Proof that Bush is not a Christian. Post it here!

[OpSomBlood]

I think this deserves a thread of it's own. Bush claims to be such a devout Christian, yet I have not seen him personify a single teaching of Christ. Seems like a rather strange paradox.

So use this thread to post Bible teachings that Bush violates on a constant basis...Gospels of Christ's own Word preferred. Hopefully this thread will help prove once and for all that Bush is not a Christian. I'll start:

Matthew 6:5-8

And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

[RobertSeattle]

1. 2000: Refers to reporter has "Major League Asshole"

http://www.snopes.com/politics/bush/bushcuss.asp

[Selwynn]

30. Umm... so what?

OOOoooo mommy he said a "bad" word, he must not be a christian!

And now for your reading pleasure are bad words from a christian:

fuck, shit, damn, ass, hell.

That was, bad words from a Christian, brought to you by the Leauge of People who think Christian Faith Means More than What Words You Say.

:)

[demon67]

34. Well put

I too am a Member of that League.

[Selwynn]

37. Don't mistake that for my saying Bush's actions reflect christian faith

...but I don't think the fact that he said "asshole" is the reason why. :)

[readmylips]

2. He's an asshole Lier...

and uses Jesus' name for profit.

[Az]

3. Tricky issue

Particularly since if the core concept behind Christianity (god exists and Jesus was his son/him) is true. If it is true then the only one that really gets to determine who the true Christians are is this god/Jesus entity.

Consider further all the Christian acts history shows us. It is not that George is a not a Christian. Its not that he is a bad Christian. The problem is George is a bad human being. And Christians and Jews and Muslems and Atheists and every other group out there needs to stand up and declare this. Forget about trying to decide who's camp created him.

[Ironpost]

28. Bad man

the trouble is we have a shit pot full of 'em.

[stellanoir]

4. he thinks

"poor people are just lazy" or so said his former Prof. from Harvard Business School.

[OpSomBlood]

5. You guys are missing the point.

I'd like to build a nice little database of Bible teachings that Bush violates. Actual references to Bible passages that show that Bush is not a follower of Christ.

I didn't really want to debate divinity...I just want to demostrate hypocrisy.

[Az]

6. Oh... Do you want all violations (OT Included) or just Jesus' rules

Cuz we could be here all day if we include the OT.

[OpSomBlood]

7. Violations of Christ's own words preferred.

n/t

[disgruntled_goat]

8. well

I dont know from bible passages, but his having said stuff like "F*cking God is on our f*cking side" to former PM Chretien has got to count for something along those lines.

wish i had a link.

[Warpy]

9. Judge not lest ye be judged

[demon67]

11. Applying your proposed standard

all Christians are hypocrites, since all are sinners. Many Christians would suggest that following the Old Testament "law" or even the teachings of the Gospels is not what makes someone a Christian. Instead, the religion assumes that followers are all sinners and are "saved" though faith in Christ.

Feel free to bash Bush, but give some thought about whether you want to wrap it in the guise of religion. When Bush tries to support his actions by pointing to religion, he looks like an idiot. Attacking him using the same methods might yield a similar result.

[OpSomBlood]

15. Just proving him wrong on his own turf.

n/t

[demon67]

17. Christianity is not "his" turf

Christianity is Christ's turf. Christ is much larger than the President or the Country or a set of political beliefs. I can't accept the underlying implication of your exercise -- that being a Christian involves doing (or not doing) a series of "good" or "bad" things. That simply addresses whether Bush is a good person -- not whether he is a good Christian and seeks to diminish or deny the divinity of Christ.

Unless you are courting a debate on competing Christian doctrines, which I don't think is your point, I would stick to calling Bush a bad person, a bad President, a bad father, a bad leader, etc. Let God judge whether he is a "good Christian."

[OpSomBlood]

26. My point...

Is that there are many passages in the Bible (Christ's own words, even) that contradict Bush's own life philosophy. I wanted to start this thread as a list of such contradictions.

