Pelosi fusses at McDermott for omitting words in pledge.

[madfloridian]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-4036722,00.html

WASHINGTON - In an unusual public reprimand, House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi chastised Rep. Jim McDermott of Washington on Thursday for omitting the words "under God" while leading the House in reciting the Pledge of Allegiance.

"All House Democrats expect the Pledge of Allegiance to be delivered as it is written with the phrase 'under God' and with respect for the pledge," said Pelosi, adding that she summoned McDermott to her office on Wednesday to express her displeasure privately.

It is unusual for the leader of a political party to publicly chastise a member of their own rank-and-file, but Pelosi spoke bluntly. "What I am saying to you is, I completely disagree with that presentation. I have made my view and the view of the House Democrats known to Congressman McDermott, and I don't think you will ever see again a presentation on the floor that will exclude the words "under God," the California Democrat said...."

SNIP..."Several hours after he did so, Rep. Pete Sessions, R-Texas, stood on the floor and accused McDermott of ``embarrassing the House and disparaging the majority of Americans who share the values expressed in the pledge.''...."END SNIP

Let's not offend those Republicans. Fall in line.

[BlueEyedSon]

1. Oh, Nancy.. WTF are you doing?

Let's get god out of our govt.

[Renew Deal]

30. She is doing the right thing.

The dems don't want or need this fight. It's not worth it. There are other ways to fight the fundies.

[krkaufman]

62. Time and a place for everything...

... and NOW is not the time to make "under Dog" in the pledge an issue.

The focus needs to remain on Bush's failed policies, and his inability to consider alternate solutions.

[Redleg]

66. I agree.

I personally prefer the pledge without "under God" but I don't really give a hoot about it all that much as long as the government cannot force people to say "under God." We have bigger fish to fry. Nancy did right by chastising McDermott. Of course that won't shut-up the Freepers.

[Az]

68. If it won't shut them up

then what the heck purpose did it serve? Who is she trying to appeal to? The repukes or the dems? If those that would raise a stink about the under god issue are already set against us and wouldn't vote for Kerry unless god descended from on high and told them to, then who the heck is she trying to appeal to?

[Redleg]

72. Try to realize that not all Dems share your opinions about the pledge.

I don't know who Nancy Pelosi is trying to appeal to. Perhaps she realizes the "under God" issue is a no-win thing and that we should forget about it for now.

[Az]

73. I understand that fully

And while trying not to be too dramatic I have to wonder how much longer we have to stay in the back of the bus.

Yes. Some Democrats do not believe that the phrase should be removed. But the nature of society is that we are constantly pressing forward and learning to discern the injustices we still bear with us. What was once accepted as perfectly normal behaviour has become intolerable cruelty. What was once expected prejudice has become reprehensible oppression. And in each and every social awakening members from all spectrums of the political arena have to be dragged into the modern age kicking and screaming. Some lead the way and some follow. But many have to be forced to accept that they have been part of oppressing a people.

[opiate69]

2. Un-fucking-believable..

Somebody needs to educate her as to the history of the pledge.

[Taverner]

3. Q: How do Democrats create a firing squad?

A: They form a circle

Why does this joke reflect the truth???


ARRRRGHHH!!!

[NMDemDist2]

4. at the last AzDemocrat Dist Mtg here, I omitted "Under God" too

seems like a really redundant phrase to me and we have very devout Hindus and a Muslim who come to our mtgs who are very active in our dist.

[Nobody]

7. Whoops! I did the same n/t

[NMDemDist2]

18. are you in AZ ? n/t

[Az]

20. Yeah, right here, and boy am I pissed

This is not America. This is not my party. This is not happening.

[NMDemDist2]

27. not at my dist mtg tho right?

heck we might even know each other heheheheh

[Az]

28. No worries

I live in Detroit, so don't confuse my name for the state. Incidently I had this name before Arizona. So they stole it from me! :P

But on the serious side. It is Pelosi and the entire Democratic Leadership Council that I am pissed at. Today I have lost one of the few remaining shreds of hope I had in the party.

