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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:10 AM
Original message
Paranoid shift
Edited on Mon Jan-12-04 09:20 AM by Karenina
http://www.onlinejournal.com/Commentary/011004Hasty/011004hasty.html

By Michael Hasty
Online Journal Contributing Writer

January 10, 2004—Just before his death, James Jesus Angleton, the legendary chief of counterintelligence at the Central Intelligence Agency, was a bitter man. He felt betrayed by the people he had worked for all his life. In the end, he had come to realize that they were never really interested in American ideals of "freedom" and "democracy." They really only wanted "absolute power."

Angleton told author Joseph Trento that the reason he had gotten the counterintelligence job in the first place was by agreeing not to submit "sixty of Allen Dulles' closest friends" to a polygraph test concerning their business deals with the Nazis. In his end-of-life despair, Angleton assumed that he would see all his old companions again "in hell."

The transformation of James Jesus Angleton from an enthusiastic, Ivy League cold warrior, to a bitter old man, is an extreme example of a phenomenon I call a "paranoid shift." I recognize the phenomenon, because something similar happened to me.

snip

In his book, "Rogue State: A Guide to the World's Only Superpower," William Blum warns of how the media will make anything that smacks of "conspiracy theory" an immediate "object of ridicule." This prevents the media from ever having to investigate the many strange interconnections among the ruling class—for example, the relationship between the boards of directors of media giants, and the energy, banking and defense industries. These unmentionable topics are usually treated with what Blum calls "the media's most effective tool—silence." But in case somebody's asking questions, all you have to do is say, "conspiracy theory," and any allegation instantly becomes too frivolous to merit serious attention.

On the other hand, since my paranoid shift, whenever I hear the words "conspiracy theory" (which seems more often, lately) it usually means someone is getting too close to the truth.
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seventhson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:30 AM
Response to Original message
1. Thanks Karenina
Great article. Bookmarked.
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
2. Funny thing is...
Edited on Mon Jan-12-04 09:42 AM by BeFree
Most of our Government these days is nothing more than one huge conspiracy theory.

The theory that making rich people richer at the expense of the poor is good for America, is a conspiracy.

The theory that we can't afford to clean up our air and water pollution is a conspiracy.

The theory that by limiting the People's Rights we will beat 'Terra' is a conspiracy.

The theory that the media is fair and balanced is a conspiracy.

The 'Elite' always conspire against the Majority in order that the 'Elite' remain more equal.

******************

Sorry, James Jesus Angleton, one hopes you do not RIP, but instead become an anquished spirit which haunts the crooks in the CIA.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. Conspiracy theories or fact?
Edited on Tue Jan-13-04 07:55 AM by Skinner
"That George Bush was the CIA director who kept the names of what were estimated to be hundreds of American journalists, considered to be CIA "assets," from the Church Committee, the US Senate Intelligence Committe chaired by Senator Frank Church that investigated the CIA in the 1970s; that a 1971 University of Michigan study concluded that, in America, the more TV you watched, the less you knew; and that a recent survey by international scholars found that Americans were the most "ignorant" of world affairs out of all the populations they studied, is not a "theory." It's fact.

snip

That, in the early 1970s, the newly-formed Trilateral Commission published a report which recommended that, in order for "globalization" to succeed, American manufacturing jobs had to be exported, and American wages had to decline, which is exactly what happened over the next three decades; and that, during that same period, the richest one percent of Americans doubled their share of the national wealth, is not "theory." It's fact.

That, beyond their quasi-public role as agents of the US Treasury Department, the Federal Reserve Banks are profit-making corporations, whose beneficiaries include some of America's wealthiest families; and that the United States has a virtual controlling interest in the World Bank, the International Monetary Fund, and the World Trade Organization, the three dominant global financial institutions, is not a "theory." It's fact.

snip

That the international oil industry is the dominant player in the global economy; that the Bush family has a decades-long business relationship with the Saudi royal family, Saudi oil money, and the family of Osama bin Laden; that, as president, both George Bushes have favored the interests of oil companies over the public interest; that both George Bushes have personally profited financially from Middle East oil; and that American oil companies doubled their records for quarterly profits in the months just preceding the invasion of Iraq, is not "theory." It's fact.

