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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:10 AM
Original message
F911 could have a GOLDMINE of DVD extras, dontcha think?
Perhaps we could collect a good list of possible ideas here and send them to MM. No doubt he has tons of good footage that we have no clue about.
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gmoney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:17 AM
Response to Original message
1. Like the entire 7 minutes in the classroom?
I thought he should have just put that 7 minutes into a little box in the corner, uncut... either that, or run it in a box next to the closing credits, just to really give the feel of how long he sat there.

Funny, the clips on 60 Minutes looked a lot better than the big-screen footage, surely because the movie was full of TV resolution video enlarged to a movie screen. But I think this is a good sign that the DVD release will be a very good thing.
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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I'm not sure why
people have attached to the damned seven minutes in the classroom...I understand the argument, maybe if he'd acted quicker he could have saved the Pentagon, etc., but it's all just speculation. It's not one of our strongest points against him. It's a woulda/coulda/shoulda with an indeterminate conclusion.

Concentrate on the MONEY. The Saudi/terrorist connections, the Halliburton "sweetheart deals" (as the Kooch calls them), the defense contracts, the OIL (goddamn, the freaking OIL), the media connections, etc. And the war. Billions upon billions spent, hundreds upon hundreds of dead Americans, thousands of dead Iraqis, rampant corruption and war profiteering, the terrorists only getting stronger, our reputation destroyed.

7 minutes in a classroom is the least of our worries.
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MadinMD Donating Member (88 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I agree
While in a perfect world a leader would have ripped off his shirt, showed us the red and yellow S on his chest, then flew backwards around the planet really fast to reverse time and stop the whole thing from happening, it was only 7 minutes. The 7 minutes isn't going to resonate with the public. The 7 minutes is inconsequential in the grand sceme of things.

The saudi ties are where it's at.

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Rainbowreflect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:00 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. To me it was not how long he sat there.
It was the look/looks on his face. His reaction or lack there of is very telling of the kind of person he is.
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tinanator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #8
20. yep
to see the whole stretch and watch his clearly abused body language would be devestating. Yes, there will be much Moore in the DVD.
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TrustingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
26. right on... it wasn't the time so much as the Fear in his...
furtive lil black raisin eyes.
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gardenista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #26
42. Did you notice that he was rocking back and forth?
It was very subtle, but he was rocking like a chimp wrenched from his momma's bosom. He was really frightened.

I had a friend say, "Well, most people wouldn't know what to do, either".

Yeah, well, he ain't most people. He's the President of the United States. The Commander in Chief.
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:18 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Gosh, I've heard that "Superman" analogy before.....
He shouldn't have even gone into the classroom that morning. The first plane had already hit before the left the hotel for the photo op.

Failing that, he should have excused himself & gotten to work when told the 2nd plane had hit.

Of course, he avoided the real "work" of protecting the USA while he was on vacation the entire month of August.

That 7 minutes shows that he's a clueless idiot. Or it shows he was expecting an attack & was just waiting for it to play out. Or both.

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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. I totally agree.
But I just don't think we should centralize our attack around that seven minutes. It's not that strong.
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tom_paine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
33. No, a Real Leader would have immediately leapt to his feet and
DONE SOMETHING...anything!

I mean, imagine you are sitting in a classroom (it's bring a parent to work day at you child's school) and someone says, "Somone's out there setting fire to your car!"

Now, you might not rush down there and try to tackle a maniac by yourself, but would you SIT there and not even make a call to the police?

Of course not.


So, out go the window with your Superman Strawman. Bunnypants* didn't have to smite the evildoers personally. He just neede to behave like a Real Leader in a Time of Crisis (which does NOT include sitting one one's ass!
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Oddman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. I completely disagree!!!
That was some of the MOST powerful moments in the film. It shows bush was a deer in the headlights - he had absolutely no idea what to do! He was our commander in chief and was paralyzed when our country was coming under attack. Think of how long those seven minutes must have seemed to his staff and the administration . . . he couldn't think on his own it showed how completely inept he is as a president.

It was truly frightening to watch him just sit there without a clue while we were being attacked - he mind was like his expression - BLANK!!!!


A Pathetic Excuse for a pResident
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:50 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. I agree that shrub sitting there in the classroom, as a 7 min loop, would
be a good background scene for the DVD menu. Or making grimaces before his war speech.
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duhneece Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
4. Does anyone know DVD release date? nt
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Nicholas D Wolfwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. September/October
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cthrumatrix Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:50 AM
Response to Original message
5. internationally, the sales will be off the charts...and this will be a
black eye for *...again.
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KC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 07:55 AM
Response to Original message
7. It would be
interesting to say the least.

