Anti-Americanism in Canada?

[Canadian_moderate]

Any Americans here who feel that Canadians are a little too harsh on all Americans?

My wife is American. She's a democrat who voted for Gore in the 2000 presidential election. That said, she is very distraught at the anti-American comments she has to deal with on a daily basis. It's really making her question whether she wants to stay in Canada. I honestly can't say I blame her, but I'm not that eager to move to the USA either. We have regular discussions about this issue and it just keeps coming back.

She doesn't like Bush either, but it's really getting to her. Just like America has its ignorant people, there are lots of ignorant people in Canada who make huge generalizations about "those damn Americans". These people often forget to differentiate between the various segments. I often call people up on it when they make stupid comments.

It must be an inferiority complex. Similar to the way the Scots always bitch about the England. My fellow Canadians are getting a little too smug for my liking. Just a few weeks ago, Canada was in the news about the seal hunt. We've got our skeletons too!

[still_one]

1. To be honest

what do you expect your fellow Canadians to do. After 9/11, Canada was one of the first countries to support us in Afganistan, but when they opposed our entry into Iraq this administration became outraged, and listed them with countries that do not deserve to do get any work in Iraq. Canadians gave their lives in Afganistan, and we treated them with scorn.

Frankly, it is not just Canada, but 98% of the rest of the world we is not happy with us.

After 9/11, the whole world was with us. Within 12 months, based on lies and deceit most of the world is against us.

I don't blame the Canadians.

[Eureka]

9. Yeah, Bush* really looks after allies huh?

Australia had the same problem. Aussie SAS were in Iraq days before the US was, we have jumped when required for years and years, then Bush* gives us a free trade deal where the US gets access to our beef market immediately and we get access to the US market in, get this, 18 years!. Oh thats what you expect from your mates, a good old fashioned reaming!

That being said, we have our skeletons too, like our current bunch of facists is using the same tricks against all mighty East Timor.

If people are putting down your country and they are wrong, give them facts to shut them up. If people are putting down your country and they are right, maybe do something to fix up the country. I think everyone should be able to accept fair criticism, but maybe Bush* has made too many criticisms fair?

[rockymountaindem]

2. There is some anti-Americanism here

I was surprised. I'm a student at U of T, born in Colorado. I was quite surprised at the level of anti-Americanism here. I mean, we have our little jokes about Canada, bt it's all in good fun. Some of this Canadian stuff is a little hard-core. The other day one of my friends here said something about how the whole world should just nuke the US. I didn't appreciate that to say the least. Sometimes it gets unfriendly. I thought we were all friends...

[still_one]

4. You can blame it on the bush administration

when the bush administration LIES to the world about Iraq, unilaterally gets out of the ABM treaty with the Russians, gets out of the Kyoto agreement, stops funding for any U.N. programs that support birth control, makes it clear that it is the duty of the U.S. to "free" the peoples of the world, and implies that God has chosen him to do so, what do you expect?

[Canadian_moderate]

8. That's my whole point

It goes much deeper than disagreeing with the USA about foreign policy. Canadians make ignorant comments about Americans being rednecks, while Canada has more than its fair share.

I personally love America in many ways. I disagree with the lack of universal healthcare and the high tuition costs, among many other things, but regardless of that, I think of the USA as a great country that has much to offer. Unfortunately, the USA is becoming a country of greater extremes and greater division, especially in politics.

While Canada has many things to be proud of, we have our issues as well. Separatism, lack of unity, short summers and long winters, increasingly longer healthcare waiting lists, the f*cking queen of England as head of state, crumbling inner cities (really!), etc. Let's not be too smug and at least be good Americans to those who share most of our values.

My wife is finding the hostility very hard to accept. Although she's no fan of GWB, she is still a proud American, and rightfully so.

[still_one]

10. Hey, if you are so upset with Canada come over here

bush would love you to join the army

[Canadian_moderate]

11. Funny, but that wasn't my point.

I'd rather live in Canada right now. In fact, I've told my wife I will not move to the USA under the current circumstances (post 9-11 BS going down). If I were live in the USA, it would defintely have to in a liberal area.

I feel that my fellow Canadians should be a little more considerate of Americans who choose to live here. Sure, if a republican starts making blatant politics comments, he/she is fair game, but don't brush all Americans with one stroke. Many Canadians forget to realize how the USA is also a very diverse country.

