Have we learned nothing from the 2000 election?

[Q]

- I'm beginning to wonder. Democrats are making the same mistakes over again and not preparing for what is surely to come.

- Given the lessons of the 2000 (s)election:

1. The election process will most certainly be 'manipulated' or rigged.

2. The corporate American media will continue to support the corporate Bush* government and character assassinate the Democratic nominee.

3. GOP-controlled states and legislatures will give Bush* their electoral college votes no matter how the people vote.

4. The decidedly partisan Supreme Court will resolve any conflicts in Bush's* favor.

5. The Republican RWingers will send out their paid thugs to intimidate poll workers and create the facade of a 'popular mandate' in front of tv cameras.

- I'd like to know what the Democratic party PLANS to do if 2004 is a repeat of 2000. We KNOW what's coming. Are we prepared?

[freetobegay]

1. Attack of the killer tomatoes!

eom

[Q]

3. Is that an attempt at humor?

- Perhaps we should just blame Nader and not think about the implications of the Bushie GOP pissing on our elections once again?

- We should have learned SOMETHING from the 2000 election. If nothing else...we should have learned that we HAVE to protect civil rights and insist that all votes are counted.

- Another lesson: Republican poll workers and those in power like Harris and Jeb can rig an election in plain sight and get away with it. Remember the purged voters? The 'felon' list that purged legal voters from the rolls?

- What will it take to wake up the Democratic party?

[freetobegay]

7. Lighten up!

What does one do with a tomato when they don't like someone?


P.S. I do remember the purgered voters, I was on it! Did not get it corrected till it was to late!

[Q]

16. I guess I'm one of 'those'...

...who are still pissed off that Democracy was stolen from us in 2000. I find little humor in it...especially when one considers that the same political machinery is still in place to steal it again.

- Also...if you haven't seen it yet...take a look at the documentary 'Unprecedented'.

[drthais]

11. oh MAN

I thought no one else had ever heard of that movie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[murielm99]

15. I have the video.

I have Plan 9 from Outer Space also.

[ixion]

2. nope, I would say not prepared, Q

I think they're basically playing softball with the neocons, which is foolhardy at best.

[Q]

4. Softball would be a good description...

...considering that NO ONE was prosecuted for the outright election fraud in 2000. It's a sad thing to admit that PLAYERS like Harris have actually gone on to better things and been rewarded for helping to STEAL an election.

- Those who call the 2000 election fraud a 'conspiracy theory' are actually helping those who plan on pulling off the same thing in 2004. "It couldn't happen here"...again.

[LynzM]

5. I don't think we are prepared,

And I don't know what to do about it...? I think we need a lot of regular voters to stand up, hang out at polling places and counter any intimidation, track lists of people being removed, conduct independent exit polling, etc., but I don't know how we accomplish all of that. Any ideas?

[bobbieinok]

8. aren't there plans, volunteers signups, etc at BBV web sites???

[Q]

12. To what end?

- There is absolute PROOF that Harris and Jebby boy PURGED legal voters from the Florida voter registration in 2000. There is no comfort in the fact that NOTHING was ever done about it...not even a promise NOT to repeat it.

- Bev Harris and others are doing a great job...but there is no NATIONAL effort by GOPers OR Democrats to make sure 2004 isn't a repeat of 2000.

[connecticut yankee]

6. I think the DNC is making preparations

At the big dinner last month (I forget the exact title) Terry McAuliffe stated that the Dems will have precinct workers everywhere there might be potential problems. I would assume that means Florida.

:kick:

[Q]

13. Watching the polls is a great idea...

...but what are the plans to follow up? What legal measures have been put in place to prosecute fraud, correct problems or count votes that were 'mistakenly' thrown out?

[ewagner]

9. No we are not prepared

First I want to applaud your proactive thinking. We (as Democrats) need to do more of it.

Second, we need to be organized strictly for the purposes of a)getting our vote out and b)maintining security at the polls.

There is no leadership to ORGANIZE such an effort.

I think those are the two key words: Organization and Leadership . Sadly we are missing both of those elements at the moment.