[NMDemDist2]

35. don't despair AZ she is a San Francisco liberal

her constituents won't let her stray too far :)

[Nobody]

71. Not in AZ, in MN

But at our state senate district convention I left out those two words. I don't swear oaths I don't mean and I don't swear to things that I don't believe in.

[stepnw1f]

5. I Have Lost Respect for Her

[Cascadian]

45. I guess San Francisco will have to replace her with a real liberal.

Any takers? My respect for her has diminished.

At least Barbara Boxer is still fighting the good fight. Pelosi has gone soft.

John

[WillParkinson]

6. My letter to Nancy...

Dear Ms. Pelosi,

It is with great consternation that I read of your rebuke of Rep. Jim McDermott for not adding the words 'under god' to the Pledge of Allegiance.

We are told that anyone who does not want to use the phrase should not be required to do so. We are told that it is not a religious affirmation but a ceremonial thing. Your rebuke of the Representative is the very reason that the phrase 'under god' does not belong in the Pledge. You are now saying that people should be forced to read it 'as written'.

This Pledge did not even contain the phrase originally.

My respect for you has dropped greatly, Ms. Pelosi. Your "god" does not belong in my government.

[madfloridian]

8. Good letter.

I will never forget when Dean suggested being fair to the Palestinians. She and others wrote him a "fall in line" letter.

When I read this today, I just got furious again.

[villager]

12. Mine (prompted by yours):

Dear Speaker Pelosi;

When you publicly upbraided House member McDermott for leaving the words "Under God" out of the pledge, you were in the wrong. McDermott was right,

The words "under God" were added during a previous era of Republican demagoguery -- during the post-war witch hunts spearheaded by the likes of Joe McCarthy.

By playing into Republican hands now with your comments, you make the Democrats look weak, the Republicans look "right," and you do a disservice to all Americans who want to take our country back from rightwing, theocratic fanatics.

The way to fight bullies is to fight them. Not run around doing their "tsk-tsking" for them.

For America,

Villager

[WillParkinson]

15. Excellent!

Good job.

[villager]

25. et tu, WillB...

good 'un as well...

[rumguy]

9. I want to know why McDermott voted for the increase in FCC

fines...

[azmesa207]

21. Palosie

Does any one have her email address we should flood her withour protest

[killbotfactory]

10. I thought people who didn't think it should be in the pledge were...

Supposed to just omit the words and "get over it"?

[Kadie]

14. Isn't that what they want us to tell our kids?

Now they are showing us what will happen if they do omit the words. They will be pointed out and maybe even reprimanded.

[genius]

11. Pelosi's daughter Christine OPPOSES a voter-verifiable paper trail

Perhaps the Pelosi family needs an education in democracy.

[GreenArrow]

16. perhaps the Pelosi family

is composed of dyed in the wool status quo corporatists who like things just the way they are.

[genius]

17. Nancy voted for Homeland Security, which allowed pharmaceutical

companies to get away with poisoning children. They were being sued and the bill ended the class action law suit.

[lastknowngood]

13. Is it just me or didn't the whole reichwing Nazi bunch said you

didn't have to say in god if you didn't want to?
'
And pusslisey can kiss my A** it's none of her damn business
If I don't want to say god then I am not required to as a matter of fact I'm not required to say the damn pledge at all!

[mgarretson]

22. Shame on Nancy Pelosi...

Ya know, as a Democrat, I thought our party was a little bit better about attempting to moralize on everyone... Pelosi's supposedly a San Francisco liberal Democrat and she's going off on the guy for omitting "under God"? And it annoys me that he ran away from his comments to, saying the words just slipped out...

Let's have a little backbone, folks! Especially you, Madame Minority Leader!

[mgarretson]

26. My email to Pelosi...

"Madame Minority Leader,
Your public belittling of Representative Jim McDermott of Washington is unconscionable. As a Democrat, I take pride in the inclusive nature of our party. I take pride in our willingness to value and listen to dissenting voices. We are an inclusive group which tries to take care of our fellow citizens and keep to keep the government out of their private lives. As a citizen of our country, and even more so as an elected official, Mr. McDermott had every right to omit the words “under God” from his Pledge of Allegiance. He also had every right to expect you, as his leader, to stand behind his right to do so, even if you didn’t agree with them. “Under God” is divisive because the Republicans made it that way and they don’t need your help in doing it. Not only was your public rebuke not in the best interests of our Democratic Party, airing dirty laundry in public is a mark of bad leadership. Lest you forget, Madame, you are the Leader of the Democratic Party in the United States House of Representatives. We need you to fight for every us on every vote you can, rather than wasting our time belittling one of our own.

