is not a complete loss. :-)

[WillyT]

26. TIA... You Are SO ARTICULTE In Your Genious Brevity !!!

You wax elequent my man, and I thank you!

:thumbsup::hippie::thumbsup:

[wtmusic]

29. That thought has crossed my mind too

If Iraq gets bad enough McCain would take over

[Dr Fate]

32. Unless there's a live boy or a dead girl, Bush is running. n/t

n/t

[Selwynn]

36. TIA: a question to you - do you ever come back and post when you're wrong?

Seriously. When Bush does in fact run again, will you make a post that says "yeah, I was totally dead wrong on that one" or just slink silently back into the shadows?

If you're right, please - please remember to PM me if I forget, so I can make a post that says TruthisAll was totally right and I was totally wrong.

But I'd like to see you do the same. If you're going to be a conspiracy nutball at least you can have the basic balls to post and acknoweldge that the lastest crazy theory you suggested was in fact completely and utterly wrong every time it happens.

That's what I'd like to see - some unflinching accountability to match speculation.

Deal?

[grasswire]

37. I think he'll run...

...simply because he's needed to make some last-minute pardons in December 2004. A whole bunch of them.

[proud patriot]

38. You may call me a dreamer , but I'm not the only one

Here's to keeping the faith :toast:

[jsw_81]

39. Bush won't run?

I think this prediction is just as silly as your various wild and wacky JFK conspiracy theories. Trust me, Bush is running.

[Kinkistyle]

40. Half the country still think Bush was picked by God.

He's running. He's the closest thing to Jesus that some of our country's religious conservatives have at the moment. Bush commands a lot of votes right now and the media is still whoring themselves, despite what you might be seeing from some of the more liberal journalists, they are literally covered up by all the B.S. being spewed out there. Our view of world events is significantly different from what Joe and Jane America's.

[NicRic]

44. Among other false assumptions !

The other day on C-SPAN a pro bush caller ,started talking about how bush and his wife came from nothing and how bush was a self made man , WTF ,what planet do these ignorant people come from .Some of the things people give bush high marks for are just unbelievable ,like he is a honest person , honorable , intelligent and the worst lie ,that he is doing a good job as President :eyes: I just dont get this blind faith in someone with such a bad record while in goverment and even in private ventures ! I mostly blame the media for allowing these false assuptions to go on un contested,however people do have a responsiblity to educate themselves to the facts with a open mind !

[Honesthumanbeing]

41. let me get this straight

You are saying bush won't run for re-election?

[Killarney]

42. With approval ratings like his... he'll run

I wish what you're saying was true, but it's not. He's running and he's running to win. And so far he's leading the polls.

[Merlin]

45. TIA, you da man, and all that. But on this one...

I dont THINK so!

But, do you think he'll keep Cheyney on?

[Silverhair]

46. Bartender! Cut this guy off. He's had enough. n/t

[JNelson6563]

48. TIA may I send this on?

So many hear the media whores and their "Bush can't lose" mantra, I want to hand out this hand list of just some of the problems. Might help to snap them out of their defeatist mindset.

Julie

[rman]

50. doesn't matter if the public at large doesn't know

unfortunately

[NoKingGeorge]

51. May be by design.

The people in power ,cheney, wolf's group, do not care whether this
deserter is in Washington or not. If he is a liability he will go. They will prop up another moron who is incurious enough to not be a bother to them. Not one of the people behind the curtain though, they are more effective where they are.

[KoKo]

52. "Truth" you're always so optimistic. I think he will stay. They will

NEVER give up control and they know the country doesn't have the appetite for Impeachment because we are just coming off Clinton's troubles. They will stay until the last man is standing. Their whole 40 years of building power to the Ultimate position they now have to change the whole world remaking it in their own vision is at stake for them.

No, it's going to be a long haul. Who knows when this nightmare will end. No Democratic administration is going to be able to turn this around in one term, and they will be fought as long as there's one BFEE or PNAC'er left.

That's my dark view. They've gotten away with too much for it all to come down in one year. But, I wish!

[brainshrub]

54. I bookmarked this...

A McCain/Dean competition would be grand! I'll bet sparks would fly at the debates! Both men are inteligent, witty and can kick some serious booty without resorting to dirty tricks.

Although I would never vote for a Republican, McCain would make a good president. I feel he is an honorable man who has the nations best interests at heart.

However, I don't think it will happen. Bu$h is going to run. He has to to preserve the oil for his corporate customers or they'll literaly kill him.

[DrBB]

56. Don't forget DOWD, covering the all-important haberdashery beat

Yes, some of the things you mention are marginally significant. But how could you neglect the brave Ms Dowd, who fearlessly launched into the critical haberdashery issue this last week? Even as Bush takes these trivial little shots against His Magnificence in stride, we can rest assured that Dowd will NOT let us neglect the critical matter of what colors, fabrics and styles are currently being favored--to our horror and disgust--by the Democratic candidates!