I am not attempting to debate theology or the divinity of Christ. I am attempting to prove that Bush does not follow Christ's teachings, and is therefore not a Christian.

[demon67]

33. You just reaffirmed my point

Quote: "I am attempting to prove that Bush does not follow Christ's teachings, and is therefore not a Christian."

Again, you reassert your belief that "following Christ's teachings" is what makes a person a "Christian." This is a theological position that is not universally shared.

[texastoast]

41. It's not about believing

Just follow directions. Christ was very clear about what to do to know the Kingdom of Heaven (and who is authorized to decide exactly what that is?). Humans muddle it up trying to come to agreement about how/what/why, thinking they can better "interpret" Christ's very clear communication. To paraphrase, a "universally-shared theological position" about anything to do with Christ is not an issue (for Christ, anyway).

Bush has not followed any of Christ's directions (and he is in the company of a great number of self-styled Christians). Whether that makes him a "good" or "bad" Christian depends on a individual's point of view.

[riverwalker]

10. the beatitudes Matt 5

Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.

Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.

Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the
children of God.

[shaolinmonkey]

12. Thou shalt not kill...

Thou shalt not steal
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's possessions
Thou shalt not bear false witness

[randr]

13. Thou shall not kill

for starters!

[glarius]

14. If Christ were on earth today, Bush & his ilk would reject him as a

socialist pacifist or worse....The fundamentalist types display NONE of the qualities Jesus Christ personified!

[killbotfactory]

16. He thinks he is a Christian, and that he speaks to God

You know... like David Koresh, Jim Jones, or Osama Bin Laden.

Bush is completely out of his fucking mind. He uses his belief that he's doing the will of God to justify his shittyness. People like Bush often do the most horrible things because they believe "the ends justify the means".

[indepat]

18. Thou shall not kill, bear false witness, steal

[Az]

19. I find most religious right run screaming from Luke 6:30

Luke 6:30 Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again.

Actually most of the bits from Luke 6 are quoted but this one gets dropped like a hot potato. Try it some time. Hit a hard core fundimentalist with it and then ask them for something.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

20. Heard that in Dean's book - Bush is portrayed as a "pottymouth"

According to Dean - Bush makes Nixon look like a girl scout.

[OpSomBlood]

21. To be fair, profanity is not a sin.

Come on, let's stick to Christian teachings.

[Az]

25. It depends on

if he blasphemes the name of god. In fact there is one sin that Jesus will not forgive. Blaspheme the Holy Ghost and you are done. No chance of forgiveness. Mt 12:31-32, Mk 3:29, Lk 12:10

[BigThama]

22. Here.

James 2:17 "Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone."

[terrya]

23. Giving $2 trillion to the ultra wealthy and making the rich even richer.

[the_real_38]

24. He's not a Christian, he's a Roman...

... Jesus wasn't preaching control and domination, war and killing... the guys who hung him to the cross were. Bush is like Nero, allowing Christianity, publicly displaying some consonance with it himself, but in reality, we know what he's about. Iraq is the proof.

[powergirl]

27. I can help you out with this later this week

I will be out of town over the weekend. But I got a new annotated Bible that makes it real easy for me to find specific passages that Bush tends to ignore. You are just looking at New Testament, right? Let me know what I can do because there are a lot of Christian (I am Catholic and those evangelicals don't consider me Christian) people who are liberal and we need to reach out to more of them.

[Az]

29. A source for info

Ok, its an atheist/skeptic resource but it does have some of the more interesting rules and concepts highlighted. Give a look see here.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com

[checks-n-balances]

31. How about "Thou shalt have no other gods before me", commandment

number one from the 10 Commandments?

And Jesus' words about how those who follow him cannot serve both God and Mammon (money)? Don't have time to look it up, but can probably be found on google.

