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BQueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-03-04 10:56 PM
Original message
"What Is This Shith?!"
Edited on Wed Nov-03-04 11:09 PM by BQueen
To quote Bluto, one of the great cinematic rebels...

I wrote this from about five to six tonight for another blog, but I think it's also somewhat appropriate here, and wanted to post it since I see defeatism all around since I checked in at DU not long ago. I'll try to edit it to fit here, but I'm exhausted and my brain is getting spongy. If the part about provisionals/absentees has been superceded by later events, sorry...out of the loop all day.

I was out there on the ground in Ohio in a hellishly red area getting about 5 to 1 positive responses to our presence -- huge turnout, lots of young people and (friendly) seniors. Something smells...

Okay,
I've barely even processed the fact that Kerry conceded. Just got home from being a good samaritan at about 4, out since 8:30, on maybe 5 hours of sleep after standing in the rain most of yesterday.

First, I'll admit a few tears of frustration and despair -- we all get those moments. Read over the blog post-concession and there's lots of good stuff here -- too tired now to brain-storm, but we've got plenty of material to work with.

Second, concessions mean diddly-squat other than in the public perception. I grant you that it would appear to be really stupid to concede at this point, from a PR standpoint -- it seems to embolden the opponent and also demoralize your supporters by reneging on a promise.

Hopefully you noted the articles saying that the counts will continue in Ohio and Florida. That is because the concession does not change the law in existence at the time of the election... remember your Antichrist Scripture Book of Baker, Chapter 3, "You can't change the rules in the middle..." The only way Kerry could concede the right for the votes to be counted is if he were a party to the "contract" that is an election -- he isn't...that agreement exists between the United States and its citizenry.

That was exactly the reason why the USSC should never have taken Bush v. Gore -- w was not a party in interest; it wasn't his vote that was allegedly being diminished, it was the votes of Floridians. In legal terms, w did not have "standing" to make the claim -- he could not stand in the shoes of the people whose rights he was claiming to defend.

Let's take this another step -- what if when the counts are completed, it shows Kerry won Ohio or Fla or both? Do those states then choose not to award those electoral votes even though the concession was based on early returns and the provisionals/absentees were lopsided for Kerry? Please!! The citizens of those states can seek to force the naming of the proper (Dem) electoral slate...Kerry can help by seeking to join as a third party plaintiff or by filing amicus briefs, but basically, it is not his ox being gored here (no pun intended when I decided to use that phrase, but it is fitting, no?). Shouldn't we want him enough to fight for him? He did for us, and I'm not convinced this isn't strategic, although I haven't had the benefit of viewing his concession speech.

Another step -- even if the counts don't go Kerry's way, suppose that due to efforts by various individuals and groups we demonstrate that there is something fishy, get investigations, etc., and can raise a colorable claim of election fraud. And don't start in on me with the nay-saying -- fraud takes time to investigate, you can't do a damned thing until it's going down, and the polls haven't even been closed for 24 hours yet. The corpse not only isn't cold yet -- it isn't even a fucking corpse! So quit your keening over the late-not-so-great Kerry campaign; no sale.

Okay, back to the fraud -- one major pillar of the law is that decisions (legal rulings, contracts, etc.) based on fraud are not binding. The Latin term is "void ab initio," which I always liked for some reason, meaning held void from the beginning, as if it never existed. Now, granted, I have no idea of the application of the concept to say, an inauguration, but I think it could certainly be applied to the certification of a slate of electors.

Without doing research on more of the specifics, I can't come up with a date (seem to recall mid-December from 2000...) and even if the certifications go thru then, proof of fraud could arguably require recert up to inauguration.

BOTTOM LINE: From what I can prod out of my brain right now, it is my belief that we have about a month and a half to get at least probable cause level evidence on the fraud in order to attempt a halt of the certification of the electors' slates.

