How's this for a protest? Health Care

[camero]

Everyone here knows the damage that our for profit health care system has caused the nation in terms of economic growth and lost lives. Alot of us have personally been devastated by what is happening in our lives when we get sick and have to deal with the for-profit system of medicine.

Some of these stories you can see here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=679836&mesg_id=679836

We have an idea that everyone who can and are willing make copies of their hospital, doctor's bills, collection notices, court cases, and bankruptcy records to make copies of them and mail to a centralized group where we can go to Congress and protest to bring about a single payer system.

I would like to thank Liberalhistorian and loftycity that they think it's a good idea. Any suggestions to how we can get started and any help is much appreciated. I feel that this may be one of the few ways to wake Washington up to our situation and it's affects on the nation.

[liberalhistorian]

1. And I have to thank you again

for that idea, someone should have thought of it a long time ago!

I think trying to coordinate a national campaign might work, I'm going to try to get something started in my own area. We need EVERYONE, but what we especially need are web experts who can help us organize and coordinate everything. LET'S DO IT!

[camero]

2. That's true

I haven't the faintest idea how to start a website or activist program...lol. Maybe a few well placed e-mails to consumer advocacy and health care groups also could be helpful. :)

Blondatlast had a website up where we could tell our health care stories but I forgot where it was at. That also may be a good place to start.

Edit: And thanks again.

[liberalhistorian]

3. I do have

some activist experience and knowledge I can draw on, so we'll see who responds and where it takes us.

[camero]

4. Dang, I shoulda went to college. :)

I'm also curious to see who will respond. There are many activists here but I wonder where they are. :shrug:

[liberalhistorian]

6. I think maybe they'll be on tonight,

many can't get on DU during the day.

[The Democratic Kid]

78. Activists Stand up Unite and Fight! Fight! Fight!

I'm the Democratic Kid. I'm a health reform activist living in Phx. AZ.
I'm 41. My family was lied to and taken advantage of by this corrupt, greedy health care system of ours. They lost their life savings and my family was turned upside down. To everybody that reads these stories of tragedy, print them and send them to your elected officials. Call talk radio and read the stories over the air. Call your elected officials, read the stories over the phone. If they are short with you, call back and demand to be heard. That is our right.
With your help, we will organize a million patient march and delilver these stories and others to Washington by this summer. One of the groups on the front lines of health care reform is The Alliance for Retired Americans. Visit their website and join them.
Anyone can join no matter their age. The webstite is www.retiredamericans.org.
Thank you. Lets band together, fight together and win together. I'm with you all!
The Democratic Kid E-Mail me at [e-mail]

[camero]

79. The million patient march.... brilliant. Thanks

I wonder if we can incorporate this idea with the Million Patient March? Thanks Democratic Kid. :)

[The Democratic Kid]

84. Million Patients March..

First Start posting this idea on as Meany boards as you can, call talk radio, WE must work with the Alliance for Retired Americans I HAVE talked to them about this idea, I am friends with the Pres. of the Az, Group They like the idea. It has to be in the early part of summer because of health concerns of older people Protesting, Summer is to hot and winter is to cold, Protesting is a matter of life and death for some people, Please contact me I have a plan that will work. Thank You, The Democratic Kid... Dkid @fight-backusa.com also www.retiredamericans.org

[camero]

86. I'm glad they like it.

This seems to be rolling faster than I thought it would. :)

[blondeatlast]

22. PNHP has already tried to start a campaign, here's info:

http://www.pnhp.org/news/2001/july/its_time_to_establis.php

[camero]

27. Thanks

My story is long and has lasted years. Very much thanks (muchas gracias) :) for all your links and help.

[The Democratic Kid]

85. Hi

Are you an Activist please E-mail me so we can work together We have to stand up and Fight Back now or we will lie down and suffer tomorrow.... The Democratic Kid...

[blondeatlast]

25. I think I can help--not an expert. but I'm well versed in the issue

and am decent at setting up a website and doing graphics.