[ngGale]

3. Tell her to stay in Canada it's for her own good...

hell, I'd go there if I could. I've seen this coming, I have Canadian friends. We in the U.S. are ticking off our closest neighbor. I'm sure Bushco doesn't care.

[American Renaissance]

5. as an American living in Canada,

I would say it is mostly reactionary to the Anti-Civilization stance taken by the Bush administration.

It doesn't really bother me, but i have lived here for 20 years so maybe I am not as sensitive to it.

[Egalitarian]

6. The root problem here is nationalism

Why the need to identify with your country?

That being said, I'll trade you my citizenship for yours, eh?

[2Design]

7. stay in canada

CAnada opposed Bush war. Made good sense to many of us to oppose it. AMericans have bashed any country that didn't support it. Remember Bush said either you are with us or against us.

Remember Freedom Fries. All the French bashing because they opposed Bush war.

So canadians I am sure are just standing up for themselves against what they perceived as Canadian Bashing.

As far as staying in Canada, many are thinking of moving there if we fail to get this right wing nuts out of government offices, school boards, local and state governments.

Canada appears to be a lot more supportive to its citizens and not as readily war mongers.

She is taking the heat for our appointed president and his friends nastiness, beligerent attitudes......

[Djinn]

12. God I HATE that term

we get it thrown around here alot - anything one says about US Foreign Policy makes you "Anti-American"

I'd say it's one of two things...either your wife is over sensitive and she's taking legit criticism of the US as "anti-americanism" eg:

The fact that the US is a rich developed nation with no public health care is f**ked

The fact that getting a decent tertiary education is prohibitavely expensive is f**ked

The fact that there was barely a peep of protest at the theft of the last federal election is f**ked

That hardly anyone votes is f**ked

The MASSIVE influence of corporations on government (as manifested by loobbyists becoming heads of government depts, that the truth about GMO's is almost unknown in wider US) is f**ked

Those things are not "anti-americanism" they are facts.

OR people she see's may be ignorant ie they say things like

"all American's are stupid" including Noam Chomsky?
"all American's are fat" including the cast of the unlamented Friends?
"all American's are war mongers" including the millions that protested against the most recent one?

Some people are ignorant - tell your wife to ignore them - much as you would ignore some American idiot telling you that "all Canadians are...." (not really up to date on the Canadian social stereotypes) and if they're not just pig-shit stupid engage them, ask their opinions on FDR and Eleanor Roosevelt, Chomsky, Greg Palast, The Bill of Rights, the copious political forums based in the US (more than most nations have so obviously not ALL Americans are tuned out from politics) New York City, Popular Culture etc etc etc

[HEyHEY]

13. I think it's a superiority complex

It's an attitude that Canadians are so much better, not that we feel lesser and lash out.

[bigbillhaywood]

14. Hey, we're the most powerful imperial power on the globe

along with that comes the hatred of every other nation on the globe. It's to be expected. Hell, I'm American and sometimes I hate Americans. Shit happens. Canada's okay by me, except for your funny spelling, arctic jet stream, and sorry excuse for bacon. And in my humble opinion, the Quebecoise are the most beautiful women in the world (of course, I haven't seen much of the world).

[HEyHEY]

15. Dude, Quebec women rule

When I lived there, my other English buddy used to say, "If the other guys in this county knew about these girls....they'd all be here."

I'd move back, but there just isn't any ocean....gotta have my ocean.

RE: BAcon...What's the matter, you don't like fried lard?

[Senjutsu]

16. Re: The Bacon

Common misunderstanding. What Americans term "Canadian Bacon" isn't what we we call bacon here (what we call bacon is exactly what you would call bacon). What American's (for whatever strange reason) call Canadian Bacon, is properly called peameal, or more colloquially Back Bacon.

[Sufi Marmot]

17. Another American living in Canada...

I'm here temporarily, not entirely of my own volition (strange work situation, but I'm not complaining, I like it here...)

I find that most Canadians harbor some issues about America, but the vast majority of them are too civil/polite to throw it in your face, especially if they know you oppose the policies of the Bush Administration. (I wear my politics on my sleeve up here, so everyone knows where I stand - I'm told I was unbearable at work for a few weeks after November 2000...) I tend to get more sympathy than anti-American grief.

A lot of my friends/colleages just don't understand the current cultural schism that exists in America right now, and they are genuiunely mystified by the religious right, the gun culture, the lack of universal health coverage. I often get into conversations that start: "I don't understand why in America...".

