the facts be damned, anyone but bush frothing at the mouth

[westsidexview]

will only alienate centrist voters. i am afraid that the left is scaring people with their mooneyesque acceptance of anything anti-bush regardless of how convoluted or dishonest the criticism may be. i don't like bush. i think he is trying to change the country to benefit himself and his friends and the rest of america be damned. yet to march lock-step against bush with an "all is fair in love and war " mentality is beneath the true american spirit. opinion is one thing but to wholesale distort facts is wrong.

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Welcome to DU. :^) I disagree with your point, but glad you spoke up.

[drthais]

2. and what facts

would those be?

would you care to elaborate?

and guess what
it IS Anyone But Bush

[Bunny]

4. Yes, please, do tell us what facts are distorted?

What is not factual? Because you know, I am SO concerned about what those people think...:eyes:

[westsidexview]

14. i want bush to lose

but what i am talking about is when howard dean gave the "i have a scream". he sounded more like churchill defending england than a serious candidate in 21st century america politics. and in f911 when mr. moore tried to sign up members of congress's children to fight in iraq. #1 were the children old enough? and #2 if they were old enough they would have to sign up themselves(their parents couldn't sign them up). for people to defend a cause is one thing but to defend it at the cost of common sense corrupts the democratic process. i do not want to argue with anyone but i do want bush to lose. freepers have money and the electoral college on their side. they are tough to beat. but if we have truth on our side, we stand a chance. if we don't, well i feel it is just too risky to go down that road. we must be better than the freepers.

[VolcanoJen]

16. So, Michael Moore's request of Congress Members bothers you more...

... than the fact that currently, only ONE child of a member of Congress is serving in Iraq?

Congress voted to send that member's child off to an immoral and unnecessary war, and yet no other members of Congress are willing to make a similar sacrifice.

That's what bothers me... not the fact that Moore drew attention to it.

I refuse to even address the Howard Dean speech. :puke:

And as far as treating the right wing with "kid gloves," include me out. Gloves are off now, and it's time to kick some ass. Let them go cowering and scurrying into the darkness of their lies and enabling. I don't give a crap, and we're not going to need such "sensitive types" to win this election, anyway...

[Bunny]

18. Well, excuse me while I go puke.

We HAVE truth on our side, my friend, and we ARE better than the freepers. We're right, they're wrong. We need to use whatever means at our disposal to show the rest of America the truth. Including Mike Moore's movie.

I'd still like to know what is not factual? Have you answered that?

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

23. You want Bush to lose...

But you want us to shut up about the hard facts of his maladministration?

Is this some kind of Zen thing?

[VolcanoJen]

26. You don't want to argue with anyone, you say....

... but the fact is, you can't just drop Right Wing Talking Point Bombs and then scurry away without discussing the counterpoints.

If you don't want to argue with anyone, then you might prefer turning off the computer, flopping on the couch and ordering the latest Vin Diesel flick on the pay-per-view.

Just a suggestion.

[ibegurpard]

31. They don't necessarily want to argue

they want to see if it is still possible to exploit the left's fear of appearing too "nutty."
I'm afraid they've dipped into that well a few too many times.

[tom_paine]

37. Why is it you fellas always are so keen to ID yourselves in that way

"I want Bush to lose."

Yeah, NOW I believe you.

:silly: :crazy: :crazy:

[LuminousX]

39. freepers have money and the electoral college on their side

Uh..no.

Freepers have jack.
Bush has a slight money advantage.
The Electoral College, if it is like 2000, is pretty much split. Remember, more people voted for Gore than Bush.

[JHB]

41. How old are you?

Exact age isn't necessary, I just want to find out how much "perspective" you have, because from MY vantage point "being better" than the wingnuts for the last twenty years is what PRODUCED the Bush presidency.

Have you paid attention to politics since the Reagan era? Noticed how all the political talkshows for two decades pitted Right Wing legbreakers against milquetoaste centrists labeled "left". Noticed how the entire spectrum of political debate has been yanked rightward?

Sorry, but as long as we keep fundamentally honest, stunts like the "congressional kid recruiting drive" are fair game. It just shows how ridiculous their position is.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

52. LOL so I guess you think it would've been better if MM had never made F911

...

NOT

Try again.

[fdr_hst_fan]

3. Like Lloyd Bentsen tried

to tell Michael Dukakis: Politics is a contact sport, especially since the advent of broadcast media.

[rooboy]

5. What facts do you claim are being distorted 'wholesale'? n/t

[mike1963]

6. Could you please translate that post into English for those of us who

aren't literate in gobblygook?
Thank you!

[VolcanoJen]

7. Mind offering a list of the "anti-Bush facts" you're in disagreement of?

Let's do a point-by-point rebuttal here, because I'm not quite sure what you're talking about.

[acmavm]

8. Jeez, there's been a lot of this stuff lately. But I wonder, why do you

suggest. Sugar coat the truth? Not point out that the entire planet thinks he's the most dangerous person on earth as well as the most hated? That he lied to get us into the mess we're in, and God only knows when the hell we'll ever get out. That someone in his administration isn't a traitor in the Plame affair? That he hasn't just about bankrupted the treasury, put future generations in debt, undermined every environmental law ever passed?

[westsidexview]

17. i remember the 1984 democratic convention

it was too preachy and democrats were embarrassed

[alvis]

24. As Lewis Black said recently on The Daily Show

Hate in the now. That was 20 years ago. Got something current?