Respectfully,

Michael G. (Mike) Garretson"

[Az]

19. Does this make me an ABB only Democrat?

Someone convince me that the DNC/DLC has not totally evicerated the Democratic leadership. I am sickened by this. This puts her in the Joementum category in my book.


Crap this pisses me off.

[goobergunch]

23. Mr. Sessions needs to learn House rules

Rule XVII (b)(1) Remarks in debate shall be confined to the question under debate, avoiding personality.

http://www.house.gov/rules/RXVII.htm

[redqueen]

64. lol - as if republicans respected rules

Funny!

[markomalley]

24. Just another political hack

She is unwilling to take a stand for what she knows is right. I think new leadership is needed in the House.

[salonghorn70]

29. Most of You Are Out of Touch With Regular Voters

She did the right thing. How do you think this would play to the average voter out there. I believe that most average voters would be outraged that those words were left out.

[mgarretson]

31. she's his leader... she's supposed to stand up for him...

It was probably misguided for him to lead the pledge in the manner that he did... I'm from the buckle of the damn Bible Belt and I'm sure not to many Oklahomans appreciated his choice of words... I'll grant that... but it's enough of a wedge issue on its own here in OK and in other places... it doesn't need another liberal Democratic to jumping on the criticism bandwagon.

She's his leader and he should be able to count on her to support his right to say things even if she doesn't agree with what he says. You don't air dirty laundry in public...

She's a solid leader and I believe she'll continue to be solid, but her outburst does not reflect well on her or our party, imho.

[madfloridian]

33. Actually you need to define "regular voter". I thought I was.

I think I am average and regular pretty much. I remember when it was not in the pledge, and I remember most did not care.

We are letting them define the issues.

[GiovanniC]

47. Then Change Their Minds

Average voters have supported lots of things that shouldn't be supported.

So-called "average voters" have supported slavery. So called "average voters" have supported racial discrimination. After 9/11, the so-called "average voter" was in favor of making the Middle East a sheet of glass.

There's this quaint little document inside a glass case at the National Archives that says basically that with regards to religion and government, never the twain shall meet. Nancy might do well to read the thing.

It's Pelosi's job to defend the Constitution. But when a government official exercises his First Amendment right to Freedom of Expression and Freedom of Religion, she dresses him down.

Fuck Nancy Pelosi, and fuck anyone else who figuratively wipes their ass with the Constitution.

[guajira]

48. I Learned the Pledge Before the Under God was Added

And I omit those 2 words when I have to "say the Pledge".

I realize some of my fellow local Democrats notice it, but that's my right.

Rep. Jim McDermott is my hero. He spoke out about Iraq and he's right about the Pledge!!

Pelosi has always sounded like a B*-lite to me!

[usregimechange]

53. You are right of course but...

Most voters supported the Iraq war and would have supported bombing Mother Teressa's dead body following 9-11 if their leader told them she was the cause for all their problems.

[kiahzero]

54. Playing politics does not trump the Constitution

The continued presence of "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance is a blight upon the Constitution of the United States. It is blatantly unconstitutional under even Chief Justice Rhenquist's understanding of the Establishment Clause. Yet it persists, because of "average voters" who are outraged when the Constitution is followed.

[Az]

59. Lost inalienable rights

How can a right be inalienable if a group can simple ammend it away from you. The constitution is being pecked to death by those that hate us for our freedoms.

[kiahzero]

60. They remain inalienable

The government just moves towards a tyranny of the majority in failing to protect them.

[Az]

32. The thing is that its currently unconstitutional to include the phrase

The ninth court of appeals found it unconstitutional and removed it. Thats the law. Its currently being considered by the supreme court but the law is currently defined by the ninth courts findings.

