Lets' put these strong feelings about Reagan to constuctive use.

[Raskolnik]

I have a question for all of us here at DU: what is the best way to present our ideas in the context of Reagan's death?

I am calling for ideas and suggestions about how to use Reagan's legacy (both positive and negative aspects) to work agains Bush. I'm interested in topics that point out the failings of the Bush administration against the backdrop of Reagan's (supposed) ideals and similarities in their failings as President.

Anyone with quotes to use, interesting columns they think are pertinent, or letters to the editor suggestions is invited to share them with us here.

We've got to remember that a disconcertly large percentage of Americans remember Reagan fondly. That's a fact we must deal with. I'm not interested in alientating those people from our cause, but I am interested in persuading some people to vote against W in November.

Thanks in advance for the input.

[Walt Starr]

1. Even though I despised the evil old fuck

We need to remind the voters that G.W. is no Ronald Reagan.

[Raskolnik]

2. Agree.

But what specifically do you think would be helpful in that regard?

[Robbien]

3. I like the idea of saying Reagan Deficit whenever we refer to the deficit

Or say Reagan/Bush wars of aggression and Reagan/Bush Deficits.

If Bush wants to be linked to Reagan, link them together on all the negative things they both support.

[Raskolnik]

5. That's a start...

Not bad.

[MoonRiver]

4. So what do you think about Robbien's suggestion, Raskolnik?

The one where Reagan and bush* are always linked in the negative?

[Burma Jones]

6. Here are some Contrasts

Reagan grew up poor with a nasty alcoholic Dad
Reagan put himself through college
Reagan played football
Reagan supported FDR
Reagan read books
Reagan read newspapers
Reagan could write his own material
Reagan headed a Union
Reagan could handle an occasional drink
Reagan was a success before he was President

The Chimp:
Grew up in lap of luxury
Had a free ride at Yale
was a cheerleader
only supported his Daddy
doesn't read
doesn't write
was a drunk cokehead (not that it makes him a bad person)
failed at business




Policy-wise, I'm too busy to do the research, but my general impression is that the Chimp feels that, since Congress is in Republican hands, the over 50% of us that are Democrats have no say and can go to hell. At least Reagan had to get along with the Democrats and you did not get the feeling of complete sneering hatred that you get from the Chimp and his lot.

[Raskolnik]

7. Good points all.

That's exactly the kind of thing I was looking for. You should write a letter to the editor if you have the time.

[DNA]

16. Let's not start

believing all the nonsense being put out about Reagan. It's bad enough seeing all these Democrats coming out and licking his behind. Reagan was famously not a reader, not a man who could write his own lines or think on his feet (although he did deliver prepared lines much better than Shrubby), and not a reader of newspapers. He read the Reader's Digest, and that's about it.

[Raskolnik]

22. Hoist them on their own petard...so to speak.

I'm sort of leaning towards using the myth against Bush. If people want to pretend that Reagan was a great, towering figure, I think it will only make W look more pathetic by comparison.

Some people will not be convinced between now and November about the realities of Reagan's legacies, but I think we have a much better shot at convincing them about W's bumbling incompetance.

[wryter2000]

24. Elevating the discourse

I forget the exact * quote, but he said something like he wanted to elevate the discourse. In fact, he's slung mud from day 1 and is only getting worse. He even played dirty tricks on McCain. Mondale recently said that he appreciated that Reagan was never negative in the campaign against him. Thinking back, I can't think of anything particularly negative he said about either Carter or Mondale.

Compare that to Willie Horton and the lies * is saying about Kerry now.

[merh]

8. What about ...

What about all of the "pro military nonsense" that they profess, yet they close military bases, threaten to close military bases, close and threaten to close VA hospitals, cut veterens' benefits and benefits to retirees and dependents.

Talk about flip flop - even Lott tried to pass legislation to put off or stall base closings and G.W. advised he will veteo the bill, so it died. McCain is against tax cuts during this "war" because how do you justify tax cuts when your military is stretched thin?

All the cuts to veterans began in Ronnie's "pristin world".

Then of course, the outsourcing!
How do the soldiers really feel about "serving" next to mercaniers who make as much as $100,000.00 (tax free) and they get paid peanuts and come home to families on food stamps, praying they still have a job?

Kerry needs to suggest that all military be provided the same benefits of the mercanies. Tax Free - No taxes for the military.

Talk about a tax cut that would get the nation behind him. It only makes sense, don't you think.

