Am I A Conservative?

[louis c]

I believe in a balanced budget.

I believe that all jobs created should stay in America.

I believe that our military should not be involved in nation building.

I believe that the government should stay out of my business.

I am a strict constructionist of the constitution. I believe freedom of speech, of religion, right to assemble, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, separation of powers, and equal rights.

My freeper friends keep calling me a liberal. I thought all these issues that I support made me a conservative.

I guess the definition is if you're for Bush and the Repukes, you're a Conservative. If you disagree with them, you're a Liberal. If, when you agree with them, in cases like a balanced budget (remember the big Repuke push for the Balanced Budget Amendment in the 80's?). When they change their minds, if you don't change your's too, you're a Liberal.

Funny how that works, ha?

[JuniperLea]

1. yes indeed

killing, lying and stealing are conservative traits now. no worries, you are on the right side... ermm... left side?

[mzmolly]

2. Well depending on where you fall on social issues, taxes and helping

children in need, you could be a libertarian?

But any foe of the Freepers, is a friend of mine. :hi:

[louis c]

5. This is all tongue in cheek

I'm really a card carrying Union, Democratic, McGovern style liberal, and proud of it.

But weren't we proud of Clinton when our deficit became a surplus, and wouldn't that be nice to have again?

Repukes were all over this issue when Dems. ran deficits. Now, their asshole has broken all the negative records on this subject, and not a peep.

[Kanary]

10. McGovern style, that's good......

Jes' a question for ya.....

Were you "proud of Clinton" when he abandoned a lot of women and children with his cuts?

That's what I want to hear about when people talk about reducing the deficits..... HOW? WHO gets the ax?

That makes all the difference in the world in whether you are left of the aisle, or right of the aisle.

Kanary

[louis c]

13. I believe in big Government

They are responsible for the health and welfare of all our citizens.

All our workplace rights that flow from the Unions are enforced by our Government. Without them, our rights are empty.

I just want us to pay as you go.

[Kanary]

15. That's good to hear.......

but, you didn't actually answer my question...

Who gets cut?

Kanary

[louis c]

16. No One

Pay as you go.

In my original thread, you didn't see anything about lower taxes, did you?

[Kanary]

17. still no answer.......

Given the HUGE debt...... "pay as you go" means somebody will get cut.......the taxes will first go to the debt, as you previously stated.

I understand your reluctance to commit yourself to an opinion on who that should be....... same as Kerry does.

Doesn't mean we can't figure it out between the lines.

Kanary

[louis c]

22. The Debt Won't Be Eliminated In One Year

There is a deficit or surplus. That is the total over or beneath the amount of money taken in by the government. Pay as you go only guarantees at least a balanced budget for the fiscal year, not an elimination of the debt.

The National Debt is the accumulated shortfall that has resulted from all the past deficits.

Presently, the deficit is about $500 billion for this fiscal year. The accumulated debt is about $8 1/2 trillion.

Pay as you go just means that the yearly budget is in balance. This is Kerry's position and what he was talking about when he voted for the $87 billion appropriation bill for Iraq, before he voted against it. He wanted the troops to receive the expenditure, but he didn't want it added to the deficit. He wanted to "pay as you go". Repeal the tax to the wealthiest 2% of Americans to pay for the war.

I hope my position is now clear.

[lanparty]

34. Credit Card debt ...

Is seldomly disposed of as quickly as it was created.

Doesn't it suck that Democrats are always forced to pay off Republican spending sprees.

[jukes]

31. i've got an answer

our burgeoning unnecessary military

our prison system, by legalizing all drugs, not just the really bad ones that are legal now.

police agencies, see above.





ALL those billions can be put to good use, w/o depriving social services

[Kathy in Cambridge]

3. They're just foolish, not true conservatives

BTW are you coming to the DU gathering on Tuesday?

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[City Lights]

8. I think you're missing the point.

The point he's making (I think) is that all the things the conservatives are supposed to stand for are being flushed down the toilet. The platform of the repuke party changes based on whatever evil they are currently cooking up.

[louis c]

23. I knew some one would get my point

Thank you

[cosmicvortex20]

32. The parties have swapped sides on issues historically more then once.

Do some research on the history of the parties and youll be surpised who stood for what and when...

[BillZBubb]

6. You definitely hold some conservative positions.

Most of what you list leans libertarian, but a lot of the "meaty" issue specific stuff has been left out.

But what you wrote reminds me of the chapter from "The Grapes of Wrath" where a right wing farmer is asked by an Okie worker "how do you know if someone is a red (commie)?". The farmer replies "if I'm payin' 5 cents an hour and some bastard wants 10 cents, he's a red". Conservative's definitions are very situationally flexible.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Toucano]

14. Excellent application of literary reference.

Thank you.