On the other hand, I have several good Canadian friends of whom I am very fond who are socially conservative, pro-life Christians (although not bible-thumping fundamentalists). They're very decent people and I'm very pleased to know them. They don't inflict their religion on anyone else, they just follow their conscience and live according to their own values. Would that more American Christians followed their example.

Since Canadians are, on the whole, a society tolerant of differences, whenever I do get into a heated political discussion with my Canadian acquaintances, I just try to explain to them that within American society there are significant differences of opinion about the direction in which our society should be headed, and I just ask them to be patient with us.

-SM

[ConcernedCanuk]

18. "Canadians are, on the whole, a society tolerant of differences"

.
.
.

There ya go, you nailed it.

Alot of people, especially those that are of the "Boosh" mentality, believe "you are with us - or against us".

There is no "grey" area to alot of Americans, more-so than us Canuks.

We can be "different" and that doesn't make the "other' guy "wrong".

Canuks saw no threat from Iraq,

The USA with all it's "intelligence" failed to turn up ONE solid piece of evidence,

STILL HAVEN'T

just alot of innuendo and hoopla, that for some reason alot of the American people bought, and still do.

Just cuz we call the Murikkan pResident a MORON, doesn't mean we hate Americans,

It means we think the pResident is a MORON, that's all.

But yeah, we DO blame a few of the voters . . .

But that doesn't mean we hate them

Should we? :shrug:

[carolinayellowdog]

19. Preemptive war doctrine makes USA the scariest of neighbors

Hey,

I went to Canada twice last summer and hope to return soon, but was visiting friends in the country and had little contact with the general public. Saw or heard no anti-Americanism but can hardly blame Canadians for it. No one has more to fear from the preemptive war doctrine than Canada and Mexico.

CYD

[mmonk]

20. Actually

I don't see any Americans buying into an invasion of Canada or Mexico. bush supporters may be extremists sometimes, but I couldn't picture that.

[AntiCoup2K4]

23. It could happen.

Canada has oil. Also, by invading Canada, Junior would eliminate the easy option for draft dodgers. Hell, at this point it would be better for Canada to invade the former United States.

[qb]

21. Bush & the Neocons' bloody & self-serving agenda is American policy

after all. They are murdering innocents and telling the rest of the world to fuck off, all in the name of America. Anti-American sentiments are completely understandable. As an American, I don't take these comments personally, because I agree with the reasoning behind them.

[Spazito]

22. The majority of Canadians aren't anti-american, they are...

anti-bush. All the polls taken show this. We are neighbours and are alarmed by what is happening. Any of the discussions I have or hear are about bush and his cabal and what they are doing to their own country.

[Canadian_moderate]

24. I realize this, but unfortunately

many Canadians are not clearly differentiating between hating Bush and hating Americans.

I'm Canadian and I also hate Bush. I actually hate his policies more than the man himself (I think he's severely in ofver his head and misguided).

What I see is my wife, who is a progressive and liberal American, continually being upset at how my fellow Canadians tend to label all Americans. I know Bush is the reason and I tell her that, but it does tend to wear on her.

[SidDithers]

25. You're doing the same thing you're accusing other Canadians of doing...

that being, painting with too broad a brush.

Some Canadians probably are anti-American, just as some are pro-American and some really don't pay any attention at all. However, you said:

"What I see is my wife, who is a progressive and liberal American, continually being upset at how my fellow Canadians tend to label all Americans. "

Surely, you mean how SOME Canadians tend to label all Americans.

I'm not going to apologize for or defend how SOME Canadians feel and choose to express their feelings. There are idiots everywhere. However, to say that Canadians, in general, are anti-American and are rude about it, is wrong.

Sid

[Canadian_moderate]

26. Fair enough

I stand corrected. It is some Canadians who generalize about all Americans, but the number seems to be rapidly increasing and I do realize why this is. I don't recall this being a major problem when Clinton was president.

In Canada it seems to be politically incorrect to criticize any country other than the USA. If we're going to criticize, let's be fair and also criticize others.

[Spazito]

27. That is an unfair criticism, in itself,...

Canadians aren't keen on Blair either, you keep saying Canadians are criticizing the US and are anti-american but can only site your wife's incidences. The polls say you are wrong in your conclusions. If you do a search, you will find most articles criticize the leaders of countries, Blair and Bush, as opposed to criticizing only the US. I am sorry your wife has had unfortunate contacts but to base your judgment of Canada on one person's experience is not a fair judgment.

