Don't feel like apologizing for how you feel re: Reagan? Post here.

[WilliamPitt]

A lot of people got into politics because of John Kennedy, or because they wanted to fight for justice in the civil rights cause. That entrance to politics was a positive one.

A lot of people got into politics because of Vietnam, or because Bobby got killed, or because MLK got killed, or because of Watergate. These were negative entrances into politics, borne of a need to stop outrages before they swamped the body politic.

Ronald Reagan was my entrance into politics, and it was a negative entrance. I remember very vividly this President telling me that my generation would be the one to face the apocalypse, a statement that was one of the most defining moments in my life. I lived under a cloud of fear after that.

My work in politics, for my whole life, has been in the majority an effort to undo the massive damage from the disaster that was the Reagan administration.

Our mainstream media journalism is a joke because of Reagan dereguation.

Our social programs were savaged because of Reagan.

Our environmental regulations, once something to be proud of, were eviscerated by Reagan.

The manifest power of corporations over virtually every facet of our lives came because of the massive deregulations put forth by Reagan.

The AIDS virus found a long, comfortable home in America because Reagan couldn't be bothered with funding research into 'gay cancer.'

Crack owned the urban world, wracked by the aforementioned social evisceration, for years because Reagan couldn't be bothered. Whole generations of Americans died in misery because he couldn't have gven a damn about their problems.

Saddam Hussein was a creation, in huge part, of Reagan.

Same goes for Osama bin Laden, who along with al Qaeda and the Taliban went from being a side project under Carter to a front-and-center priority that led directly to the attacks of September 11, not to mention the African embassy bombings. Those two embassies were destroyed with Semtex sold to Afghan mujeheddin (nee Taliban and al Qaeda) by the Reagan administration.

Dick Cheney was a Reagan creature.

Don Rumsfeld was a Reagan creature.

Paul Wolfowitz was a Reagan creature.

Richard Perle was a Reagan creature.

John Negroponte was a Reagan creature.

Elliot Abrams was a Reagan creature.

Dick Armitage was a Reagan creature.

There was some other guy named George, who spawned an idiot named George, who also came out of the Reagan administration.

If you cannot make the direct 2+2=4 connection between the legacy of the Reagan administration and the goddam intractible swamp we slog through every day today, then I despair of your ability to follow coherent logic.

Am I happy Reagan is dead? No.

Do I have a moment of doubt as to whether or not I should speak the truth of him to as many people as I can reach with my arm? I have not one single moment of doubt.

I'm sorry you feel bad because I don't feel bad enough about this, that I am perhaps being 'disrespectful.' Ronald Reagan was my entrance into politics, and it was an ugly, frightening entrance. The Reagan legacy has been a stain across our national landscape, and my life's work to date has been the process of trying to staunch the bleeding.

If you think I'm going to back off because he's dead, think again. If you don't like it, there's a nifty little 'x' next to this thread. Hit it.

Otherwise, speak the truth here and the Devil take the hindmost.

[bluestateguy]

1. Go ahead

But you then forfeit your right to be outraged when the Freepers celebrate Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton's demise.

[WilliamPitt]

2. No I don't

How does one forefit anything by speaking the truth?

[LeahMira]

19. If that happens...

But you then forfeit your right to be outraged when the Freepers celebrate Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton's demise.

... that they celebrate when President Carter dies, then it will show what THEY are because President Carter is a decent man... maybe not the most successful as President, but certainly one of the best as a man.

President Clinton is still young, so hopefully there will be no more Freepers around or the few that remain will be ashamed to show themselves when his time comes.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

74. We forfeit NOTHING, dammit!! And they have no reason to go after...

...Carter or Clinton, other than the crap they'll fabricate when the time comes.

[lastliberalintexas]

130. Um, Will didn't celebrate Reagan's death

In fact, Will very specifically said that he is not happy that Reagan died. He simply laid out a long list of policies of the Reagan administrations which were bad for our country (and the world for that matter). Compiling a list of bad policy doesn't equal a celebration.

I'm sure you can tell the difference.

[jpgray]

3. Amen to that. A bad man is no better for being dead or sick (nt)

[DoveTurnedHawk]

4. No One's Asking Anyone to Feel BAD That He's Dead

It's just really unseemly to be crowing about it in the hours after his passing.

DTH

[WilliamPitt]

5. Is there anything in my post above you could define as'crowing'?

[DoveTurnedHawk]

13. Perhaps Not You

I'll say that I actually do not think you were crowing (although many are), but I also think there's a time for savaging someone, and there's a time to lay off. I disagree with almost everything Reagan stood for, but I personally don't feel the need to point out the gory details about it. Not today.

And although you might be wanting to get the "truth out" about him based on the notion that you want to counteract the inevitable eulogizing, I will say that IMO that will be a REALLY hard sell, and if anything it will just make your audience more closed to your message (unless you're already preaching to the faithful).

Peace.

DTH

[Media_Lies_Daily]

75. Find a post that represents "crowing", then we'll talk about it...

...and for a poster with the boardname of "DoveTurnedHawk", I find it VERY curious that you "disagree with almost everything Reagan stood for". Help my understand what you're really trying to say.

And here's another point...don't tell us what to say about Ronald Reagan on ANY day of the week. That's simply not your call...if you don't like it, do like Will said and hit the "x".

[DoveTurnedHawk]

128. I'm Not Going to Mix It Up With You Over My Screen Name

You should feel free to believe me, or not, as you choose. I reiterate, however: I disagree with nearly everything Reagan stood for.

And here's another point...don't tell us what to say about Ronald Reagan on ANY day of the week. That's simply not your call...if you don't like it, do like Will said and hit the "x".

I find it highly ironic that you are now trying to tell ME what to do. Your post seems more than a bit hypocritical.

Regardless, I have no power to censor you or to dictate your behavior. I am just speaking out, just like you are, about the MANY posts which are completely inappropriate (and yes, there are many which are crowing, many which are celebratory), IMO.

DTH

[The Screaming Icon]

58. My two cents

Whatever Reagan was as a human being, he more than screwed his legacy as a president. The two are separate entities, in my opinion. Remember the famous eulogy: "I came to bury Caesar, not to praise him."

http://ianmcgibboney.blogspot.com

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[PVnRT]

7. My objection

is with the "I'm going to celebrate, yee-haw!!" posts not 24 hours after his death. Criticize his policies all you want.

[Moderator]

8. Locking.

We are trying to consolidate some of the Reagan
threads. Please continue the discussion here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&a...

Thank you for understanding.


DU Moderator

[JohnLocke]

9. Kick

[mopaul]

10. kick

[WilliamPitt]

11. Thank you, elad

[truebrit71]

12. Reagun made me the Democrat I am.

Loud, fierce and loyal.

[UTUSN]

14. Count Me In - But Sure Wish There Were About 4 Pinned Threads

One for the straightforward condolences, one for remembering the negatives, one for the Outraged-at-us, and one for the media whore coverage. It's gonna be a danged long week. But thank Zeus it happened now and not in, say, October. Who knows what'll be happening in October.

