Who here believes Christ is coming back?

[mopaul]

Do you think he is coming back 'physically', or, 'figuratively', as in, the teaching's of Christ are coming back?

Who here thinks that a biblical prophecy is soon to be manifested, concerning Israel and the middle east? Who here believes that the United States should pick a side in the middle east conflict, between the Israelis and the Palestinians? Who here sees the whole mess in religious terms?

Who here sees these times as the end times, and bush as some pre-ordained player in this inevitable Greek tragedy? Do you think that bush is purposely trying to hasten the end times by being a brinksman? Pushing three of the great super religions of the world to conflict and Armageddon?

Do you foresee a holy war, waged between Christians, Muslims and Jews, all of whom worship the same God?

Would Christ be returning to bring peace, or a firestorm?

[hang a left]

1. Well I feel different at different times Mo

But I will say the some prophesies in the bible are eerily familiar with world events today.

I would say that possibly Bushifer could very well be the anti-christ.

[opihimoimoi]

5. When ET returns, the WEED CONTROL SQUAD will

accompany him.

"Kill it before the Humans Spread beyond their Solar System" We gave them brains but something went wrong" They use their brains not for Peace but for war."

[mopaul]

29. carbon based life form detected...disinfection will now begin

apply copious amounts of hawaiian lava to infected area.

opihimoimoi rules!

[opihimoimoi]

46. Peace Rules, but we haven't figured that one out yet.

Still stuck on Greed, Arrogance, and Fantasy.

[Submariner]

2. The supernatural is a figment of the imagination

for the believers. There is enough scientific evidence to deduce our origins did not come from a creator. When you think about it, what did Jesus and his followers know 2000 years ago during the era of the flat earth society. Not much! No math, no science (physics, astronomy, biology, etc.)

No schooling, thus little if any education, so they believed in spirits. The god of thunder and lightning, the sun god, etc. Religion is just gibberish and in our day is a root of much evil.

Bush scares me because of his born again status, and I believe he believes that if he unleashed a nuclear war it would be justified by his "god."

I had 12 years of nuns. Scary shit.

[bobthedrummer]

3. No one knows the time, mopaul, but I believe Jesus Christ will

return as promised, but only God knows when that time will be.

I think Jesus is gonna be a real surprise to many of the fundy's that have perverted his teachings and actually do evil, not good, in His name.

But as to when that will be, no one knows. In the meantime everyone can work towards peace, Christ is known as being against war and the victor over death and war and confusion, not the guy of praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition fascist nonsense.

[papau]

38. Amen - :-)

:-)

[physioex]

4. Never!!

He was man NOT the son of god! But perhaps we could follow his historical example and not take lives.

[bobthedrummer]

8. He was God in human form, born to a human mother

to believers.
Son of God/Messiah to many.

[Ernesto]

11. Tell us how you REALLY feel. We can take the truth.

Welcome to DU physioex!....... Personally, I believe in the tooth fairy.

[MikeG]

6. Some seriously question whether he ever existed.

[Catholic Sensation]

7. well using the Bible as a template

Pushing three of the great super religions of the world to conflict and Armageddon?

Not how it works. It's a war between the Anti-christ's followers versus followers of God (Jews, Muslims, and Christians) who refuse to accept the divinity of the Anti-christ, though all the "fighting" is done by the Anti-christ's side.

Do you foresee a holy war, waged between Christians, Muslims and Jews, all of whom worship the same God?

I see one being waged right now by the Bush Administration and Terrorists, both of which represent an incredibly small number of people their respective religions. Sadly neither side is fighting the other most of the time :(

Do you think he is coming back 'physically', or, 'figuratively', as in, the teaching's of Christ are coming back?

I believe he's coming back physically.

Who here sees these times as the end times, and bush as some pre-ordained player in this inevitable Greek tragedy? Do you think that bush is purposely trying to hasten the end times by being a brinksman? Pushing three of the great super religions of the world to conflict and Armageddon?

Several things wrong with this section. Man can NOT hasten God's plans. He can try if he wants to, but it's in the hands of God, and thankfully not in Bush's. The whole religions fighting one another won't happen, as it will be true worshippers of God versus worshippers of thr Anti-christ.

Who here thinks that a biblical prophecy is soon to be manifested, concerning Israel and the middle east? Who here believes that the United States should pick a side in the middle east conflict, between the Israelis and the Palestinians? Who here sees the whole mess in religious terms?