[mgarretson]

36. Stay?

Hey Az,
Didn't the 9th Circuit issue a stay on their ruling pending higher appeal? Even if they hadn't, their rulings only have force in the states under their jurisdiction right?

I'm definately on your side on this though... and the 9th Circuit aint to shabby, either. :)

Best,
Mike

[NoPasaran]

34. When we recited the pledge

At our county convention in March there was a noticable dip in volume when we came to that phrase. I would guess that half the people there skipped over the reference to invisible friends.

[salonghorn70]

37. This Is Why Democrats Have A Problem

Most Americans believe in God and most Americans believe that the words "under God" should be in the Pledge. This is why some regular non right wing Christians have trouble with the Democats.

[mgarretson]

39. understood, salonghorn70...

but do you really think it helps the situation for Pelosi to backhand him the way she did? She could have maintained her support for the pledge and her disaproval of McDermott's wording while still publicly supporting his right to do so... It's only fair... And, as a San Francisco liberal, is her rebuke really going to settle anyone's fear about the Democratic party being "anti-God"? It just fuels more Republican "wedge-issue" attacks...

[madfloridian]

40. But we are right, and they are wrong. Should we give in?

Just because they believe it, should we give in always? Not being difficult, because the phrase did not bother me until this extreme administration.

Now it bothers me.

[NoPasaran]

43. And that is why I have a problem with religionists

Churches all over the place.
Churches owning other properties exempt from taxation.
Blue laws restricting commerce.
Entire television networks devoted to religion as well as religious programming on secular broadcast outfits.
"In God We Trust" on all our money.
Prayers at the start of public meetings.

AND IT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH FOR THESE PEOPLE!!!

Give me a freaking break!

[kiahzero]

55. Democrats have a problem because they follow the LAW

The RNC has demonstrated time and time again that they have no qualms about circumventing any law, up to and including the Constitution of the United States, in order to score political points.

"under God" in the Pledge: Unconstitutional.
Forcing children to say the Pledge, even "voluntarily": Unconstitutional.

Democrats are supposed to defend unconstitutional practices, because "most Americans" believe that we should violate the Constitution?

[LizW]

56. Well Christians will have a problem with me, then

because the Constitution is still the supreme law of this land, as far as I've heard.

It is still the law that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion... ." The addition of the words "under God" is unconstitutional, no matter who likes it or doesn't like it. For any person to be compelled to include those words is a violation of the First Amendment, no matter how popular that violation may be with any group.

My children recite this, in violation of the Constitution, every day in public schools. They do it because they don't wish to be questioned, pointed out, made different, and possibly ostracized by the Christians. Just because a majority likes it doesn't make it right.

In my opinion, any Christian who has a problem with Democrats standing up for the Constitution is a right-winger.

[Jacobin]

38. Dimwitted freakazoid of a lilly livered capitulator

:puke:

[madfloridian]

42. LOL

:7

[Christ was Socialist]

41. A Socialist Created the pledge

http://www.reason.com/links/links062702.shtml

snip

Turns out that the Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by a Christian socialist, Francis Bellamy -- first cousin of Edward Looking Backward Bellamy -- a hater of capitalism whose sermons about “Jesus the Socialist” got him fired from his Boston church. Turns out that before World War II, many schoolchildren recited the Pledge not with their hands over their hearts, but with their right arms outstretched toward the flag in a pose we now associate with fascist storm troopers. Turns out that until the 20th century, the flag was rarely displayed in classrooms at all, and that the Pledge was part of a campaign by the ostensibly anti-capitalist owners of the magazine Youth’s Companion --where the Pledge first appeared -- to sell a whole lot of flags to schools
...
Of course, Bellamy

didn’t write the “under God”

clause that offended the court; that was the 1954 addition of the Knights of Columbus. But judging from the widespread rejection of the court’s ruling as lacking “common sense,” whether by Tom DeLay or The New York Times’ editorial page, the phrase has become indispensable to the whole. Removing the clause would by now threaten the meaning that Pledge recitation developed prior to 1954, when it didn’t contain the phrase at all. It appears to be a certainty that God will remain in the Pledge, even if that means amending the Constitution so as to remove any possibility of future legal challenges.