EDITED BY ADMIN: COPYRIGHT
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Moderator DU Moderator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Karenina
Per DU copyright rules
please post only four
paragraphs from the
copyrighted news source.


Thank you


DU Moderator
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. OOPS! Sorry!
In my haste I didn't C&P this bit:

Michael Hasty is a writer, activist, musician, carpenter and farmer. His award-winning column, "Thinking Locally," appeared for seven years in the Hampshire Review, West Virginia's oldest newspaper. His writing has also appeared in the Highlands Voice, the Washington Peace Letter, the Takoma Park Newsletter, the German magazine Generational Justice, and the Washington Post; and at the websites Common Dreams and Democrats.com. In January 1989, he was the media spokesperson for the counter-inaugural coalition at George Bush's Counter-Inaugural Banquet, which fed hundreds of DC's homeless in front of Union Station, where the official inaugural dinner was being held.

Permission to reprint is granted, provided it includes this autobiographical note, and credit for first publication to Online Journal.
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YNGW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
3. Paranoid
I wouldn't be so paranoid if Bo Gritz would stop following me around. Also, why are there two moons in the sky? Has anyone read Dhalgren backwards? How many anarchists does it take to form a consensus that perhaps it's time to change the lightbulb? I'd never want to be part of a conspiracy that would have me as a plotter. Oh, I'm so alone. Where are the Cheez-its? When will this nightmare end. There's a little Area 51 in all of us.......
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rogerashton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
4. Conspiracy or class?
"And there are those, even on the left, who question the current relevance of this information. "

Well, yes. And there is a danger that by focusing on the Bush family, and Scull and Bones and all that, we might divert attention from the fact that this is all part of the fundamental nature of capitalism, and encourage the idea that, if only we could get rid of a few bad actors, capitalism would be jes' fine?

From that point of view, conspiracy theory could be just -- too comfortable.

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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:39 AM
Response to Original message
5. Wonderful piece, ought to be spread around
Edited on Mon Jan-12-04 09:49 AM by Minstrel Boy
Thanks for posting!

Some more:

A second major reason people won't make the paranoid shift is that they are too fundamentally decent. They can't believe that the elected leaders of our country, the people they've been taught through 12 years of public school to admire and trust, are capable of sending young American soldiers to their deaths and slaughtering tens of thousands of innocent civilians, just to satisfy their greed—especially when they're so rich in the first place. Besides, America is good, and the media are liberal and overly critical.

Third, people don't want to look like fools. Being a "conspiracy theorist" is like being a creationist. The educated opinion of eminent experts on every TV and radio network is that any discussion of "oil" being a motivation for the US invasion of Iraq is just out of bounds, and anyone who thinks otherwise is a "conspiracy theorist." We can trust the integrity of our 'no-bid" contracting in Iraq, and anyone who thinks otherwise is a "conspiracy theorist." Of course, people sometimes make mistakes, but our military and intelligence community did the best they could on and before September 11, and anybody who thinks otherwise is a "conspiracy theorist."

Lee Harvey Oswald was the sole assassin of JFK, and anyone who thinks otherwise is a "conspiracy theorist."

Perhaps the biggest hidden reason people don't make the paranoid shift is that knowledge brings responsibility. If we acknowledge that an inner circle of ruling elites controls the world's most powerful military and intelligence system; controls the international banking system; controls the most effective and far-reaching propaganda network in history; controls all three branches of government in the world's only superpower; and controls the technology that counts the people's votes, we might be then forced to conclude that we don't live in a particularly democratic system. And then voting and making contributions and trying to stay informed wouldn't be enough. Because then the duty of citizenship would go beyond serving as a loyal opposition, to serving as a "loyal resistance"—like the Republicans in the Spanish Civil War, except that in this case the resistance to fascism would be on the side of the national ideals, rather than the government; and a violent insurgency would not only play into the empire's hands, it would be doomed from the start.