There is no way I can do the whole thing alone, though.

Since I'm a librarian, I can get good info, too.

You might want to read (make that SHOULD definitely read) Health Care Meltdown by the late Robert LeBrow.

[camero]

28. I will do that

Sounds like a good book. Thanks. :)

[The Democratic Kid]

87. The Time is NOW !!!

I read every one of these stories, You Kick ASS I want to work with you, I am a Health care activist that is on your side, MY FAMILY went threw hell and was turned upside down by this greedy, corrupt system of ours Health Care Reform Today Or Your life savings and dignity tomorrow...Email me and together we WILL KICK THERE ASSS and Spit Fire Back in their faces,,, Thank You The Democdratic [e-mail]

[loudsue]

5. This is a really good idea....

MoveOn may be willing to organize this campaign; you should write to the officers and propose this. MoveOn already has millions of members, and this is not a partisan issue. It's happening to ALL Americans, one by one. I think it would spread quickly.
:kick:

[liberalhistorian]

7. That's a good idea.

How would we go about doing that?

[loftycity]

38. We could write the proposal

Hey, We could write the proposal here...if Blondealast can do a Web site to kick us off? What do you think?

[camero]

10. Thanks

I sent a statement. The e-mail address is [e-mail]

[davsand]

8. I am delighted to see this!

Any change requires that somebody take that first step. Finding that here at DU is a wonderful thing.

Now, as for Congress critters that are sympathetic to the issue, I do know that Bernie Sanders, Indy, from Vermont put up a copy of the WSJ article on Body Attachments and hospital collections on his web site:

http://bernie.house.gov/documents/articles/20031031155424.asp

I also know that Lucette Lagnado from the Wall Street Journal has written several articles on the issue of medical debt. She is a most wonderful lady, and I am deeply thankful to have had the opportunity to have worked with her on her article about my neck of the woods.

Locally, we have a consumer organization called the Champaign County Health Care Consumers, and they are very good at what they do. I seriously urge a look at their website:

http://www.prairienet.org/cchcc/

They have done a lot of work on medical debt and collection practices, and you can find a lot of info at that website.

The Executive Director is a lady by the name of Claudia Lennhoff and I am so very proud of her for all she has done. Just in the last year she got national attention for her work in health care advocacy, and from what I can tell, she's kicking even bigger bootay this year!

CCHCC was born in the 70's as a class project. The founder, Mike Doyle was at the U of Illinois and this was his project to begin with. I'd say he passed--the CCHCC is still going strong 27 years later!

It galls me to think that if you pay property taxes directly or even rent anyplace--you are helping support the hospitals who use collection agencies and harass people. Anybody that has any interest in trying to strip the local property tax exemptions for hospitals let me know--I'll tell you all I know from having tackled it here in Illinois.

Laura

[liberalhistorian]

9. Thanks, Laura!

I read the link to the Champaign County advocacy group when you posted it in the other thread, and I'd like to get something like that started in my own area.

There are several nationally-known hospitals and clinics in my area that are known as being pretty ruthless as far as this is concerned. As a historian and paralegal, I think I'm gonna use my research and investigative skills to dig deep into their collection practices, and the rates of those affected by them and the bankruptcy filings as well.

Also, a popular columnist for my local Cleveland paper is engaged to a local congressman, Sherrod Brown, who is a strong advocate on this issue. He refuses to use the congressional health care coverage until ALL Americans get the same coverage, he busses seniors to Canada to buy cheaper prescription drugs, he fights the drug company all the way, he's on top of fighting those perpetuating this ridiculous and phony malpractice "crisis" (the REAL health care crisis is what we're fighting right now), etc. I think I'm going to email her, explain what we're trying to organize, and ask her to put the word out. I don't know if anything will come of it, if she'll do that or not, but I'm sure gonna try.