KC
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:25 AM
Response to Original message
11. Three extras I'd like to see:
1. Amplified information on *'s past---the alcohol, the failed businesses, the shady stock dealings, the draft dodging, the record as governor of Texas.
2. More on the Florida voting fiasco---present Greg Palast's work, together with BBV issues.
2. A no holds barred review of the media complicity in this whole load of crap. Name names (NY Times, NBC News) and take prisoners (Judith Miller, Tom Brokaw)
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latebloomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #11
16. What about more of the Democrats' complicity
in voting for the Patriot Act and the Iraq war??
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checks-n-balances Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #11
37. Yes - FLA voting scandal, esp. with any footage of intimidating RW mobs
Surely some exists. I know about it already, but it would make my BLOOD BOIL to actually see those bullies doing their dirty work.

That's one story that pretty much has disappeared into a black media hole, IMHO.

So please revive it, Michael!
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gardenista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #37
43. Yes, and there should be "pop-up-video" style balloons
with the names of all of the Congressional staffers in the mob! It would be priceless!
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
13. Add in the PNAC,
using their web site, and their 1998 letter to Clinton (signed by Rumsfeld, et al) advocating the invasion of Iraq.
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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. ABSOLUTELY.
That is PERTINENT.
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adadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. And
Edited on Mon Jun-28-04 08:49 AM by cheryl27
momma Babs not wanting to waste "her beautiful mind" on things like body bags and number of soldiers killed. That should have been the final clip
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #13
19. and the RW propaganda machine / myth of liberal media bias
see "Blinded by the Right: The Conscience of an Ex-Conservative" by David Brock.

Both PNAC and this are instrumental in getting us in this mess.

At some point people should/will start wondering how we got in this situation.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. Funny...
I just printed both of those and gave them to my mom yesterday. She's a loyal democrat; but has a really difficult time believing that Dumbyass and his cronies would stoop so low as to let 9/11 happen on purpose.

Not for long... :hi:
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #13
29. I agree with PNAC, OSP discussed on the extras, with web links.
Think--F911 is like DU, for people who don't read newspapers or troll for net news. Most of these people may not like shrubya but many, many have no idea of the existence of these entities even now.

This is an unparalleled opportunity to educate people about it prior to the election.

Could perhaps be done with some fun and humor.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #13
41. Yes!
That would be an excellent addition!
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checks-n-balances Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:03 AM
Response to Original message
18. IMHO, MM needs to fill in the blanks with the Bushco drive for ME Empire
It's a golden opportunity to educate the general public more fully about why we invaded Iraq. THEN it will make more sense to everyone and expose those behind the insane plan.

The excuse of WMDs, bringing democracy to Iraq, fighting terrorism, etc. have been window dressing and don't help connect the real dots about what Bushco has been doing post-9/11.

I hope that, somehow, something about all this can be added. It would be hard to do, considering that this is the most under-reported story of this century so far, and I doubt there's any footage. What complicates it further, Pitt points out, is the Israel/Palestine entanglement and the implications of the neocon agenda on that. But Bushco opened up this can of worms and the American people deserve to know the truth. All of this is crucial for understanding this administration's actions!

New York, You've Been Used
By William Rivers Pitt
t r u t h o u t | Perspective
Monday 15 September 2003


...The Project for a New American Century was formed with a number of specific purposes in mind. The first, and foremost, was to fundamentally reorganize the foreign policy standards of the United States, to change forever the way America deals with the world. The first step in doing this, according to PNAC, was to attack, invade and take over the nation of Iraq. This plan was codified in a scolding letter sent to President Clinton in 1998 which chastised him for not rolling tanks on Baghdad. The next step in the process, according to PNAC, was to invade and take out friendly and unfriendly regimes alike in the Middle East, thus "Westernizing" the region through warfare and bringing our values to them. Implicit within this plan is the PNAC idea that open warfare and wholesale regime-change in the Middle East is all part of "Defending Israel." Unfortunately, the most common thing to see within the progressive community today is two people who agree on 99% of the issues screaming in fury at each other. 99% of the time, that screaming happens because of the fundamental differences between supporters of Israel and supporters of Palestine. This is the rift within the progressive community, and it is a mile wide, and PNAC falls right in the center of it. Now, there are 100 sides to these arguments and these issues. I am not here to stand and espouse one side or the other, beyond this: It is flat insanity to claim that theater-wide warfare and destabilization in the Mideast will do anything but make Israel less safe, and by proxy will cause further suffering and death within the Palestinian community. These are things we have to be able to talk about. We cannot discuss the Bush administration without discussing PNAC. We cannot discuss PNAC without discussing Israel and Palestine. If we cannot discuss Israel and Palestine without shredding each other, we will never be able to address this profound problem.

