Talk to me about what happened on Bill Maher last night.

[Hamlette]

Al Simpson and Andrew Sullivan were on, among others. Both of them chastised us for not being in touch with the values of people in the red states as evidenced by the exit polls which apparently show 20% of voters last Tuesday voted on moral/values issues.

I thought "values" this year was codespeak for anti gay marriage amendments. Both Al and Andy support gay marriage or at least civil unions.

Aren't they just as out of touch with red state values as we are?

If you saw it, Simpson, former Senator from Wyoming, seemed to have made some disconnect early on. He got defensive and tried to correct by saying he heard the audience laughing and thought they were making fun of him. What the hell did he have to be defensive about? He won and Bill was extremely nice to him. He came on the show looking for a fight, I think. Why?

I wouldn't have made too much of it had it not been Andrew Sullivan then jumping us for our lack of values. Since he's not ony gay but rumored to practice unsafe sex, who is HE to lecture me about being out of touch with homophobes?

If I'm reading this right, and I'll readily admit to possibly reading too much into this, Al and Andy were defensive about moral issues polling so high in a year when discriminating against a class of people was on the ballot. Al was so quick to say he was pro choice and gay rights. It was a disconnect.

Is this OUR wedge issue? When we talk about demo moving to the center there is one area we can coopt without losing our ideals: fiscal responsibility. We could be fiscal conservatives. It's all bullshit language anyway. The GOP have outspent the Dems when they controlled the white house for the last 25 years.

Let's drive a wedge between sane christians and insane christians, sane republicans and freepers.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

1. Sullivan is a Right Wing Hypocritical Prick!!!!

He'll do anything to protect the Neo-Cons! :grr:
And yes, Sully is known to be promiscuous!

:argh:

[blondeatlast]

31. Not to mention, as much as he runs circles around himself

with his wacko logic, he has a unique ability to, well, you know.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

2. If being 'in touch with values of people in the red states' means

supporting homophobia, then let me be 'out of touch' because I want no part of that whatsoever. I agree; Simpson looked like he was ready for a fight.:spank:

[PROGRESSIVE1]

3. Why was Alan looking for a fight?

[Hamlette]

6. that's the question I keep asking. . .

if I were a famous person and we had won the election decisively and I went on Hannity or O'Rielley...I would not have been defensive.

I would have moved heaven and earth to not appeal smug but I sure as hell would not have been looking to pick a fight.

[nedbal]

11. it will get worse....

>>>>I would have moved heaven and earth to not appeal smug but I sure as hell would not have been looking to pick a fight<<<


They despise DU types as much as the allies despised Hitler after they won, they feel no need to reach out to the 48% . Think it's bad now, it will get worse....

[Hamlette]

13. no, I guess I didn't make my argument well

they wer not smug, they were defensive. What do the republicans have to be defensive about.

there are 2 memember of the GOP who support liberal social policies.

I think they were defensive because they knew this election showed a side of American that is ugly and that ugly side voted for them.

[joefree1]

29. Bad analogy

"allies despised Hitler after they won"

More like how the Nazis dispised the Jews after they came into power. And we all know what happen to the Nazi's don't we.

You want to fix that?

[Kurovski]

4. I'll say only one thing about it

they broke a cardinal rule of comedy: they were self righteous assholes. (Simpson and Sullivan} They took themselves too seriously. They should have saved it for Flux news or CNN.

Bill, I don't ever want to see them on again. I tuned in to have some laughs. It was gruesome.

The Repubelickin party needs to be more self-effacing --Bob Dole notwithstanding. Even if some painful truths emerge about themselves in the process

[Vanje]

5. "Milky Loads" Sullivan lectures on Moral Val-Yoos.

Thats rich.

Simpson is a cranky cranky man.

These Republicans are sure poor winners.

[Touchdown]

33. Is "Milky Loads" his screen name on the barebacking chatrooms?

That's rich! LOL! He's also HIV+ and is not rumored, but KNOWN to have solicited unsafe sex on one of the internets. It's well known in the gay community.

Mike Singoreli is always attacking Sully for being a hypocrite and an Auntie Lance. I'm going to make sure and catch his show Monday (Sorry Al, but I can miss one Oy, Oy, Oy show once...or forever)...to hear if he saw RT. He'll have some juicy things to say.

Barebacking. v - To have unprotected male on male anal intercourse. ...Just for your information, straight people. It's a new word. Before AIDS it was called fucking.;)

[Jack_Dawson]

7. Sullivan is a Log Cabin Repuke

who was definitely experiencing his "special time" last night. The in-control congressional repukes (Alan Simpson) proved that they are more angry and humorless than ever.

[Old and In the Way]

8. All Republicans and their broadcast media co-conspirators must

maintain the offensive and the RNC meme that Bush has a mandate. It is their very survival that we are talking about here. We're not going anywhere, the facts will continue show another fraudulent election. The domestic news will continue to go south, the world will get more united against us.....

The Republican World is shrinking everyday, outraged Americans against these people will grow relentlessly. They can steal elections, but they cannot steal the hearts of minds of the growing majority. The clock is ticking and there is nothing they can do stop it.

[wickywom]

9. I've noticed a rise in FW : and RE emails from my fundie inlaws ,

seems relatives on the other side have been attacking thier fundamentalism.
The responses have been nothing short of shocking.