[camero]

11. Another place to contact

http://www.pnhp.org/

They want to make health care a public service and not a business. Glad to see some docs still follow the Hippocratic Oath.

[iverglas]

12. pnhp

Physicians for a National Health Program.

You were posting that as I was having one of its pages crash my old Netscape. ;) I'm not going to try that again -- but I'd bet the PNHP is a good clearing house for info.

This is the one that stalled me:
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2001/june/talking_to_americans.php
"'Talking to Americans' <Rick Mercer's segment on 'This Hour Has 22 Minutes'> Reveals Ignorance of Canada in US"

My favourite site for info for USAmericans about the Canadian system:
http://www.newrules.org/equity/CNhealthcare.html
It's very readable and informative.

The main "Equity" page at the New Rules site
http://www.newrules.org/equity/index.html
also has info about Maine's single-payer initiative, which I've been eagerly waiting to see in action.

.

[camero]

13. It did take a while to load

Thanks for the links. I think if we e-mail as many places as possible, someone will pick up on it. Maybe some of the candidates will take part because this issue is not going away anytime soon.

[liberalhistorian]

14. There are, indeed, doctors

of integrity and caring who follow the Hippocratic Oath and who are very angry and disgusted with the way the system currently is. I just wish there were more of them.

[camero]

15. Me too

Here's another group: http://www.thealliancefordemocracy.org/html/eng/1377-AA.shtml

They think real democracy is not possible without a healthy populace.
I have to agree.

[loftycity]

39. We have a list and know the doctors who are willing

Tom has to post here soon...works for the VA doctors really interested.

[camero]

16. Is there any way that we can..

bring this up at Meet-Ups also?

[liberalhistorian]

17. I don't see why not.

It's a major issue for a lot of people, even the middle class is starting to deal with health care difficulties in large numbers, which they've generally been spared from until now.

The problem is that, while many people decry our current system, they still are brainwashed into thinking that it's better than anything that the government would run, and they're still brainwashed into thinking that the nationalized, guaranteed systems of the other industrialized countries are far worse, thanks to repuke propaganda. What we have to do is figure out a way to break through that entrenched way of thinking and get them to see how much better a reformed system would be, that it would NOT be "socialist."

[camero]

18. Part of it maybe to get people to see

Doctors and health care workers like police and firefighters. Most people I know actually do see them like that. Maybe this protest would raise awareness.

[liberalhistorian]

19. And there are a lot of caring, concerned health care workers,

from doctors and nurses and everyone else, who deserve to be thought of that way, who do the best they can for people, they're just stuck in the same mess of a system as everyone else.

Unfortunately, there are too many doctors who simply do not have any idea what it is like to not have resources or be uninsured, and they have far too many stereotypes of that.

I well remember that from the days I was on Medicaid, (you're made to feel like scum) and the time I suddenly lost my job four years ago and couldn't find another for almost a year. I had no insurance and no money, and my own doctor's office, where I'd gone for the past eight years, treated me like shit and refused to see me when I had a major, painful throat infection until I coughed up some dough that I just did not have.

I was made to feel like a criminal and scum because I was sick and without money or insurance, from the doctors to the nurses to the office staff, EVERYONE. And I'd gone there for eight years! Their policy now is not to see anyone without insurance unless they pay 75 bucks up front, which is impossible for most people without insurance. Even if you've gone there for years and suddenly don't have insurance for whatever reason, it just doesn't matter. All they care about now is money.

[camero]

20. I agree

I hope this thing takes off for all of ours sake. Alot of people have been through the same as you. Including myself.

[Kanary]

88. Medicaid doctors

I agree that many Medicaid patients are treated badly, and that is just plain nasty. However, there ae also drs with ethics and concern who continue to treat Medicaid patients, even though it is a hassle for them with the system, because they believe that everyone should have access to health care.