[Pithlet]

9. Remind them of the Iran Contra affair.

If you want to remind them of the negative aspects of the Reagan legacy, and how the consequences of those actions have affected us to this day, and Bush continues that legacy.

http://www.webcom.com/pinknoiz/covert/irancontra.html

[playahata1]

10. Reagan certainly was no friend to African Americans.

I am African American, and as such I do not fit into Reagan's vision of America. I was 13 when Ronnie was elected the first time, so I saw the Reagan Era in all its brutality. My neighborhood was and is one of many black neighborhoods in which crack flowed freely, in which many people died and/or went to jail over drugs. And it was Reagan's CIA that used the profits from those sales of crack -- and powdered cocaine -- to fund covert operations against governments and other groups the Administration did not like. Also, my black women friends, neighbors, and relatives were ridiculed as "welfare queens." Even if they weren't on welfare, Reagan certainly gave the impression that all black women were busy pumping out babies for more benefits. Yes, you can say that Reagan was indeed bad for black Americans.

Also, in 1986, my grandfather lost his job of 32 years because his union had been weakened, thanks to Reagan's destruction of PATCO. And it was under Reagan that cuts in Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid began. Today, my grandparents are barely keeping their heads above water, and Medicaid does not pay all of my medical bills -- I am a cancer patient -- and how the hell can anyone live on the $376 a month I am getting in SSI disability payments? (And I expect to return to my teaching soon.) You can lay these things at Ronnie's feet, too.

I don't have the time now to dig up specific articles about these two issues. But they are out there, and if you are still around later, I can get you a link or two or three.

[Raskolnik]

15. Sure.

So I think you are proposing to appeal specifically to African Americans?

What kinds of arguments would be best to draw those parallels between Reagan's policies and W's?

[Raskolnik]

23. Hope I didn't overstep.

Hey, I hope I didn't offend you by inviting you to post on this thread. I just thought that all the energy should be channeled into something constructive. That'a all.

For what it's worth, I think you should probably write some letters to whatever publications you think would be appropriate asking them to address your issues.

[Zero Gravitas]

11. Reagan was an optimist

who appealed to the good in all of us (so says the Corporate media) but Bush is an evil twisted little fuck who tries to hold on to power through fear mongering.

[no name no slogan]

12. One thing that's sorely missing this year: "the vision thing"

One thing that made Reagan immensely popular (IMHO) with Americans was that he had an overriding optimistic VISION for how great the country could really be, if we put our minds to it.

Even though us Dems disagreed with Reagan's visions of "greatness", he spelled out exactly what he believed in, and didn't need "handlers" or "defenders" to explain what it was he said every time. With Kerry, we're still not quite sure on where he stands, or what his vision for the country is-- other than it's not Dubya's. Sure, he has a number of positions that are different from Shrub (some are substantially different), but there's not a coherancy that Reagan was able to put across-- no overall driving ideology that is clearly different from Shrub and the PNAC boys, other than "not Shrub".

That may be enough to get 45% of the vote, but that may not be enough to WIN this year. Kerry needs to boldly stake out his territory, like Reagan did, and tell American what he's really all about. Not in policy-wonkish detail (like a tax break for companies not exporting jobs), but in a grand VISION of what he wants America to be in 4-8 years (i.e., protection for American jobs, an end to corporate dominance of economy and government; a foreign policy based on cooperation; not confrontation, etc.)

In that sense, Reagan took his cue from FDR, who boldly articulated not only what was wrong with the country, but how to fix it, too. FDR had his "We have nothing to fear..." speech, Reagan has his "Morning in America" commercials. So far, I've not heard anything that inspiring from Kerry. I know he has it in him, as his 1971 anti-Vietnam speech proves, but he's just not getting it together.....yet.

Even if people don't always agree with you, they appreciate your willingness to stand up for what you believe in. Here in MN, Paul Wellstone did that, and consequently got a lot of Republican votes because he was honest, and would do what he felt was the right thing because you KNEW where he stood. People hate politicians who waffle, or try to excuse a bad decision and not own up to it. Even former House Speaker Tip O'Neill said that if you change your mind, announce it, explain it, and move on.

We can learn from Reagan in that respect: paint an optimistic picture of what John Kerry's America will be. Run on a message of HOPE, not fear. Tell America what will be BETTER for them in a Kerry Administration, not what could happen to them if they vote for Shrub.

[Raskolnik]

13. Excellent point.

Put that in a letter to your paper's editor. Send it. Please.

Thanks.

[merh]

14. not even a shrub

definitely a weed!

[Hamlette]

17. Reagan could change

He was against taxes but when he realized that social security needed fixing he increased taxes.

he increased the size of government by 25% even though he was against "big government". If Reagan is such a hero maybe he was right when he realized the need for big government?

It wasn't Reagan's threatening behavior that "brought down" the soviet union, it was his willingness to negotiate with Gorbachev on a nuclear arms treaty. That gave Gorbachev stature in his own country to pull off some reforms. (Article today about Reagan's "U" turn). I also remember Reagan's "backpack diplomacy", letting Americans behind the Iron Curtain to travel exposing them to our lifestyle and educated us as to theirs. It was Reagan's diplomacy, not his rush to go to war, that helped the process along. Reagan would never have gone into this Iraq war. (I don't have many facts to back that up but I repeat it whenever I can.)