[KittyWampus]

15. I Hope Neo-Conservatism Follows Reagan Into Death

Am looking forward to all the Kerry Republicans who will join the Democratic Party because they are so disgusted with Junior and his crew.

[leftofthedial]

16. he was far more evil than Nixon

and I was glad when that bastard died too.

I could not agree with you more, Will. The evil the bushgang has wrought domestically and internationally is the fruits of the seeds Reagan sowed.

I plan to celebrate tonight, but it won't be a happy celebration. It will be grim and reflective at how we collectively failed to stop the evil.

[PurityOfEssence]

56. That's a tall order

I'll give you this: The forces that used him and wrought destruction and subjugation on the world as they looted it were much worse, and the net effect of his regime was much worse, but there's a serious problem with your statement. The problem is that Reagan was a dilettante and a figurehead; his beliefs were broad-strokes and truly shallow. Nixon, on the other hand, was his own man. Nobody owned Dick Nixon, and all of his evil was his own doing. Although his lasting legacy is dimmed by his downfall, and his policies weren't as cruel and insensitive as Reagan's, he was a much meaner cuss.

In the end, because of letting himself be used by some truly odious rotters, your statement is true, but Nixon was eeeeeeevil.

[leftofthedial]

72. Reagan's name went on the label

he was a shit and I'm glad humanity finally passed him.

Nixon was an asshole, but he never stood for what Reagan helped to come to pass.

[jus_the_facts]

17. posted this Tip O'Neill quote on the 'Kerry's Raygun Remarks' thread....

....Tip had a desk that belonged to Pres. Grover Cleveland in his office...Raygun had come in Tip's office the day he was inaugurated to change clothes after bein' sworn in...after Tip told him the history about the desk...Raygun said..."That's very interesting...you know I once played Grover Cleveland in the movies." Tip replies..."...No..Mr. President...you're thinking of Grover Cleveland Alexander...THE BASEBALL PLAYER!"...abridged exerpt from MAN OF THE HOUSE...The Life and Ploitical Memoirs of Speaker Tip O'Neill with William Novak

Tip says he didn't tell the press about the incident but Barney Frank said something to House Democrats about the President being under the impression that Grover Cleveland had pitched a few seasons for the Washington Senators during the four year interlude between his two terms in office!!

......I'm apathetic to his demise m'self! x(

[playahata1]

32. DELETE.

The poster to whom I was responding did mention Reagan's saying he played the role of Grover Cleveland Alexander. My bad.

[Solly Mack]

18. I'm glad this has been re-opened

It was a needed thread.

a man died today who brought great harm to this country. it's not disrespectful to say that. it's the truth...

for me, to say otherwise would be to add to the rightwing myth of the "Gipper"....there was nothing warm and fuzzy about what Reagan did to this country.

Part of the righwing problem is that they labor under so many destructive myths.....Reagan was, and still very much is, one of those cherished myths.

[ScreamingMeemie]

20. Am I going to toast his death? No. Is Alzheimers a horrid thing? Yes

Was Ronald Reagan someone I admired? No. Should it make a difference? No. Is Reagan's death a partisan issue? It shouldn't be, unless we make it one. Let's not let politics cloud rational thought.

That's about it.

[WilliamPitt]

23. My grandmother died from Alzheimers

pretty much ten years ago to the day. I know all about it, because it took ten years to kill her. Do I pity Reagan that he endured so awful a slow, debilitating demise? Of course. Am I going to pull my punches because of it? Under no circumstances whatsoever.

[mopaul]

26. my grandpa too

and he died flat ass broke like me. no health care for shit, cause of assholes like reagan. reagan convinced all his asshole supporters that the poor are a drag on the rest of us.

we may all get frikkin alzheimer's and pneumonia, but we'll have to fight like hell to get health care for it thanks to ronnie and his asshole devotees.

[ScreamingMeemie]

29. ...and I am not going to celebrate. Do I still hope for a regime change

come November? Yes. But this has nothing to do with that. And we are no better than those we despise when we act in such a manner. :(

[greatauntoftriplets]

21. Ray-goon was George W. Bush's political "grandfather".

Had RR not chosen Poppy for VP and the anointed him as his successor, George W. Bush would still be some bush-league failed bidnessman in Texas.

The Dim Son is RR's legacy to this country. That is the gods' honest truth as I see it.

[BuelahWitch]

22. "Poor man was sick" blah blah blah

My mother had an Alzheimer's like illness. I say "Alzheimer's like" because I couldn't afford an autopsy when she died, and Medicaid wouldn't pay for one. But she definitely had dementia. Reagan had enough money to stay home. Nancy could afford round the clock care for him. She never had to worry about getting fired from a job because she had to take Ron to the doctor. She never had trouble getting respite care. She never had a cop tell her she "better do something" about her husband because the police were tired of picking him up when he would go wandering while she was working at a job. Reagan was the one who started slashing aid for the poor so that by the time I needed help with my mother there was nothing left. In-home care was a thing of the past and I had to put my mother in a nursing home when I could no longer take care of her.
So I can't feel sorry for him because he's dead after being sick all those years. Dealing with an Alzheimer's patient isn't easy, but if you've got the money it's a hell of a lot better than if you don't. But Reagan, Gingrich and their ilk don't think the working poor and lower middle class need to live decent lives.
Let the fucker burn in hell.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

68. My grandmother had azhiemers, and I know what you are saying..

....we ended up having to put her in a home too, for the reasons you did.

So, yes, too bad about the alzheimers, but Nancys experience with the medical / personal care side of it was alot different than ours.

[No2W2004]

24. I kicked him when he was President, and I refuse to stop now....

Reagan is dead.....too bad he wasn't there for it.

Having lived through his administration, I do remember. I never blamed him, nor did I ever give him credit. He was an actor and a brainless dolt. He could memorize his lines and look "presidential". He could give that little wave, or put his hand to his ear and pretend not to hear or just cock his head to the side, and the mindless sheeple would feel all fuzzy inside. He set the standard for the "front man president", and helped create the fascist fuckheads now occupying the white house. His stories and anecdotes were about non-existed people. His administration started the trend to take away power from labor so the corporations could export all the jobs to the 3rd world. They created the myth of the "welfare queen" so that social programs could be cut or made harder to obtain. They created a secret arm of the executive branch that could spend money without oversite. They funded and armed illegal armies in Central America that butchered over 40 thousand people. They talked about smaller government, but ran up large deficits. Their theory of "trickle down economics" may have worked for a few, but the lower classes knew what was really "trickling down" on them. They created a unworkable defense plan against an enemy quickly running out of time that made contractors rich. They started the culture of fear when they promised hope. They put a sworn enemy to the environment in charge of it, and then proceeded to rape it. When the media reported what they didn't like, they cut off access, and the rest learned their lesson. Want to discuss the Reagan presidency? Then you must start with the real powers behind the throne; Ed Meese, Jim Baker, and Mike Deaver. No one and nothing got through to the oval office until one of these guys signed off on it. They were the ones who served up policy in the small, bite size pieces that Reagan could cope with. They made the policy, Reagan signed the bills. I don't blame him personally for the conduct of those he fronted for. I do blame him for not respecting the office of President, setting the precident, and showing the evil bastards that, with the right person running, that the highest office in the land could be made into a corporation. That is Ronald Reagan's true legacy. He helped make our lives worse.

