Howard Dean was RIGHT.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

"White folks in the South who drive pickup trucks with Confederate flag decals on the back ought to be voting with us, and not , because their kids don't have health insurance either, and their kids need better schools too." -Dean

"I still want to be the candidate for guys with Confederate flags in their pickup trucks,"
"We can't beat George Bush unless we appeal to a broad cross-section of Democrats." -Dean

When Dean made these comments many Democrats were criticizing him. I guess the jokes on us. hahaha? Only if we listened to Dean and followed a new Southern Strategy.

I'd say Dean for DNC chair and that we put our trust into him.

[wurzel]

1. It is the pragmatic thing to do.

[dorktv]

2. Ever notice how Dean would say something...everyone

would jump down his throat and then a couple days later he would be shown to be right...hmmmm.

[Howardx]

5. indeed i did n/t

[Straight Shooter]

6. Dean is a classic Scorpio, which means he's psychic

bush is a psycho, a Cancer in the White House *shudder*

[dorktv]

10. HEY! I am a cancer!

[Straight Shooter]

39. But you're the GOOD kind!

Please forgive me

[progressivebydesign]

48. MY worst ex husband was a Cancer.. I biased.. sorryy!! n/t

[DU9598]

3. I concede

I was an Edwards' man all the way, but Edwards will not likely get my support if he runs in 4 years. I love John, but Dean was the brain that got us in this game.

I was thinking today we need Bill Clinton or Howard Dean as our party chair.

[dddem]

53. the brain, perhaps

but even more impressive, the balls!

[demgrrrll]

4. You know Sam Elliot could have out cowboyed Bush. Just kidding

but since the cult of personality seems to be the issue ole Sam could have played the part well.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

7. Yes, you are right

and there were some rednecks (self-described, btw, so I'm not being prejudiced) who were smart enough to see through the Bush BS and vote Kerry. One said that he was glad he could only have 4 more years-his kid wouldn't be of draft age while Shrub is in office.

BTW, I got a mailing from Democracy for America. Dean is still fighting. I think this site is one all DUers should at least monitor is not support.

Dean was willing to be more than Rethug lite. The Rethug talking points I heard today was that the Dems were too far to the left. I think this is what they want us to believe. They don't want us to give clear choices and to define ourselves. I think Dean is willing to define himself and not leave it to the Rethugs.

[American Tragedy]

8. I agreed with him in theory

except many of these people seem to find peace and prosperity rather uninteresting, judging from yesterday and past elections.

[mandyky]

9. Our new Southern Strategy also came from Dean -

He said we need to get the ethnic groups and the rednecks to the same table. In an earlier thread I suggested a new type of Freedom Ride in the South that involves whites joining NAACP and Rainbow Push and going into the South, like Bobby Kennedy did with the war on poverty.

[Township75]

11. FUCK YEAH!!!

Right on Iraq,
Right on Guns,
Right on The South
Right for our Party!!!!

[FreakinDJ]

14. Your right...we need to take guns out of the debate

[YankeeFan]

40. Second the Motion!

Gun Control killed Kerry so badly. I took one of the exit polls while waiting in line. I spoke to another person who also took the exit poll. He said that if he could have marked the reason for him voting for B*** was Gun Control he would have. He entered "Values", instead.

While I marked "Values" for why I voted for Kerry, he asked me, "What happened to the shotgun that Union gave Kerry for a present?" When Kerry went goose hunting during that photo op, he should have used his gift shotgun. Since he didn't that means that he doesn't really give a damn about Unions. He finished by telling me that very few genuine gun owners believed Kerry when he said he was a life-long hunter.

Then he voted.
Then I voted. (For Kerry.)
And then my State went Red instead of Blue.

[KoKo]

12. We have a failed DNC/DLC and Dean is "unscripted." Let him be our

voice? Why not...we've lost three elections...maybe if someone finally speaks the truth about Iraq/Debt and 9/11 they will find an audience???