[bryant69]

10. I'm prepared

I've already given up. Given up in advance so to speak. I've been visiting Democratic Underground for quite a while now, and I've realized that there is little to no hope for any democrat (not to mention one as great as John Kerry) to take office.

I was going to spend the summer talking to my friends and telling them about how great John Kerry is and reminding them of the constant failures of the Bush administration; but I can see now, thanks to Democratic Underground, that that would be afutile waste of time. I live in Florida and my leglislature will send the Republican Slate no matter how the vote goes. I guess you could say I've abandoned all hope.

Thank you Democratic Underground for convincing me of the futility of my ways.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Q]

14. Don't equate being aware and prepared with 'giving up'.

- Why is it that when anyone attempts to point out obvious flaws and problems that it's characterized as 'giving up'?

- Isn't it more of a defeatist attitude NOT to be prepared and believe everythings going to be alright despite evidence to the contrary?

- On Edit: you don't seem to remember the Florida state legislature promising their EC votes to Bush* even if Gore won the state and despite of how the electors voted. Are you willing to repeat this history?

[bryant69]

17. You got no solution

The problems you bring up have no solution that I can implement that i can see. I don't own a media conglomerate. I don't control the Supreme Court or our legislature. You propose nothing other than the extremely nubulous "be prepared." That doesn't tell me anything.

So to recap; enormous problems with our electoral system over which I have no control. No solution proposed, nothing I can do to fix this problem.

Why shouldn't I give up?

[Q]

18. You've given up if you haven't...

...at least complained to your Democratic leadership. Ask them why they laid down and allowed the RWingers to walk all over them in 2000. Then ask them why they abandoned the Congressional Black Caucus when they needed ONE Dem Senator to stand up with them and investigate/prosecute civil rights abuses.

- A problem can't be solved until the problem is acknowledged and identified. The problem with the Dem party is not that we don't have a good platform or agenda...it's that the right-leaning leadership is complicit in moving this country in the wrong direction. That is...they've directly enabled the Bushies to break the law, wage aggressive war and drain our treasury to enrich the 'ruling class'.

- Election fraud is only part of the problem.

[bryant69]

19. I have sent them letters

You are all over the map.

Clearly if the Democrats are allowing the right wing to sieze complete control over the mechanisms of power than they are just as guilty as the right wing.

By the way thanks for explaining to me that the Bush's have waged aggresive war and drained the treasury to enrich the wealthy. Having just fallen off the turnip truck this morning, I really wasn't aware of that.

So that's your great solution, eh? A few letters to my congress person and the problem is solved. Great. Maybe I won't give up after all.

[sofa king]

20. There might be room for an ironic twist....

After breaking its own state law and counting absentee ballots without postmarks (many of which were demonstrably sent in my members of the armed forces after it became clear that the 2000 Florida election was too close to call), the Florida legislature re-wrote its election laws to legitimize the practice. There were 680 questionable overseas ballots counted; most of them were military, and are widely believed to be overwhelmingly for Bush. Bush won Florida by 573 votes.

This time around, all absentee ballots from overseas will be considered to be properly postmarked, even if they are marked days late or not at all.

Many of those overseas absentee ballots will be coming from American troops in Iraq. Unless something changes dramatically between now and then, a lot of those people will be enjoying extended stays in a combat zone courtesy of President George Bush.

Interesting, no? The silent coup of the year 2000 could be reversed by the very same people who made it possible.

(There is also a small probability that somewhere, someone signed his own death warrant by illegally returning a late Florida absentee ballot in favor of George Bush. For example, some of the more controversial ballots came from the USS Tarawa, which in 2000 was carrying the 15th Marine Expeditionary Unit. The 15th MEU has since served in combat in both Afghanistan and Iraq. Edit: sorry, I forgot to point out that http://lunaville.org/warcasualties/ByState.aspx">24 Floridians have died in Iraq so far. And please, please do not misunderstand me--I am not gloating over the deaths of our troops. I'm just trying to point out that this election cycle is probably going to be very, very important to the members of our armed forces.)