[mopaul]

36. he proved that ANY jerkoff can be president...hence bush 1 & 2

a total sock monkey yes man robot moron. he's the ultimate re invented man. the ed meeses of the world have turned him into fucking jesus

[NashVegas]

25. *waves hand*

Although, frankly, I have little to say.

[cally]

27. I agree with you Will

Reagan did great harm to the world. I'm not toasting his death but I have no sadness.

[Neecy]

28. this is a natural reaction

Anyone watching cable news right now is probably feeling outrage at the over-the-top, maudlin 'greatest president of the 20th century' crap. It makes me want to scream that this man was a criminal, a heartless bastard and a dunce and I don't care if he died today or last week when I say it. It's as true today as it will be for all time.

The Sainthood of Ronald Reagan is so overdone on cable at the moment that I think it's creating some of the vocal backlash. The truth still matters, regardless of the lies the media tells.

[kaitykaity]

30. Whoopi Goldberg did a skit about Reagan that's

still just fantastic.

She pantomimed Reagan fucking all these different
groups of people in the ass while talking sweet
nothings in their ears--the one I remember is the
air traffic controllers.

That's pretty much how I feel about Reagan. That
isn't going to change because the shell of a body
has finally stopped breathing.

[Hubert Flottz]

31. I'm not sorry!

Shei'ite happens!

[Q]

33. I guess it took the death of the original 'teflon' president...

...to bring out all the Reagan Democrats here on DU. It was the 'Reagan Dems' who ripped the party to shreds and opened the way for the 'new' Democrats trying to emulate the 'success' of the 'Reagan Revolution'. The problem was: the conservative Dems had to sell out the party just like the 'new' GOPers.

- But Will is correct: It was the Reagan Revolution that brought us this shithole we find ourselves in today. The destruction of our country's infrastructure and the literal end of the 'new deal' which gave the 'little people' some hope of having a share of the American dream.

- Bush* is continuing where Reagan left off. But Bush* has several advantages that Reagan could only dream of: the 'trifecta' of controlling all branches of government and an opposition that couldn't find their asses with both hands.

[mopaul]

34. what can i say?...i'm full of hate

i don't deny it, just a filla soffical observation.

[minkyboodle]

35. Thanks for this post

We are really in a no win situation today and all this week. Any criticism of Reagan will be attacked as inappropriate or in bad taste yet the right wing is free to canonize the guy for hours on end on every television channel. IMO WilliamPitt has nailed to right way to handle this situation with the above post.

[Kanary]

48. You only forgot one little teensy thing......

The unmitigated joy they'll express when it's a "librul" who dies.

We miss ya, Paul. :cry:

Kanary

[spotbird]

37. If it haddn't been Reagan there would have been some

someone else that caused the destruction.

I remember the night he was elected like it was yesterday, how the country could not see what they had done mystified me. For days I wandered around looking at people wondering if they had voted for him, how could they?

Now my youthful idealism is realism, people are very selfish and want their leader to give them permission to feel that is a virtue. It is all but impossible to get middle class parents to force their children to suffer consequences for malfeasance, much less teach their children about the common good. That is what changed in America in the early '80s, the notion that there Americans need to give to get, sacrifice is necessary for patriotism to exist. Reagan didn't cause that change, he exploited it.

In the days following 9/11 * asked America to shop more. That was the expected contribution. To this day * has not asked America to sacrifice for the "war on terror" whether it is real or not. Imagine the public reaction if Bush told the country that they should "ask not what they can do for their country....

[starroute]

117. Reagan single-handedly made greed respectable

I remember how depressed I was right after the 1980 election, how over the next two months I managed to convince myself that it might not make *that* much difference, and how the moment Reagan was sworn in it became clear that my worst fears were justified.

As I recall, it was the coverage of the inaugural balls that make things crystal clear. The articles were all about how the Jimmy Carter style (wear a sweater and turn down the thermostat) had been completely swept away, and how ostentation and conspicuous consumption were back.

I'm always very aware of what clothing styles say about the national mood. Late 70's fashion had been increasingly conservative (preppy look) and nostalgic (prairie style), a mood which set the stage for Reagan's election. But early 80's fashion wasn't at all like that. Instead, it was dominated by power suits and extravagant party dresses. (I think of Princess Di's wedding dress from 1981 as the epitome of that period.)

Americans elected Reagan because he promised them a return to basic values and simple American optimism. Instead, they got class warfare and the privilege of being spectators to the indulgences of the very rich.

[Darranar]

38. No, I don't feel like apologizing...

Reagan was among the worst, if not the worst, presidents we have ever had, keeping in mind the fact that the current pile of trash is not the president.

On the other hand, he wasn't doing any harm to anyone for the past several years, so I'm not about to cheer at his death.

But I'm not going to tearfully sob for an hour, either, or for any duration, at least not on this matter.

[eleny]

39. Ronnie did one good thing

He died well enough before the election to mitigate any bounce.

But I wouldn't be surprised if Rove isn't begging to be allowed in to pinch his cheeks a bit to bring some life back.

[VelmaD]

40. Thanks Will

Reagan was not my introduction to politics. Carter was. And that was a much more hopeful introduction than you got. I was only 6 or 7 but I believed. :)

I hate Reagan because he came along in 1980 and did everything in his power to kill the hope and replace it with fear...fear of the Soviets, fear of the poor, fear of African-Americans and other people of color, fear of anyone "different". I will NEVER forgive him for that. He didn't win...I still have hope. But I had to fight with that fear everyday of my life to hold onto that hope.

[peacetalksforall]

41. Anyone know how many people in Latin and South America didn't live to 93?

How many in other hemispheres and in our own country?

[peacetalksforall]

42. Anyone know how many people in Central & South America didn't live to 93?

And how many other in our country and the rest of the world went to an early death because of him?

[Kanary]

49. Thank you, higher class

So very few remember, or want to think about, the thousands of deaths of disabled people in THIS country because that Evil One took away their only means of existance.

Kanary

[BeFree]

43. Reagan was your entrance?

Heck, you had it easy. Imagine having to put up with Nixon too!


The people who wonder why others are venting like they are right now, just don't get it. They don't get how awful things were in his time. War, 24 x 7 x 365 War. Star Wars, Israeli Arab war, Enviro war, Homeless war, Good government war, take your pick. I'm telling ya, it sucked. It was 8 years of the kind of war we've lived through the last 3.

It didn't have to be that way, Clinton proved that.

As I sit here thinking about those days, a slow boil is beginning to simmer.

While it was good to blast away at Reagan anytime over the last 20 years or so, now, the time is right. Blast away people. Have at 'em. He deserves the blasting.

To those of you who are scratched by the vitriol, too bad. Quit yer bitching. Turn of your computer, we've got some bad vibes we need aired out and there ain't no better time than right now.