The PNAC plan was codified in the passage by the Gingrich-controlled Congress of the Iraqi Liberation Act in 1998, an act that made regime change in Iraq a matter of American law.
The letter sent to Clinton in 1998, and the strident advocacy for the passage of the Iraqi Liberation Act, both bore the same signatures and fingerprints of the men and women who signed the PNAC Statement of Principles.

<snip>

So let's tie all these threads together, and find out why some wacky right-wing think tank is important. We'll start with the signatures on that Statement of Principles. Among those who signed on with the Project for a New American Century in 1997, who founded the Project, who stand by its ideologies and who press those ideologies out into an unwitting world, are:
Dick Cheney, Vice President, and former CEO of Halliburton Petroleum;
Donald Rumsfeld, Secretary of Defense;
Paul Wolfowitz, Assistant Secretary of Defense;
Elliot Abrams, senior member of the National Security Council, who pled guilty to the charge of lying to Congress in the Iran/Contra scandal;
Norman Podhoretz, a writer who described the PNAC mission and the war on Iraq as, "A process of the reformation and modernization of Islam;"
Bill Bennett, whom you?ve surely met if you've been to Vegas recently;
Lewis "Scooter" Libby, chief assistant to Dick Cheney.


<snip>

I told you, a moment ago, about the most disturbing part. I told you, also, that these PNAC plans were formulated in that "Rebuilding America's Defenses" report written long before September 11. I didn't tell you about page 51 of that report. Page 51 of a report that has become the basis for our war in Iraq, and our new and aggressive foreign policy stance. Page 51 of the report that is now the heart and soul and ideology of this government. Page 51, and one simple sentence: "The process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event - like a new Pearl Harbor."


Please continue at:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/091503A.shtml

See also:
America's Bid For Global Dominance
by John Pilger; The New Statesman; December 12, 2002

One of George W Bush's "thinkers" is Richard Perle. I interviewed Perle when he was advising Reagan; and when he spoke about "total war", I mistakenly dismissed him as mad. He recently used the term again in describing America's "war on terror". "No stages," he said. "This is total war. We are fighting a variety of enemies. There are lots of them out there. All this talk about first we are going to do Afghanistan, then we will do Iraq... this is entirely the wrong way to go about it. If we just let our vision of the world go forth, and we embrace it entirely and we don't try to piece together clever diplomacy, but just wage a total war... our children will sing great songs about us years from now."

<snip>

...innocent people will be killed by the United States. This is reminiscent of Operation Northwoods, the plan put to President Kennedy by his military chiefs for a phoney terrorist campaign - complete with bombings, hijackings, plane crashes and dead Americans -as justification for an invasion of Cuba. Kennedy rejected it. He was assassinated a few months later. Now Rumsfeld has resurrected Northwoods, but with resources undreamt of in 1963 and with no global rival to invite caution. You have to keep reminding yourself this is not fantasy: that truly dangerous men, such as Perle and Rumsfeld and Cheney, have power. The thread running through their ruminations is the importance of the media: "the prioritised task of bringing on board journalists of repute to accept our position".

"Our position" is code for lying. Certainly, as a journalist, I have never known official lying to be more pervasive than today.
We may laugh at the vacuities in Tony Blair's "Iraq dossier" and Jack Straw's inept lie that Iraq has developed a nuclear bomb (which his minions rushed to "explain"). But the more insidious lies, justifying an unprovoked attack on Iraq and linking it to would-be terrorists who are said to lurk in every Tube station, are routinely channelled as news. They are not news; they are black propaganda.

This corruption makes journalists and broadcasters mere ventriloquists' dummies.
An attack on a nation of 22 million suffering people is discussed by liberal commentators as if it were a subject at an academic seminar, at which pieces can be pushed around a map, as the old imperialists used to do...


Much more at:
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=49&ItemID=2744

THE PNAC ARCHIVE - "Must-see" for all DUers at:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=110&topic_id=80

Further note: Took me awhile to gather this info and in the meantime, some of you on this thread and someone else on another thread had the same idea:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x1877718