[charlie]

28. "Preachy" is a matter of style

And has fuck-all to do with your charge of "wholesale distortion" of facts, not unless you're claiming Mondale et al were spinning whoppers in 1984.

[physioex]

9. Please be specific, I can.....

We went to war over lies. This country is commiting mass murder and torture. Over 800 troops have died in the past three years. Shrub family is doing busniess with Bin Laden, and Saudi Arabia. Carlye and Halliburton are profiteering from the war....

[leesa]

10. OK. Whatever. Join the club. Have fun!

[merh]

11. What facts have been distorted, we all what to know.

Maybe you have misinterrupted or misread a post. Give us a chance to clarify and/or answer you regarding the wholesale distortion of facts.

[Th1onein]

12. Welcome to DU. I think that is bullshit, though.

The left has put up with the nasty right wing tactics for years. Guess what? We can get nasty, too. We're tired of it, and we're not going to take it anymore!

[shraby]

15. The difference between the right wing

and us is we deal with truthful facts that can be substantiated. Please, please tell us what we are not being truthful about.

[Tosca]

13. . i am afraid that the left is scaring people with their mooneyesque

The repub party OWNS mooneyesque, he's on their payroll, sweetie.

[Sentath]

25. I thought it was the other way around

After all they weren't crowned by him, they crowned him and he declared himself the messiah.

'Course I could be wrong. He wouldn't be the only delusional on the payroll. ( ;

{rlg}

[Tosca]

30. You are correct.

I spoke too soon, the Repubs don't own Moonie the Looney, they like him because he has a lot of money, the only qualifier that really matters to the Repub dickheads. If you got money, you're my honey!
Bunch of whores.

[prodigal_green]

27. Yep...except

it's the other way around.

Links:

http://www.iht.com/articles/526495.html
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/06/21/moon/index_np.html

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

19. "The Only Thing in The Middle of The Road..."

"Is Yellow Lines and Dead Armadillos".

Fact is, the right wing, in their ascendancy to hitherto unchallenged power has screwed, blued and tattooed the middle class of this country. On wages, working conditions, employment opportunities, education, individual rights, privacy, health care and many other issues, the fix is in and they aim to keep it there. They maintain their power by using rather unimportant social wedge issues to keep people angry, hurt, confused, apart and marginalised. They often do that by demogoguing those issues to the point of the lie.

Fact is, it is high time that the hard truths of them and their tactics was told. Sad fact is that the truth is sometimes not pretty or polite. We have, as a part of the body politic, been eviscerated and emasculated long enough, and it is past time for us to find our voices and use them.

If these things upset you, oh well. Ask your doctor or pharmacist about Atavan, 'cause the party is over for the right and we ain't gonna shut up and sit down any more.

Full Stop. After all, people are dying out there.

[ibegurpard]

20. zzzzzzzzzz

:boring:

[Sweetpea]

21. I understand

I just read a post that said the CIA is behind the beheading of Berg. It isn't going to help anyone unless there are sources. I do believe Michael Moore has a crew of fact checkers.

[luaneryder]

29. Excuse me, but wholesale distorted facts

is Exactly what the current administration is doing. Now, I need another list to fact check, damn!

[Just Me]

32. Fact is, this administration betrayed the American people,...

,...exploited the American people, in order to profit themselves, their cronies, and expand their own power. This administration has no sense of honor or integrity. They deserve no respect.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[westsidexview]

34. tell me god , will i win the lottery?

[Karenina]

35. Help me out here

BUY A FUCKING TICKET.

[tom_paine]

36. Oh, PUH-LEEZE!

With that sort of "please don't hurt me" attitude, you must have taken quite a few beatings as a kid.

Got news for you, we GOT TO THIS PLACE, have almost LOST EVERYTHING the Old American Republic once stood for

from that kind of attitude!

NO MORE!

[Skittles]

47. AMEN

"distorting the facts"? That is rich.

[porphyrian]

38. Fuck "Centrist" Voters

What good have they done in the last two elections? If they are too stupid to see just how far right everything has moved while they've been waffling around and that Bush must be removed from office, then we don't need them anyway.

[rman]

40. so ehm, what about those distorted facts?

and what are you going to do to make bush lose?

[Forkboy]

43. Hey cool,another new DUer telling us all how we should act

You guys are really getting desperate.

[tom_paine]

48. Lot of 'em around here lately, ain't there?

Pigoby or Insannity must have mentioned us again.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Forkboy]

46. BTW,what facts are being distorted?

I notice the people bitching like this always tend to leave those little tidbits out of thier rants.

[VolcanoJen]

49. Awwww, crap.

You're still here? :eyes:

[LibertyorDeath]

50. The reasoning in your post is pure shit. IMO

If anything the left is helping to open centrist's eyes to just how much of a danger Shrub is to the America they love.

[matcom]

51. rrrriiiiggghhhhhttttt

who is distorting fact "friend"?

you can't debate Moore's facts any better than my RW co-woker who called him a liar today.

i turned to him and asked, "Can you prove ONE LIE with backup documentation and/or counter-facts?"

his response, "Moore is unAmerican"

that's it. NO FACTS. just pure HORSESHIT!

so, "friend", got anything else to ad other than PURE HORSESHIT?????


hhmmmmmmm???