What if we applied Christ's teachings to the Muslim world?

[mopaul]

and instead of bombing and torturing the fuck out of them, reach out to them with peace and understanding and financial aid?

i must be smoking some pretty powerful stuff huh?

[KlatooBNikto]

1. What, are you trying to mess them up even more?

[mopaul]

2. i'm an atheist, but am willing to try it

don't the jews, arabs, and christians worship the very same god?
why can't they get it together?

i might also suggest a large dose of atheism to these troubled peoples.

[KlatooBNikto]

3. I couldn't agree more.Probably a lot of sex and intermarriage will

also help.

[whistle]

4. You mean this one....

....Jesus: A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another. (Joh 13:34-35)

Let's try living this commandment in this country first. I think the muslims were doing ok with Islam before we came along and imposed our will on them.

[mopaul]

5. Islam actually respects Christ, unlike Christianity

which these days promotes hatred of Muslims

[H2O Man]

7. You are making an important point....

Even many sincere Christians do not understand that Islam recognizes Jesus as a prophet of great significance in human history. Muslims believe in one God who created the universe, and who has sent humanity a number of enlightened prophets, including Abraham, Moses, Isaiah, Elijah, David, and Jesus. But they do not think that God stopped 2000 years ago, and withdrew into infinite nothingness. They believe that God sent the prophet Mohammad.

Islam teaches many of the same beliefs and values as does the Jewish and Christian religions. The main difference is that Jews refer to "Jehovah"; Christians pronounce it "God"; and Muslims say "Allah". All three teach that the earth belongs to God, and that we should show love for God and for our brothers and sisters on earth. The great differences are a result of the lack of insight from some human beings who are not able to grasp the true meanings of the messages brought by the holy prophets.

[bicentennial_baby]

8. Another big difference

The original sin does not exist in Islam, and Eve was not created from Adam's rib. She was created independently by Allah, according to them. I think that's pretty cool, personally. :)

[whistle]

10. Here was a dialog between Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson....

...the two leaders of the Moral Majority and Christian Coalition only 48 hours after the 9-11 attacks in New York and Washington DC seems to be right6 on target as to the commandment from Jesus "That ye love one another; as I have loved you":

<snip>Jerry Falwell Foot in Mouth Disease

JERRY FALWELL: And I agree totally with you that the Lord has protected us so wonderfully these 225 years. And since 1812, this is the first time that we've been attacked on our soil and by far the worst results. And I fear, as Donald Rumsfeld, the Secretary of Defense, said yesterday, that this is only the beginning. And with biological warfare available to these monsters - the Husseins, the Bin Ladens, the Arafats - what we saw on Tuesday, as terrible as it is, could be miniscule if, in fact - God continues to lift the curtain and allow the enemies of America to give us probably what we deserve.

PAT ROBERTSON: Jerry, that's my feeling. I think we've just seen the antechamber to terror. We haven't even begun to see what they can do to the major population.

JERRY FALWELL: The ACLU's got to take a lot of blame for this.

PAT ROBERTSON: Well, yes.

JERRY FALWELL: And, I know that I'll hear from them for this. But, throwing God out successfully with the help of the federal court system, throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools. The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad. I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way - all of them who have tried to secularize America - I point the finger in their face and say "you helped this happen."

PAT ROBERTSON: Well, I totally concur, and the problem is we have adopted that agenda at the highest levels of our government. And so we're responsible as a free society for what the top people do. And, the top people, of course, is the court system.

JERRY FALWELL: Pat, did you notice yesterday the ACLU, and all the Christ-haters, People For the American Way, NOW, etc. were totally disregarded by the Democrats and the Republicans in both houses of Congress as they went out on the steps and called out on to God in prayer and sang "God Bless America" and said "let the ACLU be hanged"? In other words, when the nation is on its knees, the only normal and natural and spiritual thing to do is what we ought to be doing all the time - calling upon God.

PAT ROBERTSON: Amen

<more analysis link> http://www.sullivan-county.com/nf0/nov_2000/falwell_911.htm

Right on target with the message of love and tolerance, eh?

[AntiFascist]

23. how anti-American is this conversation?

the fundies want to bring down America faster than anyone else. They're just as suicidal as any Jihadist.

[whistle]

24. Seems like it, but the Falwells and Robertsons and Grahams of ....

...the world are just following prophecy and the Book of Revelations. Daag blamm it!

[AntiFascist]

25. Not quite....

I think they jumped the "gun," so to speak.

[Dookus]

6. off topic...

Mopaul - anyway to change or slow down your sigline graphic? It's really headache-producing. Thanks.

[Sterling]

9. Lets start with the Christian world

If we could get them to listen to Jesus then we might not have to worry about anyone else.