Once the Dome of the Rock is destroyed, then I'll start to believe a Bible prophecy is being manifested. Until then, nope. I don't think we should pick any sides in the Middle East conflict b/w Palestine and Israel. But between the Saudis and Israel, I'll take Israel's side everytime. I see this in religious terms as both the major players in Judaism and Islam in this game are ignorant to the other (and their own) religions it seems.

[Proud_Lefty]

9. People said the end was near for the past 100 years

However, Bush is mighty scary and the power about him is even more scary. I wouldn't be surprised if more catastophic damage is done before people wake up and get rid of this terrible corruption in our administration. I'm not sure how to interpret the bible, which one to interpret, but I found this article a while back about God and thought it made a lot of sense.

A SPECIAL MESSAGE FOR YOU


Let me introduce myself. I have many names, God, Lord, the creator, Jehovah, and the list goes on. Many think they know me well and speak for me frequently. Unfortunately, they rely on false teachings throughout generations of mankind and have been conditioned to shut themselves off to the truth. The more devoted you are in your religion, the stronger you might rebel to this truth. Churches teach you to limit your acceptance to their specific interpretation of the scriptures or your assurance for eternal life will be jeopardized. Sadly, this contradicts your ability to utilize one of my many gifts to you – common sense.

I created this entire world with all its beauty and splendor, from the brightest stars in the sky to the tiniest creatures not even visible to the human eye, and everything in between. My wonders don’t just happen. Can anyone explain why people expect me to prove my legitimacy by performing the supernatural or magic? Don’t they understand that the “natural” is my phenomena that commands your utmost respect. Everything I make and how I make it has a purpose in the world. Why would I ever change that course to prove to anyone that I really exist? If you really need proof, try creating a single living cell yourself.

Why do you apologize for being one of my most precious creations? I always hear “Forgive us, Lord, for we are born of sin.” This is insulting. I made you not of sin, but of pure love. Everything about you has a positive purpose. When you struggle and learn, you develop and grow. This is part of my plan and again it is perfect.

Sensuality is another gift to you. It provides happiness and enjoyment, not to mention continuation and fulfillment of life. As with everything, its limitations need to be understood and learned. Your inner self, where I reside, provides you with that direction if you listen. Remember that modesty promotes rigidness. I’m not ashamed of this gift and you shouldn’t be either.

Your anger is also misunderstood. It serves an important function. It is not to be suppressed, as that could result in long-term psychological harm. Instead, you must know to use it for your protection and that of your loved ones. How to effectively utilize anger is one of the most difficult lessons in life, and sometimes takes almost an entire lifetime to achieve.

My gift of humor is often returned, unopened. For some reason, many think to serve me is to be solemn and serious. Don’t you realize that I created humor, that laughter and gaiety extend the quality of life? What could make a father happier than seeing his children laughing and happy?

Why do you look down upon others who worship me differently than you? Those who praise my name continually, while putting themselves on a pedestal high among others, are hypocrites. Remember how many times Jesus pointed that out during his lifetime? While you interpret so many biblical stories literally, why do you ignore the continual teaching that I want you to come to me in all your humility? In other words, to worship me is to rid yourself of ego, and then love, accept and respect all my people, even if they are Jewish, Catholic, Christian, Muslim, Buddha, African-American, Mexican, Indian, gay, heavy, skinny, disabled or mentally challenged. I made all of them, live with them, and love them.

I don’t want people showing up at my house in their best attire just to make an appearance, sing a song, and then brag about how superior they are to others. Judgment is reserved for me. You need to stick with humility, acceptance and tolerance, and I’ll be smiling on you.

The bible was written by men to help people understand me and was inspired by me. However, thousands of years of flawed men with different spiritual agendas caused that bible to be interpreted many different ways. I continue to create people in different regions of the world that require different spiritual guidance. I don’t have a chosen people and never did. That’s what you call prejudice. You know prejudice is wrong. So what makes you think I could create all people, but only love a few?

I also don’t need to be marketed, unless you truly want to share this truth. Unless you know what you’re selling, it scares people away more than brings them to me. This world I’m offering has few boundaries. Start living your life on the open highway, being the best person you can be. Follow what is right as you feel it deep in your heart, where you’ll always find me, and you will do right by me. This is my truth and who I am. But deep down inside, you’ve already known this, huh?

Love,
Your Heavenly Father

[oldlady]

10. it will be a surprise

one thing the scriptures are clear about -- it will be a surprise-- I disagree with the poster above-- the science of astronomy & astrology was pretty advanced-- that's what brought the east-Asian folks to Bethlehem after all. hey, we're still puzzling over the whole building of the pyramids thing.

