I have a question about Fahrenheit 9/11

[tavalon]

Why do you guys think that Michael Moore left out any discussion of PNAC? It seems to me that PNAC is a big part of the picture around why we went to Iraq. Michael Moore loves showing how the different people interconnect and goodness knows there are an awful lot of Bush administration people who have their fingerprints in PNAC.

I'm interested in hearing some speculation from y'all.

Terri from Texas

You can send our village idiot back now. We don't really want him but we really don't want to subject the rest of you to him anymore.............,.

[LeighAnn]

1. Hope for good DVD supplemental features

Yeah, that movie had to fit a lot of facts into a 2 hour timeframe ... PNAC might not be something for the first-timer. I think if I would have found out about the PNAC the same time I found out about The Carlyle Group, it would have made my head spin.
Might be too much for someone who's new to all this. I'll bet there will be more info in the DVD supplements.

[oasis]

2. He cannot overload his flick with "conspiracy theories". Folks have enough

to digest with what Moore has presented.

[tavalon]

8. Conspiracy theory?

But it isn't a conspiracy and it's written and it has neat names on it, like: Jeb Bush, Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, and Paul Wolfowitz.

I thought about the movie already having plenty of things to digest but there were a number of tangents that, while interesting, seemed to me to be things that could have been left out to allow such a pivotal piece of evidence a moment of light.

[JSJ]

3. going for a two hour running time?

I'd like to have seen his film take on that issue, too. As well as the 'mysteries' surrounding the attacks on 9-11. But, Moore was going for the most publicly digestible points that would best serve to dislodge George W Butcher from the WH. Combined with my anti-Butcher posts, the film seems to be doing just that.

[tavalon]

10. Oh, I'm not saying it's a bad movie, it's a great movie

I just think PNAC is so important that perhaps he could have taken out a few of the extraneous tangents to allow for a very important piece of the puzzle to be seen.

[Pale_Rider]

4. Woofy sucking his comb ...

... should be connection enough.

[Pale_Rider]

5. Woofy sucking his comb ...

... should be connection enough.

[Robbien]

6. The movie was so jam packed with info it made one's head spin

I agree, one more fact in the movie would have been too many. And PNAC is a huge fact for a newbie to get their brain around when they are already stunned by everything else.

[Syrinx]

7. I'm pretty sure PNAC is mentioned

I think it's right around the Bonanza spoof, when they're talking about Afghanistan. I guess I could be confusing it with a Moore tv appearance, though.

[tavalon]

9. Actually

I had thought that it was mentioned but I went tonight to see it again. My head was clearer and I watched for it and it wasn't there.

[IkeWarnedUs]

12. Not in the movie - and haven't heard MM say it on TV either

Granted, I haven't seen EVERY one of MM's interviews, but I have seen a lot of them and I am getting horse from shouting at the TV for him to say the words - PROJECT FOR THE NEW AMERICAN CENTURY!

[Syrinx]

14. I really think it was in the movie

I know for a fact I've heard Moore say those words. I can hear them in my head. Not all psychological though. :)

[JSK]

15. In "Dude, Where's My Country?"

MM discusses PNAC. Just listened to it today on CD while traveling. I too wish he had mentioned it in the film.

[Syrinx]

16. okay, thanks for that

But, G-O-D, it seems like I can hear him uttering that phrase in 9/11.

[IkeWarnedUs]

11. I have been wondering why NO ONE talks about PNAC

The only one I am aware of that has spoken about PNAC is Joe Wilson on Letterman.

I keep hearing people (like Senator Kennedy for example) talk about this administration's ideology. Why not give the reference for that ideology? It's like it is one of George Carlin's words you can't say.

Is it possible Michael Moore doesn't know about PNAC?

The only other reason I can think of is the PNAC/DLC connection (Will Marshall) - don't want anyone to use it to smear Kerry and Edwards (both DLC'ers).

I totally disagree that info on PNAC would have been too much for people to digest. I also disagree that it is a conspiracy theory. The PNAC plan is there for everyone to read for themselves. It isn't a theory - it is a fact and a plan being played out before our eyes. In fact, knowledge of the PNAC plan is the only thing that makes the administration's actions make any sense at all.

For that matter, if people don't know about PNAC, they can end up thinking that getting rid of George Bush will take care of the problem, which is not true. That's like snipping off a dandelion flower and thinking you got rid of the weed. The flower is just the flashy part of the weed. We need to pull these guys up by the roots!

[tavalon]

13. me too!!!!!

Back when 9/11 happened, I was living with a roommate who is about 10 years older than me. She was an adult during the Vietnam war and she began telling me about the Military Industrial Complex and she pointed me to the PNAC website and it was her who told me, way back then, that we would go to Iraq by way of Afghanistan......

And I waited for the media to pick up on the blueprint for the Pax Americana and I waited and I waited........

[ContinentalOp]

17. He tried to keep it simple and focus on emotion.

Once you start getting into groups with acronyms and administration officials signing their names to foreign policy statements on websites it all starts to get a little more complex and arguably dull for the average viewer. By focusing on the Bush/Saudi connection and *'s inaction in the classroon Moore was able to keep it simpler and still get the point across. The important thing for the audience to understand is that the people in this administration place their own personal economic interests over the safety and lives of the American people. It isn't necessary to present all of the mountains of evidence and details that prove that point because hopefully a spark will be lit and audiences will go away asking their own questions and looking for more information.

[MI Cherie]

18. PNAC isn't shy

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

BTW: There have been rumors of censorship — who would be surprised? If some people heard mention of PNAC & some didn't hear it ... who knows?

[bos1]

19. That brings up what is really wrong with F911

Stupid White Movie: What Michael Moore Misses About the Empire
By ROBERT JENSEN

"I have been defending Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 9/11" from the criticism in mainstream and conservative circles that the film is leftist propaganda. Nothing could be further from the truth; there is very little left critique in the movie. ...it's a conservative movie that ends with an endorsement of one of the central lies of the United States, which should warm the hearts of the right-wingers who condemn Moore. "

"I agree that Bush should be kicked out of the White House, and if I lived in a swing state I would consider voting Democratic. But I don't believe that will be meaningful unless there emerges in the United States a significant anti-empire movement. In other words, if we beat Bush and go back to "normal," we're all in trouble. Normal is empire building. Normal is U.S. domination, economic and military, and the suffering that vulnerable people around the world experience as a result. ...

"It is obvious that "Fahrenheit 9/11" taps into many Americans' fear and/or hatred of Bush and his gang of thugs. Such feelings are understandable, and I share them. But feelings are not analysis, and the film's analysis, unfortunately, doesn't go much beyond the feeling: It's all Bush's fault. That may be appealing to people, but it's wrong. And it is hard to imagine how a successful anti-empire movement can be built on this film's analysis unless it is challenged. "

http://counterpunch.org/jensen07052004.html