[Canadian_moderate]

29. Reality check

If you think she is alone, you're kidding yourself. I have spoken to other moderate and liberal Americans that also find it very tough to deal with at times. The way I see it is that these people (liberals and moderates) are our friends, let's welcome them with open arms rather than make them feel like shit about every aspect of America.

As for Tony Blair, I think most Canadians do not despise the man the way they despise GWB. I also would not lump Blair in the same catagory as Bush. Blair is a social-democrat who happens to back the war in Iraq. Bush is a neo-conservative who has lead this misguided war.

[Spazito]

30. I hope I am wrong but I am beginning to get the sense...

that you just simply dislike Canada and, no matter how one may disagree with you, you site no examples and use your response to make another slam at Canada and Canadians. I respect your right to continue and will just say I disagree with you but, please, continue to slam Canada if you must.

[Canadian_moderate]

36. WTF? I love Canada

however, I would prefer it if Canadians would focus on what makes Canada great rather than simply saying we're different from Americans. How is that slamming Canada?

I much prefer Canada's universal health care, reasonable social programs, liberal and progressive laws, better subsidized post-secondary education, etc, etc. That said, Canada needs more self confidence and self-esteem.

Many of us bitch about Americans, however, we trip all over ourselves when an important American or a big celebrity comes to town. It's embarrasing at times and it's not cool.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

39. I don't recall this being a major problem when Clinton was president

I think you just answered your own question, then.

[wadestock]

28. Yeah Canada for calling a spade a spade

Look at the face of America as you drive in your car .....

The people here are becoming more arrogant and ignorant by the day.
The right wing Reaganite machine has gained control and brought forth a real decadence in this society. Credit quite a bit of the arrogance and ignorance to Mr. Limbaugh too....

I'm 51 and I can remember a time when the face of America was quite different. I use the "driving in your car" analogy because my brother loves that. Are you old enough to remember a time when a 70 year old man didn't pull out and cut you off within an inch of your life when he has absolutely no place to go but the local 7/11 to buy a lottery ticket in hopes of winning 10 million?

Canada is right...what else can you say?
The worse thing about us is the right wing Reaganite psycho religious ideal that we are "good" and others are "evil". That caps it all.

We should be profoundly ashamed of ourselves for not leading the world in energy conservation, alternate energy sources, health care and research and a host of other decent things. Then we could truly say that our form of runaway capitalism actually is working.

We all know....it ain't.

[trof]

31. Say it ain't so.

Going to Vernon BC for a wedding in July.
Should I take a flak jacket?
damn

[Spazito]

34. ROFLMAO, noooo, but bring some sunscreen!

and, if you like wine, be sure to make a tour of the vineyards in the Okanagan, it is amazing how those small samples can add up!

[Screaming Lord Byron]

32. 'Similar to the way the Scots always bitch about the England.'

You might want to read some history on that relationship before making that analogy.

[Canadian_moderate]

37. I know British history

Time for the Scots to get over it. ;o)

Like Canada and the USA, they're more similar than they realize.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

42. Not very well it seems.

'Similar to the way the Scots always bitch about the England.'
For a start, that's a bullshit assertion, and I'd like to see you back it up. I'd also point out that the relationship between Scots and English is pretty good, and mutual teasing goes on all the time. You, clearly are only looking on one side of the fence. Believe me, the Scots and the English trade 'insults' and barbs often.
Besides, considering the fact that the English invaded Scotland at least a dozen times over five centuries, evicted an entire culture from the Highlands, attempted at least five times to absorb Scotland ito England by force, executed hundreds of Scottish patriots and ravaged the Scottish lowlands over and over, I'd say our current relationship is pretty good.
As an aside, I will point out that the Scots are also guilty of major crimes against England, both sides giving as good as they got.
As a Scot myself, and a Nationalist, I myself am the biggest Anglophile around. I love the English, and you'd be surprised at how many Scots, joking aside, share that view.

[Canadian_moderate]

47. Sorry I touched a nerve.

I was only kidding. I have many Scottish friends here in Toronto. There are a few recent expats on my soccer (football) team.

They're good guys, but when it comes to football its ABE (anybody but England), even Argentina or Germany.