As to real or spiritual in return-- I believe it's a real appearance. While I think Christians in every age thought it was going to happen any minute-- heck, I'm old & back in high school I remember thinking it was just around the corner.. but, some of the prophecies which were not in place then are in place now

*re-establishment of Israel (ok, that was in place when I was in high school-- I'm not THAT old)
*re-unification of Europe (Daniel)

Do I think Bush is trying to "speed things up"? hmmm.. it seems many people he affiliates with in the Christian Right feel that way, but I haven't seen/heard him say so specifically. Probably not a good idea for him to try-- until he sorts out that whole God/Mammon quagmire.

My son recently had to do a long research project on NDE (near-death experience) and we went to hear Howard Storm speak. He had a lot to say about God being very unhappy (not lightning bolt pissed, understand, but grieved) with the way we are mistreating the world (environment) and each other.

Might seem trippy to mix NDE and scripture here....but, hey, everyone's understanding is bound to be individual-- we're all collecting info. independently in our life here & it makes sense to me-- big message, don't worry, there is a love bigger than any hate we've seen. imho
peace,
jacki

[doni_georgia]

19. not trippy to me Jackie

I do believe that the some on the right are trying to speed things up. I keep harping on this here, because I had the misfortune to get embroiled in a several months long online debate with some theonomists/christian reconstructionists. They along with the "Kingdom now" folks (of which I am also well acquainted) really do believe they are "ushering in the age of Christ."
Excerpt from Religious Tolerance :
Its most common form, Theonomic Reconstructionism, represents one of the most extreme forms of Fundamentalist Christianity thought. The followers are attempting to peacefully convert the laws of United States so that they match those in the Hebrew Scriptures. They intend to achieve this by using the freedom of religion in the US to train a generation of children in private Christian religious schools. Later, their graduates will be charged with the responsibility of creating a new Bible-based political, religious and social order. One of the first tasks of this order will be to eliminate religious freedom. Their eventual goal is to achieve the "Kingdom of God" in which much of the world is converted to Christianity. They feel that the power of God's word will bring about this conversion. No armed force or insurrection will be needed; in fact, they believe that there will be little opposition to their plan. People will willingly accept it if it is properly presented to them.

All religious organizations, congregations etc. other than Christian would be suppressed. Nonconforming Evangelical, main line and liberal Christian religious institutions would no longer be allowed to hold services, organize, proselytize, etc. Society would revert to the laws and punishments of the Hebrew Scriptures. Any person who advocated or practiced other religious beliefs outside of their home would be tried for idolatry and executed. Blasphemy, adultery and homosexual behavior would be criminalized; those found guilty would also be executed. At that time that this essay was originally written, this was the only religious movement in North America of which we were aware which advocates genocide for followers of minority religions and non-conforming members of their own religion. Since then, we have learned of two conservative Christian pastors in Texas who have advocated the execution of all Wiccans. Ralph Reed, the executive director of the conservative public policy group the Christian Coalition has criticized Reconstructionism as "an authoritarian ideology that threatens the most basic civil liberties of a free and democratic society."

http://www.religioustolerance.org/reconstr.htm

[yardwork]

54. Ok, this is scary!

I go back and forth between thinking that Chimpy thinks along the lines of this so-called "Religious Tolerance" group (talk about ironic names...) and figuring that Chimpy doesn't give a damn about anything except money and power. In that scenario, Chimpy and his pals use religion as a carrot/stick to manipulate the masses.

As for my personal beliefs, I am a Christian evolving into a Pagan. I don't believe that there will be an Armageddon, but those biblical stories represent a lot of truths about the human experience. That's why so many current events seem to "match" religious prophecies.

I'm very impressed by the multitude of diverse beliefs expressed on this thread, and the fact that nobody has attacked anybody else for their views. Way to go!

[Sallyrat]

63. Re: Ralph Reed

I don't have text, but have read in the past that Bush Jr didn't want to make a mistake and turn off the fundies like his dad did, so he hired Ralphie to show him how to talk the talk to win over the right. He is talk only, says what they want to hear but needs their vote. He says one thing, but you notice, he does something entirely different. He has people positioned in every large gathering to promote this propaganda, they pass it along. This is a form of mind control and sooner or later these people will wake up to the fact that they are being used. It is already happening, they know that real Christians don't lie and they have had to hear one lie after another and it won't take much longer for many of them to figure out that they have been duped....mark my word..........

[LDS Jock]

27. Welcome to DU oldlady/jacki

great post

[HFishbine]

30. The "science" of astrology?

I quit reading after the fisrt paragraph.