We Liberal Chrsitians are pissed.
I just completed my best work ever on how the Right keeps Abortion legal to control Christians...
and that basically many Christians in our country are too self righteous to ever affect any change because they care more about being right than doing right.

They just poked us with a big stick.

[Hamlette]

14. I don't know what "FW" and "RE" mean

[ldf]

17. they are types of emails

FW: are forwards, where people just pass them along to others.

RE: is responding TO emails. many hit "reply all" which sends to everyone who received the original email.

[MatrixEscape]

10. Chomsky was so misunderstood and

had so little time. Plus, he didn't get a chance to reply in kind. After he was off, he was getting slammed by an idiot.

That was a disgrace to me. Maher should do a whole show with Chomsky on so people can have enough of him to understand his depth and clarity.

Chomsky calls himself a Conservative and a Zionist, BTW. Some statements made about his leanings were ignorant.

[Hamlette]

16. yes, there were many arguments to be made to defend Chomsky's position

but Andy just lost it and started screaming about how he hates America.

Would be nice to have a forum where we could discuss things without calling names.

[kysrsoze]

18. Andrew Sullivan is a big whining pussy.

After Al whatever was on, he proceeded to try and ream Maher, saying he's criticizing Christians and acting all superior. Maher pointed out the RWers do the same damned thing, and Sullivan would say, "Yes, you're exactly right." Then he would whine about some other non-issue and get slammed by Maher and Hughley again. I really like D.L. He says some great things. It's too bad they didn't give Chomsky more time to talk.

[Wind Dancer]

23. Maher made it clear that he didn't agree with

any of Chomsky's views, very disappointing for me to hear.

I thought everything Chomsky said was on target, I am as upset with Maher as I am with Simpson and Sullivan.

[Kurovski]

24. I seem to recall Maher saying

he didn't agree with everything Chomsky said, Not that he didn't agree at all.

It will be rerun --tonight?

[Randi_Listener]

12. Fuck that cunt

2 red state pukes who don't know pig shit.

[Hamlette]

15. well, gee Randi, that's a productive comment

how do we expect to convince people we are right when we call them names.

Anyway, you missed my point. I was saying they seemed to be on our side, or at least defensive about what their party did.

[Kurovski]

25. Exactly, but

Andy especially would have something to say about his own party, instead he and his pal Simpson followed faxed party orders and blathered humorouslessly on about how the dems aren't bowing down to the extremist self-deluded "values" of 22% of voters.

Dems represent values as expressed by Christ in a way the fantasy-based PIPA crowd couldn't begin to accept. Why keep giving in to horseshit? Those days are over.

[AndyTiedye]

19. We ALREADY ARE the Fiscal Conservatives

Under Clinton $200B+ Surplus
Under Boosh $500B+ Deficit

we spend money on social programs, they spend it on unnecessary war.
War is very expensive, especially when you let Halliburon steal
so much of the money you're spending on it.

[ibegurpard]

20. There are a LOT of people in Simpson's boat

And they are feeling boxed-in and that's why they lash out. And we have to find a way to peel them away from the radical fundamentalists.

[Hamlette]

22. that's exactly what I was thinking

that Simpson is seeing is party pulling too far to the right on social issues and was lashing out at us (misplaced).

They think they have made a deal with the devil and are not sure what to do about it.

Can't we figure a way to peel them off, as you say?

[Kurovski]

27. It seems their own conscience

would be the only thing that could do that.

I guess they'll have to weigh six-figure incomes against their own better selves.

It's up to them.

We've got other things to tend to for now. Let their integrity be their own struggle.

[Wind Dancer]

32. Well said! n/t

[mulsh]

21. Bill should have let simpson rant

As I watched simpson getting shriller and shriller and Maher trying to defend himself I thought " let him spew Bill. we'll probably learn something about these nazis."

Simpson always struck me as one of the more accessable repubs. last night he was clearly on attack mode. I kept thinking he's getting his orders from above and that his performance is emblematic of what's in store from the rest of his party. Ie. his remark about not taking this "bullshit anymore, pal."

Unfortunately Bill got defensive and inturrupted Simpson in mid rant. I think if Bill had kept quite we would have seen simpson behaving as repellant as sullivan did later in the show. I'm pretty sure Simpson was saying something very important about not insulting the people you want to appeal to. I'm equally sure that had been given the chance he would have reavealed a couple of ugly truths about his party.

it was one Bill Maher's better shows. can't wait until next season.

[rockydem]

26. I totally agree - we have to spearate the loons from the not-loons

We can split the pukes on these issues....

[Reciprocity]

28. On Bill Maher last night

Simpson and Sullivan are scared shitless that Americans have finely woke up to the fact our government has been hijacked by fundamentalist both Christian and Islamic. These two are at war with each other. Rivers of blood and countless martyrs to their cause. Blinded by hate spewed from the church and mosque no sacrifice is to great. It was hate that coused the church going public to come out in numbers never seen before.Repent now the end is near.
Umm that was a joke sort of.

[gratefull4u]

30. There is already a big wedge between sane & insane Christians.

My church has been fighting them for years. Hopefully this debate will help show the right wing churches for what they are, a political organization.