[mopaul]

44. oh, and nancy is a ............rhymes with witch.........n/t

[greatauntoftriplets]

45. Remember when old Bar Bush said something similar to that....

...about Geraldine Ferraro in 1984? What a class act.

:eyes:

[Selwynn]

46. Hating Regan's politics is one thing, acting like Rush Limbaugh is another

I hated the Regan Administration, and I hate Regan's politics. That doesn't mean I take pleasure in his own physical suffering or the emotional suffering of his family. Personal life is personal life, and business is business. And when it came to how he chose to govern, I have a real beef with him. But for me to use that as a license to make it personal and say despicable disgusting things about him just like the freepers would about a democrat - that lowers me to a level that frankly, I'm too good for. I'm not willing to stoop to that level of shit, because I believe in acting better than my enemies.

At the same time, it will never change: some people feel little but anger, and the misfortune of an opponent is the only thing to take pleasure in. It seems fairly pointless to fight it.

I tried hiding all regan threads but apparently it is the ONLY thing DU wants to talk about today. So I just deal with it now.

[Junkdrawer]

47. The only way the DEATH of Reagan is a political event...

is if Kerry or some other mainstream Democrat makes or can be framed to have made a disparaging remark about his passing.

As for his legacy, I couldn't agree with you more Will.

[PurityOfEssence]

50. If you listen carefully, you can hear the munchkins sing

His legacy is one of selfishness, false piety, greed and the marginalization of anything that doesn't fit a cheery worldview. He tripled the national debt, wasted the environment, neutered the FCC, crushed unions, enabled theocracy and wandered around letting himself be used by the forces of monarchy. Like many somewhat self-made men, he was fully convinced that he did it all himself. (Without SAG, he wouldn't have made anywhere near as much money, and he didn't start in poverty.)

He is just another example of the life-destroying fixation on beauty and power, and by playing the common-man simplification of life, he did far more damage than good. History already knows this. The world at large knows this.

[Marnieworld]

51. I can't believe no one has said this yet.

Will, not only do I agree with you 100%, but I think you should publish this piece. Not just because it's excellent writing, butit needs to be said. There needs to be a response to the insane coverage on TV now. I admit my memory was faulty about the details of the damage he did, certainly my focus is on today's evil administration. I watched some of the coverage without sadness but without the clarty to articulate why. You put so well into words what I've been trying to tell my former republican husband that I am printing this out for him. Thanks again.

[WilliamPitt]

52. Tomorrow

Thanks.

[agincourt]

53. The thing that rolls my stomach the most,

will be the crap in the news how he won the cold war, how he "saved" the US economy, how nice of an asshole he was, how he brought confidence back to our political system,what a stand tall straight shooter the arms supplier to terrorists was. But I think the thing that will make me most sick is how the media rim-jobbers
will go on how "important" he was. As if nobody else was qualified to sell out him country and let the rich run it. It's not the guy I hate so much as the fountains of shit unleashed to make the sheeple believe he was a great man.

[suegeo]

54. Well F-all, I thought they locked this post!

Since they musta unlocked it, here is a list of LAWS that Reagan probably broke!

I took this list from a book, source noted below.

I believe this list is only in regard to the Iran-Contra crimes. There may be other laws broken by Reagan, Inc. which are not listed here.

1. The Boland Amendment (Thou shalt not mess with Central America.)

2. The International Security and Development Cooperation Act of 1985, Public Law 99~83, Section 722 (d). (Thou shalt not provide funding directly or indirectly against Nicaragua.)

3. The Intelligence Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 1986, Public Law 99-169, Section 101 and 105. (Thou shalt not plan or covet military or paramilitary operations against Nicaragua, directly or indirectly. )

4. The Neutrality Act of 1974, Section 960 Title 18 of the US Code. (Thou shalt not engage in supporting, funding, planning or aiding military adventures against any country with which the US is at peace.)

5. The Arms Export Control Act, US Code Title 22, Section 2778. (Thou shalt not trade in weapons for export ,,'ithout applying for and obtaining a license to do so.)

6. Intelligence Oversight Act. (The CIA shall inform the Congress of intelligence acti,'ities regarding foreign countties.)

7. Executive Order 112333. (The US and its agents shall not participate in assassinations.)

8. The Anti-Deficiency Act, US Code Title 31, Sections 1341 and 1350. (Thou shalt not spend money for purposes not specifically authorized.)

9. Misuse of Public Money, Property or Records, US Code Title 18, Section 641. (Thou shalt not use US funds or property of value without legal authority.)

10. Fraud and False Statement, US Code Title 18, Section .1001. (Thou shalt not falsify, conceal or cover up by any scheme, trick or device a material fact or make false, fictitious or fraudulent statements or presentations of same.)

11. Obstruction of justice, US Code Title .18, Section .150.1. (Thou shalt not influence, intimidate or impede the due course of the administration of justice, including criminal investigations.)

.12. Conspiracy to Defraud the United States and Commit Other Felonies, US Code Title 18, Section 371. (Thou shalt not plot to violate criminal laws.)

13. Misprison of Felony, US Code Title 18, Section 4. (Thou shalt not fail to report a felony to the proper authorities.)

14. Federal Election Campaign Law, US Code II, Section 43. (Thou shalt not use or ~launder~ either foreign or federal funds for political purposes.)

15. Misuse of Appropriated Funds for Publicity and Propaganda, Section 501 of Public Law 98-411 under Departments of Commerce, justice and State, 1985. (Thou shalt not use any appropriation for publicity or propaganda purposes not authorized by the Congress.)

16. War Powers Resolution, Section 4(a). (Thou shalt report to Congress within 48 hours after US forces have been committed to hostilities. )

17.The foreign Assistance Act of 1961, Section SO2B(a) (2): (Thou shalt not provide security assistance to any country the government of which engages in a consistent pattern of gross violations of internationally recognized human rights). These rights are defined as: tortures or cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or prolonged detention without ttial or charges, or causing the disappearance of persons by abduction and clandestine detention, or other flagrant denial of the right of life, liberty and security of the person.

SOURCE: "Prophets without honor", by Strabala, Palacek. Algora Publishing, New York, copyright 2002.

[dsc]

55. Neither Cheney nor Rumsfeld worked for Reagan

Cheney was Ford's Chief of staff, Congressman from Wyoming, Defense Sec for Bush 1 and VP. Rumsfeld was Ford's Sec of Def, and out of government until Bush named him.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

82. Wrong. They did indeed work for Reagan...

Cheney: <http://www.pixelpages.net/bucks4bush/cheney-bio.htm>

"His career in public service began in 1969 when he joined the Nixon Administration, serving in a number of positions at the Cost of Living Council, at the Office of Economic Opportunity, and within the White House.

When Gerald Ford assumed the Presidency in August 1974, Mr. Cheney served on the transition team and later as Deputy Assistant to the President. In November 1975, he was named Assistant to the President and White House Chief of Staff, a position he held throughout the remainder of the Ford Administration."