[RainDog]

49. clarification about astronomy, etc.

astrologers who were the three wise men were Arabic...were they from what is now Iraq? I forget...but they were part of what the Hebrews would have considered "the other" i.e. not Jewish, so the statement that "things were pretty advanced" does not mean that there was lots of intellectual inquiry across the spectrum of any population, especially since all the nations at the time in the area believed it was okay to own and hold slaves and those slaves did not need an education to serve their masters.

There were always scholars of any particular religion, but they were the exception, not the rule.

And you conveniently skip over the fact that after various despots converted to Christianity and then use their power to force conversions among existing populations across western Europe, education was still restricted to a small priestly and aristocratic class who used their power to enforce the repression of populations (i.e. serfs and landowners), and with the ascendancy of Christianity in the west, Europe was plunged into what was called "the dark ages" -- a period in which nothing was allowed as a source of inquiry unless it was sanctioned by the church. so westerners had lots of time to debate how many angels could dance on the head of a pin, for instance.

then, the European Christians decided they also had the right to claim Jerusalem as their own, and with the crusades, the crusaders brought back goods and spices which spurred trade with Arabic people who had preserved their heritage of intellectual inquiry into subjects like math, for instance.

with these exchange of trade, then, also came an exchange of ideas and information, at which point the Renaissance began a slow move away from the power of the church to control and enslave people in western europe by the gradual erosion of their power by exposing the lies behind so many of their "inerrant" beliefs.

This, in turn, led to Martin Luther's questioning of the entire hierarchy of the established church, and led to wars between religious factions, which eventually led to the downfall of the entire system of church and state as one and the same and the doctrine of "the divine right of kings" ...the Englightenment, which led...

to the American and French Revolutions.

And now America is back to wondering how many angels can dance on the head of a pin and a probable head of the Supreme Court of this land who gives a speech called, "god's justice and ours" who calls the Enlightenment a "bad" thing and says that Christians would 'naturally' support the death penalty, for example, and who calls Europe "post Christian," as an insult.

For this reason, among others, Scalia should be impeached, because he does not support the Constitution of this nation, as he himself has said, though he couches it in terms meant to appeal to the facism in Christians in America. Christianity had nothing to say about democracy, and should have no say in democracy today. To say that Christianity is pro-democracy is to be ahistorical.

If you look at the psychological concept of a "self-fulfilling prophecy" -- I think that's what is going on now.

The three monotheisms of the world all share apocalyptic and messianic neurotic belief systems and they are all fighting for control of the same bit of real estate in the world, using those beliefs to justify control.

It might interest Christians to know that the Sadr faction in Iraq also believe in the return of a messiah, and that this messiah is Islamic. Mahdir, as in the name of Sadr militia, is the name for this messiah figure for them.

As long as Americans willfully believe literalist interpretations of a book which has repeatedly shown it is factually incorrect, they will continue to play into the equally irrational beliefs of Islamic extremists, and fail to see the Muslims who are just as dedicated to an Enlightened and self-determining rule of law across nations.

[hang a left]

70. I don't know if I personally would characterize it as trying to

speed things up. I think that he is a false prophet. Dastardly deeds with hidden motives.

[damnyankee]

12. I don't know. We've sort of messed the place up in the meantime.

Who'd want to?

[RichardRay]

13. Not a matter of any consequece

since according to my point of view it makes no difference in how much suffering there is/will be. Just another glowing point in the realm of the dieties, ya know?

[jsw_81]

14. Not me

The Jesus story is, in my view, an obvious myth and I'm not holding my breath for his "return." But if you have any credible evidence that he is indeed coming back I'll be happy to review it.

[RebelOne]

15. In my opinion, he was only a mortal man.

So I can say with all certainty that he will not be returning.

[doni_georgia]

16. well

I personally believe that he will come back, but I do not believe in the "Left Behind" version of events. I kind of have a "it'll all pan out in the end" view of the whole thing. I somehow doubt he's going to show up with flashing lights saying, "Look everyone it's me!" Think it will be more of - he's here and the religious hyprocrits won't recognize it's him - will probably attack him, because he won't agree with them and be on their side. Cause I believe when he comes back it will be to separate the wheat from the chaff amongst his followers.