...

But as a paranoid, I'm ready to join the resistance. And the main reason is I no longer think that the "conspiracy" is much of a "theory."



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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. The denial is deep.
*dumbya is a misanthropic dauphin. The *cabal propping him up has exactly ZERO interest in the welfare of anything or anyone but its slime sucking members. It is the biggest threat to our collective survival the world has ever seen. They will stop at NOTHING to maintain their power.

IF THAT MEANS KILLING YOU AND YOUR WHOLE FAMILY, SO BE IT.

YES, I MEAN YOU.

If your eyes aren't rolling around in your head yet :crazy: Google "Christian Reconstructionism" and see what you find.
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kayell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Yikes! Do you know of any lists of people in govt. who are
involved in or subscribers to that philosophy? I'm only done skimming a few of the google links and already my paranoia level has tripled this morning. Handmaid's Tale ahead...
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Look here
Cornell University is keeping track

www.theocracywatch.org
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Check out these quotes
http://www.politicalamazon.com/cr-quotes.html

Then check out with whom Rushdoony and North have connexions...
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Howard Ahmanson - Theonomic Reconstructionist
"My purpose is total integration of biblical law into our lives"

California billionaire gave the initial money to Todd and Bob Urosevich to start the touchscreen voting machine businesses.
www.tabletnewspaper.com/politics/73_tftgk.html
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Ah yes, the Ahmansons...
Dorothy Chandler, anyone?
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #9
35. Thanks for the link, keeping track of these things some times seems...
like pot calling the kettle black, but when people use their religion to subtract constitutional rights the shoe is now put on the other foot, they have gone from building alliances to trying to break them down.

They seem to fit quite well together one group telling tales that can't be substantiated to another group with simular unsubstantiated and unprovable theories. Is any wonder why they get along so well.

Only a fool could not guess why freedom of and from religion was the first thing enumerated in the in the original Bill of Rights
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truth2power Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #8
21. Tom DeLay n/t
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ellie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks for posting this!
It was really interesting, scary, and sad, all at the same time. The Bush Family Evil Empire is certainly a fitting title for this band of miscreants, isn't it?
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cryofan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
10. this ties in perfectly with chomsky, parenti, zinn, et al. -eom
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ellie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #10
23. Zinn, yes
My husband started reading "A People's History" and it totally changed his life. This is stuff he didn't learn in school. Me either, but I started out much more cynical than him. He has caught up with me.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
11. kicking it
:kick: :kick: :kick:
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
15. THIS is a VERY important article. Here's the part I like best:
Perhaps the biggest hidden reason people don't make the paranoid shift is that knowledge brings responsibility. If we acknowledge that an inner circle of ruling elites controls the world's most powerful military and intelligence system; controls the international banking system; controls the most effective and far-reaching propaganda network in history; controls all three branches of government in the world's only superpower; and controls the technology that counts the people's votes, we might be then forced to conclude that we don't live in a particularly democratic system. And then voting and making contributions and trying to stay informed wouldn't be enough. Because then the duty of citizenship would go beyond serving as a loyal opposition, to serving as a "loyal resistance"—like the Republicans in the Spanish Civil War, except that in this case the resistance to fascism would be on the side of the national ideals, rather than the government; and a violent insurgency would not only play into the empire's hands, it would be doomed from the start.

Forming a nonviolent resistance movement, on the other hand, might mean forsaking some middle class comfort, and it would doubtless require a lot of work. It would mean educating ourselves and others about the nature of the truly apocalyptic beast we face. It would mean organizing at the most basic neighborhood level, face to face. (We cannot put our trust in the empire's technology.) It would mean reaching across turf lines and transcending single-issue politics, forming coalitions and sharing data and names and strategies, and applying energy at every level of government, local to global. It would also probably mean civil disobedience, at a time when the Bush regime is starting to classify that action as "terrorism." In the end, it may mean organizing a progressive confederacy to govern ourselves, just as our revolutionary founders formed the Continental Congress. It would mean being wise as serpents, and gentle as doves.