Looks like Cheney served as Chief-of-Staff for Ford for a little over one year: November 1975 until Carter's inauguration in January 1976. Additionally, Cheney did work for Reagan as Chairman of the Republican Party:

"He was re-elected five times and elected by his colleagues to serve as Chairman of the Republican Policy Committee from 1981 to 1987."

=================================

Rumsfeld: <http://www.whitehouse.gov/government/rumsfeld-bio.html>

What you missed in regards to Rumsfeld were the duties he carried out for Reagan, such as:

"*Member of the President's General Advisory Committee on Arms Control - Reagan Administration (1982 - 1986);

*President Reagan's Special Envoy on the Law of the Sea Treaty (1982 - 1983);

*Senior Advisor to President Reagan's Panel on Strategic Systems (1983 - 1984);

*Member of the U.S. Joint Advisory Commission on U.S./Japan Relations - Reagan Administration (1983 - 1984);

*President Reagan's Special Envoy to the Middle East (1983 - 1984)."

That seems to make Rumsfeld more a creature of Reagan than he was for any other Republican president.

[dsc]

90. I will give you Rumsfeld

but not Cheney. That position was a party position not a White House one. He was a US House member that entire time.

[Skittles]

57. no crocodile tears here

some of these people need a real history lesson

[mopaul]

60. like jack nicholson as the joker said...

'hell, i'm glad he's dead, hee hee hoo hoo'

[ElsewheresDaughter]

59. adios president joan quigley reagan...sucks to be you

[warrior1]

61. Amen

bro Will

[catzies]

62. I'm not only not sorry that I'm not sorry

I'm getting happier by the hour. That's what good anejo tequila does on a beautiful Southern California summer night.

And as it so happens, his final resting place is a stone's throw away. So I raise a shot glass in his general direction as I understand a cortege is now winding its way from Bel Air to Santa Monica, and will then come on up here to Simi Valley.

But as far as I'm concerned, Bonzo went to Bitburg today . :headbang:

"18 Apr 1985: I think that there's nothing wrong with visiting that cemetery , where those young men are victims of Nazism also, even though they were fighting in the German uniform, drafted into service to carry out the hateful wishes of the Nazis. They were victims, just as surely as the victims in the concentration camps."

[Feanorcurufinwe]

63. Reagan was evil

dead or alive, the man was scum.

[MuseRider]

64. This is an interesting point.

The time of your political awakening may very well have something to do with your action or reaction to something like this. It does not appear to hold true across the board from what I can tell but it is an interesting point to think about particularly when thinking of the future.

Feel bad or do not feel bad, that is up to each of us individually. I will never mourn this person but I can't join in right now out of respect for the love of his family. I can understand why some do but please try to understand why some of us do not. That is my truth for tonight.

You speak truth once again for those of us who choose to hold back for now.

[maggrwaggr]

65. THANK YOU WILL PITT

You said it, and you said it beautifully as usual.

Reagan was my introduction to politics as well.

Reagan is the reason I will NEVER vote Republican.

Reagan is the reason we are in the mess that we are in today.

Reagan was a national embarrassment.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

66. Thanks, Will...I really appreciate the honesty here about RWR.

People need to be clear-eyed about Reagans legacy here and not eulogize him in a positive light.

[maggrwaggr]

67. "REAGAN WAS A GIFT FROM GOD"

I was just flipping channels and some asshole on MSNBC, I don't know who it was, actually said this. He was being interviewed by Keith Olberman as the helicopters fly over my house here in Santa Monica. (His body is about two blocks from where I type this. The helicopters are still there).

I want the TRUTH told about Reagan. That's it.

This whole myth of Reagan is a creation of the right wing and the media.

It's complete bullshit, it's an utter fabrication.

And it fucking pisses me off.

I don't care if he's dead or alive, I don't give a shit if he died of Alzhiemer's or anything else, I want the TRUTH told about the man, his administration, and what he did.

[Dees]

69. Now wait just a god damned minute

Where around the world has the death of an oppressive leader not been rejoiced? Reagan and his criminal neo-con friends are directly responsible for the oppression and poverty of millions of Americans. When a leader (father) of a heinous criminal faction that destroys lives dies it's time to reflect on true feelings. Ding dong the witch is dead.

[NoPasaran]

70. I wish I could express myself better but here goes

Before Reagan we took it for granted that whatever problems we faced, we would face them as a society. Our future was a road to an ever-more harmonious, just, peaceful, prosperous, happy society.

That came to an end with Ronald Reagan. The idea that government should provide for the common welfare was ditched in favor of open class warfare against the poorest and weakest Americans. The mentally ill were thrown out of their institutions to wander the streets as a growing army of the homeless. Crackpot economic theories, huge tax giveaways to the rich and runaway military spending generated gigantic budget deficits. The demonization of political opposition, nuclear saber rattling, and media hysteria campaigns generated a climate of endless fear. Whatever feeble resistance that Congress mustered against him was circumvented by an illegal parallel government unprecedented in our history.

Virtually everything that we find so awful about the current regime had its trial run during the Reagan years.

I don't believe in Heaven, but if there is a Hell Ronald Wilson Reagan is there tonight. My only regret is that he did not spend his final days living on the streets eating out of a dumpster like so many of the helpless victims of his evil, corrupt administration.

[maggrwaggr]

79. you express yourself very well

and I echo your sentiments

[TacticalPeek]

71. Donna Brazile says it for me, today at BookExpo (c-span2 - BookTV)

(Brian Lamb mentioned that the news reported Reagan's worsening condition, asked about effects his death might have.)

"Well, I can tell you I worked very hard to try to stop Reagan from being elected in 1980 and in 1984. But let me just say this, I was also privileged to go to the White House on the occasion in November of 1986 when Ronald Reagan signed the bill to make Dr. King's birthday a national holiday. And I'll never forget that day, because what I was struck by Mr. Reagan is that he had brown hair, I was already graying at that time, and brown suit, brown tie, brown shoes, and he was so nice and so kind, and I looked at this guy who I had spent all of these years trying to, you know, get out of the White House, and I said to myself 'What's up with this guy?' He was the king of optimism, I mean he had this natural joy about him, this natural way of just putting his hands on your shoulder and making you feel, and - that he's all right... But then you looked at his policies and you said 'This guy is bad. He's bad for America. He's bad for the country. He's bad for the world.'

I pray that whatever happens over the next, course of whatever, that Ronald Reagan is in peace; and many conservatives I know will mourn his death, but let me just hope that we end an era, an era of very vicious, nasty, and Linda Chavez will not like this, politics that came out of the Reagan era. The politics of taking on poor people. The politics of telling poor people that they are worthless. The politics of telling poor people that they didn't work hard, it started with the Reagan era.

And perhaps that's what pissed me off about the Reagan era. I grew up poor, and when I came of age in politics it was because people who thought they were conservative said that poor people didn't hold up their end of the bargain. And that was wrong, and so that is the part of the Reagan era that I hope is buried when he is buried.