It is *those* drs we also need to support. I know that I have decided that if I'm ever able to get a real life, and get beyond Medicaid, (and if I live through the cutoffs this coming summer), I will continue to go to the drs who have taken my Medicaid, and will give them my money rather than some other drs.

Some Medicaid drs deserve some recognition for being among the few who actually have some concern for patients.

Kanary

[blondeatlast]

21. I'd be happy to, and I have applied to go to DC with the

American Diabetes Association to tell my story to Congress and anyone who will listen.

Here are some like minded groups.

http://www.amwa-doc.org/Advocacy/issues_healthcare.htm

http://www.familiesusa.org/site/PageServer

http://www.amsa.org/hp/uhcinitiative.cfm

http://www.amsa.org/hp/myths.cfm
This has an interesting sort of "sim" about UHC that lays rest to the myths.

[liberalhistorian]

23. Thanks,

and let us know what happens with the Congressional testimony, that's great!

[loyalsister]

24. Great idea!

Here is some VERY convincing testimony.

http://www.nomanagedcare.org/DrPeenotestimony.html

The movie "Damaged Care," tells the whole story. Dr. Peeno might be interested in this effort.

[camero]

26. Thanks

I don't know what came over me. :) Thanks for the link.

[liberalhistorian]

29. WOW!

I've heard of her, but hadn't really read anything by her, that's incredible and EVERYONE should read it!

"How much more harm and death must occur before we have the courage to do something about it", indeed!

[camero]

30. Dr. Preeno's site is a good one.

I was especially enlightened with this:

We have enough experiences from history to demonstrate the consequences of secretive, unregulated systems which go awry. The list above is not new. In fact, it comes from a book detailing the characteristics of a dire period of recent history. The last time this combination of forces worked in concert, over 200,000 individuals lost their lives in Nazi Germany (even before the Final Solution). Most of these persons were German citizens sacrificed for medical reasons set by economic and social agendas. I find the parallels chilling. One can only wonder: how much pain, suffering and death will we have before we have the courage to change our course?

[camero]

31. kick

[camero]

37. kick

[camero]

42. One more kick

for the night people.

[camero]

68. nother kick

[rustydog]

32. Keep in mind..HIPPA Laws regarding health information

If you are going to have people send copies of billing for medical procedures, they had better send a signed HIPPA-compliant document giving your group permission to use the information or you may run afoul of the law and be punished. ( up to 25,000.00 dollar fine)

healthcare is a major issue. hell, the hospital where I work ahs been bought by a for-profit company and it does not bode well.

There has to be universal healthcare coverage and it needs to come now.

[liberalhistorian]

33. That's a good point about

permission, and I had thought of that. And the words "for-profit" and "medicine" DO NOT go together, nor should they ever!

[camero]

34. Would a disclaimer on the website work?

and from what I'm reading this applies only to health care workers. I could be wrong.

Link here:http://www.nclnet.org/healthprivacy/

Also it's an opt-out provision. I would think if people voluntarily mailed them then it would be in compliance with the law.

http://www.healthprivacy.org/info-url_nocat2303/info-url_nocat_show.htm?doc_id=173435

[loftycity]

35. I'm here

We have to get corporate america. in on this.
I have heard interviews with the head of Health Care for GM and Calpers. They want Universal health care..they cannot afford it any longer and they are laying people off to pay for it.
I will be willing to go after these two companies and see what they have to say in backing this. I know they will.

[camero]

36. Nice to see ya.

I agree. Not a bad idea.

[duhneece]

40. I don't suppose anecdotal stories would be useful?

I was business manager of a radiation/cancer treatment center and witnessed many who failed to get tests (pap, mammo, etc) because they lacked health care insurance and funds for these tests. Their cancer, when detected, was at a later and more fatal stage.
I saw young couples who ended up with no home as they paid for medicine instead of rent.
I witnessed the denial of Social Security in the very same week out patient died.
I want to help.

[camero]

41. I think they could be a help.

There is alot of destruction in our For-profit system of health.
And thanks.