It would be a lot of work. It would also require critical mass. A paradigm shift.


But as a paranoid, I'm ready to join the resistance. And the main reason is I no longer think that the "conspiracy" is much of a "theory."


Followed by several paragraphs of items which are not "theory" including but not limited to this:


That the Bush administration has desperately fought every attempt to independently investigate the events of 9/11, is not a "theory."

Nor, finally, is it in any way a "theory" that the one, single name that can be directly linked to the Third Reich, the US military industrial complex, Skull and Bones, Eastern Establishment good ol' boys, the Illuminati, Big Texas Oil, the Bay of Pigs, the Miami Cubans, the Mafia, the FBI, the JFK assassination, the New World Order, Watergate, the Republican National Committee, Eastern European fascists, the Council on Foreign Relations, the Trilateral Commission, the United Nations, CIA headquarters, the October Surprise, the Iran/Contra scandal, Inslaw, the Christic Institute, Manuel Noriega, drug-running "freedom fighters" and death squads, Iraqgate, Saddam Hussein, weapons of mass destruction, the blood of innocents, the savings and loan crash, the Bank of Credit and Commerce International, the "Octopus," the "Enterprise," the Afghan mujaheddin, the War on Drugs, Mena (Arkansas), Whitewater, Sun Myung Moon, the Carlyle Group, Osama bin Laden and the Saudi royal family, David Rockefeller, Henry Kissinger, and the presidency and vice-presidency of the United States, is: George Herbert Walker Bush.

"Theory?" To the contrary.

It is a well-documented, tragic and—especially if you're paranoid—terrifying fact.

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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Whoomp! Dey it is!!!
:kick:
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Stephanie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. Why does he include the Christic Institute?
Weren't they the good guys who sued over the Iran-Contra intervention in Nicaragua?
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-04 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. Guess: The Christic Institute's LaPenca lawsuit named "Secret Team."
VP George Poppy Bush was CIA Action Officer inside the Reagan White House. The suit named John Hull and a bunch of spooks tied to Poppy and North's network who ran drugs and killed people. No wonder Poppy didn't forget to pardon Weinberger, Gregg, Fires and this pack of traitors as a lame duck prez. Too bad Clinton's Justice Department didn't pick up the trail. Many of these turds are back in power with Smirk-n-Sneer's occupation.

BUSH PARDONS WEINBERGER, FIVE OTHERS TIED TO IRAN-CONTRA

Calls Weinberger "true American patriot"


(650)

By Dian McDonald USIA White House Correspondent

Washington -- President Bush December 24 granted pardons to former Defense Secretary Caspar Weinberger and five other individuals for their conduct related to the Iran-Contra affair.

Bush said Weinberger -- who had been scheduled to go on trial in Washington January 5 on charges related to Iran-Contra -- was a "true American patriot," who had served with "distinction" in a series of public positions since the late 1960s.

SNIP...

The president also pardoned five other persons who already had pleaded guilty or had been indicted or convicted in connection with the Iran-Contra arms-for-hostages investigation. They were Elliott Abrams, a former assistant secretary of state for Inter-American affairs; former National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane; and Duane Clarridge, Alan Fiers, and Clair George, all former employees of the Central Intelligence Agency.

Explaining those pardons, Bush said the "common denominator of their motivation -- whether their actions were right or wrong -- was patriotism." They did not profit or seek to profit from their conduct, Bush said, adding that all five "have already paid a price -- in depleted savings, lost careers, anguished families -- grossly disproportionate to any misdeeds or errors of judgment they may have committed."