And I hope we have a new politics in this country, that says regardless of where you are born, that regardless of how much money you have, that you're worth something, that your life is valuable; and that part of Ronald Reagan I will celebrate. The part of Reagan that I saw before he left office, Hands Across America, when he opened up the White House to poor children, and said 'I'll hold your hand.' But he never gave them anything, he didn't give them vouchers, he didn't give them hope, but he held their hands, and I'll remember that, because I'm gonna find the good in Ronald Reagan and I'll praise it.

But I didn't like his policies, and I didn't like his administration. And I fought hard to prevent Ronald Reagan from being elected in 1980 and 84, and I have no regrets about that."

(with feeling, and some of Carville's cadence toward the end :) )

[RetroLounge]

73. Kick

RL

[Bombero1956]

86. my political awakening

came after a speech Reagan made that for me signaled the beginning of the demonization of us Liberals. I for the life of me can't recall when and where he made that speech but I remember it was him. In it he implied that Liberals weren't true Americans. To paraphrase he said " there are Liberals and then there us real Americans. If anyone can find that speech I would like to know where to get it.

[Kickin_Donkey]

76. I don't feel bad about it.

I don't give a shit at all. The man's been an irrelevant vegetable for years, including when he was in the White House.

Just because some of us aren't feigning reverence, all these sanctimonious, weak-kneed, milquetoast DUers are claiming that we're "pissing on Reagan's grave."

Fuck Reagan. As I wrote in another thread, Reagan's gang is what made Bush possible.

No turning the other cheek anymore. No unilateral disarmament. Never give a quarter to the Repugs.

[genius]

77. Reagan killed himself with his opposition to finding a cure for Alzheimers

[KT2000]

91. Even worse than that!

It is more than likely that there is an environmental component to Alzheimer's. It is also likely that the culprits will be identified as substances under the purview of the EPA - an agency he essentially prevented from protecting the public health in favor of protecting corporate profits.

My sympathy is with all the other people disabled by these substances.

[Walt Starr]

78. If not for Reagan

We'd never have been saddled with the evil administration we currently have.

Fuck Reagan and anybody who has the audacity to chastise me for saying it! The fucker killed so many people he, Pol Pot, Hitler, Stalin, and a damn site more mass murderers should all be mentioned in the same breath!

[Zomby Woof]

80. Word

Up. Down, and sideways. :-)

[trigz]

81. Well over in Europe, we're toasting

the passing of one of the most influential right-wing pricks ever born. Reagan has piled misery upon so many people and lay the foundations for the cryptofascist quagmire you wade through today to such a degree that there shouldn't be anything to make you think it's "sad" that the bastard is gone.

I'm sorry if this offends you, but Reagan's death has caused no reaction other than "good that that's over and done with" from me and many others over here. The man was a swine.

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

83. Ive been noticing the Brits are more upfront about this...

....the are pretty irreverant about all this. No eulogy on the UK websites that I post at.

[fedsron2us]

110. Most Britons equate Reagan with Thatcher.

Her legacy continues to poison the UK. When the Grim Reaper finally comes for her there will be many people on this side of the pond who will be only too happy to start singing 'ding dong the witch is dead'.

[Oilwellian]

84. One criminal down...

many more to go. I have one word for Reagan's death....riddance.

[Rex]

85. Same here, I was 13 when my yellow-dog democrat grandmother

introduced me to The Great Satan (Reagan). We would watch C-SPAN and she would explain to me how these Repuke bastards were lobbying and redacting all known regulations on trade, destroying unions and crushing all social welfare programs that helped the mentally handicap & poor.

Fuck Reagan, he was a pox on our country and I'm glad he is gone.

[smirkymonkey]

87. There is no reason to mourn his passing,

I only mourn the fact that ever lived at all.

[Lugnut]

88. JFK political junkie

Since I have nothing kind to say I'll say nothing except to agree with your post.

[Raskolnik]

89. I'm posting this all over in the hopes that people come to their senses.

When my hero Paul Wellstone died a few years ago, the progressive liberal movement lost someone who they viewed as a champion and an icon. Some conservatives took the opportunity of his passing to mock his ideals and score cheap political points at his expense. They were terrible people for doing so.

Some conservatives, however, simply stated that although they disagreed with many of his political decisions, Wellstone was a man of his principles and at the moment it was simply a time to mourn a human being's passing and give condolences to his family. In particular, Rush Limbaugh showed restraint and behaved appropriately (surprisingly enough).

My question to those here at DU is this: if we can't be at least as good as that piece of garbage Limbaugh, what good are we? I LIKE being able to categorize liberals as the more humane and generous political group. I don't want to give people reason to doubt that.

I am NOT asking people to forget Reagan's many ill deeds. History will remember him appropriately, I believe. However, there is a time and place for attacking a man and his politics. The day of his death is not that day. We do ourselves and our cause a disservice when we descend into this kind of childish, ghoulish gloating at a man's death.

[NV1962]

92. I'm sick of the smarmy "we are better than that" BS

Yes, we are.

And I'm quite content he's gone.

For too long, too many times, too many people try to "play nice" in the face of evil bastards whose ride to power is aimed at nothing but the destruction of everything those same goody-two shoes defend. The same evil bastards whose ride to power is driven by dirty tricks, backroom deals and smear campaigns. The same evil bastards who won't even flinch at the opportunity of bringing "ethical issues" up to discredit an opponent. The same evil bastards who don't give a flat monkey's rear about ethics, integrity, compassion, or honesty - but use those same terms as empty campaign shells with which they bait and switch a distressingly naive electorate.

And playing nice will do what exactly to further our agenda, aside from stroking some misguided sense of self-righteousness?

If stating one's mind -- i.e., joy over the permanent departure of a total monster and disgrace for any government -- is not playing nice, then I'm not interested in playing nice.

Being honest and saying what I see is more important to me, and if that offends the tender soul, tough cookie.

Reality sucks, and it's time that we stop finding excuses to beat ourselves up over it - and instead gather courage and integrity to deliver the message that the evil bastards are just that.

For me, this surprising outburst of appeals to guard the "forms" around this left-leaning forum in response to the evil bastard's death comes across as a cross-dressed appeal to an ethically cleansed treatment of his crimes, and it don't wash with me.

A dead evil bastard is still a dead evil bastard, no matter how many layers of roses his snivelling minions attempt to place on his corpse. And I reject the stench the spectacle produces, loudly and colorfully.

Here's my smilie for the day:

:nopity:

[Angelus]

93. Hopefully he's getting what he deserves.

An eternity in Hell.

[mitchum]

94. HE WAS A DESTRUCTIVE AND STUPID MAN...

I neither celebrate nor mourn his death

[Lou_C]

95. Reagan taught me how to hate

The lying SOB took office on a lie. Carter had freed the hostages and they were sitting on a landing strip in a plane and they couldn't be released until after Reagan won the election.

He called Ketchup and Mustard vegetables and kids lunches at school became unbalanced because of him.

Iran Contra, Iran Contra, Iran Contra...Lie Lie Lie.

I hated the lying SOB.

Rest in Hell Reagan.