It's not so much a deep-rooted hatred as it is a resentment, I suspect.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

48. You see, the problem here is that you're making huge generalizations

to back up your point. You believe your wife has experienced incidents of 'anti-americanism' and you apply these traits to a whole nation. How do you expect people to react then?

[Canadian_moderate]

51. I admit my guilt

however, I did indicate I was kidding. That said, I find the resentment among many of my fellow Canadians exhibit towards "Americans" similar to the resentment many Scots exhibit towards the English.

If it makes you feel better, I happen to like both England and Scotland. Wales is a nice place as well. My ex-gf was a limey from the Midlands (Stoke-on-Trent) and we visited the UK on a few occasions. My favourite region is still the Cottswolds. I love the countryside pubs and the beautiful villages and countryside there.

[Joanne98]

33. Tell her to get a tee-shirt that says, "I hate Bush too."

And for God's sake don't move back here. I was just watching that snake Pat Robertson on TV today bitching about the supreme court. (They turned down a football prayer case) He says the next President will get to appoint 2 or 3 justices. He was telling his kool-aid drinking cult followers how important it is for Booooosh to win. These fucking fundies are a HUGH problem down here. Start telling Canadians to keep on the lookout for them STARTING RIGHT NOW. You know they're sneaking around up there trying to take root. If they get control of this country I'M LEAVING. x(

[trof]

35. My T shirt for Canada trip:

"If you can't say anything nice about George W. Bush...


sit next to me."

[Canadian_moderate]

38. I love to bash Bush with the best of them

The difference is how people communicate. People need to use facts and knowledge, not make ignorant and immature comments.

[Lisa]

68. I love it!

Though you might want to be careful about wearing it when you go through Customs on the way home. One merchant in my town claimed that some American visitors had bought his "Moron" T-shirts (highlighted with a tasteful photo of GWB) and the garments were confiscated.


Hope you enjoy your visit!

[Frederic Bastiat]

40. Well they burn the American flag here in Montreal

Does that count? :-)

(American married to a Québécoise)

[Iceburg]

52. and the Canadian flag ....

while the loyalists like to burn the Quebec flag. It's all rather untasteful but relax America ... Canadians still feel free to speak and "that's a good thing".

[LeahMira]

41. She will hear the same thing here...

... from many people who live here but were born in another country. It happened recently that within the space of a single week two people who were born in Germany were telling me how much better things are in Germany than in the U.S.

Part of me wondered why these people stayed here, since they would have it so much better in Germany and since neither had chosen to become U.S. citizens and to commit to working with the rest of us to improve the situation here. Another part of me realized that we in the U.S. only imagine this to be the best country in the world.

There are few real advantages to living in the U.S. right now. For me, it's home. It's where family and friends are, and it's where I've planted my vegetable garden and buried my parents. I have a lifetime of ties that hold me to this land, but none of those ties convince me that this is the best country. It's just where I happened to be born.

[adriennel]

43. anti-canadian sentiments in u.s.

I thought this post was interesting, because there is a fair amount of anti-Canadian sentiment held by those in the U.S., you know, those crazy non-violent universal health care-lovin' Canadians!
I live about an hour from Detroit, there's lots of traffic over the border, and on a local level, Canadians and Americans get along fabulously!

[Canadian_moderate]

45. I agree

There are some serious misconceptions that Americans have about Canadians as well.

I find it interesting that we are labelled as "socialists" for having universal healthcare, yet Canada has prospering free enterprise and there is also a huge gap between the rich and the poor (and it is widening).

[Minstrel Boy]

44. "It must be an inferiority complex"

Or maybe, we hate them for their freedom? :shrug:

Perhaps you and I travel in different circles, but no one of my aquaintance has an inferiority complex regarding the United States. Rather, there's a palpable sense of relief we reside on this side of the border. Our economy is healthier, our health care more equitable, our society more just and our laws more progressive. And none of this makes me anti-American. Neither am I anti-Zimbabwean, anti-Chilean, anti-Hungarian....

Agree? Or is that too smug for your liking?

[Screaming Lord Byron]

46. I think there's a neo-con attitude that any criticism is 'anti-american'

and that's a little too close to 'un-american' for me.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

54. It's because the RW think they and they alone are America

And the opposition is some kind of alien mutant horde sent by Satan.

Even here in Brazil I've seen a few (VERY few thankfully) people reacting to statements like this:

A: Bush sucks. I hope Kerry wins.
B: You are anti-American.