[loftycity]

43. Send them the bills

NOW. (Sitting here with Loftycity) I really like the idea of dumping all these health-care bills on the White House and Congress. Maybe we could add to that: Each time you get any bill for health care, send a copy to the White House and one to your Congressmen and Senators. Deluge them with bills that wouldn't exist in any other "enlightened" country (like Cuba).

[camero]

44. True

Though I'm apt to think they would just throw them out but it could be a good addition.

[camero]

45. It would need media coverage to work also

[liberalhistorian]

62. I'm working on that,

I'm emailing a well-known locally influential columnists for the Cleveland Plain Dealer, she's engaged to Congressman Sherrod Brown, who is a well-known, strong advocate on this issue. She may be able to help get the word out.

[liberalhistorian]

61. You would absolutely

be of great help, and thanks! PM me, I'll give you my email, and we can get going. I've already gotten a lot of emails from other DUers interested in helping out, so we're off to a good start.

[camero]

46. Another bump

Can't resist. please keep this kicked. :)

[populistmom]

47. Would it be a class-action suit type of thing?

Sounds like a good concept. I'm just trying to understand it.

[camero]

48. Sorta like the anti-war protests

But for universal health care. Picture 18 wheelers going down Pennsylvania Ave. with doctor bills to give to Congress.

[Cleita]

49. I'm a hundred percent with you guys.

:hi:

[camero]

50. Thanks a bunch Cleita.

:) :hi:

[Kanary]

51. Some European posters have given info about other countries

There is one who is talking about starting a website or forum about the issue of democratic socialism, including health care.

If you're wanting to combat the propaganda about the bogeyman of "socialized medicine" it would be good to have the help of people who are living it.

Kanary

[camero]

52. Yes it would

This is more of a way to show Congress that our situation is not going to get any better with the present system. Too many have died already because of our for-profit system.

This may expose our suffering to the people in power. I would love to hear from our European posters about this idea. :hi:

[Cleita]

53. Yes, this would be good.

I'm trying to set up a small website about it, since I have Canadian friends who can counter the lies told. However, I don't have a lot of time to spend doing it so it's going slowly.

[Ladyhawk]

56. I have a million anecdotal stories.

It's gotten to the point where I don't expect the system to work for me. I've had some very bad experiences.

[Cleita]

67. Hi Ladyhawk

Check your Inbox. :-)

[Kanary]

72. Would it be possible, Cleita,

for you to respond to my PM message, also?

Just thought I'd ask.

Kanary

[Cleita]

73. I didn't receive one.

I sent you one just now. If you don't get it then there's a glitch happening.

[Ladyhawk]

54. I've lost track of all the times the system has failed me.

n/t

[camero]

55. So have I

I hope to help right it though even in a small way. Where did you get my pic? :P

[Ladyhawk]

57. My problem is I'm on Medi-Cal.

I have a theory that Medi-Cal is designed to kill the patient in order to save the government money.

[camero]

58. I hear that alot

Almost like SSDI. Which I probably will die before I get.

[loftycity]

59. Have to keep trying to get this going

It will happen faster than just waiting our Washingtion people to do something.
I fear once they get in---they will forget about this.

[camero]

65. That's true

We must keep telling them about it and keeping informed. We can't let them forget.

[marie123]

60. anything anything

I will do anything you ask that will help out in regards to Health care

This is an opportunity for liberals and conservatives alike to come together. I wish I could help this process. I know together we can change and secure health care in this country. Howard Dean is a man of change we need him.

[camero]

66. Good to have you aboard.

No matter which candidate gets in, change needs to occur in this regard. Thanks for your help.

[liberalhistorian]

63. I would also like to include

denial of care letters from the goddamned HMO's as well. This month's ABA (American Bar Association) Journal had an article discussing the Supreme Court's agreeing to hear a case on whether or not patients have the right to sue HMO's, because currently they're exempt under the federal ERISA law. There were some real hair-raising stories from people who suffered injury or were disabled due to a denial of care, and also about people who died due to care denial.