[Guava Jelly]

17. Humans are Biological machines

When you Die your machine is Broken Period.
There is no Second Chance You arent reincarnated or go to some special place..Because Your Brain.. Natures Harddrive Decays rather Quickly All your thoughts memories not being Held together by a functioning HardDrive Even if they were still stored for a period of time Your Directory / interpreter is toast.
Humans are Animals Hell watch the news We sure act like Them.
I think Just Being good to each other and try to have fun for your days are finite Is really All the religeon one needs.
P.S. If I am Wrong and there is a god then He is not a good nor Caring being.Look at all the evil The entity lets Happen.And why would he let good people die Young..Sorry I used to be a baptist But I refuse to worship a being that would Kill my mother last year, My niece this year,My girls father last Year,My friend Sue of Cancer this year leaving a Husband and two kids ..
Face it I am just Sick of Gods Love !!!!

[Trajan]

18. Jesus, as defined in the material sense ....

was a live being ... an earthly animal ...

As we know: ... ALL earthly, live beings DIE after a short term of existence ....

Given what we know of the life cycles of live, earthly beings: they die eventually, and never come back ....

Whatever one may speculate of eschatological matters: THIS is the known reality: ALL live thing die ....

Until I can be shown irrefutable evidence that spirits, holy ghosts, demons and godly deities ACTUALLY exist: I MUST come to the conclusion that Jesus Christ, if he existed, will NEVER come back ....

[lumpy]

20. The holy war is on the table

and Bush is a self-proclaimed prophet. Will Christ come back? Not in this lifetime. Maybe never.

[Skittles]

21. mopaul - that sig pic

what is it?

[mopaul]

23. i'm glad you asked that question...

...that's Sparky, the dancing DU warthog

[Skittles]

25. I.................I.....................I don't see him

it looks like a Texas prarie following a grass fire. :o

[No2W2004]

22. Just my opinions....

The teachings accredited to him are, for the most part, are a good start for living one's life with humility. It should end there as no one will be "coming back". (I learned this the hard way....I lent a guy named Jesus 20 bucks and he never came back.)

There have already been holy wars fought between christians, muslims, and jews for centuries. The crusades are just one that comes to mind.

There have been great civilizations that have come and gone over the centuries. There is nothing that says ours will be any different. Remember, in comparison, our government is still pretty new. If you want to see where it's headed if things don't change, look up history under "The end of Rome" and "bread and circuses".

As far as the bible goes, very long, hard to read, in the christian version the second part contradicts the first part, lots of killing, pillaging, sex, drinking, ect... but I'd have to switch my brain into "autothink" mode to take it literally. Without the bible though, think of all the cool horror movies we'd never have seen.

If Jesus does come back, I hope he has my 20 bucks.

[LDS Jock]

28. Welcome to DU No2W2004

I hope you get your 20 bucks back soon.

[randr]

24. My views generally confound my Christian friends

but I believe Christ, or someone like him, was one of many others who had the balls to stand up to the HRE. His philosophy, as it has been recorded, is one of humanity and tolerance. A mentality that must have been truly evolutionary in his times. I think he, and many others throughout history, may have had an inner sense of human evolution and concluded that our love and understanding would someday overpower the hate and intolerance. We are constantly moving in that direction and at this time in history the humans of kindness outnumber the idiots to a great degree. Unfortunately the dark side of humanity still has no qualms about killing the "enemy". The compassionate side of humanity will never be able to overcome this force by force alone, as it is not in their nature to settle disputes with conflict.
This compassionate consciousness, or Christ mind, is slowly going to displace the lizard mind as surely as there a so few Neanderthals among us.
The return of Christ is the presence of his kindness in all of our acts.

[Spider Jerusalem]

26. He won't be coming back; he never came in the first place.

The Jesus of the Bible is a fictional character, an amalgam of the personalities of several pagan gods. There WAS someone named "Jesus" in Jerusalem in the 1st century, who claimed to be the Messiah (he gets a one-line mention in Josephus' "Antiquities")...but there were dozens of claimants to that title, in that place and that time, most of them political revolutionaries, and "Jesus" (or, rather, "Yeshua") was as common a name among 1st century Jews as "John" or "William" among 20th century Americans. There exists no evidence for the life, words and deeds of the Biblical Jesus outside of the Bible, and the Biblical accounts disagree with one another to such a great degree that no serious scholar of the history of the period (as opposed to theologians and apologists, whose interest is not historical) accepts them as valid, or accepts that the Jesus they speak of was an actual person.

[HEyHEY]

31. What for?

[orthogonal]

32. Oh, Jesus

My invisible sky ghost can beat up your invisible sky ghost, because your people eat unclean food and pray in the wrong direction!

Since the Christian Bible explicitly instructs Christians that they won't know when Christ is supposed to return, why not relax, forget the eschatology, stop trying to figure out Jesus's timetable, and instead spend your energy trying to live as Jesus lived?