[davsand]

58. The "powers that be" may not let him run.

I have maintained from the get-go that shrub was not intended to be any more then a one termer. I think they have used him like a kleenex. They got the tax cuts they wanted and they got the profits they wanted, along with the relaxed environmental standards they needed to increase profits even more.

He raised a huge amount of cash in his first race from the big money guys--the one who control the cash flow in this country. They put him in place to enact an agenda, and they did it with every intention of letting him go down the crapper after he gave them what they wanted. They gave him Unca Dick to lead the way--and they allowed everyone to know all about Unca Dick's bad ticker.

I think this has been a set up from the beginning that Unca Dick was gonna step down for "health reasons" (or even go room temp at some convenient point) and then a moderate GOPer was gonna go in the VP slot. This moderate was gonna be above reproach--and completely insulated from the shady stuff that shrub and company has been up to. This moderate will also be somebody they can count on not to roll back the tax cuts and the regulations providing increased profits.

I fully expected them to let a really juicy bit of information out and then the entire GOP would give him up in "moral indignation," however, the cash cow has been too good to give up. Now they are at a point that is too late in the game to put up any opposition to him--it has become a matter of life and death.

Bear one thing in mind--they want control of the WH at all costs--and they could give a crap about who the puppet is. If shrub is a public relations liability then he's gone. IF they see the numbers drop in those approval polls (the real ones--not the ones they put out in the media) then I will bet you money that shrub turns into a JFK and some poor schmuck gets to fill in for the beloved martyr.*

Neil and Jeb are too tainted-there will be no Bobby Kennedy action here. I expect it to be some moderate GOPer like maybe a Governor or a Senator. Maybe even a candidate that is not so openly associated with the Right to Lifers. The defining thing about this candidate will be that they can control him/her...

I admit freely that I may be strapping on my tin foil hat--but if you look at who footed the bill for his selection--it is possible I'm right. Think about this--how many times have we commented here at DU that shrub acts afraid? If you were in his shoes--wouldn't you be? He may have a "message from God" that he's doing the right thing--but if he really did feel that way would he be so paranoid?

Truthisall, you and I can share a padded room. I agree with you and have for a long time.

Laura


*Obligatory note to the SS: I do not wish ill on any one and it is my fervent hope that Whistleass is in fine health for as long as possible. Frankly, I WANT him to stay healthy--I think the DNC can kick his ass outta the WH. Make sure he gets enough sleep and takes his vitamins--OK?

[randr]

59. Article yesterday pointed out the decline of major media's

control of the information. More and more people are looking to the net and elsewhere for facts. Facts are facts and soon we will see a major shift in reporting of the news from entertaining spin to exposure of the truth.
An old adage is the "if it bleeds it leads". The more people learn of the facts about this administration the faster they will demand heads on the proverbial platter!

[Faygo Kid]

63. You're right. He won't "run." He will assure the election is rigged.

If there is ANY danger that he won't win (i.e., if a Dem is within 15 points of him), he will get in touch with his friends at Diebold, and on the courts.
If a Dem is within 5 points of him, he will either nuke North Korea, or arrange a terrorist attack, and declare martial law, cancelling the election.
You "misunderestimate" this guy's megalomania. He believes he was chosen by God.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

65. ABSENTEE BALLOTS are NOT even opened nor counted in many states

unless the race is close

[leetrisck]

66. Gene Lyons did an article about this

and he called it "failing upward" bush has failed at everything he's done but he's always failed into something higher (with help of course). So where does he fail upward from here. Lyon's thought he might not run either - think he actually thought he might resign. He should - NOW

[Snivi Yllom]

67. marking thread

but I think its more likely my dog will start reciting poetry.

[Wapsie B]

68. Who would they put in,

Dan Quayle? Chimpy not running is all nice to think about but I still wouldn't hold my breath.

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

70. But what about the desire of the Repubs to appoint the SC judges?

I suppose if there is such a thing as some cartel of "powers that be" running things from the shadows, they would be smart to let a Democrat president get in there and appoint the judges to ensure social stability and let the Democrat stabilize the economy too, while taking the blame for everything. Then let the Republicans try to come back in and steal some more, later.

But Bush thinks God has put him there and they haven't taken any smart actions yet, so I would think that Bush will run. Because whoever is in charge appears to act more like fanatical, greedy meglomaniacs, than clever behind-the-scenes manipulators.

Maybe there is some kind of battle going on between different groups with power. But if there is, the crazy ones seem to win all the time and they are probably too delusional to do anthing sensible.

Boy do we need democracy.

[PATRICK]

71. Jeb will step in

Unstained, pure, more popular than his brother, the suddenly ill "hero" of the Oil War will retire like a martyr, not like Tricky Dick, bitterly and madly raving as the moving van pulled in.