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cybildisobedience Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
21. a few ideas for extra footage:
- more media whores cheerleading for war --- they already hate Moore and are going after him with a vengeance. He might as well strike now. It will help regular tv viewers turn into the bias.
- The media treatment of him as he was questioned for this movie -- Matt Lauer pretending to be such a "tough guy" interviewer, Katie Couric insulting his CLOTHING, for God's sake?
- Barb's "beautiful mind" quote -- I agree with an earlier poster that this is classic
- quick story on the Maytag employee who was fired for showing footage of flag-draped coffins (after her employer was pressured by the Pentagon). And her husband was fired, too, just for good measure.
- The Hitler brouhaha -- how the right always freaks when someone, anyone mentions the obvious parallels, but how they use it on Bush's own re-election site to denigrate Democrats - and not in a subtle way, either.
- ELECTRONIC voting!!!!! Huge issue, and Moore is the one who could really put this on the mainstream radar screen. Even a few words about the associations with the companies who make the equipment and the Repig party.
- A quick listing of the stalwarts of the "family values" party, with some of the latest news on each: Example: Bill Bennett, author of the "The Book of Virtues" -- reportedly squandered $8 million on gambling. Rush Limbaugh, right-wing talk radio success story -- investigation on purchase of illegal drugs and doctor-shopping, admitted Oxycontin addiction, and just announced plans for third divorce. I mean, this stuff writes itself!
- The Howard Stern story -- Clear Channel, FCC, whole bit -- the one thing that is capable of causing a huge demographic shift in the presidential election

I could go on and on...
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JHB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
22. The 2000 Republican Platform
In addition to the PNAC material, include the 2000 Republican platform (all of it, but highlighting both the Iraq and terrorism stuff that was obviously in synch with PNAC **AND** all the stuff they ditched, like "carefully rebuilding the coalition against Saddam", "cooperation is the key", etc. After 9/11, politically they could get away with acting unilaterally, and did so, smearing longtime allies in the process.
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
24. Class Wars
Their IS a war against the middle class, waged by the executive class and their government surrogates utilizing as means taxes and the government budget. Few Democrats (exceptions, Wellstone r.i.p., Feingold, Kennedy) will touch this issue and Michael could bring it to the table.
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Kanary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Whew!! I'm sooooo glad to know there isn't a war against poor folk!
Poor middle class, taking the brunt of it now.....

Kanary
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
25. Another idea:
His new movie could be entitled "Grim Fairy Tales", and proceed chapter by chapter through modern myths, such as "Republicans as the party of morality", "Make the world safe for Democracy", "Compassionate Conservatism", "Republicans are more fiscally responsible", etc. Get Al Franken to help in the screenwriting.
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
27. I want the full Nightline footage of all the soldiers who died in Iraq.
That would make for a meaningful DVD extra.

I'm also VERY curious about the Nick Berg interview Moore has.

I REALLY want to hear what some Democratic senators have to say. Maybe add a few interviews so they can explain their lack of action when confronted by the CBC. If the interviewer could be a DUer, that would be even better. Pitt maybe?

A MUST for a DVD extra is Moore refuting some if not all the criticisms made by the "liberal" media.

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The_Gopher Donating Member (857 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
28. didn't they edit out Barbara Bush's line about her "beautiful mind"?
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Yes, I'm assuming they got some kind of pressure or legal threats
on that.
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Mayberry Machiavelli Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
31. A special segment about the cameraman they had inside Iraq would be
essential to the DVD extras.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
32. Definately. It's gotta be a 2-disc special platinum super-ultra edition
Pack the dvd's to the brim with useful information, extended segments for the "he took it outta context!" whiners, his sources, etc. Throw the moveon.org documentary on there. the PNAC files.

We can't just defeat BushCo, we have to humiliate, defeat, and totally expose these bastards for the criminal pieces of crap they are.
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PatGund Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
35. Since he has them....
Copies of *ALL* the unredacted versions of *'s Air National Guard records. As a graphic or PDF.
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gulliver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
36. "Sometimes accounting isn't black and white...."
Edited on Mon Jun-28-04 09:21 PM by gulliver
from his corporate responsibility press conference.

Also, I would add the time when Bush dissed David Gregory with the "Que Bueno, how wonderful, now I'm literate in two languages."

Maybe a little of the trifecta stuff, with Bush repeating it several times and then a dollop of Tim Russel saying it "never happened."

There is a lot of footage I would like to see in the DVD...
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sablescort Donating Member (132 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 10:44 PM
Original message
Subtitles subtitles subtitles
On both the feature film AND the special features, too.

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sablescort Donating Member (132 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 10:44 PM
Response to Original message
38. never mind...dupe look above
Edited on Mon Jun-28-04 10:46 PM by sablescort
brain fade clicked twice :P

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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
39. The "trifecta" comments
what happened to the F-15s on 9/11 (maybe that 7 minutes cost everyone in Tower 2?) More details on what happened at Abu Garaib, details on The Patriot act II.
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BattyDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
40. I think it should have ...
some of those interactive DVD-ROM features, so when you put it in your computer, it'll take you directly to DU! :evilgrin:

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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-28-04 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
44. I hope they add any footage of it's opening and lines etc..
plus it would be nice to see all the inagural protest
footage .
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