Hardball Matthews interviewed mom of "refusal" soldier in Iraq

[eleny]

They discussed the issue of the contaminated fuel.

An email from her son indicated that they were made to contaminate the fuel. She said she thought that it was because the tankers were not cleaned properly before new fuel was pumped into them. So, the soldiers knew the fuel they would be delivering would be contaminated. Just a week earlier, a helicopter crashed, presumably because of bad fuel.

I hadn't heard this angle before and always wondered about that fuel.

[dogtag]

1. Gen. DeLong just put his foot in it. Big time.

He acknowledged that they bought the information that Chalabi was feeding them outright. They thought they would face zero opposition when they went into Iraq. Didn't follow the party line and talk about faulty intelligence from other sources.

[eleny]

2. And how about his observations on our styaing there more than a year?

If the elections come offf and
If the infrastructure is up to snuff and
If they have locals not expats running for office and
On and on and on
Then things will go well for America

What a bunch of hearts and flowers have to be in place for us to be able to stay in Iraq.

[Ducks In A Row]

3. You could tell DeLong didn't want to ask some of Tweety's questions

about "who decided to get rid of the army". DeLong's eyes were doing that looking over to the right thing that people who are lying do. He know who, but didn't want to answer.

Have to give Tweety credit there, he did try to get a straight answer from the General.

[Elbowroom]

8. linkage?

please

[eleny]

9. It's Hardball on MSNBC with Chris Matthews

No link since it's tv.

[eissa]

4. Am I understanding this correctly?

Soldiers were told to load fuel into unclean tankers, knowing that doing so could result in an explosion? That can't be right, because if it were there would be more outrage, and I still (unbelievably) do not see a high level of outrage regarding what is happening in Iraq (both to our soldiers and the Iraqis).

[cthrumatrix]

5. the soldiers were right IMHO

[eleny]

6. That's what prompted me to post

It's what the soldier's mom said. I hope there's a transcript. But she did say that there was a helicopter go down a week before they refused the mission. Made me sit up straight in my chair.

[Carla in Ca]

14. More of the truth is coming out now, finally

In short, the 13th Corps Support Command -- led by Brig. Gen. James E. Chambers -- apparently has terrible morale and has been singled out by grunts for repeated criticism.

The soldiers involved in this mission had made complaints up the chain of command for months about the dangerously poor quality of their trucks and equipment. Then they were sent on a mission to deliver jet fuel that lasted four to five days. The trucks -- due for repairs -- broke down and ultimately the fuel was rejected because it was contaminated with diesel fuel.

The troops returned late Oct. 12 and were roused at 4 a.m. the next morning and were ordered to deliver the same useless fuel to another location much farther north than the last stop.

Imagine: being ordered to risk your lives on an utterly pointless mission of delivering tainted jet fuel that would be no use to anyone and ordered to do it with equipment and trucks that were dangerously in disrepair. They went up the chain of command and even got a civilian to confirm the fuel was tainted and useless but they were ordered out anyway.

[PissedOffPollyana]

15. And then, imagine ...

... Bush apologists in the media not reporting the full story of why you refused the mission.

I've posted a thread asking as many people as possible to pressure the media to ask some very relevant questions, not only about these soldiers but the fuel in question as well. Hopefully, it can stay visible long enough to find enough people willing to make a serious impact on how the "impartial media" covers this. These soldiers and all the others victimized by the incompetence and war-profiteering of this administration deserve all the help we can give them.

[Carla in Ca]

16. Well, I know Hackworth is aware of it..that always helps

n/t

[eleny]

24. Perhaps it did some good

I was surprised to see Matthews' interview - and the first story of the hour, too.

[txindy]

23. Two crashed within three days of the mission they refused

but other members of their unit did deliver that fuel. Makes me wonder, now, about a connection. No indication of why those choppers crashed, although I don't believe enemy fire was cited as a cause. :shrug: This reeks and gets worse every day. :grr:

[knowbody0]

7. the fuel they were delivering

was unsafe for helicopters (could cause crash)
they did not have armored vehichles
they had no air support

[eissa]

10. My God, what is it going to take

for the other half, and the moronic undecided, to open their eyes to the corruption and incompetence of this administration?!