Seriously, it will be hard to get this embarrassment out of their craw unless some big debacle happens and is allowed to master the headlines. I bet the reasonable suckers thought they always had an out, like a Powell in the wings(which is why the Bushites deliberately destroyed him)or controls. Some of them are more nervous than we are about the future and probably for the same reason- the truth.

I think it is a subtle process, very murky. First Bush's hold has to be broken, not just slip, his assurances about the (s)election have to be patently ruined, his opposition has to be great not seen as anything from hopeless to modest chance. Those threatened have to flex muscle and not just noble whistle-blowing. If the Pope said Bush said so and so it wouldn't be enough. Maybe a smoking gun video could break the ultimate dam. I think Bush's backers are trapped, that the Dynasty is more than the insubstantial man himself.

If so, watch for an enormous payoff and legend as the Bushes stage a strategic retreat to the future. The GOP knows they will let the party flounder and put back another Bush later as a Savior. Blackmail, threats and privilege keeps his loyalists "honest".

Right now, at this stage they may be at the point of needing a surprise, my bloodless favorite being the careful late choice of a showcase Veep(Cheney will actually still hang around the cabinet disrupting natural power transfer cycles)but the media will go 24/7 with the excitement to drown out all things democratic(big d, small d).

There are more ominous means. Even the starry-eyed loyalists fear Bush/Cheney in their gut if they cross them. Can the dirty ruthless Rove campaign be contained until November? How? The weakness and sometimes defenseless posture of the media starved Dem politicians does not scare them as much as reality suddenly getting through to the masses. They will be convinced to hang tight from that weakness which also depresses the vote of dissenters.

[Beam Me Up]

74. Nice analysis!! n/t

.

[IkeWarnedUs]

72. Typing with one hand - wrapping tinfoil with the other

I agree with your assessment TIA.

PNAC'ers have too much invested, are too close to their ultimate goal of an American empire, too old to wait another 4 (or 8) years again and have committed too many crimes to let a REAL democrat take over the White House.

In 1992 when Bush the Elder was defeated it was by the DLC golden boy, Bill Clinton. We now know about the PNAC influence on the DLC. I don't think Clinton was as easy to control as they hoped (so bring in a special prosecuter) but at least he didn't look under any rocks they didn't want him to (Iran Contra for example).

I think their hope was to have another DLC candidate so they could maintain their influence. I am not going to name the DLC candidates, you can go to the New Democrats directory and find them yourselves (http://www.ndol.org/new_dem_dir_action.cfm?viewAll=1).

If the Democratic candidate is someone they can't control I think we are in for some real theatrics. Maybe Bush will resign - but if he does I think Cheney will go first so they can put a more palatable puppet in first (remember the Agnew to Ford move). Otherwise we may see some new dramatic development - another 9/11 type attack or war. In that case they will either rely on people's natural reaction to "rally behind their president in a time of crisis" or "be forced to postpone the election" like they did in New York after 9/11.

As encouraged as I am over the s**t getting closer to the fan, I am scared by it as well. These guys are getting backed into a corner and I believe they are capable of doing ANYTHING to survive.

[Skittles]

75. Bush was an incompetent, lying, thieving bastard the first time he ran

he was selected anyway. I harbor no doubts that they couldn't pull it off again.

[On the Road]

76. Hey, I Never Thought of That!

on Paul O'Neil: "There are a lot of CEO's that are just like him."

Yes, Paul O'Neil definitely has some credibility with business leaders as the former head of Alcoa. Dissatisfaction in the business community can be a fulcrum for prying Bush loose from power.

Most business leaders are pragmatic and apolitical. Although they may like their tax cuts, fiscal irresponsibility and reckless war cause great concern in most industries. Many CEOs are potential allies in getting rid of Bush, and Paul O'Neil speaks to them.

[caledesi]

77. TIA - I have been thinking the same thing. * will pull an "LBJ"....ho hum

[ShaneGR]

79. You've been reading too much DU

Unfortunately, over 50% of the country still doesn't care about all of the Bush Cabals crimes.

He's gonna run, period.

[mourningdove92]

80. There is a lot of substance in what TIA has pointed out.

Lately, with all the things that are being allowed to come out, that make Bush look bad, including the immigration policy that his base considers a slap in the face, I have been wondering, WTF? Something is up. I don't know if Smirk will quit, I just can't see that, or if something else will happen, but something doesn't seem just right here. There are many of us, while rubbing our hands in glee, have also been questioning the timing and content of recent news and events. I've got my tinfoil hat out...I'm going along with TIA on this one. Maybe not exactly as he forsees, but something unusual.

BTW, if Chaney were out of the picture, and Smirk was out of the picture, wouldn't that put Delay next in line? Someone, please tell me I'm wrong. I live in Texas, I know what Delay is all about.

:scared: :tinfoilhat: :wtf:

[meisje]

82. The only thing Bush "Won't" do is Lose!