The counts are going on, and that *may* pull our butts out of the fire, but as someone up-blog noted, we've got no time to be depressed. Today was it -- seven stages of grief compressed into one afternoon (or maybe a weekend) consisting largely of disbelief. {Hang on to that Anger character, though, there will be pressing need for that...}

Tomorrow, we begin....research, interview voters (e-mail family and friends in swing states and ask them to describe their voting experience in as much detail as they can recall – things that didn’t seem notable at the time often raise flags later), find something, anything, that you can do to work on this collectively. This is one time when it’s not just okay to ‘throw yourself into work’ to avoid despair – it’s absolutely essential that you do exactly that. In other cases, it would prevent healing; in this case, it could erase the reason for the despair.

It will take a few days for the organizations to put plans in place to know where to assign volunteers. (Not saying this was unexpected, but again, impossible to deal with fraud until you know its form.) This leaves a few days of feeling directionless. Go to the various websites and indicate your willingness to help – that will help them have a better idea of resources. Let them know if you can travel, work via internet, etc. Be specific about talents that you think may be helpful – Can you get people to talk easily? – actors, apply here (remember, we are not agents of the state bound by the Fourth Amendment). Are you good at research, statistics, computer programming, demystifying technical verbiage often contained in esoteric elections regulations, a writer able to translate an interview into an affidavit? Do the e-mail interviews of family and friends (make sure to ask about turnout, lines, etc.), if they know ANYONE who worked the polls or in BOE offices (lots of temps), see if they can get them to talk.

None of this will be easy by any stretch of the imagination. This will take the combined effort, resources and strength of will of everyone who realizes that this is our country that is on the line. We ARE fighting for our lives, here. But, realistically, what did we expect? We knew that anything but “Kerry in a Landslide” was a recipe for repug “problems” after the election. We knew that the fight would continue into December or longer, even if the counts were over. We just hoped that we would be in a position of perceived strength for the fight. But perceived strength can be overrated. The element of a surprise knockout punch from a seemingly toppled foe cannot be.

We are the underdog. We are Rocky. We are DanielSan. We are the BoSox down three games to the New York Yankees, the richest team in baseball. They may have the money, but we have the talent and the will to take them out. They know that. They believe they have vanquished us because they have taken our head. But, like the mythical Hydra, the creature that will pursue them in their waking nightmare has many heads, all of which will be striking at different points at different times.

We are united - we will not be deterred, and we will not be denied the electoral process due us. This is not the end of anything; it is simply a new stage of the fight, slightly less heady than expected. But infinitely more gratifying if it comes off.

C'mon -- it's actually OUR turn now -- we get our chance to kick the bully in the nads. How many threads have I seen here crying in frustration that Kerry-Edwards weren't going for the jugular? They couldn't -- we can. It's that part of the movie where the bullied have to stand up and realize that together they are strong.

So, again I ask "What is this shith?.... Over?! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? **** It's not over til WE say it's over!" Because, dammit -- WE ARE THE PEOPLE.

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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-03-04 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. Exactly what I was screaming at Boies (well, the radio) in 2000
"That was exactly the reason why the USSC should never have taken Bush v. Gore -- w was not a party in interest; it wasn't his vote that was allegedly being diminished, it was the votes of Floridians. In legal terms, w did not have "standing" to make the claim -- he could not stand in the shoes of the people whose rights he was claiming to defend."

All of your post well stated, nominating for front page. THanks for posting.
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BQueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-03-04 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. wow, thanks!
amazing what a creaky body and sleep-deprived brain can produce sometimes.
B-)

And boy, I was screaming the same thing....
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DUreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-03-04 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
3. I'm bookmarking this for later
I'm on short focus tight now.
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steely Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-03-04 11:33 PM
Response to Original message
4. KinAY BQueen!
What can I do as a citizen to be a screaming pain in the ass to the politicians? Anyone got any ideas? Write letters pointing out their fucked-uped-ness? I volunteered locally in gubment, but it's small potatoes. I joined ACLU (sent a chk), but what can I do to fight smart and make my voice be heard?
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BQueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Have to work on those,
I think I'm finally ready to crash -- adrenaline finally wore off.

