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[sistersofmercy]

1. I've been doing reading on Lebonan lately, I'm trying to pull together

an understanding of the strife in the region in general. I started with Israel which brought me to Lebanon. read an interesting interview with Venus Knoury-Ghatta. By the way, I think Bremer's on vacation. I totally agree with you about years of strife in Iraq but I thought that when this war started.

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2. regarding iraq, who is fighting who?

i mean in terms of a civil war, are we talking about sunnis vs shiites? shiites vs shiites? it's hard to tell what's really going on... i'd like more info...

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[sistersofmercy]

7. But didn't the fact that palestinians fleeing Israel had something

to do with it as well? The way it reads to me is that the PLO began operating or taking cover in Lebanon, when an incident occured in west bank israel responded with bombing the south of lebanon. Which put the christians in sticky situation of cracking down on muslims! No I'm not anti-semitic but I do think if I'm reading the history correctly that israel is in part at fault for the civil war that followed.

[sistersofmercy]

4. Where to begin....

Prior to the war, the two different Kurdish groups in north were fighting each other, in fact, one of them ask for and got help from saddam. So far we've had the kurds and the turkmen fighting in the north since this war. Then we have the shi'ites who will mostly target sunnis who they hold responsible for years for oppression. In addition, there will be the shi'ite moderates vs the shi'ite extremist! Iranian influence when and if it comes will determine the outcome. The way I see it so far Iran has been playing along with the US, the cleric targeted had been in exile in Iran for 23 yrs, also US had been in negotiations with Iran about al qaeda detainees. Another little known fact is at the beginning of the war, a once popular shiite cleric who had been in exile in london for some yrs was air vac into najaf by Us to try to win approval for US, he was hacked to death by an angry mob of shiites, along with I believe his nephew.

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5. thanks to sistersofmercy and peteNYC for replies

so something like

North: kurds vs kurds vs turkmen

Central/South: sunnis vs shiites, shiite moderate (i.e. cooperating with usa? with iran? unclear) vs extremist


i remember that shiite cleric who was hacked to death-- not exactly a cheery beginning for this horrible enterprise

final question: who do you think is most likely responsible for the recent bombing in najaf?

[sistersofmercy]

6. That's a really hard call....

The cleric had just expressed dismay with US being unable to stabilize the country or restore basic services. He was exiled by saddam but saddam released a tape today saying "Wasn't me!" Which totally cracks me up (guess he found his taperecorder). I do find it interesting the tape doesn't address the UN bombing. Then there was the bombing in the north of another shiite cleric extremist struggling for power about a week before. The jury's still out for me! I think it's far too easy to just point the finger at baathist though.

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8. look at this just posted in LBN

US, Israel Stood To Gain from Najaf Bomb-- Hizbollah

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=92732

looks like everyone's trying to figure it out