[Bombero1956]

111. he was also a cheat

Lest anyone forget, I remember one of the first debates between Reagan and Carter during the 1980 presidential campaign, briefing papers to be used by Jimmy Carter in preparation for the October 28 debate with his Republican challenger had somehow been acquired by Reagan's team. The papers gave Reagan advance warning about the issues his opponent would raise. A Reagan "mole" had "stolen" the papers. This was the kind of person Reagan really was.

[playahata1]

113. That "mole," if I remember correctly, was ABC's own GEORGE WILL.

n/t

[LibDemAlways]

96. Thanks, Will.

Watching the media whores elevate the B-actor turned RW politician into some sort of god is sickening.

He drove up deficits, created a hell of a lot of homelessness, ignored AIDS, and eliminated tax breaks that benefitted the middle class.

His family life was a textbook example of repuke hypocrisy. His friends were the rich and famous - and he happily took whatever they offered - including a home with an impressive zip code.

Reagan's great gift was that he could read a script and make people believe he was some sort of kindly grandfather type - when in actuality he was the creep guarding the front door while his minions were ripping us off and creating mayhem behind the scenes.

He was the prototype for the chimp in an increasingly Stepfordized America.

[hunter]

97. Jimmy Carter was my president, and he still is.

Reagan had a lot to forget, and God blessed him with that, and that's the only reason he didn't drop straight down into hell today. God will probably give Reagan a second shot at heaven, but I'm glad I don't have to find that sort of love for the man in my own heart.

I remember seeing Reagan at a very public event during his second term and it was obvious he didn't know where he was, or what he was supposed to be doing. It was horrible because everyone ignored it, and that evening they showed his smiling face on television, and pretended everything was okay.

I feel sick today. The horrible choreography exploiting his death is so damned blatant. I actually punched the screen of my television, and in front of my kids too. I can't watch it.

[Blue_Tires]

98. ttt

my entrance in politics came when i was 18, and it was 1994, the year the REpubs came out with their "contract on america." That pushed me to the left, and i've only been going farther left ever since...

I was a kid in reagan's heyday...I remember me and many of my classmates in elementary school thought he was some kind of superhero, who could defeat the enitre USSR by himself, of only given the chance. I was born in a military town (Norfolk, VA) so this was the prevailing attitude at the time...

Of course, as a kid i did NOT know or even care about the air traffic controllers, El Salvador, Corporate malfeasance, 270 marines, 'trickle-down economics,' and AIDS was something that had "Band" in front of it and came in a little tin box.

Bottom line is i'm not here to criticize him, nor am i especially sad to see him go. He lived a long and healthy life, and he had been an ill recluse for years. As far as the public was concerned, for all intents and purposes he died years ago. They're just deciding to bury him now. I guess what I'm saying is that i could really care less. Like many deaths, this is sad, but NOT overly tragic.

I also want to say i hope this board can quit sniping at each other, and understand there are some posters that will miss reagan, some who don't care, and some who are still partying as i write this. (my party is being reserved for jesse helms, personally)

[REP]

99. Anyone Else Remember

a cartoon from the Raygun era, showing Ronnie reincarnated as a poor black HIV+ woman in jail with an unwanted pregnancy and an abusive husband? I do. Then as now it made me want to believe in reincarnation.

On the other hand, Alzheimer's seemed like instant karmic payback.

[JCMach1]

100. My response is here....

http://www.thesyndrome.com/archives/00000993.htm

[saracat]

101. The good thing about the death of Ronald Reagan

is that we don't have to pay for his secret service anymore! The bad thing is they will stick us with a huge bill for a state funeral that he doesn't deserve!

[FDRrocks]

102. I thought I would be happy when he died...

in light of all his shitty policy stances and the crimes against humanity that occured due to his policies.

But I am not happy. I am saddened.

RIP Reagan.

I can't quite reconcile it all. I got the same feeling when the media was plastering images of Husseins sons pourous bodies all over the place. I knew they were deplorable human beings... but they were human beings.

"This world is so depressing."

[radfringe]

103. didn't vote for him the first time

nor the second time

and at the end of his term in 1988 I let out a sigh of relief and cringed at the thought of mini-me-reagan-poppy-bush for at least another 4 years

I am now wincing at the GOP proposals to rename EVERYTHING after reagan - although they may stop short of renaming bus-stop benches on the routes that go by the unemployment offices...

[noiretextatique]

104. race-baiting reagan

some of his supposed "optimism" was thinly-veiled appeals to racism. race relations, and civil rights progess, worsened under reagan.
as to his demise, i have no feelings whatsoever. i think only of the other people who died today, some of whom are probably more deserving of a thread.

[Jose Diablo]

105. Its the next day and I have had time to reflect on yesterday

Fuck you Reagan, you are still a prick, a dead one though and thats good.

I do not mourn your death, I rejoice.

If giving the chance, I would indeed piss on your grave.

Now I am ready to move on.

[mopaul]

107. I too feel a sense of closure to use an overused word

like a seeming hatred has been lifted. maybe like the families of murder victims feel when the killer is finally executed after 14 years on death row. not happy, but satisfied.

if i thought i could get away with it, i really would pee there.

[bread_and_roses]

106. I celebrate his death

Reagan's administration was the evil flowering of every selfish, cruel, complacent, bigoted, racist, greedy impulse that a rational social contract is constructed to restrain and mitigate. For every person with HIV/AIDS, for every person still rotting in our prison's for some drug offense, for every disappeared, tortured, dead victim of his rapacious policies, I celebrate his death unashamed.

[mopaul]

108. some folks either don't know recent history, or have bad memories

the guy was a nazi, and his crew is now running the show.

[skippysmom]

109. Thank you for this post

I am not rejoicing that Reagan is gone.

However, I am sick already of the maudlin crap on TV and everywhere else about what a great president he was. They did it with Nixon, and they're doing it again today.

I plan to spend my day reading books about the Constitution for an upcoming field trip with a group of teachers.

[RebelOne]

112. I don't feel good or bad about Reagan's death.

After all, he was just about dead anyway for the past few years. I hated him just as much as I hate Bush now.

[scrotim]

114. Why do you repeat phrases so often in your writing?

I'm referring mainly to the "...was a Reagan creature" device you use in this thread's post. You tend to use that repetition thing frequently in your writing, and it strikes me as annoying; even a bit Peggy Noonan-ish.

I've lurked here for three years, and I've always found your writing well-informed and full of information.

But there's a tone of grandiosity, perhaps arrogance, that I find off-putting...for instance: in the above post, where you share with the reader that your "life's work" to this point has been to "staunch the bleeding" of this poor, wounded nation.

I mean, are you saving the life of America all on your own? Do you do anything else with your time, or is this a 24-7 commitment on your part?

I don't mean this as a hostile post; I think writers, especially those as prolific as you, should be open to criticism. It can only make you better.

What do you think?

[fedsron2us]

115. This by far the best post I have read on this subject

The death of Ronald Reagan, father and husband, is obviously sad for his family, even though at the age of 93 years it can not be described as unexpected. However, those of us who are not immediate relatives are under no more obligation to mourn his passing than we would be for any other individual with whom we have no direct acquaintance or intimate knowledge. To assert otherwise is emotional hypocrisy.