D'oh. Kerry and the other Democrats are what, Nepalese?

[Canadian_moderate]

49. Given your avatar

you're a little further left than I am.

I agree with you on most aspects, except maybe the economy. Regional disparity is quite severe in Canada. I'm lucky in Toronto, but there are many places that have little or no economy.

I also think that Canada has an democratic deficit. We need a Canadian head of state (elected, not a monarchy), an elected senate, representation by population (rather than the archaic British parliamentary system) and less partisanship amoung the parties (MP/MPP's shouldn't be forced/coersed to tow the line, as they often do).

[HEyHEY]

50. Well, I agree Minstrel I'm sick of people saying that

On a Personal level, do you feel inferior to an arrogant bully during everyday life? I don't.

It's a cop-out, an easy way to make themselves feel better because they have the true complex.

We have a far better social structure and are loved around the world....why the FUCK should we feel inferior?

Disclaimer
I don't feel this way towards Americans.... only towards the Bush types

[Minstrel Boy]

53. It's typically the bullies who have inferiority issues.

And the bullying is the same in the US, where progressives are told they must hate their country if they don't agree with the repressive measures of the state. It's a bullshit tactic to stifle dissent.

[Canadian_moderate]

55. Yes, Canadians may be liked around the world

Loved is a strong term to use for a people that many people around the world often confuse with Americans.

Canada is pretty low on the radar and the rest of the world is not all that aware of us. I've spent a lot of time in Europe and I barely saw any references to Canada in the news. There are some, but you have to pretty much find them.

I was born in the Netherlands and I know that the Dutch love Canadians, but most Dutch people are pretty uneducated when it comes to Canada. We're not a big influence in this world. Not as much as we think we are. I would love to see that change.

For starters, Canada needs more people and our climate doesn't help us achieve this. We are hugely underpopulated in many areas and many of our rural communities and small cities are dying.

[Canadian_moderate]

56. HeyHey posted this in another thread

http://www.macleans.ca/switchboard/essay/article.jsp?content=20040503_79671_79671

I think it's pretty much on the money. Sorry to all those Canadians who don't see a problem here.

I don't think we should follow Bush's decisions, but were not really doing much to stop our slide into irrelevancy.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

57. Very well, what is your alternative? What would you like to see us doing?

What is your prescription for our supposed bad attitude 'and slide into irrelevancy'?

[Canadian_moderate]

59. Less preaching for a start

Deeds speak louder than words.

Our country is totally tied to the USA in many ways, especially economically. Canada needs to diversify and seek more trading partners. We need to lead instead of follow.

While I was and am against the war in Iraq, the actions of our politicians were not always honourable. The word pettiness comes to mind. I know Bush is also petty, but we should be above that.

I Canada needs to define itself, it should be based on actions other than just opposing the USA. Our pride should be based on our achievements, not based on how we differ from Americans.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

60. In the case of the Iraq War.

Would you consider Canada's refusal to join the 'coalition of the willing' a negative anti-american act, or a positive pluralistic act?

[Canadian_moderate]

62. A positive act/decision

However, the way some of our politicians lacked diplomacy was embarrassing.

[Screaming Lord Byron]

64. I don't recall. What, about the way they dealt with it bothered you?

[Canadian_moderate]

67. Lack of diplomacy and maturity

Everyone knows Bush is a mental midget, but no need to piss off the country on which our country relies in many ways. We should have been above Bush's pettiness. Diplomacy is always a priority. Not to sell out, but strictly for respect.

Sure, the decision against the war in Iraq was just, but the way the PMO's office head staffer (Francine Ducros? - "Bush is a moron") and others (various MP's and other politicians) dropped insults and created aggrevated relations was sad.

I realize Bush and Chretien never liked each other from day one, but our top politician should be above pettiness.

[Neecy]

58. it's a mixed bag...

I worked for a Canadian company through three American administrations (Reagan, Bush I, Clinton) and spent a considerable amount of time in Canada.

I think the problems emerge when we have a jingoistic, flag-waving right-wing administration in charge here, because those qualities seem irksome to Canadians. Canadians certainly love their country, but they aren't compelled toward macho braggadocio, sabre-rattling and "USA"-style chanters.