After what we've been asked to do to "Compromise" to get Kerry Elected...how can we not support Dean once again or for the first time...in case you passed over him the first time. :shrug:

[cali]

13. He was right.

And I'll say it: I would much rather have taken my chances with Dean. I've been thinking about him alot today. Isn't it ironic that Kerry jumped all over Dean for being a waffler? Ha. Dean was what Kerry never was; the real, real deal.. Dean was straightforward and courageous. He never gave up, and DFA is the best thing we have going for us. Something like thirty of the Dean dozen made it into office. I was just over at blog for America. As several people pointed out, Kerry took down his blog when he lost, something Dean never did. Kerry abandoned us. Dean stuck by us. I won't forget that. Kerry: Just another ambitious politician without the courage of his convictions. Dean: unwavering in his committment.

[Jane Austin]

15. I didn't follow Dean closely until the primaries heated up last fall.

So I am curious to know from someone who was there, would he have responded to the "Taxachusetts" barb (if he had been from Massachusetts instead of Vermont)?

If yes, how would he have responded?

Thanks.

[dorktv]

18. Well they would have said Liberal Liberal Liberal!

But then could have countered "Tax Cut and Spend Credit Card President! Stop screwing over the future of our children!"

[Jane Austin]

20. I really mean an answer to the Taxachusetts thing.

I imagine you and Dean both know the answer to it.

[dorktv]

23. Oh yes..."Montana has higher taxes."

Besides...Dean was from Vermont.

[mandyky]

25. Why would they say Taxacgusetts to Dean?

He's from NY and was Gov of VT. No connection to MA...

[Jane Austin]

45. Well, they wouldn't of course.

I meant if Dean WERE from Mass, and they asked him that, how do you imagine he would answer.

Since no one understands my question, I will supply an answer and see if you who know him better think he would have answered it this way.

OK, when bush or his supporters called him " the Senator from Taxachusetts", Kerry ignored the barb as far as I can tell.

I think he should have not spent any time on it, but I do think that while talking about taxes in general, Kerry should have parenthetically said, "Oh, and by the way, Massachusetts taxes are lower than Mississippi's (or whoever's applies).

Would Dean have answered it directly like that?

[mike_c]

16. I find it ironic that just about a week ago saying anything nice...

...about Dr. Dean would get a whole bunch of DUers hopping mad. Dean and Kucinich were right all along.

[Jane Austin]

24. I musta missed those posts.

n/t

[mike_c]

26. I refer you to #17...

...although admittedly there is a strong scent of troll lingering around that one.

[Jane Austin]

30. Gosh, that one struck me as totally tongue in cheek!

n/t

[mike_c]

32. you're probably right-- I'm way too tired....

It's funny, I didn't read it that way until I saw your reply, and then it became almost parody. I should go home and get some rest.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

33. Naw, you were right.

62 posts, and a post like that after what has
just happened? Gimme a break.

[Jane Austin]

43. We all should.

Here's a cyber hug for a tired compatriot. :)

[A-Schwarzenegger]

31. I refer all to

a.l.e.r.t. on said strong scent.

[Citizen Kang]

17. Dean's not electable.

Stop saying he was right. John Kerry is electable. He will lead us to victory.

[mike_c]

21. you might want to try going through the time warp in the...

...other direction. Today is Nov. 3, 2004.

on edit: CK-- I think I missed the sarcasm big time. I'll leave this up as a monument to my being too tightly wound tonight. Mea culpa.

[Politiclo8]

19. So is this the fork in the road that divides the Democratic party?

I think that this election is going to divide our party into the DLC and what I would call the Dean wing . We've tried to play the middle of the DLC game but look what it got us yesterday--our asses handed to us on a silver platter. But of course I blame the citizenry more than I blame Kerry and I must admit that that last minute OBL tape was a stroke of genius from Rove. They don't call him Turd Blossom for nothing because yesterday he laid a pretty big steaming pile in the lap of the Democratic party.
I still can't believe we didn't hold the Senate seat in FL or pick up any of those close ones like Alaska or Colorado or Oklahoma.
Back to the drawing board.

