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LTRS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:16 PM
Original message
The story about Ohio ballot fraud came from DU'ers
You guys all realize that, right? Some DU poster found it, posted it, and a bunch of us called and wrote emails.

But the bigger stuff is in Florida. Looks like Bev is on this, but hopefully we can push this into the press as well. I have been posting this all morning.

Flordia ballots show huge (and I mean HUGE) numbers of DEMS supposedly voting for Bush in very Dem counties. The spreadsheet linked below has the data, and was done by someone else (Kathy Dopp). But we checked it and it's true.

So, my partner spent hours crunching numbers last night and there is no doubt - they stole FL. Trust me, we are NOT the conspiracy theorist types, and even on Wed I posting here saying "take off the tin foil hat" to people who automatically assumed it was stolen.

But it was. It really was. Check here.

http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm

That link shows the results compared to the registered dems and reps per county. And it shows that massive numbers of dems supposedly voted for Bush.

It's just not possible that 40 and 50% of registered dems voted for Bush, but ONLY in optical scan counties. For one thing, if it were true that they voted for Bush, why wouldn't the exit polls and endless number of pre-election polls have reflected a massive movement for Bush from Dems?

I don't know how to post a spreadsheet here, but here is a summary of how they did Florida AND what the results would have been had they not messed with the machines (at least an approximation):

Summary

-- In 13 of 15 touchscreen voting counties in Florida, Dems gained over what would be expected looking at just registration percentages –more than just Dems voted for Kerry in these counties

-- But in only 7 of 52 optical scanner voting counties (15%), Dems gained over what would be expected looking at registration percentages - this seems a little odd

-- In the touchscreen counties, the average gain was 8% over what you would expect based on Dem registration, including all 15 counties

--In the optical scanner counties, the average loss was 16.6% under what you would expect based on dem registration, including all 52 counties

-- If you apply the 8% average plus the expectations based on registration that was seen in the touchscreen counties to the optical scanner counties where we saw losses in the Dem column, it's a total of 281,143.

If you add this number to Kerry’s total, and subtract this number from Bush’s…

Method
Bush Votes
Kerry Votes

Subtotal
Touchscreen
1,845,876
1,982,210

Subtotal
Op-Scan-Precinct
1,950,213
1,445,675

Adjustment

-281,143
+281,143

Corrected Subtotal
Op-Scan-Precinct
1,668,730
1,727,158

Corrected Total
All Methods
3,514,606 - Bush
3,709,368 - Kerry

And guess what, when you correct, it matches the exit polls!

If we could get the paper ballots rescanned in Florida with machines that had been actually checked to make sure they was no fraud going on, you would see that Kerry very likely won this election.
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:17 PM
Response to Original message
1. Unless this makes mainstream media, though..

..it really doesn't matter.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Then get busy
and help get it in the mainstream media.
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. It matters if someone files suit. Not even MSM will dis THAT scoop
--------------------------------------------------------------------
FIGHT! Take this country back one town and state at a time!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/electionreform.htm
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. It made Yahoo ....Keep up The Hard Work
Now is not the the time To Relent .

Focuss Focuss Focuss

we got an election process to fix
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skooooo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Yep I saw that...
now is the time to make noise
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KitSileya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
15. Could you provide a link?
I'd like to rate that story a 5.
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Nay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. Even if it makes the mainstream media, it won't matter -- look at all
the stuff that DID make the media, and nada happened. Plame, Abu Ghraib, I could go on and on. After a few weeks, it all went away.

The ONLY thing that will matter is if someone FILES A LAWSUIT. Forget the goddam media, and find out how to file. And let's file before December, so the rightful president can take office. Otherwise, it will be 2000 all over again.

WHO ON THIS BOARD KNOWS WHAT IS DONE LEGALLY TO CORRECT VOTER FRAUD LIKE THIS? I don't. I wish I did. But someone must know how, and those people need to get the ball rolling. Forget the stupid media.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
2. I have been informing
many, many people about the information you are posting. I appreciate the work you are doing. We need everyone to help.
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LTRS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Thank you, thank you, thank you!
It's Kathy Dopp we should thank for compiling the data in the first place though. I am just a persistent bugger who, after I spent all last night analyzing it, is determined not to let it go uninvestigated.

One senatorial aide I know wrote back and said AP is investigating ballot corruption overall. But we need to pound this story. Thanks for your help.
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kslib Donating Member (485 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I'm new. How do we do that?
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tsuki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
8. Can anyone get this info to
President Carter and his group? They know about this kind of fraud. They have been all over the world with it. I am printing all the info and will send it to the Carter Center, along with a plea. Help us here in Florida. You were right.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
9. That's why I don't believe those who say "The media did it"
Edited on Fri Nov-05-04 04:32 PM by sangh0
This PROVES that we can force the media to cover our stories, but we have be ORGANIZED to do so
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. that's right.
It takes hard work and organization. It also helps that the people who have brought this to our attention have done a heck of a good job organizing it, and giving it in an orderly, factual manner. It's not a lot of name-calling and insults. Rather, it is a search for truth.
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slutticus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
10. Kick
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
14. Yet another example of why Kerry should not have conceded.
While a concession speech has no real legal status, it does have a very symbolic one - and it causes the general public to assume that the election was fair, clean, and is now over. This perception is being merrily reinforced by the Republican party, the mainstream conservative corporate media, and (may it be to their eternal shame) even some Dems.

Kerry could have just waited for the provisional ballots in Ohio, and the 1.8 million absentee ballots in Florida, before making a decision. Had he done so, he'd have bought us the time needed to expose the fraud that obviously occurred.

Why, oh WHY, did Kerry concede? More importantly, is he paying attention to all the stories of fraud popping up, and will he do anything about them???

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GumboYaYa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. I wonder whether Kerry knew that if he did not concede the Repugs
would have swarmed over FL and OH with attorneys preempting the ability to investigate these claimes without being hounded by the media and the Repugs every step of the way.
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LTRS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. Could be! Let's hope that is the strategy
But I kind of doubt it. The AP never would have run that story if some DUer hadn't been digging around the 414 page Ohio report.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. No way for him to know that. Suspect it, maybe.
But given that 1) more people actually voted for Kerry than b*sh and 2) we all remember 2000, I think he could have risked saying "let all the votes be counted, and if I lose, so be it".

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GumboYaYa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
16. Oh my god...that is way beyond the scope of explainable results.
I had really avoided getting tinto the fraud issues, not b/c I don't beleive them, but b/c I can't stand the thought of getting my hopes completely dashed again. A part of me had really hoped that there was no fraud so that I can at least trust our elections. After seeing those numbers, I can only conclude that there was massive fraud.

It's time to roll up the sleeves and dig into this issue now.

Thanks for sharing.
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 06:04 PM
Response to Original message
20. kick
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