Sometimes the animosity could be abrasive. I took a lot of heat during the Reagan administration, despite my repeated assurances that I hadn't voted for him and disagreed with almost everything he stood for. This didn't stop the rather constant stream of criticism, even for things as minor as American 'hero worship' demonstrated by our penchant for putting former presidents on our currency. Really, it got ridiculous. Intestestingly enough, possibly because I spent most of my time in Vancouver, this animosity stopped entirely when Clinton was elected. I can only imagine that it's probably peaked now to an all-time high with the current right-wing oaf in office.

Having said all of that, I have nothing but the highest regard for Canada and its people. They have an entirely different outlike than Americans (which most people don't understand, since we share a border and one official language) and I found them on the whole to be more simpatico than many of my own countrymen, the ones who elected Reagan twice and who very well may put the most dangerous man in the world back in office in November.

I still, however, don't get curling :)

[Skittles]

61. I am disappointed in your wife

as a liberal living in Texas I would advise her to stop being a wuss and FIGHT BACK. Let Canadians know we are not all Bush-worshiping idiot assholes here!

[Canadian_moderate]

63. I've told her to be more assertive

By nature, she likes to avoid conflicts. However, she has started to become more assertive.

[HGSpectre]

65. Some thoughts

Very interesting discussion and I'm sorry to hear that your wife's experiences cause her discomfort. A non-confrontational "As an American, I don't really think it's fair when people use sweeping generalizations about people" would at least make them think (hopefully) about their comments.

This is also not an isolated situation by any means. I forget where but I recently read an article on Americans living in France having the same difficulties. Then again, look at some of the very public expressions of the American view when it comes to "The French". Cheese-eating surrender-monkeys?

Individual vs. collective identities will always collide when it comes to hot-button subjects. Perhaps in the case of America it is more common because the word "American" doesn't just refer to nationality, it represents a way of life - one that is continually being portrayed as the ultimate ideal all others should strive to imitate.

[Claire Beth]

66. the shrub's fault! he has the whole world hating us! n/t

[BillZBubb]

69. Tell your wife it's even harder being a liberal in most of USA.

I'll guarantee we lefties take a lot more crap here than anything she has to put up with there--especially those of us in the Red (neck) states.

Tell her to count her blessings and wait until Bush* has faded into oblivion.

[walmartsucks]

70. Well, there is the one small detail

If it weren't for the U.S. having such a large military in North America, coupled with the fact that we would never let any country invade Canada or Mexico (except us, of course) Canada would have to spend a lot more on national defense and their military, thereby reducing the amount available for domestic programs. Essentially the U.S. is Canada's national defense.

[Malva Zebrina]

71. Sure--Mexico and Canada are weak leeches off the great military might of

the US. <sarcasm> They should get down on their knees and adore us and pay homage to us for all that we sacrifice for them to keep them safe.

Meanwhile our country is becoming more and more like serial killers and murderers -- ruthless , lying barbarians who attack and invade a soverign country by lies, under an insane man , George Bush, and Canada and Mexico has refused to support the war in Iraq. They are not a part of the willing They are, imo, far more civilized than we are under Bush.

Bravo to them

And Bush will try to "punish" them for not joining him in his greedy quest. But he cannot, of course.

[walmartsucks]

72. That's not what I meant

Simply making the point that there really is no reason for anti-Americanism in Canada. Canada and the U.S. share the largest non-militarized border in the world. And no, border guards don't count. I've made several trips across the U.S.-Canada border on I-5 in Washington state, although none recently. I can think of nothing America has done to Canada to warrant any ill will. The two countries may have occasional minor disagreements, but they have been nothing more than that. It would be similar to anti-Canadian sentiment in the U.S. for Canada importing prescription drugs into the U.S., which would be just as silly as anti-Americanism in Canada.

[Iceburg]

74. I dare say ... littleman-walmartsucks .. "you" would not

be welcome in Canada or any other nation outside the US.
Most Canadians can make the distinction between the people and the administration. However, if b*sh gets back in for a second term the lines of distinction will be blurred.

PS walmart. Give DU a donation and get back to class...

[Minstrel Boy]

76. "Essentially the U.S. is Canada's national defense"

Total bullshit.

Canada's only threat is its predatory neighbour to the south.

Can you name the only country to have invaded Canada? And more than once, at that?

Ever heard of Laura Secord? Do you know why she's a Canadian hero?