[JPace]

11. Iraqi's do not want Christian love.....

they are systematically killing and driving
out Christians in Iraq. Too much like us and
they don't like us anymore. Seems furious
george's freedom and Christianity is being
rejected.

http://www.danielpipes.org/article/2033

Christians Disappearing From Iraq
by Daniel Pipes
New York Sun
August 24, 2004

"What are the Muslims doing?" asked Brother Louis, a deacon at Our Lady of Salvation, an Assyrian Catholic church in Baghdad minutes after it had been bombed. "Does this mean that they want us out?"

Well, yes, it does. Our Lady of Salvation was just one of five churches attacked in a series of coordinated explosions in Baghdad and Mosul on Aug. 1, a Sunday, between 6 and 7 p.m. In total, these car bombings killed 11 people and injured 55. In addition, the police defused another two bombs.

The timing of the assault guaranteed a maximum number of casualties. August 1 is a holy day for some Iraqi Christian denominations and because Sunday is an ordinary work day in mostly Muslim Iraq, Sunday services take place in the evening.

The five bombings were by no means the first attacks targeting Iraq's Christian minority since the overthrow of Saddam Hussein. Others (according to the Barnabas Fund, an organization assisting persecuted Christian minorities), were bunched together at the end of 2003 and included a missile attack on a convent in Mosul; bombs placed, but defused, in two Christian schools in Baghdad and Mosul; a bomb explosion at a Baghdad church on Christmas Eve; and a bomb placed, but defused, at a monastery in Mosul" more........

[juslikagrzly]

12. Why can't we just let other countries

decide how they want to conduct their own governments? I realize that's a bit naive and we should step in when genocides occur, but I hate the arrogance and self-righteousness of the christian religious right in attempting to impose a belief system upon another group of people. Many christian denominations see it as their sole purpose to proselytize and gain converts. Notice how the Jewish and Islamic religions do not condone conversion and proselytizing? I also hate the American view that all countries desire our brand of democracy. It doesn't work very well here anyway, given what we've experienced during the * administration.

My very liberal presby minister husband and I debate this issue a lot, with my point being that religious belief is behind almost all of the shitty nasty things we humans do to each other.

I wish I had his faith :(.

[Cleita]

13. I don't know what you are smoking, but you are sounding like Ann Coulter.

She said we should make all Muslims Christians. What a dreadful thought, more fundie Christians in the world. If you think their culture has no problems with beheadings, wait until they discover crucifixion.

On edit: I do agree we should treat them with kindness, although I find that to be more of a Buddhist concept than a Christian one.

[Raiden]

14. It has to be better than the Ann Coulter approach!

I really think that being kind and respectful to people would resonate much better with them than blowing 'em up. That's just my opinion.

[Zhade]

15. mopaul, I love ya. This is excellent thinking.

Certainly would make a difference, no? I mean, yeah, we shouldn't hug suicide bombers, but since, like, only 1% of 1% of the Muslim world are terrorists...

We have a lot of work to do on ourselves. Our foreign policy must change, drastically, for the world to survive.

[the_outsider]

16. just leaving them alone for a change will be a good start

for once let them decide what they want to do with their lives, culture, religion and OIL. Peace, understanding, financial aid are welcome, but don't bring Christianity and its imperial/colonial/evangelical baggage into it.

[piezoid]

17. Christian logic

After hearing so many people call into c-span and describe Bush as a "godly man" I think an appropriate counter to this assertion is that if God were directing the hand of their "godly man" why then did God not tell Bush there were no WMD in Iraq? Why would He have Bush kill tens of thousands of civilians if there was no threat?

Ooops, I forgot, God forbids his true believers to use the brain He mistakenly gave them. That must be it.

[mopaul]

18. would the creator really pick HIM to be our leader?

tammy faye baker would've been so much more appropriate.

welcome piezoid

[meow2u3]

19. That would be THE most effective weapon against terrorism!

If we really were to do Christ's will, we'd want to help the Muslim world out of the abject poverty and hopelessness which drives them to commit acts of terror.

In other words, I say kill'em with kindness. Works almost every time.

[mopaul]

20. Thus Spoke Christ:...........................

Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Blessed are the meek,
for they shall possess the earth.

Blessed are they who mourn,
for they shall be comforted.

Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for justice,
for they shall be satisfied.

Blessed are the merciful,
for they shall obtain mercy.

Blessed are the clean of heart,
for they shall see God.

Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they shall be called children of God.

Blessed are they who suffer persecution for justice' sake,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

[LiberalAndProud]

22. Thanks for reminding us.

... and please do away with the swastika.

[datasuspect]

21. hmmm . . . sounds like we're already doing that

disproportionate punishments and all the rest of that stuff