Reagan was not a religious nut case. He used the religious right to get elected but then ignored them. They were not happy but knew they had no where else to go. (PBS special on rise of religious right.) He knew better than to say God told him to do something. He could defend his positions without using the ultimate trump card.

[phoebe]

18. so many similarities between Reagan and Bush - where to begin..

start at the behind-the-scenes meddling with the US election involving the hostages in Iran and go on from there. While we're on the subject, voting rights ranked low on the list of Reagan priorities.


http://www.aclufl.org/news_events/archive/2001/simon_voting.cfm

From the passage of the Voting Rights Act in 1965 through the 1980's, the ACLU Foundation's Voting Rights Project filed approximately 200 lawsuits in as many separate jurisdictions, shouldering most of the burden of private voting rights enforcement. The Voting Rights Project's work took on increasing importance through the 1980's when the Department of Justice Civil Rights Division during the Reagan administration virtually abandoned its voting rights enforcement responsibilities under the law. The project challenged racial barriers to the right to vote as well as election challenges that involved the clarity of the ballot and other voting irregularities.

[calimary]

19. Reagan launched Saddam.

Everything we wound up not liking about Saddam Hussein got started under Reagan/bush. A gentle reminder here and there...

[VOX]

20. In 1976, Reagan was all over Gerald Ford about the *national debt*!

Ronald Reagan: "Speech to America," March 31, 1976
"...Now, in this election year 1976, we're told we're coming out of this recession just because inflation and unemployment rates have fallen, to what they were at the worst of the previous recession. If history repeats itself, will we be talking recovery four years from now merely because we've reduced inflation from 25 percent to 12 percent?

"The fact is, we'll never build a lasting economic recovery by going deeper into debt at a faster rate than we ever have before. It took this nation 166 years until the middle of World War II to finally accumulate a debt of $95 billion. It took this administration just the last 12 months to add $95 billion to the debt. And this administration has run up almost one-fourth of the total national debt in just these short 19 months..."
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Of course, Reagan fell short of delegates in '76. But when he got into office in 1980, he ran up the national debt like a fleet of drunken sailors. His "shining city" was built on a mountain of debt.

http://www.counterpunch.org/freeman05302003.html
...Jimmy Carter's last budget deficit was $77 billion. Reagan's first deficit was $128 billion. His second deficit exploded to $208 billion. By the time the "Reagan Revolution" was over, George H.W. Bush was running an annual deficit of $290 billion per year.

Yearly deficits, of course, add up to national debt. When Reagan took office, the national debt stood at $994 billion. When Bush left office, it had reached $4.3 trillion. In other words, the national debt had taken 200 years to reach $1 trillion. Reagan's Supply Side experiment quadrupled it in the next 12 years...

[Raskolnik]

21. Deficits are a good choice.

Yeah, I fail to see anything "conservative" in crippling debt either.

You should write a letter to the editor making those points.

Thanks.

[Armstead]

25. From The Nation magazine

This is from an unabashedly progressive writer. I agree with him 100 percent. Worth reading.

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0607-04.htm

Published on Monday, June 7, 2004 by The Nation
Reagan's Politics of Passion
by John Nichols

EXCERPT

....The lesson to be learned from Reagan is not an ideological one. His ideology was wrong for America and wrong for the world -- something even Reagan sometimes recognized, as when he backed away from the most extreme tenets of the conservative agenda to, for instance, defend Social Security, and when he finally agreed, at the behest of Margaret Thatcher, to negotiate with reformist Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev.

Rather, the lesson to be learned from Reagan is a stylistic one. He loved preaching his conservative doctrines. And he loved battling with liberals at the ballot box, at the debate podium and in the Capitol. He was a conservative first, a Republican second. He showed no respect for party decorum, challenging a sitting Republican president -- Gerald Ford -- who he felt was too moderate. And he was willing to lose on principle, whether in that 1976 nomination fight with Ford or, during his presidential terms, in fights with Congress over tax policy, foreign affairs or nominations to the U.S. Supreme Court.

Just imagine if Bill Clinton had been as committed to advancing an activist liberal ideology as Reagan was to his conservative agenda. America might have a national health care plan today. Labor law reform could have been a reality, rather than an empty promise. The United States would certainly have a more progressive judiciary. And here's another notion: If Clinton or Al Gore had put as much energy and enthusiasm into educating Americans about and promoting a liberal agenda as Reagan did for his conservative ideals, the United States would today have a different Congress and president.

This willingness to fight so fearlessly and forcefully for his political faith is what made the 40th president remarkable. It is what inspired conservatives. And it is the one thing that liberals would do well to learn from Ronald Reagan.