Cynical question about the prisoner torture

[mrgorth]

First, I truly abore these actions. I'm completely disgusted. Second, if you WERE going to do this shit, how fucking stupid do you have to be to photograph it? I'm not in the military, have never been, and even I know this. WTF?

[tabasco]

1. No offense to the good MPs out there ...

but in my many years of military service, the MPs were the stupidest and most immature group I encountered. Generally unprofessional. And no, they never arrested me so I'm not grinding an axe. At one time I had a platoon of MPs under my command, and I had a very poor impression. The soldiers involved in this abuse must be punished severely. They cannot blame their actions on the contractors.

[LittleApple81]

2. But the Army has to respond on allowing CONTRACTORS to do their

dirty work. The excuse that they are not under their jurisdiction is absolute BUNK.

[tabasco]

3. Well, the contractors must be punished too ...

but it's true they are not under the jurisdiction of the military to punish. It seems the military should detain suspected civilian criminals and turn them over to FBI or something.

[TN al]

4. Interesting observation...

...During my time in the army I found the MP's to be very professional and well-trained. The cavalry on the other hand was quite scary in their arrogance and ignorance.

The most intelligent soldiers I met were infantry by the way but that is not to say they were all intelligent. For full disclosure I was in aviation. They all prayed to me. Kind of like this: "Oh God, please send me a helicoter now!

[tabasco]

13. I'm glad the infantry impressed you.

That's my branch. Wow - what a different impression of the MPs we have! The MPs involved in this incident have certainly not acquitted themselves well.
I have a very favorable impression of aviators and had quite a few friends in aviation units.

[cmayer]

14. How about turning the contractors over to the Iraqi courts?

Once they are up and running. I wonder how this would qualify under Iraqi law?

[Az]

5. Trophies

Its a time honored tradition. Conquoring armies take trophies. Be they wives, ears, boats, swords, there is a certain expectation within victorious troops to demonstrate their superiority by taking something of the enemy that they cannot stop. Modern times merely create new opportunities for this act.

[Minstrel Boy]

6. Trophy photos like these are not as rare as you think, or hope.

There's this, for instance, taken by Canadian "peacekeepers" in Somalia, of their torture and murder of a 16-year old Somali boy named Shidane Arone:



Say cheese, Private Kyle Brown!

Militaries are purposefully brutalizing. We ought to be horrified, but can't allow ourselves to be surprised.

[DemLikr]

7. These were poorly traiined RESERVISTS, no?

From what I've read, these jerks are among the thousands of unprepared soldiers tossed into the heat, sand, and blood of Iraq to sink or swim, survive or die.

I'm not excusing any of this behavior, but people get freaky in war situations and all kiinds of weird shit goes down. I mean, are you kidding? I'm sure these pics are lightweight compared to lots of incidents much worse about which we will never know.

This little tempest is just another tragedy which should be brought up at GWB's war crimes trial.

And, of course, we'll never have pictures of Iraqi children's heads beiing blown off by huge American bombs dropped from the stratosphere. Because when you kill from airplanes, it doesn't count, you see?

:eyes:

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

8. People that dehumanize other people and committ such acts

are strangely proud of their actions. I don't know why that is, but the Nazis, for example, recorded their atrocities to an amazing degree.

There is a book called "Hitler's Willing Executioners" that demonstrates how most of the rank and file that were doing the killings would take pictures of the horrible things they were doing like they were on vacation or something. Also, the higher-ups kept detailed official records of the killings too, films, photographs and so on.

[Misunderestimator]

9. If you ever get the chance, go to Dachau

to the concentration camp which is now a museum. It was one of the most emotional experiences of my life. Indescribable, really. Along with the prison cabins, the gas chambers (never used there), the furnaces where bodies were burned... was a museum which contained hundreds of photographs taken by guards and by doctors. I remember one particular photo of a surgery removing the top of the skull of a prisoner so that they could do experiments on his brain.

I will never understand how anyone can take pride in their own evil.

[treepig]

11. and now, the sequel

"Bush's Willing Executioners"

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article3988.htm

[loftycity]

10. The photographs prove that it's OK to torture- cruelty is fun

The military should put them away forever. Just think of the torture these cruel pis-poor excuses for humans didn't photograph.

[LittleApple81]

12. Drudge on C-Span this morning: he thinks the female soldier was an Iraqi!

What piece of crock...He implies she is Iraqi and that Iraqi women are going to take revenge on Iraqi men????
Women had more rights in Iraq than in almost any other Muslim country.

[kiahzero]

15. It's not that shocking, scientifically.

http://www.prisonexp.org/
http://www.stanford.edu/dept/news/relaged/970108prisonexp.html

All people have the capability to do evil as well as good. It's an unfortunate fact of "human nature."