Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Does any know much about The Koran or Mohamed?

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU
 
kat21 Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:37 AM
Original message
Does any know much about The Koran or Mohamed?
My brother-in-law says that Mohamed thought that those that did not worship Allah and the Koran should be executed. So far, the only websites that seem to state that are Christian websites (my brother-in-law is Christian). If I find a website that is for Muslims living in western countries, those seem to state that Mohamed was a very kind and loving man.

Thanks for your input.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Syrinx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:39 AM
Response to Original message
1. nope, nobody does, sorry
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:41 AM
Response to Original message
2. Wrong
Mohamed told all to honor people of the book. That means Christians, Jews, and muslims. Mohamed preached tolerance and peace.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kat21 Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Thanks Cally -
I thought it was a bunch of B.S. Believe it or not he's a dem living in the most conservative county in California. Not surprising his church would feed this to their parishioners. I sure wish he would see through it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. no he didnt cally
he wasnt a peacekeeper, not even kinda. i will see if i can find the info, i read a huge ole site after 9/11. i am not into any particular religion, find them all interesting, am amazed at the similarities of christian and islamic, and certianly respect islamic beliefs.

from memory, there are 7 pillars. 5 of them are of love and lite and grace and peace. mohummad is later and it is not love and acceptance and allowance. it is domination of the world. i remember one part that speaks, it is the muslims job to go out amongst the non believers and even live their lives to hide their religion so they can take them down.

wish i had saved. i hit many sites, but i found a really good one

now this is not how the majority of muslims practice their faith, just as the majority of christians arent the fire and brimstone of the old testament
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Both of us must goggle and find the passages
and debate tomorrow. I'm going to bed.

Mohamed was a prophet who survived battles. Much of his testimony is not about peace. However, his prophecy is about peace, love, and tolerance. And no, I'm not Muslim. I'm Christian.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #12
19. wink.....bed for me too
high five. that sounds about right.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ani Yun Wiya Donating Member (639 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
3. islamonline.com
There are many links there.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kat21 Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Thanks for the link
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigbillhaywood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
4. Depends on if you were an infidel or Zimmi
Zimmi are "People of the Book"-- Christians and Jews. They don't have to convert to Islam in a Muslim country (though they cannot prostelyze to Muslims), and may worship freely (more or less). Infidels (everyone else) must convert or die according to Mohammed. But there's only one thing you need to know about the Koran, or Bible or Torah, or any holy book-- they're all irrational BS at worst, cultural myths at best.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shraby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. Google Koran and
you'll find it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:49 AM
Response to Original message
9. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
bigbillhaywood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Suck my big Arab-American cock you Freeper fuck.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Kewl!
I finally caught one before it got deleted.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
minkyboodle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:02 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. LOL
not much I can add to that :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Enjoy your stay n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IranianDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Mommy bought you a computer for your birthday eh?
.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Djinn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:11 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. Go fuck yourself
you know absolute nothing about Islam and I'd posit any other other subject.

The Koran teaches no more hate/war or love and peace than the Old and New Testament - problem is there are always going to be ignorant bigots like yourself easily conned by priests/Reverends/Rabbi's and Imams to beleiving a warped and historically innaccurate portrayal of each respective religion.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
blitzen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:16 AM
Response to Original message
17. some thoughts for you
Here's an excerpt from something I'm writing...Sorry for the academic language, but that's the way I write (it's my job), and I'm too tired to paraphrase it right now. Sorry also if this is a little long. But maybe there's something you can use here.