With regards to Reagan's political legacy, I fear that his administration sowed the seeds of many of the worlds current woes. He died just as his country started to reap the bitter harvest.

[Carolina]

116. "sowed the seeds"

so very true. We and many people all over the world have been reaping the bitter harvest of his policies and the dreadful people he brought to power with him many of whom are enjoying a resurrection with the current idiot-in-chief.

Thank goodness for this thread and similar ones here on DU. My TV is off and will remain so until this revisionist history, glorifying, deifying lovefest is over. I can't stand it and I can't make nice about the man simply because he finally died.

I witnessed the hope that was Kennedy destroyed, and have now lived through the spite of Nixon, the deceit concealed by an amiable front that was Reagan, the hypocritical bullshit of Bush I and now the hell of his devil spawn Bush II. Thanks to them (the last 4), all cut from the same cloth, we are on a downward spiral that I am not sure can ever be remedied.

[Dropkick]

118. I feel cheated...

...because of Alzheimers, he never went through the end of life soul-searching and regrets that many people go through when confronted with their own mortality. I doubt he ever regretted one thing he did. I feel cheated, because I know that he never looked back on his actions and thought "I was wrong, and because of that, people got hurt and people died."

I hope that whereever he's gone, he spends an eternity enveloped in the pain and death that he caused.

[gpandas]

119. the first celebrity elected president...

now we have ahnold in california, and daffy duck in the white house. started the dumbing down of america. started issue of religion in government(astrology). started 'lying to the max' as mainstay of repug party. the only good that came from his time in office was the revelation of the stupidity of vast numbers of the american people. unfortunately, only the repugs take advantage of this fact. i mean one can consistently lie to these people and they don't appear to care.

[Tatiana]

120. This is a five-star post.

Really don't have anything to add. You've summed up my feelings perfectly.

[DinahMoeHum]

121. Well somehow, I'm not feeling like a Munchkin over this.

Reagan was in living death for a long while because of Alzheimer's. Given his legacy, he was already in a living hell.

He has to answer before God now. Fortunately, I'm not his judge, but I don't expect to see him in Heaven when I go anyway.


:evilfrown:

[FreakinDJ]

122. 66 Things to Think About Reagan

The firing of the air traffic controllers, winnable nuclear war, recallable nuclear missiles, trees that cause pollution, Elliott Abrams lying to Congress, ketchup as a vegetable, colluding with Guatemalan thugs, pardons for F.B.I. lawbreakers, voodoo economics, budget deficits, toasts to Ferdinand Marcos, public housing cutbacks, redbaiting the nuclear freeze movement, James Watt.

Getting cozy with Argentine fascist generals, tax credits for segregated schools, disinformation campaigns, "homeless by choice," Manuel Noriega, falling wages, the HUD scandal, air raids on Libya, "constructive engagement" with apartheid South Africa, United States Information Agency blacklists of liberal speakers, attacks on OSHA and workplace safety, the invasion of Grenada, assassination manuals, Nancy's astrologer.

Drug tests, lie detector tests, Fawn Hall, female appointees (8 percent), mining harbors, the S&L scandal, 239 dead U.S. troops in Beirut, Al Haig "in control," silence on AIDS, food-stamp reductions, Debategate, White House shredding, Jonas Savimbi, tax cuts for the rich, "mistakes were made."

Michael Deaver's conviction for influence peddling, Lyn Nofziger's conviction for influence peddling, Caspar Weinberger's five-count indictment, Ed Meese ("You don't have many suspects who are innocent of a crime"), Donald Regan (women don't "understand throw-weights"), education cuts, massacres in El Salvador.

"The bombing begins in five minutes," $640 Pentagon toilet seats, African- American judicial appointees (1.9 percent), Reader's Digest, C.I.A.-sponsored car-bombing in Lebanon (more than eighty civilians killed), 200 officials accused of wrongdoing, William Casey, Iran/contra.

"Facts are stupid things," three-by-five cards, the MX missile, Bitburg, S.D.I., Robert Bork, naps, Teflon.

David Corn, March 2, 1998, The Nation

http://www.thenation.com/edcut/index.mhtml?bid=7&pid=1051

[maggrwaggr]

124. Great post!

I'm bookmarking this whole thread.

[slaveplanet]

126. The problem, reaction ,solution

That was created by the Reagan administration's blind eye policy toward Iran/Contra, Which allowed the CIA to greatly increase it's role as the nations leading importer and dealer of illicit controlled substances. Which in turn led to massive roll backs of civil liberties under the massive escalation of a Militarized domestic police forces(drug warriors)and effectively criminalized major segments of the population. The juggernaut rise of the Prison /slave labor/industrial complex. The laws that came from such policies (laws which many of the Patriot act provisions use as basis points)in conjunction with the media deregulation will prove to be the (slow)death knell of freedom in this republic.

thank you Mr Reagan your accomplishments shall be duly noted in Hell.

[Clintonite]

123. To Hell With Reagan!

That guy told as many lies as w has! And just like w, he got away with it time in and time out!?!? The whole key for those two are to lower the expectations of them so when they complete one sentence right, people think they changed the world.

Fuck reagan.

T.Hall

[Justpat]

125. He was responsible for my activism.

During his presidency Pennsylvania Avenue was still open to the
public. You could protest directly in front of the White House
all day and night if you wanted to. His policies on the homeless and
his stunt of labeling ketchup a vegetable in poor kids school
lunches enraged me.

To the absolute horror of my family and friends, I stood for months
one winter out in front of his White House carry a big sign with a
quote from the Old Testament that said: "What mean ye that ye beat
my people to pieces and grind the faces of the poor?" I was out there
with a few others that had been there for ages protesting nuclear
arms policies.

His policies on just about everything were mean spirited, evil
and ill informed. But what scared me most about his time in office
was the public's adoration of him. His presidency was a triumph of
style over substance and fact. Most people think the dumbing down
of America was complete with the appointment of Bush, but I think
the public's acceptance of this fool as a leader was a chilling
example of the public's inability to distinguish truth from fiction.
It was as if the majority of the citizens here choose a fictional
president because they liked the scipt. And they confused the ability
to deliver a well written speech with intellect.

And the Iran Contra affair was, for me, the first moment in my life
that I realized how much I loved this country - and how despairing
I was of it returning to it's original vision. The people accepted
lies as truth and they made heroes out of crooks and tyrants.

The media circus that is going on now over his death is pathetic.
No one in mainstream media, no one, has the strength of character
to tell it like it is.

[IconoclastIlene]

127. Thank you for summarizing my own feelings.

I really don't give a darn; and his sniveling wife asking for stem cell research to save her darling hub; makes me want to gag!!

[David Zephyr]

129. Sharp Observations And, As Always, Well Said.

Thank you, William for putting into words what a lot of us have been feeling.

[htuttle]

131. Reagan stole my Pell grant and flooded my city with contra crack!

Fuck him and the horse he rode in on!