May I suggest you title this something like:

"I W. really following Jesus? You decide" or something along those lines. IMHO, many people call themselves Christians and yet pay no attention to what Jesus taught. Ironically, they are likely to condemn those who do, and accuse THEM of not being Christian. They've turned it totally upside down.

I've started using the term "follower of Jesus" rather than "Christian" just to make the distinction, also because too many people have made "Christian" almost a bad word. They've turned off as many people as they've turned on.

[Selwynn]

32. Basically read the Sermon on the Mount, and he reflects none of it.

Jesus also says, while we are to judge not on one hand, he also tells is that "by their fruits you will know them."

If Bush was truly a christian I would have expected to see different fruit...

[heidler]

36. If The U.S truly followed Christ's teachings the support for this WAR

would be nil. The facade of belief runs so deep that if Bush was actually a follower of Christ he would have never ever been elected in the first place. It seems to me that people need to believe that they are good, but avoid the destructive force of finding out that they are just human animals and are incapable of total honesty. Diogenes couldn't find a honest man and no own else can either. This does not mean the we humans are despicable it just means we are what we are and it's not all that bad. This pretense of being religious and thereby good causes headaches. Bush has piss poor judgment and his position in life should reflect that flaw.

[Az]

38. Its a big book, you can find justification for many things in there

Consider these words preported to be from Jesus

Mt.10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword."

Lk.12:51 "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law."

Lk.22:36 "He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one."

[grasswire]

35. simple

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law" (Gal. 5:22,23).

"If you love Me, keep My commandments.... He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him" (John 14:15,21).

[KansDem]

39. Wiping his glasses on the clothing of Letterman's assistant...

It seems to me that Christians would not want to clean themselves on the persons of others, although I know of no bible verses that address the wiping of your dirt off on other people.

I may be wrong, but it just doesn't seem "Christian" to me...



(See video here...)
http://www.bushflash.com/unb.html

(on edit: and this was AFTER he was "born again")

[carols]

44. OMG! Somehow I missed that one - what a smug pig he is!

I am utterly speechless. He is a piece of human garbage. And that definitely was NOT a Christian thing to do.
Carol

[ithacan]

40. Here's a whole website:

http://www.right-wing-pseudo-christians.com/

What Would Jesus Do? Jesus Would Send All These Right-Wing Pseudo-Christians Straight to Hell (And Liberals May Not Be Far Behind)

by Jack Clark

Introduction

In Matthew 25:31-46, Jesus proclaims that how you treat the hungry, the thirsty, the sick and other "least of these," is how you treat Jesus himself. And if you fail to help the "least of these," Jesus promises, he will send you to Hell.

The premise of this essay is that you can't be a true Christian if the focus of your life is thwarting others and the society itself from fully implementing such a fundamental teaching of Christianity as Matthew 25:31-46.

<much more>

You've GOT to check this out, it's absolutely fantastic!

[carols]

42. Matthew 7:15-20 The litmus test for self-described "prophets"

"Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them"
...and there is a lot of rotten fruit growing on that Bush...


7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

[texastoast]

43. Altogether Now--All You Need Is Love

Matthew 5.38-41
You have heard that it was said, "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." But I say to you, Do not resist one who is evil. But if any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also; and if any one would sue you and take your coat, let him have your cloak as well; and if any one forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.

Matthew 26.51-52
Then they came up and laid hands upon Jesus and seized him. And behold, one of those who were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck the slave of the high priest, and cut off his ear. Then Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back into its place; for all who take the sword will perish by the sword."

John 13:34
But I am giving you a new command. You must love each other, just as I have loved you.

Matthew 22:39-40
Love your neighbor as you love yourself.

[OpSomBlood]

45. Kick.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

46. Carla Faye Tucker

While a fundy or evangelical christian wouldn't necessarily be opposed to the death penalty, I dont think you'd see one mock the condemned, especially if the condemned person had underwent a religous conversion.