[Mr_Spock]

9. I tell freepers that I am (on monetary issues) what Repulicans used to be

before they all went crazy. Lou Dobbs call himself a conservative yet he rips this new breed of "Republican" a new butt hole just about every day. Neocons are not even human.

[librechik]

11. http://politicalcompass.org/

is useful for figuring out where you belong on the dial.

Take the quiz, it's fun!

[the Kelly Gang]

12. the current GOP is not Conservative..it's reactionary right-wing

[ScreamingMeemie]

18. I think you are a Libertarian. My husband holds many of the same

opinions as you. But in the minds of Republicans today, you are one of them there stinky, non shower taking, commie, pinko liberals.

Welcome :hi:

[maggrwaggr]

19. Yes, Dems have become the new conservatives

We want things to be "the way they used to be".

We want the old America back.

Even though it had problems, it was way better than the America we have now.

What I want:

Accountability.

Honesty.

A free and truthful press.

A government that works for, and protects, the people, instead of colluding with corporations to fuck us all up the ass.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[maggrwaggr]

21. what are you talking about?

Being a Dem doesn't make you a socialist.

By the way, your sentence could use a few hyphens unless you're trying to be incoherent.

[louis c]

24. Good Response

I can't believe how many missed my point.

[GoneOffShore]

25. The job of government

should be to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable.

[maggrwaggr]

33. hey, some days I feel pretty comfortable -- don't "afflict" me please

I have to disagree with you on that one

[leyton]

30. I agree.

I consider myself someone who is a conservative in general principles but who has some positions that are liberal either out of necessity (we can't have our corporations running overseas) or because I don't want the federal government enforcing social conservatism.

[ck4829]

26. Look at the 'hot button' issues

What's your stance on Abortion?
Do you agree with Affirmative Action?
What do you think about stem-cell research?
Were you for or against the war in Iraq?

[louis c]

29. This has gone to far

Pro-choice
Affirmative Action is necessary
100% in favor of stem cell research
The War In Iraq is a travesty, and should never had been started.

I started this thread as a lark, I never thought it would get this deep.

The point of this thread, if I can remember, is how inconsistent the other side is in labeling their own positions, specifically about the deficit and government intrusion.

Now, it seems, I'm playing twenty questions with all of you.

I'm a 1970's style, anti-war, pro-McGovern, pro-choice, pro-Big Government in the area of social justice and economic freedom, pro-civil rights, pro-civil liberties, pro-ACLU, pro-Labor, life long Democrat.

Please, No more questions. I give up

[laura888]

35. Don't worry - I get what you're saying, too

If the new "conservatives" could sum up their beliefs, how WOULD they go?

- Government completely hands off corporations (except when they need tax breaks and subsidies?)
- Don't believe that deficits are bad (can we get that in writing, please?)
- Government should be primarily about the military

What else?

[leesa]

27. You are a conservative if you think that regulation of business is a bad

thing. The greedy big business owners behind deregulation have nearly destroyed our country both economically and environmentally.

[louis c]

28. Poor choice of words on my part

I'm a Union Official, I want Government involved in regulating businesses.

When I said, in the original thread that "I don't want government in my business", it was meant like the saying "Mind your own business"

I should have said "I want the government to stay out of my personal decisions", like the right to choose, domestic partners, and freedom from censorship.

I only put this thread up for a lark, I didn't think it would get this deep.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

38. That's how I understood you

I think everything you listed is consistent with being a liberal, but to be a liberal you'd have to add some other things, let's say, believing that society has an obligation to care for those who cannot care for themselves and believing that government action is an appropriate vehicle for effecting positive change.

[MUSTANG_2004]

39. Business regulation isn't black and white

As far as business regulation, big business uses that as another tool to quash the competition, as the airlines did when trying to beat down Southwest in the 70's and as AT&T did with MCI.

The problem with business regulation is that large corporations have a powerful voice in government and consequently the regulations frequently end up being used to aid them in keeping back their smaller competitors. Good examples of government aiding big business at the expense of small companies are the ways your employer can give you tax relief, such as 401K's, HCRA and DCRA. Rather than simply make all retirement savings, health care and dependent care spending tax exempt as items the individual can deduct, the government has created rules (quite complicated ones) for how employers can deduct the money pre-tax and fund plans. This has created a nice employee perk that larger companies can afford to offer, but requires too much expertise and oversight for a small company (say 10 employees) to offer. And, of course, those plans also have the added benefit of saving the employer on payroll tax (by funding the plans pre-tax, they avoid payroll taxes), so it's a double-whammy: The government creates a perk that only larger companies can afford to offer *and* it saves them money.

[Selwynn]

36. Let's not mince words: yup. :) Not a neo-conservative, perhaps..

..and that's a good thing. :)

[sadiesworld]

37. Good point!