CONTINUED...

http://www.fas.org/news/iran/1992/921224-260039.htm
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ariellyn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
22. Wow..."I no longer think that the 'conspiracy' is much of a 'theory.'"
That's a profound statement. I never thought I'd care about or even discuss such things as government conspiracies. I thought that the stuff I saw in the movies--the espionage, the greed and malice of evil men--was fantasy for the most part. Never in my wildest dreams would I have believed corruption would infest the highest levels of our former democracy or that the American government even used propoganda. Now that I know all these things for sure, I am deeply saddened. Ignorance was bliss.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #22
30. Welcome to DU, ariellyn
Ignorance may have been "bliss" but it was also irresponsible. Take some heart in knowing that, contrary to what we were led to believe, we were KEPT ignorant; distracted daily by a million slights of hand. Losing one's illusions can be disheartening--at first. But then one can begin to become angry and hopefully motivated. The most important thing we can do right now is EDUCATE ourselves and one another. We must also begin to build bridges between ourselves and others with whom we share a common fate. This will make us a force so that, at the very least, we can begin to know who our real enemies are. They may not be as all powerful as they would like us to believe.
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thebigidea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #15
36. well, I'd agree with most of it - but, uh - the Illuminati?
I'd like to see someone "directly link" GHWB to the "Illuminati" - or hell, directly link anything to them other than some RAW novels and a Steve Jackson game.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. i don't think it matters much how some of the inner circles are called
or i should say, some of the meeting groups of the inner circle.
stonemasons, illuminati, skull & bones.

If you accept there's an 'elite global mafia' ruling the planet, then why would you think these secret groups are operating outside and independent of this 'global elite'?
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DrBB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-12-04 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
19. Yeah, well. Skepticism taken to its logical extreme
...collapses into credulity. All "official" explanations are false, but the most outlandish and unlikely explanations start being accepted merely because of their "alternative" cachet--the more occult, the better.

Keep skepticism alive, whichever side of the looking glass you find yourself on!
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-13-04 07:32 AM
Response to Reply #19
26. Anyone skeptical
that the current *misadministration is crawling with slimy characters?
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-04 04:28 PM
Response to Original message
27. Wow!
This must be why the Repubs attacked the Dems who made the Bush/Hitler video and Moveon! To try and minimize the impact of this story by making more people look like "Conspiracy Theorists" they hope to play this down again! This is the best I've seen this laid out yet!
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-04 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
28. You bet someone is getting too close to the truth!
You only have to look at LIHOP theories to know this!
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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-14-04 11:49 PM
Response to Original message
29. Good to know SOME people are thinking clearly. The "paranoid" stigma
Edited on Thu Jan-15-04 12:24 AM by Dover
is strong. But Truth and the desire for Truth, is MUCH stronger.

Thanks for the article. Here's another one that outlines who is who in the elite power structure, and their affiliations.

WHO RUNS THE WORLD?

http://www.bilderberg.org/whorunstheworld8.doc


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TruthIsAll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
31. A great article, should be required reading..
...
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 03:13 AM
Response to Original message
32. Kick
:kick:
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DUreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
33. another kick
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 01:32 PM
Response to Original message
34. kick and the US public goes their merry way
while we watch our society become increasingly fascist daily, sliding into hell.
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-15-04 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. For anyone who missed it...
:kick:
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-04 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #38
39. WOW!
:kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: :kick: :nuke: :nuke: :nuke: Dynamite Find WTG!
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-04 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
40. Well, never thought of myself as one of the "Human Remnants"
and muricans as "pod people" but Damn it sure is fitting....

<What perplexes me most is probably the same question that plagues most paranoiacs: why don't other people see these connections?

Oh, sure, there may be millions of us, lurking at websites like Online Journal, From the Wilderness, Center for Cooperative Research, and the Center for Research on Globalization, checking out right-wing conspiracists and the galaxy of 9/11 sites, and reading columnists like Chris Floyd at the Moscow Times, and Maureen Farrell at Buzzflash. But we know we are only a furtive minority, the human remnant among the pod people in the live-action, 21st-century version of "Invasion of the Body Snatchers.">


Thanks for this Karenina!
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-04 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. "Invasion of the Body Snatchers."
It's the: "Invasion of the MONEY and POWER Snatchers."
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lostnfound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-16-04 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
42. kick n/t
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