"Desire to Beat Bush Masks Deep Divisions within Democratic Party"

[GreenPartyVoter]

BOSTON - If you watch next week's Democratic National Convention, you'll see the face of the party as Sen. John Kerry and party leaders want you to see it.

But there will be only about 5,700 delegates and other party members at Boston's Fleet Center, while there are about 48 million registered voters across the country who call themselves Democrats - and they don't always think the same as the people on the convention stage.

For now, Democrats are unified to an almost unprecedented degree by their intense desire to defeat President Bush. That could help Kerry win the White House.

But it obscures divisions among Democrats over issues such as the war in Iraq, leaves unsettled the definition of what it means to be a Democrat in 2004 and could make it difficult for Kerry to govern if he's elected, as he navigates between his party's vote base and the broader population. Bush faced the same problem after running in 2000 as a centrist, then governing as a hard-line partisan.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0722-08.htm

[David Dunham]

1. Who cares. Either we get Bush out or he'll silence/imprison us.

[gratuitous]

2. True enough, but . . .

The first several orders of business will be repairing and healing the damage done to our beloved country from the last four years. I think this major reconstruction will occupy us all quite enough that we don't need to quibble over what kind of flowers to put in the window box.

[22181]

3. Know what's funny...

I think that after we get * out of the WH and reclaim it with a President who was actually elected by a majority, we will be more united than ever. There are always issues and disagreements within a political party. That's nothing new. But much like family, you agree to disagree and move forward.

[GreenPartyVoter]

6. Welcome to DU. :^) I hope you are right.

[rocktivity]

4. It's the "scared Dem" meme!

Despite their candidate setting records for fundraisng and taking a lead at the polls the Dems are disunited, insecure, imploding...Did a Republican plant this?

:headbang:
rocknation

[HawkerHurricane]

5. Headline from 1996...

Desire to Beat Clinton Masks Deep Divisions within Republican Party

There are always 'divisions'. It ain't unusual.

[emulatorloo]

7. So Knight-Ridder doesn't like a Unified Dem Party ?

Sorry, I don't care.

[sendero]

8. News Flash...

... there is no news in this article. The Pukes are just as divided as we are, easily.

The difference is, they have always pulled together for the "greater good", whereas we are only just now doing so.

[Fridays Child]

9. We're circling the wagons and nobody has tried to hide that fact...

...as far as I've ever noticed. Kerry will govern just fine--and much better if we can get majorities in one or both Houses. I'm thinking Kerry may be a "sleeper," sort of like the amazing leader this country never expected but got in Harry Truman.

One thing is for sure, Kerry is as staunch a union supporter as you will ever see, and collective bargaining is our best (maybe only) bet for recapturing the power that has been stolen from the people by fascist corporations and their Republicans whores.

[Old and In the Way]

10. Total Baloney.

Kerry is the Bush antidote. Electing a Democratic majority in the House and Congress will give him the mandate to drive a real progressive and liberal agenda.

And the whole game has changed. We've found our voice on the Internet. We will have a powerful effect on the next Democratic Congress....many who will be energized/radicalized to support and work for legislation that puts the focus on serving all Americans.

I think we pretty much all agree that Bush Replublicanism has destroyed our ability to use federal policy and funding to support an overhaul of our economy. Since they've chocked revenue, it seems that we will have no choice but to restruce/reduce the Defense portion of the budget. It's really that simple.

When the bus is running down the mountain, out of control with the brakes burnt out.....you don't argue about fuel economy.

[charlyvi]

11. I think we have all been scared enough

to put the country's well-being above our squabbles. Kind of like you don't know what you have until you almost lose it. We always thought fascism, totalitarianism happened to some other country, never the USA, but THIS IS HOW IT STARTS. When free citizens give up their rights willingly--without questioning those in power. I think we have all learned something this time. VOTE VOTE VOTE!!

[CanonRay]

39. Be The Change

Here in Colorado, a maverick Senate candidate, vying for the Dem party nomination, uses a Ghandi quote, "be the change" meaning each and every one of us carries within the power to evoke change. We must mobilize, organize, and STAY ANGRY!

[Chmara]

12. Division or Debate -- Brownshirts or Democracy

It would not be the Democratic Party if there were not divisions on real issues, real problems and approaches.

It was Will Rogers, who when asked what organized political party he was a member of answered" None, I am a Democrat."

My vision of open debate on real issues caused me to consider the following snippets of Republican Brownshirting in the last few years:

1. Congressional aides to Republicans and Lawyers banging and physically assaulting the recount room headquarters in Florida before the "liberal judges who rule by decree" handed the election to our current president.

2. Protesters being herded well away from view of the politicians and figures they most want to influence, confined to fenced areas well away from view. They are now marginalized as Kooks with signs, not honored as citizens with views and opinions.

3. The discounting of any loyal opposition or alternate planning as "unpatriotic."

4. The outrageous and uncivil actions of a minority portion of a large audience booing, allegedly throwing drinks and tearing down posters disrupting an encore dedication to Michael Moore by Linda Ronstadt during a one time Las Vegas show.Their outburst was allegedly in reaction to Ronstadt calling Moore a patriot.

I feel their outburst was more a reflection of the doctrinaire approach and training of zealots that offer no respect of others. It is the same genre of training that Hitler's Brownshirts started with in Germany. Unruly civil dissent to quash expression of opinion. It brings to mind the same faces and expression we saw in #1.

Oh, yes, is it not interesting that the Hotel-Casino where this occurred is owned by Planet Hollywood -- who is a part of the Schwarzenegger financial/corporate empire.

5. The firing of Whoopee Goldberg because her fat cat Republican Corporate sponsors felt they would lose sales because she opposes the administration. I guess they think none of us Democrats are overweight -- or have the guts to boycott their products in dissent.

6. Retelling not just one -- but dozens of big lies -- using the bully pulpit to hammer in the misstatements. Goebbels himself was a piker when he put the big lie into action in Germany.

7. The hubris of this administration to "put themselves on God's side" and declare a "crusade" -- alienating and polarizing much of the world's population - the majority of whom are NOT Christian.

8. Breaking or ignoring treaties written for the good of all mankind -- much as AH did with Russia, Poland, Czechoslovakia, England and France. It was expedient for him, of course, to protect "real German Values" and German citizens.

9. Moving preemptively to protect America and Americans --- I never knew that Iraq could be spelled Sudetenland. We were right to invade the Al Quiada training homeland in Afghanistan. We have been wrong in NOT aiding that nation to the extent that the Iraq war drained our resources. Conquer and leave them in poverty?

10. To at this late date, try to shift blame for terrorism to a few failures in the intelligence services, when real blame lays in the USA not sharing the burden of uplift in education, material wealth and cooperation in the world in counter to the fundamental steps of rote education the Muslim groups (once the fringe) offered to the poor of the world as they indoctrinated them.

11. To give uncontested contracts to favored corporations and then blame civil servants for "not properly managing" those contractors. I believe it is this administration and those favored contractors who have robbed the treasury my son's generation's taxes. I believe the real use of their tax dollars for domestic issues has been destroyed in their cost overruns in Iraq. Nothing is left without major sacrifice by the US to help the world become educated to the good nature of the American People -- unless we consider radio and TV educational. See #6 above.

THOSE WHO DO NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY ARE DOOMED TO REPEAT IT1

[Rebellious Republican]

14. Well said Chmara, and welcome!

:hi:

[ilovenicepeople]

27. HOWDY well said indeed

I wish I could say thats a good thing,but when your first post is a well laid out comparison of the "current" administration to the Nazi's of the past? :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: GO TAN SHIRTS!!

[GreenPartyVoter]

18. Welcome to DU :^D

[Wind Dancer]

21. Welcome to DU, Chmara!

What a great first post!

:hi:

[TexasBushwhacker]

24. So true Chmara

The Democratic Party is the party of inclusion and change and always has been. That's one thing that's never changed. There is not now, and never has been a mass exodus of commited Democrats, to the Republican party. 9/11 got some people who were sitting on the fence to commit one way or another and more of them committed to being Republicans AT THE TIME. That doesn't mean that the Democrats actually lost any voters to the GOP.

Of course Democrats don't all agree. The aren't all rich white guys and soccer moms. The most telling, and frankly comforting statistic I got from the Pew study was this:

Income > $75K - 40% Republican, 27% Democrat, 33% OTHER

While that statistic may give Bush and his supporters a hard on because of his "Lookey, I've got the most" mentality, to me it says the "haves and the have mores" are still 60% NOT GOP,

and I LIKE THAT!

[porphyrian]

34. Not precisely...

"The Democratic Party is the party of inclusion and change and always has been."

One of the biggest schisms of the left has been between the "moderates" and "radicals" over who defines the party. When the "moderates" assumed control of the DNC ala the DLC, the "radicals" demanded to be represented and were told to take a hike, which they did. That's not inclusive behavior.

Before that, the acceptance of censorship by "liberals" in the Democrats, often referred to as "political correctness," alienated a number of us who feel strongly about the subject. Though I personally never left the party, it wasn't until the 2000 election that I was motivated to vote again.

There are a number of intolerant status quo supporters among the Democrats. I'm sure I'll get in an argument with at least one here at DU today.

[newyawker99]

30. Hi Chmara!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[LittleApple81]

13. UNITY masks DIVISION. hmmmmm...LEAVE US ALONE if you are not

going to help, jerks.

[TexasBushwhacker]

15. Let's hear it for crappy reporting

From the article:

"Demographically, the party on display in Boston reflects the rank and file. Nationwide, the Democratic Party is slightly more female than male, and disproportionately minority, older and less than wealthy. (NO SHIT SHERLOCK)

In a benchmark survey last year, the Pew Research Center found that the ranks of self-identified Democrats include:

-36 percent of women and 27 percent of men.

-64 percent of blacks and 36 percent of Hispanics.

-38 percent of those 65 and older, the most solidly Democratic age group.

-36 percent of those with less than a high school education, the most solidly Democratic group by education, and 33 percent of those with a postgraduate college education, the second most Democratic group.

-39 percent of those making less than $20,000 a year, the most Democratic income group.

-27 percent of those making more than $75,000, the least Democratic income group."

If you're going to present statistics, at least present more complete picture. The numbers they show are for a only for people that say "I'm a Democrat". Why not go ahead and tell us how many said "I'm a Republican". Those numbers were in the BENCHMARK SURVEY too. Here they are:

Women - 29 % Rep, 36% Dem, 35% Ind/Other
Men - 32% R, 27% D, 41% I/O

White - 35%R, 27%D, 38% I/O
Black - 7%R, 64%D, 29% I/O
Hispanic - 22%R, 36%D, 42% I/O

The entire BENCHMARK SURVEY can be seen here:

http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?PageID=750

Even the BENCHMARK SURVEY shows its bias by only reporting the numbers for the Republicans and Democrats. For the Independents/Other you have to do the math. Surprisingly, in most groups, "Independent/Other" is the most popular choice.

[Octafish]

16. Thtat's the spirit! Four more years!

[GreenPartyVoter]

19. Well, we all know the media want * for four more years. Like *,

they enjoy long, expensive paid vacations. If Kerry gets into the WH, the press might actually have some real work to do again.

[Octafish]

23. Like most intelligent folk, I prefer Kerry in the White House.

John Kerry, IMO, is the best candidate for President since, at least, 1968. The guy's got the record, the guts, the brains and the integrity to be a super President.

If we start believing what the presstitutes are saying, whenever Corporate McPravda gets squeezed by the BFEE to play the Mighty Whorelitzer, then we are in trouble. If we choose to listen to our own drummer, we will stand UNITED. And it is they who have a right to be scared.

[Rebellious Republican]

17. Damn good replies, "this is the what I am talking about"!

Man, gotta feel the love on this thread! This is what I have been hoping for, Dem Unity, this will really frost some freeper troll ass's. I know one will eventually show up on this thread. Can't have them pesky liberals getting all united and shit!

:toast:

[Octafish]

20. The Father and His Sons

From Aesop:

A father had a family of sons who were perpetually quarreling among themselves. When he failed to heal their disputes by his exhortations, he determined to give them a practical illustration of the evils of disunion; and for this purpose he one day told them to bring him a bundle of sticks. When they had done so, he placed the bundle into the hands of each of them in succession, and ordered them to break it in pieces. They tried with all their strength, and were not able to do it. He next opened the bundle, took the sticks separately, one by one, and again put them into his sons' hands, upon which they broke them easily. He then addressed them in these words: "My sons, if you are of one mind, and unite to assist each other, you will be as this bundle, uninjured by all the attempts of your enemies; but if you are divided among yourselves, you will be broken as easily as these sticks."