From the very beginning the Prophet Muhammad’s message aimed to challenge certain limits that had been erected between self and other, “us” and “them.” The early Meccan revelations counsel Muhammad’s contemporaries to overcome the limits of tribalism (in pre-Islamic Arabia, inter-tribal violence was the norm, and one had no moral obligation to extend any rights or sympathy whatsoever to those belonging to a tribe other than one’s own) and the limits of economic self-interest (the wealthy merchant class of Mecca showed little concern for the social welfare of others, of those epitomized in the Qur’an as “widows and orphans”). Later revelations counsel the now large and ever-growing Islamic community--a community built upon the extension to others of the category of “selfhood”--to question the limits dividing peoples according to their religions. The Qur’an teaches that it is not just Muslims but rather all peoples from all communities and cultures throughout history who have been blessed with a true and legitimate prophet: “A messenger has been sent to every people” (10.47). Muhammad does not offer a radically new revelation, a heretofore unheard of message (Qur’an 46.9: “Say: ‘I am not an innovation among the messengers’.”) What is new is not the truth that Muhammad brings but rather the insistence that all peoples have always been brought this truth.
The Qu’ran’s most notable ecumenical verse tells us that each divinely revealed way is, in its own way, a right way: “For every one of you We have ordained a law and a way. Had God pleased, He could have made you one community: but it is His wish to prove you by that which He has bestowed upon you. Vie (as in a race) with one another in good works, for to God you shall all return and He will explain for you your differences” (5.48). God does not merely tolerate, but rather he actively orchestrates and maintains religious and cultural differences. The Qur’an envisions a world community that is locally diverse but also ultimately unified: all virtuous humans are part of God’s community insofar as they submit themselves to God’s guidance, to the truth that God provided for them in their own traditions and in their own languages: “Each messenger We have sent has spoken in the language of his own people” (14.4). God, who delights in cultural and racial diversity (“Among His other wonders are the creation of the heavens and the earth and the diversity of your tongues and colors”; 30.21), has given each particular historical people the message in its own vernacular--so that the truth is never something alien to a community, never something imposed by one human community upon another (as Ibn Arabi puts it: God has sent “to each and every community an envoy who is one of their kind, not someone different to them.”) Despite their differing ways, all virtuous believers--all who heed the teachings that God has given them in their own religious tradition and in their own language--will end up returning to God, and all in the end will be saved: “Believers, Jews, Sabaeans and Christians--whoever believes in God and the Last Day and does what is right--shall have nothing to fear or to regret” (5.69). The religious limit that divides “us” from “them”--although it remains in place here on earth as testimony to God’s wondrous unlimited creativity--is in the final analysis effaced.
There was in the medieval Islamic exegetical tradition a debate concerning the referent of Qur’an 5.48’s li-kull-in (“unto each”). A minority of commentators took “unto each” to mean “unto every Muslim”; they thus took the verse to mean: “For every Muslim we have ordained a law and a way.” The diversity at stake here then is internal to Islam--a matter of the multiplicity of Islamic sects, which, according to a famous hadith (one of the canonical “Traditions” concerning the sayings and deeds of the Prophet) are said to be seventy-three in number. The aim of this minority reading of Qur’an 5.48 would then perhaps be to lend scriptural support to the legitimacy of pluralism within the Islamic community as a whole. Such a reading would be in accord with the non-canonical hadith: “The disagreements of my community are a blessing.” Here one might mention the position of the eminent scholar al-Baghdadi (d. 1037 AD), who maintained that any teachings that fit in the framework of the seventy-three sects, no matter how “heretical” they may appear in the eyes of others, have a legitimate place in the Muslim community. He cites an earlier thinker, al-Ka‘bi (d. 931 AD), who goes even farther, deeming legitimate anything taught by anyone who affirms the Prophethood of Muhammad and the truth of the Prophet’s teaching: “When one uses the expression ummat al-islam , it refers to everyone who affirms the prophetic character of Muhammad, and the truth of all that he preached, no matter what he asserts after this declaration.” The thrust of this position that, within the Islamic community, there are no doctrinal limits--that anything taught by a Muslim is by definition authentically “Islamic.”
But the majority of medieval exegetes understood the referent of Qur’an 5.48’s “unto each” to include Muslims and non-Muslims alike--so that the verse is understood not to be directed exclusively to the Muslim community but rather to a variety of religious communities. In accordance with the commentary of the great historian and exegete al-Tabari (d. 923 AD)--who showed that taking “unto each” to mean “unto each Muslim” makes no sense in itself and fails to respect the context of surrounding verses--every major medieval commentator took Qur’an 5.48 to be God’s declaration of ecumenical pluralism. Some of these took the referent of “unto each” to be the so-called “People of the Book,” a category that comprised Jews, Christians, and Muslims, but which, as Islamic civilization moved farther east and encountered more peoples in possession of scriptural traditions, was expanded to include Zoroastrians, Hindus and Buddhists. On this reading, the verse teaches that all virtuous individuals belonging to communities that profess scripture-based religions will in the end be counted among those in Paradise. An even more “liberal” interpretation was implied by commentators such as al-Zamakhshari (d. 1144 AD) and al-Baydawi (d. 1286 AD), for whom the referent of “unto each” is all humans, regardless of their religious identities. The thrust of this interpretation is that, when it comes to the matter of afterlife, there are no religious limits (dividing cultures or peoples that will be “saved” from those that will be “damned)”: all virtuous humans will be accorded their place in Paradise.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kat21 Donating Member (146 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. Wow, that's a lot of info -
I will have to print it out and read it later.

Thank you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yupster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
18. Here's a website that's interesting
to browse about.

www.askimam.com
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
dryan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. Your brother-in-law may be confused
For many centuries, only Moslems were allowed to visit Mecca under penalty of death. General Gordon painted his skin and was able to slip in but was discovered and barely got out of Mecca alive. This is one of the reasons that the Mahdi hated him so much.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
doni_georgia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
22. Nope - Mohammed called Jews and Christians "People of the Book"
and called for tolerance of both groups.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Apr 16th 2024, 02:08 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (Through 2005) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC