HIV deliberately created according to Nobel Prize winner

[malatesta1137]

I'm with her, actually I think it was created in Dick Cheney's bunker, to punish his gay daughter.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200410/s1216687.htm

[MercutioATC]

1. That's really unfair.

The ONLY thing I respected Cheney for in the Vice-Presedential debate was the way he handled the question about his daughter. He obviously disagrees with Bush on the issue and he just let the issue go rather than trying to score points with the religious right.

It was a classy move.

[malatesta1137]

3. the only way he deserved any respect from gays and lesbians

is if he had spoken against Bush's homophobia.

Not even then, this man is beneath contempt. He's a war criminal, a killer and did business with terrorists in the past. I won't respect him even if he speaks against Bush in the gay issue, and I'm gay.

[IkeWarnedUs]

4. A more cynical take on Cheney's stand

Good cop - bad cop.

Bush gets to be the bad cop and secure the support of their right wing base.

Cheney gets to be the good cop and appeal to the log cabin types.

The right wing base can right off Cheney's support for gay unions as a father standing up for his daughter, so it doesn't even necessarily cancel out the bad cop Bush.

[goclark]

23. I don't respect him for a GD thing!

He has no spine and no heart.

He didn't answer because he would have been pressed to say that he totally disagreed with the less than compassionate administration that he leads.

I can not respect cowards.
I can not respect a man that drumbeats for Bush
and does not serve as a drum major for justice for his daughter.

[Silverhair]

2. She's a politician, NOT a scientist.

There are tissue samples from a guy that died in the 1950's that have been shown to have the HIV virus. Testing of the mutation rate suggests that the virus crossed over to humans in the 1930's.

In the 1950's the ability to create a virus just didn't exist. For that matter, the ability to create a targeted virus STILL doesn't exist.

That she got a Nobel Peace prize doesn't mean she knows anything about science. It means she is a skillfull politician.

[tinanator]

8. Gee, I wonder what they did with those tissue samples?

I cant stop being amazed at how quickly people shut their minds to apparently "inconceivable" possibilities that actually only logically follow known facts.

[malatesta1137]

9. really? any links?

let's not dismiss the possibility of scientists creating viruses for mass destruction.

what if this same HIV virus from that man who died in the 1950s was duplicated in a lab in the 70s.

[RoyGBiv]

12. No, she IS a scientist ...

She's a biologist/ecologist. She holds a PhD and ran a veterinary medicine facility.

Whether she's on to anything here or not, I have no idea. I'm NOT a scientist. However, she is certainly more than a skillful politician.

Bio:

Wangari Maathai founded the Green Belt movement in Kenya in 1977, which has planted more than 10 million trees to prevent soil erosion and provide firewood for cooking fires. A 1989 United Nations report noted that only 9 trees were being replanted in Africa for every 100 that were cut down, causing serious problems with deforestation: soil runoff, water pollution, difficulty finding firewood, lack of animal nutrition, etc. The program has been carried out primarily by women in the villages of Kenya, who through protecting their environment and through the paid employment for planting the trees are able to better care for their children and their children's future.

Born in 1940 in Nyeri, Wangari Maathai was able to pursue higher education, a rarity for girls in rural areas of Kenya. She earned her biology degree from Mount St. Scholastica College in Kansas and a master's degree at the University of Pittsburgh.

When she returned to Kenya, Wangari Maathai worked in veterinary medicine research at the University of Nairobi, and eventually, despite the skepticism and even opposition of the male students and faculty, was able to earn a Ph.D. there. She worked her way up through the academic ranks, becoming head of the veterinary medicine faculty, a first for a woman at any department at that university.

Wangari Maathai's husband ran for Parliament in the 1970s, and Wangari Maathai became involved in organizing work for poor people and eventually this became a national grass-roots organization, providing work and improving the environment at the same time. The project has made significant headway against Kenya's deforestation.

Wangari Maathai's husband divorced her in the 1980s, complaining that she was "too educated, too strong, too successful, too stubborn and too had to control." (quote from Encyclopedia of World Biography, 1999, Gale Group.) They had three children.

Wangari Maathai continued her work with the Green Belt Movement, and working for environmental and women's causes. She also served as national chairperson for the National Council of Women of Kenya.

In 1997 Wangari Maathai ran for the presidency of Kenya, though the party withdrew her candidacy a few days before the election without letting her know; she was defeated for a seat in Parliament in the same election.

In 1998, Wangari Maathai gained worldwide attention when the Kenyan President backed development of a luxury housing project and building began by clearing hundreds of acres of Kenya forest. In 1991, she was arrested and imprisoned; an Amnesty International letter-writing campaign helped free her. In 1999 she suffered head injuries when attacked while planting trees in the Karura Public Forest in Nairobi, part of a protest against continuing deforestation. She was arrested numerous times by the government of Kenyan President Daniel arap Moi.

In January, 2002, Wangari Maathai accepted a position as Visiting Fellow at Yale University's Global Institute for Sustainable Forestry.

And in December, 2002, Wangari Maathai was elected to Parliament, as Mwai Kibabi defeated Maathai's long-time political nemesis, Daniel arap Moi, for 24 years the President of Kenya. Kibabi named Maathai as Deputy Minister in the Ministry of Environment, Natural Resources and Wildlife in January, 2003.

[Silverhair]

16. OK, I'm wrong about her not being a scientist.

But she is still in a very, very small minority of scientists in claiming that AIDS was engineered. I don't feel like doing the googling for the links on the old tissue sample, or on the mutation rates. I've done it several times before.

Besides, for a conspiracy theorist, no amount of evidence will debunk the CT. For such a person it takes the place of a religion. If gives the feeling of being in on a select knowledge, of being one of the chosen who is enlightened. Sort of like the people who argue against evolution. The CTer will continue to believe the CT, no matter what facts they are shown.

[jdj]

19. Let's not talk about cynicism as if it is a mental illness.

There are other illnesses one can catch from monkeys, like one strain of the herpes virus,that they have to be tested for.

But if it one day comes out that AIDS was a result of bio-warfare studies, I will be the least surprised person on the planet.

[RoyGBiv]

20. Sounds far-fetched to me ...

I wasn't intending to dispute that. As I said, I really don't know, but based on what little I do know, I'd need some serious proof.

[whistle]

5. Now all Wangari Maathai needs to prove is that it was Ronald Reagan...

...who issued the order to distribute the AIDS virus at the beginning of his first term as president and she will pretty much assure total genocide among African blacks during the next 30 years. The right-wing nuts, neo-conservative, white supremacists will kick the final solution into gear.

[gmoney]

6. Frank Zappa did a "rock opera" about it...

"Thing Fish" is a surreal quasi-broadway musical that deals in part with a mystery disease cooked up in government labs underneath Virginia:

http://www.seeklyrics.com/lyrics/Frank-Zappa/Prologue.html

(If you can make it through the minstrel phonetic dialect)

Thing-fish:
Once upon a time, musta been round october, few years back, in
one o dose top secret lab-motories de gubbnint keep stashed
away underneath virginia, an evil prince, occasionly employed
as a part-time theatrical criticizer set to woikin on a plot fo de
systematic genocidical removelance of all unwanted
highly-rhythmic individjlls an sissy-boys!

De cocksucker done whiffed up a secret potium... an right long
wid it, de atrocious idea dat what he been boilin up down
deahhhh jes mights be de final solutium to de white mains
boidennn, iff'n Yo acquire my drift...

<snip>

Next thing yknow, fagnits be droppin off like flies...long
wit a large number of severely-tanned individjlls, pre-zumnably
of haychen extrakment!

[tinanator]

10. his best album, my favorite at least

light, light, light....
His Real Frank Zappa book was the first suggestion I ever saw of congressional funding authorization requests for "ethnocentric immunologically based weapons research" circa Nixon.
What a great album. I need to add it to the top of my favorite thematic double album list, along with Quadrophenia and The Lamb lies Down on Broadway.

[Barney Rocks]

7. Be real--Dick

Cheney accepts his daughter--and he doesn't have the scientific know how to do this anyway.

But--it is a very logical theory--if you put KKKarl Rove behind it.....

[salib]

11. Maybe so, but I REALLY DOUBT IT

More importantly, it deflects discussion away for the real tragedy, that Africa is kept so poor, isolated (culturally and in terms of power), and insular, that it becomes the major victim of HIV. If it had been any other virus (you name it) it is quite likely that Africa would be among the largest victims. That is the tragedy. That is our responsibility.

[951]

13. I hope its okay to say...

...I think better people could have won this prize instead of this "Wangari Maathai" seriously what has she "really" contributed to society?

[tinanator]

14. like maybe Kissinger again?

are you serious?

[RoyGBiv]

17. The Nobel Committee

Google is your friend.

This woman has gone to prison for attempting to battle deforestation. She has been physically assaulted for planting trees.


The Nobel Peace Prize 2004

The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided to award the Nobel Peace Prize for 2004 to Wangari Maathai for her contribution to sustainable development, democracy and peace.

Peace on earth depends on our ability to secure our living environment. Maathai stands at the front of the fight to promote ecologically viable social, economic and cultural development in Kenya and in Africa. She has taken a holistic approach to sustainable development that embraces democracy, human rights and women's rights in particular. She thinks globally and acts locally.

Maathai stood up courageously against the former oppressive regime in Kenya. Her unique forms of action have contributed to drawing attention to political oppression - nationally and internationally. She has served as inspiration for many in the fight for democratic rights and has especially encouraged women to better their situation.

Maathai combines science, social commitment and active politics. More than simply protecting the existing environment, her strategy is to secure and strengthen the very basis for ecologically sustainable development. She founded the Green Belt Movement where, for nearly thirty years, she has mobilized poor women to plant 30 million trees. Her methods have been adopted by other countries as well. We are all witness to how deforestation and forest loss have led to desertification in Africa and threatened many other regions of the world - in Europe too. Protecting forests against desertification is a vital factor in the struggle to strengthen the living environment of our common Earth.

Through education, family planning, nutrition and the fight against corruption, the Green Belt Movement has paved the way for development at grass-root level. We believe that Maathai is a strong voice speaking for the best forces in Africa to promote peace and good living conditions on that continent.

Wangari Maathai will be the first woman from Africa to be honoured with the Nobel Peace Prize. She will also be the first African from the vast area between South Africa and Egypt to be awarded the prize. She represents an example and a source of inspiration for everyone in Africa fighting for sustainable development, democracy and peace.

Oslo, 8 October 2004.

[951]

18. Thats it?

Lets just give every ''save the Forrest'' activist who gets arrested a Nobel not that I'm downplaying what they do I really appreciate their hard work but theres alot of other people that have done a hell of alot more without the help of poor village women than this woman will ever do in her lifetime but they will never be rewarded for it. Just because she can get poor women to plant trees for her doesnt qualify her for this prize in my opinion.

[RoyGBiv]

22. Okay then, suggest some ...

And be sure to tell us why they deserve it instead of Ms. Maathai.

As I said, Google is your friend. Use it or don't. There is a ton of information on her life and her work, which has spanned nearly three decades. If you don't want to look it up, fine, don't.

I was simply offering the Nobel committee's summary.

OnEdit: Look up the Green Belt Movement, and you might start to understand a little better. Or not.

[malatesta1137]

26. better people?

who do you suggest? Ann Coulter?

[TwilightZone]

15. Considering HIV has been around since at least the 60's, I rather

doubt it was Cheney's doing.

[jdj]

21. So why did it wait so long to "click on"?

[Silverhair]

24. Because the spread of a disease is an exponential equation.

When a disease first hops species it only infects the first person to get it. Frequently it doesn't make it to a second host as the "bug" isn't tuned to the new host and has a difficult time making new hops. So it has to make the initial, usually difficult, hop again.

Once it does start spreading, at first the numbers are small.

With AIDS in particular, there is (compared to other diseases like the flu) a long incubation period. So the doubling time is measured in months. If your numbers of infected are only one, then two, then four, and it takes a few months for each doubling, it is going to take years before the numbers are large enough to get attention. Add to that the fact that the disease was doing it initial spreading in Africa of the 1950's, and you aren't going to see it until it breaks out into the wider world. It would take decades for the rest of the world to notice.

[Silverhair]

25. Her logic is badly flawed.

She is quoted as saying, "Some say that AIDS came from the monkeys, and I doubt that because we have been living with monkeys (since) time immemorial,..."

That ignores that evolution is a continual process. For her statement to hold true, evolution would have to completely stop. I am surprised that a supposed scientist would hold such an anti-scientific view. It is like hearing a biologist argue against evolution.

I don't feel like writing several paragraphs explaining evolution.