Plame Indictments Coming???

[sandnsea]

That must be what this Berger story is all about. Has to be. Didn't Kucinich say on Randi's show something big was coming? Now we've got security breach vs. security breach. Maybe Rove figures it'll be a wash. Has to be somebody big, don't you think, for them to smear Sandy Berger?

[jjmalonejr]

1. That's what I've been thinking

The pundits are all saying that this is to distract from the 9/11 commission report and to embarrass the dems before their convention.

I think there's another agenda here, though, and it has to do with Plame.

[hang a left]

2. I read in Josh Marshall's column today that it will be in the next

several weeks. It really doesn't seem like it will be that soon. I don't know what the Berger story's planned disfusement was aiming for. He is also backing off the tetonic plate movement assumption of a couple of weeks back. He does however give a thinly veiled clue, that I cannot make out. Maybe someone can read it and speculate.

www.talkingpointsmemo.com

[hlthe2b]

5. Something is about to "pop..." Dennis Kucinich made sure to end an

interveiw with Randi Rhodes today with a cryptic comment to the effect that she should stay in touch and that she especially might want to get in touch in a couple of days......:shrug:

[merh]

6. Which section of the column are you referring to as a thinly veiled clue?

I read the Berger piece and it appears that Josh is of the impression they went after Berger for something that occurred in October of 2003 and that they were aware of at the time. He laments that the berger news is a distraction to take away for the 9/11 Commission report.

[hang a left]

10. It is down a little bit in his column, sorry about the confusion.

And the veiled clue, I thought anyway, was the last sentence in the last paragraph.

snip>

More importantly, however, the whole question is legally irrelevant. Even if Plame pulled strings to get the gig for Wilson and had the Agency arrange for him to stay at Niger's most palatial and exclusive hotels, and even if Wilson had lied about it, all of that would leave the legal case enitrely intact. There's no scoring political points exception to the law in question -- not even if you think they're valid political points, not even if they are valid points.

The folks at the Vice President's office who are under scrutiny might -- as Brown, Douglass, Garrison and Phillips once did -- be appealing to the higher law that transcends mere statutes. But we'll see.

The Times says that Fitzgerald is "expected to announce in a matter of weeks whether he will prosecute anyone." And it's not clear to me that he will choose to bring any indictments. Like everyone else, I have no idea. Yet the Vice President's office would clearly like to see the investigation scuttled or at least lay the political groundwork for a defense against possible indictments. We should thank the Journal for showing us where they're going with this.

[merh]

12. I think that is alluding to the intent issue. Did berger's sloppiness

equate to a crime if he did not realize he was breaking the law or the rules by removing the documents? Did Berger intend to take the docs without approval?

Does that equate to:

Did whoever it was that leaked Plame's identity and the fact that she was an intelligence agent know that it was against the law to release the information? What intent did the leaker have and is that relevant.

Does intent negate either crime? That is the issue they are trying to stir up. Will lack of intent nullify Berger's guilt? If it does, why won't it negate the guilt of whoever leaked the Plame info?

Admin is pulling the tadpole game, they are mudding up the water and making the issues hard to see.

I am not sure if there are published jury instructions that discuss these crimes and I am not sure if intent is essential to convict of the crime(s) or if good faith is a defense.

[shraby]

14. When leaking a deep undercover agent

of her status, intent doesn't even enter into it. You know the old saying, ignorance of the law is no excuse. When committing a treasonous act, intent isn't the issue.
Also anyone in government should know that leaking an agents identity is a huge no-no. I'm not in government and I even know that.

[merh]

15. I know that and you know that, but that is the spin they will try to put

on it. Well Gee whiz Mr. O'liely, poor scooter (or whoever) didn't know that she was still an agent and he didn't know that he wasn't supposed to tell anyone. Just like berger forgot he wasn't supposed to remove documents. We all make mistakes. We punished scooter, we sent him to bed without his supper 2 nights straight. He is only human. <sarcasm of>

I'm just saying that is the spin they will try to give it.

There are several scandals that the admin will face soon.

Outing of Plame
Forged documents re yellow cakes
a rouge, private intelligence source providing intel to WH
Torture at the Iraq prisons
9/11 final report and the ignored intel
Missing Millions from iraqs coffers
cheney & haliburton bid rigging
cheney & haliburton violating sanctions and trading w/Iran and others
cheney & haliburton bribes/tax evasion in Nigeria

They are trying to spin the press to make it look like everyone in gov makes mistakes or it wasn't our fault, someone didn't obey our orders or we didn't make the stuff up.

They have their hands full.

[ClintonTyree]

3. What Berger did.........

was not TREASON! There is absolutely no comparison between the two. One is without doubt a simple lapse of following protocol or just a very stupid mistake. The other is out and out treason and deserves to be dealt with in the most severe manner possible. Bob Novak should swing right along with the perpetrator of this heinous crime against our country.

[sandnsea]

7. It's the stench that matters

The illusion, the hype. Make Berger's documents MORE important, make Wilson's claims LESS important, and it's a wash.

[KittyWampus]

4. There's A DEFINATE Security Breach Via Plame's Outing

why are you referring to Berger as security breach?

We only know he was investigated for something close to a YEAR AGO!

He wasn't arrested or censured after things wrapped up in JANUARY.

Could it be someone concocted trumped up or false charges, there was an investigation that we're only now hearing about... AND NOTHING ENDED UP BEING ILLEGAL?

You don't think the White House or the Judiciary would LIE about something like this.. especially concerning a Democrat... do you?

Who did the investigating?
What were the proven facts known as a results of that investigation?
When was the investigation completed?

Unless we know ALL of these things in complete detail... this is utter nonsense.

[sandnsea]

8. Concocted, helloooo???

That's what I'm saying here. That's why they're leaking it now and pumping it up into something bigger than it is. Has to be a reason. Only thing I can think of is Plame Indictments.

[Generator]

13. Exactly and for Christsakes,

How many LIVES, yes LIVES did Berger risk by taking documents relating to 1999?

How many LIVES could CheneyFuck's people have risked by outing Plame and thus those she's in contact with? An active CIA agent investigating WMD, ever hear of those, America? Ah, nevermind, they don't even exist.

Sometimes there is so much bile in my throat with the priorities of this country that I can't swallow.

[lancdem]

9. There's also an editorial in today's WSJ

saying Fitzgerald should close down the investigation. Josh Marshall posted on it and speculates that the RW must be getting nervous.

[DemoTex]

11. Berger is a heaven-sent smoke screen for Plame.

Said it earlier today, and am more convinced now (after the evening news whores turned their tricks).