I'm honestly not a conspiracy-follower, but my mind is running wild right now about the reasons for these situations (contaminated fuel, no real support, etc.)

[AlCzervik]

11. War on the cheap

see the plan was to zip and then out, instant democracy*


















*new puppet dictator.

[blm]

12. I'LL SAY IT AGAIN - BushInc intends to destroy army so they can PRIVATIZE

the military. It will be run by CORPORATIONS like DynCorp, Haliiburton and Blackwell.

They HAVE to destroy the current army to do it, while picking off the elite soldiers willing to be loyal to high paying security firms.

[eissa]

13. I was talking to a Vietnam vet

yesterday, and Kerry supporter, of course. We were both sharing our amazement at the undecided. He said that we (America) have not suffered enough. He said the Vietnam vets had to "bring the war home" for everyone to understand how corrupt the administration was. Although we both want nothing more than to see a Kerry victory, he believes it will take another 4 years of this idiot (God forbid) for Americans to have their eyes opened to the incompetency of the repuke party. In four years (if we don't win now), we will not only take the WH, but the House and Senate as well.

[eleny]

25. I keep thinking about Nixon

And how it took his secomd term to be the time that he was finally ousted.

[BeHereNow]

17. Add the Goss plan and you are on to something BIG!

I go now to seek the legislation....
BHN

[BeHereNow]

18. Ah yes, here it is...Goss Blueprint for Fascism

here in the good ole US of A-
"Torte liability" is the key.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2192072
BHN

[Sterling]

20. Could you repost it to start a new discussion.

I am not sure what that bill means to us, could you explain?

[sandnsea]

27. And outsource jobs

So the kids have nowhere else to go. I hate to think it, but you're probably right. :cry:

[dave502d]

19. First time i have watch Matthews in 3 weaks.

I hope these kids don't goto Jail.

[ogsball]

21. National Guard troops, particularly enlisted, are not as well programed

to just follow directions as regular army. It was my experience if it wasn't right they wouldn't do it.

Thank God for these brave troops who should all be given medals.

[wishlist]

22. Mom of soldier says he complained of incompetent Captain also

She talked about her son complaining about their Captain who never went on any of the missions himself and wouldn't listen to their concerns.

[TacticalPeek]

26. Kick.

:kick:

[shraby]

28. Isn't KBR supposed to be supplying the troops?

[MADem]

29. LOOKS LIKE the Army has come to their senses

http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=24990
The soldiers of the 343rd Quartermaster Company who refused to drive reportedly unsafe trucks down a dangerous route in Iraq aren’t likely to face severe punishment, one military legal expert said Monday.

Too many troops voiced the same concern, which led to a halt in missions while the unit’s vehicles were inspected, and there is the risk that the incident could become a political football, said Eugene Fidell.

Fidell teaches military justice at Harvard Law School and serves as president of the National Institute of Military Justice.

With the political heat generated over the U.S. military involvement in Iraq, from prisoner abuse scandals to a lack of evidence on weapons of mass destruction, to reports troops were deployed ill-equipped, it’s unlikely the involved soldiers will face harsh punishment or be made examples of, he said.

“Personally, I am quite skeptical if any serious disciplinary action ensues,” Fidell said. “I think probably some people are going to get chewed out, and I also wouldn’t be surprised if the command takes a hit over serious appearance of lack of mission readiness.”

I have a feeling that when the whole story comes out, we are going to see some dereliction allegations focused on that brave Captain who never once made a run with the troops to see what the issues were on that TAMPA supply route. My guess is that the worst thing that will happen is a couple of Art. 15s (office hours, Capt's Mast, depending on service, all the same thing) with suspended fines and sentences. To do anything else is just asking for quiet resentment to build, not just in this unit, but across the theater of operations. You cannot tell people that they are the best, the best trained and the best equipped, when they are not. People aren't stupid, and these kids have trained together for years, are very patriotic, come from the heartland, were motivated to serve. You start pissing those types off, and you've completely lost the bubble.