It is WAY BEYOND TIME to do something about this! Congress has no fucking clue because they're usually well-off anyway, and they also have the best coverage possible, paid for courtesy of us taxpayers who DO NOT have the luxury of such coverage!

[camero]

64. That is brilliant

That slipped my mind, thanks.

[camero]

69. I wonder what the professors here

Have to say about all this. And our European posters, how did it start over there?

[liberalhistorian]

70. I should do some research on that as far as

how it got started in the other industrialized and mainly European countries.

The main difference is that in this country we've always had a much more individualistic mentality, that the individual is more important and takes precedence over the good of society as a whole. There's never been a real, general sense that it's the responsiblity of society as a whole to ensure the well-being of ALL of its members, not just those with money. In a way, that's good because it's fueled a lot of our freedoms and technical innovations and creativity, but it's really bad in the sense that there's no notion of the importance of ensuring that ALL members of a society are taken care of, not just the monied elite.

[camero]

71. I should too

I just thought I should put the question out there. Europe before The French Revolution still seemed to be a fuedalistic society in a certain sense and less so right up to WWII.

Here is some insight into how the Canadian System got started. Maybe our Canadian friends can enlighten us a bit.

http://www.policyalternatives.ca/publications/articles/article243.html

[Kanary]

74. I suggest you also add

the great piece on how medical care should be part of the infrastructure.

Before doing too much research, pulling up past threads would be a good start. There's a LOT there.

Kanary

[camero]

75. Thanks

Not finding much at the momento. Alot of propaganda to sort through. I should try to pull up archived threads here. Thanks alot.

[liberalhistorian]

76. That's a major part of the research

I want to do, and I had, indeed, intended to include the "health care as infrastructure" piece as well. There are tons of threads about health care here, and many are full of great sources and even better information.

[camero]

77. Another Universal Health Care site

http://www.uhcan.org/

[loftycity]

80. Other Organizations

I've been to couple of meetings between insurance companies and the government here in Minnesota.

We have an idea that has plenty of impact. And it will make people aware and start doing something about it.

[camero]

81. The thing I like about it that I hadn't thought until now

It lets people be proactive in affecting change. Not only do they bring their bills but also their story.

[loftycity]

82. "I believe it will get done if we show them"

They are so insulated from us. They don't know.
I thought what Ted Kennedy had said a few days ago. That we should all have the same healthcare as they have in Congress.
I'm so mad at this whole thing...they are going to be covering health,dental,vision etc....
I'm going to PM You

[camero]

83. Okely dokely :)

You're right. We pay their salaries. We should have the same benefits as they do.

Edit: alot going on today. I'll be waiting for your PM.

[liberalhistorian]

91. That's for sure!

I'll PM you with my daytime number, I'm actually here until 7 or 8 or so. I emailed the local columnist I mentioned earlier, who's engaged to Congressman Sherrod Brown, a strong advocate on this issue. Hopefully, I'll be hearing from her soon.

[camero]

92. And we're rolling

I sent out 2 e-mails yesterday. One to Dr. Preeno and also to PNHP. You should get an e-mail from Democratic Kid soon. It's a good plan.
I could PM you with the details if you like.

[camero]

94. another bump.

:)

[camero]

89. kick

[camero]

90. kick

[camero]

93. kick again

[camero]

95. Last kick

I promise.

[veganwitch]

96. tony the rat williams closed dc general

to build condos. this was a public hospital. greater southeast hospital was supposed to take the "overflow" but has been mired incontrovery. a few weeks after closing dc general, great southeast lost its liscence. rat-shit pulled some strings and they got it back. but its in southeast, leaving the northern quadrants with no local hospital. all the rest are private.

[camero]

97. This is exactly the kind of crap

We are fighting against. With a single payer system, this kind of thing would not be necessary. Join our fight.