Thought I'd pounce on your question as an opportunity for a shameless self-promotional kick before bed. B-)
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
6. Kick n/t
Kick
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Nightjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. You are inspiring BQ
Thanks for the shot of hope you gave me that John Kerry took from me when he conceded so quickly.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 05:53 PM
Response to Original message
8. kick...
excellent post BQ!!! :)
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noiretextatique Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
9. great post...something is in the works
i just know it. the stakes are too high to simply fold without fighting the same folks who stole the 2000 election. it's not over until WE say it's over...damn straight!!! and it's not over yet.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Yes, Things Flying Under Radar Without Media Circus.
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Chili Donating Member (832 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 06:15 PM
Response to Original message
10. LOUD APPLAUSE
I've done my crying. I'm now enraged.

Give me direction.
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TexasSissy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
11. I'm not with you on everything...but I think this should be pursued,
rather than just fold. If there's a chance that this election was stolen.
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BQueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
13. Direction? I’ll try,
but everyone needs to pitch in ideas along with sweat.

I think we start with contacting the voting-rights protection groups. I again spent all day out helping a sweet mentally-challenged couple being screwed over by w and his minions. So I’m fired-up, but not as sharp as I’d like to be for true brain-storming. I can’t even think of the right names right now. Black Box Voting, NAACP, CommonCause.org, votingrights.org or something? I just registered for the blog at Common Cause, and they seemed to have a stockpile of raw information already...

Phrase contact e-mails PRESUMING that there will be a rapid investigation and that they will need many volunteers in order to prevent the unthinkable – another stolen election where the evidence was not disseminated widely in the US before it could do any good. The more people we have working on evidence-gathering, the quicker we can analyze and put together a case, if one exists. If you presuppose that something is in the works, it will carry more weight than a request for an investigation, and if they haven’t thought of it (which I doubt) it will help cement the idea as one with merit.

As people seem to like this post, I’m going to send a version to Greg Palast. Since he’s been down the Florida road once, his experience is invaluable. Also the NAACP would be familiar with what’s involved – and we can use the Civil Rights’ Commission Report on Election 2000 as a crash-course primer for some of the stuff, I imagine. I’ll make sure I have it downloaded and look at it over the next couple days. I’ll volunteer to help Palast research Ohio laws and try to weasel some info out of possible BOE contacts (had a really good one in cols, but unsure if still around).

As for individual direction – it’s just that – what are you best at, and what do you have time to do? What local government contacts do you have in swing states (or in non-swing states for comparative numbers to support the argument by contrast)? Can you read a spreadsheet easily? (got 2 degrees and it takes me lots of time to figure that stuff out) – just analyzing raw data for attorneys is a HUGE time saver on something like this. Even trawling the ‘internets’ to mine the data takes time, even though it’s probably not that hard to find. Every hour you can give doing the time-consuming work frees up the experts and trained assistants and can widen the investigation.

Don’t hide your light under a bushel – say outright what your experience in an area is or why you think you would be effective in a certain way (including if you’re an internet-politics junkie who can find anything). Treat it like a resume and they can better assess how to utilize volunteers, and it will signal your commitment to the cause. If you can’t think of what you might be able to contribute specifically, just tell them what work/life experience you have, how important this is to you and ask what you can do to help. Make sure to include your location if via e-mail.

Some people have come up with some great questions about the numbers, but that’s not my area of expertise.

Faun Otter – Exit polls analysis versus reported vote count
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=11874#19010 (includes the bar graphs showing odd fluctuations in swing states’ data as opposed to non-swing)

Passport -
What's the deal with Bush getting more votes than voters in parts of Ohio?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2596872

Just two of the threads I’ve run across that had some intriguing aspects, and I haven’t had much time to spend looking. If you find others that look promising, post them, please.

I thought about starting a new thread for this in the Meeting Room or another less busy forum as a project/collection of the DU posts that contain leads. Thoughts?

And so to bed -- I will check back tomorrow after my subconscious has some time to work on it.

Thanks for all the great responses, everyone!
BQ
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Nightjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
14. One more kick for the Queens inspiration
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