James Secord, of the 1st. Lincoln Militia, was badly wounded in the Queenston battle 13 October 1812. The following May, Queenston was again invaded by Americans and this time they took the area. All Canadian men over 18 were marched off as prisoners of war, but James was allowed to remain in his home due to his wounds. Three American officers lodged with James and his wife, Laura Ingersoll Secord. Some months later, Laura overheard the Americans planning a surprise attack on the Canadian forces under FitzGibbons at Beaverdams.

Laura decided she had to get word to FitzGibbons of the planned attack, and set out at four in the morning to walk the 32 kilometres to the Decew house where FitzGibbons was staying. She told the American sentry she was going to St. David's to visit her sick brother, and after briefly stopping there, she continued on the Old Swamp Road into Black Swamp. She could not go by the main road and was forced to go through the swamp in the mid day heat, watching for rattlesnakes and wolves. By noon she had left the swamp and was ready to cross Ten Mile Creek before climing "The Mountain" , the name given to the Niagara Escarpment. When Laura finally reached the top of the mountain after an 18 hour ordeal, she was exhausted and lost. Stumbling through the woods into a clearing she was surrounded by Mohawks and Caughnawagas, loyal Six Nations allies. Laura pursuaded the warriors to take her to FitzGibbon. FitzGibbon was amazed at the 38 year old woman's tenacity and later wrote:

"Mrs. Secord arrived at my Station about sunset of an excessively warm day, after having walked about twelve miles which I at the time thought was an exertion which a person of her slender frame and delicate appearance was unequal to make."

With Laura's warning, the Canadian forces were prepared and when the Americans arrived, 50 soldiers and 200 warriors stood ready. All but 6 of the American soldiers were captured and their attempt to control the Niagara Peninsula ended.
http://www.rootsweb.com/~canmil/1812/bios/laura.htm

From the song "Secord's Warning":

So all you Yankee soldier lads who dare to cross our border
Thinking to save us from ourselves
Usurping British order
There's women and men Canadians all
Of every rank and station
To stand on guard and keep us free
From Yankee domination!

[Nadienne]

73. For the record, I am not

Canadian, but I often daydream about being there.

I don't know what kind of anti-American comments and criticisms were said to/around your wife, but even if I did know, it would be condescending of me to tell her how she ought to react.

But perhaps if you remind her that she is proof that not all Americans are bad...

:)

[Canadian_moderate]

78. I do remind her everyday

that people are just generlizing and are really slagging Bush & co. and the people that vote for them.

Ther problem is that you rarely hear Canadians say good things about the USA. I realize you have a lot of problems right now, but the USA and its people still have some good qualities.

Just make sure you bounce Chimpboy out on his ass so that it does not degrade further.

[Nadienne]

79. Will Do My Part

:)

[Walt Starr]

75. Honestly, I don't think Canada is harsh enough on the U.S.!

I can understand it though. Canada is to the United States in 2004 pretty much what Belgium was to Germany in 1936.

[Iceburg]

77. Talking to Amercians

You'll need a REAL player
http://media.cbc.ca:8080/ramgen/radio/programs/thismorning/audio/tm_mercer010330.rm

Rick Mercer talks to Bush about Prime Minister Poutine
Goto 11:50 minutes on the clip

We really do love Americans (because "this Administration" has kept our comedians gainfully employed). We hate the Americans because "this Administration" has taken the spot light off our own politicians and failings.

[charlie]

80. That guy

gets a crate of beer and dinner of his choosing from me, if I ever meet him :) :thumbsup:

[fudge stripe cookays]

81. Move to Alberta if you're not there already.

They are not as accusatory of the USA as perhaps the other provinces.

Some of them were downright sympathetic with Bush (my in-laws yet! Yuck!); others were more moderate. They realized that not all Americans are idiots. I think perhaps it's the constant back and forth of the oil industry folks between Alberta and Texas.

I was treated wonderfully at the conference in Calgary I attended. Especially when I told them I was working on the Dean campaign and busting butt to get Bush out. They were really friendly and wanted more information and gave me attagirls.

Perhaps your wife could get involved with expatriate Democrat groups. It would help her feel like she's doing something even though she's abroad, and it could help her deflect the criticism a bit. ("Well not all of us are idiots. Some of us are working for change. For instance, I'm doing...blah blah blah....") It really does work.

We can't end the insults and thoughtless comments, but we can show people that we're not ready to go down without a fight. Right? Tell her to chin up. We're all in this together, no matter where we are.