The moral: In Unity is Strength

Source:

http://www.webterrace.com/aesop/section1.htm


 

[Mr_Spock]

22. Bush faced the same problem after running in 2000 as a centrist, then

governing as a hard-line partisan.

What's new about this? Could be said for EVERY election that is close.

[Marvelous_Smarty]

25. One Question though...

Since the majority of swing voters are voting more against Bush that out of any desire to vote for Kerry, what does Kerry run on in '08?

Kerry just may be one of the most vulnerable incumbent presidents in a long time by then.

[Jacobin]

26. If he can't get us out of IraqNam I will WORK to get him un-elected

in 2008.

[Marvelous_Smarty]

28. That is what I mean.

Kerry will be under tremendous pressure to produce results. More than any other recent President, because he will not have a lot of the people that voted for him solidly in his camp.

I think the Democratic Party made a huge mistake in believeing the hype about the "Invincibility" of George Bush last year and were willing to offer little more than a sacrificial lamb. All of a sudden chinks start appearing in Bush's armor and Kerry is what we are stuck with as a champion.

[thebigidea]

29. Thankfully we have you to call him vulnerable, that'll help enormously!

I look forward to hearing more about these concerns, which just drip with sincerity.

[SammyWinstonJack]

32. Well someone just had to be the little rain cloud

:eyes:

[Marvelous_Smarty]

35. Just posting my own observations.

Nothing else. Once Bush is out, we can deal with what comes after.
Kerry is not Clinton and does not have the wealth of charm that Bill did. Kerry does not excite me, that is all I am saying. He is not Bush, that is why he had my support THIS time. I expect more from him than that in 2008.

I do not see why you would think I am insincere. I am posting how I honestly feel. The Dean voters that have found themselves in Kerry's camp because they have nowhere else to go aren't anymore excited than I am.

[MadHound]

31. Nice find GPV

One that lays out the truth, a truth that many in the Democratic party(and here) don't want to acknowledge. In the past twenty years the Democrats have swung ever further rightward, becoming more pro-corporate, pro wealthy the further right they go. This is especially evidenced by Clinton's presidency which favored such programs as NAFTA, telecom and other merger mania while ripping out the social safety net via such programs as welfare reform.

The Iraq war is further dividing the Democratic party, and it is a sad state of affairs when the person the party is nominating for president is so out of sync with the rank and file over such an important issue as the war.

Quite frankly, the only thing holding the party together right now is the desire to see Bushco out of office. However, unless Kerry re-evaluates his stand on Iraq, in addition to realigning both his views and the party a bit more towards the left, there is going to be a mass desertion before the '08 election cycle. The leftist base has been ignored and ridiculed for entirely too long now, and they will flee to the Green Party and elsewhere.

You can deny this all you wish, you can flame me all you want, but the proof is plain before you. Just go looking around the archives here, and generally any day on the boards. Many many people are dissatisfied with the direction the party has taken, and feel that they are no longer wanted. It is going to take some major fence mending on Kerry and the party's part to convince these folks and many others across the country to stick with the party. Sad to say, I don't think either Kerry or the Democratic party want to do this, nor see the need.

[UTUSN]

33. Yep, the Morning After JK Wins, the Impeachment Begins n/t

[bushwakker]

36. Hope or Fear - take your pick GreenPartyVoter

not just you but all who consider voting for a left leaning candidate this fall. It is imperative that the GOP receive a smackdown.

[Zorra]

37. We'll kill the Tyrannosaurus Rex that is threatening our village first.

And worry about the other stuff later.

[CanonRay]

38. One War At A Time

Abraham Lincoln gave one of his cabinet members the sage advice that we can only fight one war at a time. We should apply this maxim to this election.

I share many of the beliefs and aspirations of the Green Party, and also with many of those supporting Nader. Heaven knows I do not like or agree with the DNC. But the very future of this nation is at stake this November. We simply cannot afford to let King George II rule for another four years. If there is anything left of the country in 2008, there were certainly be environment destruction beyond anything we've seen since the 19th century. We must unite, mobilize, and organize to defeat the worst President in out history. I call on all non mainstream Democrats to work put our difference aside and to unseat this lunatic.