[mandyky]

28. Howard Dean was ONE main reason Nader did not

get as many votes this year.

[ClassWarrior]

22. Howard Dean for DNC chair. Dick Durbin for Senate leader.

NGU.

[meow2u3]

27. He just didn't say it right

I think if he had said, "Non-union, working-class white guys in the South and the heartland should vote with us, not with them, because the GOP denied them health insurance they could afford, because the GOP messed their kids out of a decent education....", he'd very likely earn their respect and their vote.

The fact that Dean mentioned pickups and the Confederate flag turned me off, and I'm not even a Southern male, even though I am white.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

34. piss off

you cross-eyed imbred fuck!

[mike_c]

36. be interesting to see how long it takes to zap that troll

eom

[A-Schwarzenegger]

37. he be zapped

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

35. keep an eye on this man

he's going to be our spiritual leader of sorts in the coming months
www.democracyforamerica.org

[Nordic]

38. I say a whole new party, with Howard Dean as its head

I'm done with the Democratic party

The Democratic party is dead.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

41. woah one step at a time

first you can join Howard Dean's organization www.democracyforamerica.com

[Cinletharwi]

42. My Republican parents were going to vote for Dean...

That is, before the media crucified him.

I still wonder what could've been.. sigh.

[BlueInRed]

44. Dean is great and has broader appeal

than people give him credit for. I know a lot of indepedents (in the middle) who liked Dean a lot and never bought the labels. He is fiscally responsible, a straight-talker, uses common sense and I'd love to see him in charge of just about anything. If we'd get pragmatic people in the DNC like Dean who can focus us on what's important, I think we'd start making inroads with the independents. (Just my opinion....)

[mtnsnake]

46. Dean would've kicked Bush's ass. What if Malloy is right about the voting

machines being totally fixed in this election? Could they also have been fixed during the primaries, like in Iowa??

[progressivebydesign]

47. I was an original Deaniac. I tell you.. the guy was absolutely right...

People in his OWN party jumped on him for that statement.. and yet it was the absolute truth. He's a straight talker...

[NightTrain]

49. It was Howard Dean who brought me back into the Democratic Party in 2002.

And John Kerry who, on Wednesday morning, drove me away from it again. :cry:

[DianeK]

50. damn right dean was right...

we in vermont have regular folks working hard to make a living too, ya know....if dean were our candidate he would not have folded like kerry did....i promise you

[quaker bill]

51. The maps are clear

Kerry was a hard sell outside of urban areas. We need to address this issue or we will continue to lose. Dean may not have all the answers but he recognizes the problem.

[Cuban_Liberal]

52. I always liked Dr. Dean, although I supported Sen. Edwards.

Howard Dean had TONS of good ideas, and I could have easily supported him, had he gotten the nomination. It's fairly obvious that what we've been doing isn't working, and it's time to start doing something different, and I think Howard Dean may well be the person to lead our party into that new arena. Not only was he a good politician, but most people forget that he was also a VERY GOOD physician, too; good physicians have to be good diagnosticians, and Howard Dean seems to have diagnosed our problem pretty well.

I think it's time to now take the medicine that the good doctor has prescribed.

[Cuban_Liberal]

54. Kick.

Let's open our minds, folks.

:hi:

[Kahuna]

55. Not really. What Dean and other Democrats failed to realize is

people, Dems included place their value system above anything else. We do it too. As liberals we have a set of values (freedom, the Constitution, freedom of speech, civil rights) above our economic concerns.

[Cuban_Liberal]

56. Actually, Dr. Dean *does* realize tht, Kahuna.

That's one reason he said we need to get over our obsession with things like gun-control, e.g., and start reaching out to Southerners, finding the common ground we share and building on it.