Or as Paul wrote in his epistle to the Romans, (Chapter 8, verses 24-25):
For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

[Nikia]

33. Not sure how things will turn out

It is my understanding from reading the Bible and how things are turning out that yes Bush and company is trying to fullfill Biblical prophecy but they are on a different side than they think that they are on. All mainstream political and religious leaders are on the wrong side. They will bring about all the plagues and disastors and kill and imprision all who oppose them. Some will be done in the name of Christianity, which in that form is a false religion designed to deceive people. All the armies that arrive at the final battle will be destroyed. The main political and religious leaders will be punished, not rewarded. Jesus will then lead the new world in peace.
That's how I see it if it happens in my lifetime. the Bible also says that no one will know when it will happen.
Others say that the book of Revelations is just a metaphor for things that have already happened.
I am not sure. There are things that I have dreamed and felt that make me believe that such things will happen. I will wait though and see what happens and try to live a normal life until then or until I die.

[FlemingsGhost]

34. He never left.

I pity the end-timers who are awaiting fire and brimstone. Too busy pointing their fingers in judgement and projecting their own deluded agenda, to realize and embrace the "second coming." It is the "Christ consciousness" that we are challenged to embrace. The golden thread of truth found in the teachings of all of the earthly prophets.

Ironically, the religious fundamental extremists who have the most to lose from the "awakening," or evolutionary change of consciousness regarding our notion of God and self, are resisting the very event they hold so dear.

Who knows, maybe these folks will find a way to crucify Christ again, just like they did the first time...

[devinsgram]

35. In the year 999

the only place millennium fever burned was in the Christian kingdoms of medieval Europe. Many believed the apocryphal stories that said the first day of the thousandth year after the birth of Christ was the day the world would end. The indebted believed they gained brownie points in heaven by rubbing out the records of moneys owed to them by debtors. Many lenders went so far as to throw away their ledgers and close their businesses. Some of the rich gave away their wealth so they could face God dirt poor. Farmers abandoned their crops and livestock. What need would there be for food, since there would be no tomorrow.

By autumn of 999, millions of the backsliding faithful raised the gain of their prayers and intensified their acts of Christian virtue. They even whipped themselves into a frenzy of penance. Mobs cornered and killed the misfits and purported witches, they hanged tax collectors and a few unlucky rich merchants, and of course they burned a lot Jews in a rush to gain one last bit of good merit before the angel Gabriel blew his horn.

In the final hour of New Year's Eve, Pope Sylvester II led thousands of cowering and kneeling believers in a Mass in Rome's pre-Vatican and ancient St. Peter's Basilica. Eyewitnesses reported that as midnight struck the revelers of revelation didn't exactly mark the new millennium with party hats and shouts of "Happy New Year!" The crowd screamed in terror and several people died of fright that night. Yet January 1, 1000 came and went like any other day. They were astounded. Theologians eventually reasoned that God must have postponed the end of the world until the year 2000.

Do I believe that Christ will return? No, I do not. I believe a man named Jesus roamed the earth as a teacher and prophet, but no more than that. I believe it was a myth that just got told and repeated and got bigger and bigger as it was told over and over and added to.

The only way I would believe it, is if I saw * and all his friends starting to give all their money away, after all he is in the loop.

[VeniceBeat]

36. He Still Owes Me Fifty Bucks

I doubt I'll ever see Him again.

[okieinpain]

37. yeah, he's coming and it's not going to be pretty.

[AndyTiedye]

39. No. If His Followers Bring on Armegeddon, They Fry With The Rest of Us

If there is a God, what use would he have for "followers" like that?

[KharmaTrain]

40. He Was Here In The First Place???

Has someone unearthed a true artifact attributed to one "Jesus Of Nazareth"...or how about a contemporary writing or Roman civil record.

That little "bump" always affects conversations I have with Christians. They're not keen on a Jew-boy who questions.

That's fine, my Jewish friends then get my next question...prove there's a god.

[rdfi-defi]

44. for this thread, the existence of god or jesus is irrelevant.

the fact that there are people who subscribe to a religion that prophoscises, and promotes an apocalypse in which all non-believers will be condemned to eternal suffering, is what needs to be addressed.

the other aspect of this ideology that concerns me is the part that encourages people to be apathetic about their society. while regular people 'relax because god is in control', powerful people scheme and plot. one good example is g.w. bush and the people who tell him what to think. these people could very well trigger the apocalypses (with nuclear war it would be easy) fully expecting jesus to return and reward them. and what if they are wrong? what if they are right, the suffering and human tragedy would be unacceptable either way.

