So here is my e-mail to a guy I met in CPR training class

[scarletlib]

He is 32 yrs and a veteran of the First Gulf War. He was just so gung ho about the whole thing. I rebutted his arguments and we had a good 30 minute discussion. Other people were in the class and just sat there listening. At the end he said I was one smart lady and asked for more information. He seems fairly intelligent. I just think he watches to much faux news. He is a paramedic and pretty busy. Any way I think I got him to thinking about things in a different way:


Hello: This is the lady with whom you had the discussion about terroism, bin laden, etc.

I didn't forget that I had said I would send you links to information and I am doing that. Please note that I get my information from a variety of sources from newspapers and news stations literally all over the world. I spend several hours a day reading news on the internet and then reading books on the subjects. If you just watch network TV you are not really getting any real news anymore. I highly recommend Richard Clarke's book "Against All Enemies" for an inside look on the war on terror. He spent 20+ yrs in the federal government and worked for several presidents.

The information and links primarily reference what Clinton did to fight terrorism. Much of the information is old news and some of the information may have been archived but if you are really interested you can find the news by using google or another search engine. All of the web sites and articles I list in the links below are still active and I was able to pull them up (if the links don't work you can type in the name and it will come up).

In discussing terrorism it is helpful to remember it is an ideology and a tool of war. Terrorism is not a nation or state that can be physically attacked, arrested or otherwise brought to justice. Although of course individuals who use terrorists tactics can be apprehended. In the 60 and 70's Europe faced a wave of terrorism caused by the Red Guard Brigades, Beider Meinhoff gang and Sein Fein. With the exception of Sein Fein which still exists as a political group all of these organizations were eventually disposed of using basic law enforcement techniques and the Europeans did not lose civil liberties while fighting these groups.

The U.S has been involved in terrorists incidents in the past. In 4-18-83 the American Embassy in Beirut Lebanon was bombed and 63 died (17 Americans). In 10-25-83 the Marine barracks in Lebanon was bombed with the loss of 241 marines. A few months later the U.S quietly withdrew its troops from Lebanon and never mounted any significant effort to bring the perpetrators of these crimes to justice. This happened on Pres. Reagan's watch. In addition on 9-1-83 KAL Flight 007 was shot down by the USSR with the loss of 269 (61 American) and on 12-21-88 PAN AM flight 259 was shot down over Lockerby Scotland with the loss of 270 indviduals the vast majority of whom were U.S. citizens. All of this happened on Reagan's watch and no one was brought to justice with the exception the Lockerby case which took more than 10 yrs to resolve. However, no one called Reagan weak on terror or lambasted his lack of inaction.

Clinton was in office just 3 months when the World Trade Center was bombed the first time. Neither he nor the people in his administration ever said that George H.W. Bush had been negligent in doing his job. Clinton did not blame Bush for this happening.

I would like to think that all of our past presidents have done and intend to do the best they can to keep the country safe and secure. You can be either a democrat or republican president and things will happen.

Have fun.

These links give a good overview of what Clinton tried to do on terror and also debunks the "Clinton let Osama escape' myth:

http://www.rememberjohn.com/clintongore.html

http://www.buzzflash.com/perspectives/Clinton_and_Terrorism.html

http://www.snopes.com/rumors/clinton.htm

Hart-Rudman Commission: Bipartisan & established by Clinton and Newt Gingrich

http://gadflyer.com/articles/print.php?ArticleID=71

http://www.milnet.com/hart-rudman/

http://archive.salon.com/politics/feature/2001/09/12/bush/

First World Trade Center Bombing:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4593926/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_bombing

John O'Neill--This deceased FBI agent was centrally involved in anti-terrorism efforts including the USS Cole incident. His story sheds much light on efforts in the 90's to fight terrorism:

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?020114fa_FACT1

http://www.newyorkmetro.com/nymetro/news/sept11/features/5513/

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/knew/ (a documentary)

http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=John_P._O'Neill (This one is really good--read down about the USS Cole and how he was stymied by Bush Ambassador to Yemen)

Efforts by Democrats prior to 9-11-01 on terrorism:

http://www.liberaloasis.com/archives/032804.htm#040204

Current Bush efforts on terrorism:

Osama escapes capture:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A62618-2002Apr16?language=printer

http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0304/p01s03-wosc.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,785534,00.html

Safer now?

http://www.google.com/search?q=henry+waxman+letter+april+2004

Situation in Afghanistan:

http://www.salaam.co.uk/news/displaynews.php?news_id=222322

Iraq: David Kay and Mr. Duelfer Reports--both have verified there were no WMD's to be found. Sadaam was a toothless tiger. Osama was and is certainly the greater threat. Paul O'Neill book "The Price of Loyalty" is a good read on Bush's plans to invade Iraq long before 9-11. Mr. O'Neill is a life long Republican and good friend of Alan Greenspan so he's no whining liberal with an axe to grind.

Iraq: 9-11 Commission verifies Iraq had no ties formal or informal with Al-Queda or bin Laden and took no part in the attack on U.S that day. However, 15 of the hijackers came from Saudi Arabia. It is said Iraq financed palestinian terrorists but so did and do the Saudi's. Who would you say is the greater enemy to the U.S.?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organizers_of_the_September_11%2C_2001_attacks#Hijackers

http://www.israelinsider.com/channels/diplomacy/articles/dip_0202.htm

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/657562/posts

http://thepriceofloyalty.ronsuskind.com/thebushfiles/

http://slate.msn.com/id/2094415/

http://news.findlaw.com/nytimes/docs/iraq/cia93004wmdrpt.html

Finally Bush and the Saudi's--Prince Bandar is so close to the family he is called Bandar Bush by them. Salem bin Laden, Osama's older brother, helped to finance George W's first business. George H.W. Bush and the Bin Laden's were in the same business corporation the Carlyle Group and were actually meeting on 9-11 in washington d.c. This private holding company of which bush senior is a part is making a "killing" in the defense industries which it either owns or has major stock in. War is good for defense industries and Carlyle is doing very well now.

http://www.liberaloasis.com/archives/032804.htm#033004

http://www.hereinreality.com/carlyle.html

http://www.bushnews.com/bushcarlyle.htm

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/industry/carlyle.htm

[NMDemDist2]

1. wow lady quite a list (and what's with the freerepublic link?) n/t

[scarletlib]

4. yeah, I know but I think it is important to show him news

from a variety of sources and not just "liberal" ones.

(And I could just kick myself for not giving him information about PNAC. But if he replies and wants more I will do it then.)

[Nite Owl]

2. You are going to keep this guy

reading up until Nov 2nd, when hopefully he will decide he has to vote for Kerry after reading all this. This is just a great list to send him. Good job.

[proud patriot]

3. operation truth . org is also a great site for vets looking for info

thanks for hard work and diligence

[scarletlib]

5. thanks I will add it to my favorites.