[kiahzero]

44. I don't know that McDermott's ommission was intentional

I was reading a story about it - he learned the old pledge before 1954, when "under God" was not included. He got stuck on the words when the thought of the Court case popped into his head, and inadvertantly skipped over them. At least, that was the explaination that I read.

Made me a little dejected, because I was hoping someone would stand up to the stupidity of that phrase in the Pledge.

I guess this means we can expect more demagoguery if the Supreme Court ignores relevant precedant and rules that it is constitutional?

[OpSomBlood]

46. I'm a Democrat, I'm a Christian, I love America...

...and I have always omitted the words "under God" from the Pledge. I am merely saying the pledge "as it was written."

Until there is some hard scientific evidence supporting that our nation is "under God" (or above God, or within God), we have no business collectively pledging our allegiance to such a concept.

[DaveSZ]

50. He didn't do anything wrong

The 9th Circuit, which I believe has jurisdiction over his district, took the words "under God" out.

[Aries]

52. Exactly...

Until there is some hard scientific evidence supporting that our nation is "under God" (or above God, or within God), we have no business collectively pledging our allegiance to such a concept.

There's a statement I can agree with, as a Democrat and a non-Christian.

The Cold War beginnings of "under God" is enough to make me avoid it.

Freedom from Religion Foundation

[truthspeaker]

49. FUCK YOU NANCY!

So House members who don't believe in God have to pray to him anyway? That's just great. He paused so anyone who wanted to could say "under God". Pelosi, you fucking bigot, resign now so Waxman can take over.

[usregimechange]

51. McDermott must be doing something right, n/t

[peekaloo]

57. Remember the correspondent's dinner where she was shown

laughing uproariously at Dim Son's WMD "jokes"....then when questioned on the appropriateness of her laughter she claimed it was "polite laughter".

Don't wanna be pegged as a God-less Iraqi sympathizer I guess. How Republican!

[liveoaktx]

58. CALL her office and tell her what you think about this

The Honorable Nancy Pelosi
US House of Representatives
Washington, DC 20515
Phone: [phone]
Fax: [phone]
Email: [e-mail]
Website: www.house.gov/pelosi

[robbedvoter]

61. I posted an angry entry on Franken's blog while she was there.

Soo pathetic!

[redqueen]

63. Just called and expressed my displeasure

Does she think this helps? I don't think it does.

[ieoeja]

65. So "noone is forcing you to say it" ...

... in response to those who complain about having the pledge in school has been ... a lie?!?

I am shocked. Shocked I tell you.

I would also like to go on record as saying that I thought I was attending a YWCA function when I responded to the advertisement concerning "young women".

[derby378]

67. I e-mailed Pelosi, too

Her actions are just plain shameful.

[FreeSpeechCrusader]

69. Here's what I just sent to Nancy,

Mrs. Pelosi,

I am greatly disappointed at your reprimand of Representative McDermott over his omission of the words "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance. He has every right to leave out these words as they were not originally in the pledge at all. I do not understand why you feel the need to hurt a democratic leader that is actually taking a step towards getting our country back under the law of the land. You remember that law right...you know the Constitution of the United States wherein it states that government and religion shall at all times remain separate. I understood when McDermott was chastised by the republicans, but for his leader in the House to stab him in the back just for a few votes is absolutely astounding. I wish for you to know that you lost most of my respect when I saw the video of you guffawing it up at George Bush's jokes over the WMD's, but know you have officially lost every shred of respect that I had placed in you. I hope you will reconsider your remarks, and hopefully re-issue a statement stating that Rep. McDermott had every right to lead the Pledge as he did because he was actually following what the founding fathers of this great nation had envisioned. Every single day the voters of the Democratic Party hope and pray that our leaders will stand up for our Constitution and our inalienable rights, and it appears more and more clearly every day that we will have to find some new hopes in the leadership of the party to speak for us because leaders like yourself appear unwilling.

[mgarretson]

70. Huzzah!!

Kick ass email, buddy... :)