[KharmaTrain]

56. It's Inclusiveness

Many fundamentalist deal in a world of absolutes...they need certainty to exist and the concept of god and fire and brimstone somehow creates a moral fiber where common sense obviously doesn't exist or is allowed to even surface.

The hyprocisies created by organized religions could take years to post, and its implications on our lives in profound. But it's one that we can't wish or "logic" away...just hope to deal with and "progress" forces more people to view their lives without the need of an invisible cloud being.

[Selwynn]

76. His existence or nonexistence has no effect on my beliefs...

That little "bump" always affects conversations I have with non-Christians.

[agincourt]

41. Like a thief in the night,

He'll be back, and he will bring peace. Though he may not have the same name it will be the same deity.

[rdfi-defi]

58. talk about covering all your bases. you might as well say:

god is real and loving and his apocalypse is good because seyficrecvgrvghrefvrfv uerfvourfhvoerw reuwhfhowhf iefgrgbffg ekvkuerhfvwe jlcvnwsqm.

your assertion covers all possible events that result in peace. could you be more specific.

[Az]

42. I am not convinced he was here in the first place

A man named Jesus may lie at the center of Christianity, but I am skeptical of this claim. The absolute lack of contemporary evidence definately suggests that the stories told about him are not true. They also suggest that the stories attributed may be just stories or retelling of stories of other individuals. There may even have been significant individuals that form the bulk of the story behind Jesus.

So coming back is not really one of the things I am expecting. But thats just me.

[dand]

43. how could he come back if he was never here

it is all a fabrication, can you spell control and manipulation, there is NO RECORD of a Jesus anywhere.

[Beam Me Up]

45. MO: Some maintain that "Christ" has already come:

One example:

This trip has been a great agony for me, I have witnessed and documented all of these things, and now I am nearly finished. I will go out into the earth no more. I will make no more appeal to them, for they are not of my Father’s kingdom, but the kingdom of their own making. They rest in peace, and I will leave them there. We all felt that we were the angels visiting Sodom before its final destruction. We did not find five righteous men. All true Sons will flee, for the hour of this earth’s destruction has come.
Source: The Conclusion by Michael Travesser, Nov 28, 2003
From: http://www.apologeticsindex.org/s48.html

PERSONALLY I have a much different take on the matter: Christ, that is an awakened human being, "comes" when one fully embodies those cosmic energies which are our true birthright. The possibility of such an "awakening" is not limited to one religion or another but is inherent in the underlying structure of consciousness itself. The awakening of such a consciousness could be regarded as "apocalyptic" because it sets one's perspective BEYOND HISTORY, indeed, beyond TIME--in the province of "eternity". Eternity understood not as a 'long long time' but as a higher dimension that contains passing time.

Books I recommend for those who are interested:

The Body of Time and the Energies of Being, by Bruce Thomas
The New Man, by Maurice Nicoll

Edit: typos

[seabeyond]

47. i interpret this differently

my feel on it, we all have christ conscious, the coming back of christ is people as a whole awakening to the individual christ conscious and uniting as one in christ

we are the second coming

[caffefwee]

48. Pat Robertson does

He thinks Christ is coming back to make sure Bush wins the election.

[opihimoimoi]

50. Pat "Move the Hurricane" Robertson is Deluded.

do not waste time on him. Poho poi.

[rdfi-defi]

55. robertson may be "deluded"

but he has millions of followers who have tremendous pull on politics in the world. ignore them at our peril

[opihimoimoi]

62. Jesus warned us of the Pharisees

Pat is one of them. Yes he has millions at his beck and call.

But....Nothing is forever, especially greed and selfishness.

[Nikia]

59. I read one of his endtime books

You would think that he would realize that he is on the wrong side when he talks about the evil "New World Order". I know, they are all in on this. If he does really believe in what he preaches though, he really should probably be apolitical.

[Cleita]

51. Not the human Jesus. If there is such a thing as reincarnation,

he may have been reborn many times already. For all we know, MLK or the Dalai Lama could be reincarnations of Jesus if he actually was a real person. I personally believe that the historical Jesus was born from stories about many Jesus-like men at that time. As for a big rapture-like happening end times, I doubt it.

[CabalBuster]

52. As a Muslim, I believe Jesus will come back

To install the ONE religion on earth

[RainDog]

57. sounds so nice and totalitarian

just have to love those monotheisms..

I believe that jesus will come back and tell all the fundamentalists they are full of shit.

that's my statement of faith.

[CabalBuster]

60. Well full of shit....like those who eat pork

That's the reason we are forbidden to eat pork. Pigs feed on their own manure and other pig's waste. So those who eat pork are literally full of it.

[RBHam]

53. Armageddon is a self fulfilling prophecy...

And when you have "the end justifies the means" mentality, and you're in a position of power to influence events, it's a scary scenario.

[Mari333]

61. The concept of the Christos, if people chose to learn about it

is the enlightened one, and could pertain to Buddha or any other figure from Historicaly mythology.
every time we have a millenial change this sort of silliness happens.
Its tiresome, and deadly, because now its shaping foreign policy, and we could all die from it.
I wont let other peoples evangelical delusions kill my children..one is already in Iraq because of this delusionary thinking, and he could die anyday.
I detest people who cant think for themselves, or refuse to look past their bibles and into other concepts of what christos is. Google Adonis, Odin, Tammuz, Osiris, and start connecting the dots.
There are thousands and thousands of fertility gods in mythology.
But this time, we have 3 patriarchal religions fighting amongst themselves, and dooming the world with their absurd and archaic and sickeningly interprated ideas.
No wonder paganism is the fastest growing religion in this country.
I hope its not too late to save the earth from these idiots who read Tim LaHaye and follow the Rev Moons cult.
bring the troops home now
http://www.bringthemhomenow.com
and someone drag Bush out in chains. soon.

[lapauvre]

64. Oh, what I could say about this one

but it would be far too long, and it would probably be removed.

If there is a Jesus, or a God, PLEASE rapture these nutballs up, and let the rest of us have a chance at peace. Please. Or rapture the rest of us up. There are going to be more than 144,000 either way.

I am so sick of ideological bullshit.

[mmonk]

65. Or the resurrection could have been

the carrying on of his movement after the cruxifiction and his example the judge of all.

[DoNotRefill]

66. Who is this "Christ" person....

and why should I care if he comes back? Does he owe me money or something? Even worse, do I owe HIM money???

[mmonk]

67. Nah you don't owe him any money

he was for giving it all away.

[DoNotRefill]

69. sounds like an idiot to me....

eom.

[mmonk]

71. almost unAmerican...

;-)

[DoNotRefill]

72. Freedom of religion....

also means freedom FROM religion...

[Selwynn]

77. No, actually it means freedom of choice....

...for or from.

[MoonRiver]

68. No, but I do believe in the return of the warthogs!

:D

[Citizen Daryl]

73. It's a book. n/t

[King_Crimson]

74. The Battle between Good and Evil...

and Satan is already here. He resides at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue in Washington D.C.! Jesus...if you truly are coming back...do hurry!!

[Selwynn]

75. Christ is coming back, and She is pissed!

Just kiddin...

[vetwife]

78. I do..but that is My Faith and I don't believe Bush's religion is real !

Everyone has a faith or non believers, simply don't believe..their choice. I believe what I believe but I don't buy into the Pharasee's like Bush and bunch trying to play God. God is a God of Love. Nothing like what they represent. I just can't believe when you are dead..that it. And I would hate to think this is all there is.

[BeHereNow]

80. Keppler said:

Energy is neither created nor destroyed, it only
changes form.
You and I are both Christians Vetwife, that is what I gather
from your posts thus far.
You know that the Bible warns of the rise of the false church-
those who are misled by false doctrine. I believe that we are
seeing prophecy fulfilled en masse.
Have you visited this site yet?
http://www.endtimesnetwork.com
Also-
http://www.yuricareport.com
See "The Despoiling of America"
as a Christain it will have great meaning for you.
Ys.I.C.
BHN
PS: In answer to Mopaul, who rocks, YES.
He is coming back. Absolutely. When? Not for me to know.

[progressivebydesign]

79. Jesus is as real as Buddha, Allah, God, VooDoo, Hindu, etc..

Every group has their own supersticions and stories. I have to chuckle at how many Christians think that they have the whole God thing cornered. I find it pretty interesting that when something goes right, say.. a family member comes out of surgery okay, the family said it was because they prayed for it. But how about that guy in the next bed? The one that died? His family was praying? We're they not praying hard enough?

I think it's really nice that people have things that make them feel good in this uncertain world. I'm not big on organized religion.. I think people should just work from the good in their hearts. They don't need 5 million dollar social churches, and Left Behind books, and to talk constantly about how groovy it is to be their particular religion, and how we ALL need to be their religion or we'll burn in hell.

I believe as much that Jesus is coming back to earth as I believe that the Wizard of Oz really got Dorothy back to Kansas. It's a lovely story.. really...

[BonjourUSA]

81. Yes, and he will be born in front of the CNN cameras.