The word from dem pundits and consultants...

[LTRS]

Is that dems won't be able to hold the line on conservative judicial nominations without looking bad now that Bush has a "mandate." They also say that he will likely seek to change the 60 vote fillibuster rule, and we are just going to have to live with it for 4 yrs.

Has it ever ocurred to anyone else here that dem pundits and consultants may be at the heart of what is wrong with our party? It sure has to me. Given their history, they are probably telling Kerry to ignore the election irregularities, accept defeat and move on.

[Downtown Hound]

1. I think we need some new Dem pundits

[henslee]

2. Some specifics might make your post a bit more weighty. One man's

dem pundit is another man's spewing shill poodlewhore. PFFFT. on edit....Names. Maybe a source. A quote or two. Come on, you're a 400 plus poster, I expect more.

[ixion]

3. the DLC lapdog mentality is very much part of the problem

they continue to play softball to repug hardball, which means they play the loser constantly.

It really sucks that this is the alleged opposition. :eyes:

[LTRS]

8. No kidding - one of the first calls I got on Thur morning

was from a political consultant who said "you know, I think we (meaning democrats) should back off gay rights. People just don't support gay marriage."

I was like, oh really -- did I miss the part where John Kerry or any other dem politician DID support gay marriage? 'Cause I think I would have noticed that.(I am a gay rights activist).

The speed with which the rat was ready to jump off a ship the dems are'nt even really on was astounding. All it took was a few hours of media coverage on the issue.

No surrender is a good slogan, but I think "do surrender" is more like it. Now if we could only get dem politicians to stop listening to them.

[Zuni]

4. Do they want to lose more votes?

Giving up and turning tail will make them really look like pussies

[Maddy McCall]

5. Who are these "pundits and consultants" of which you speak?

[LTRS]

10. Consultants - no one famous or that you would

have ever heard of. Pundits - Josh Marshall, Ruy Teixeira and the like.

[KittyWampus]

21. Many Of Us HAVE Heard Of Josh M. What Quotes Are You Talking About

please provide specific attributable quotes.

Otherwise this seems like "some Democratic Insider says" nonsense.

[chiburb]

27. Or "some people say"....

Ya know what I mean?

[sangh0]

28. Ahh, the lengths some will go to quote without quoting

Several posts to explain what was actually said without actually saying what was actually said.

[regnaD kciN]

33. Huh? I've read everything Marshall and Teixeira have written...

...since the election, and I've seen nothing of the sort you describe. All I've seen is Marshall quoting a FoxNews claim that Bush will try to change the cloture rules. However, as best I understand it, you need at least a 60-vote (and possibly a 67-vote) supermajority to do this. I have a hard time believing that between four and seven Democrats would defect to go along with a proposal that would so clearly strip them of any power whatsoever.

[Shopaholic]

6. I agree 100% they are the problem--

the consultants and the pundits and the *&^%#$ DLC have ruined this party. They have their narrow-minded beltway mentality and they can't see the big picture--they just don't "get it". So they believe that we're supposed to let them screw us and we're supposed to thank them for screwing us???? Just how fucked up is that?

[LTRS]

11. Bingo - beltway mentality!

Kiss of death, but no one can convince them of that.

[tech3149]

14. We can't win if it's not from the bottom up

Work locally to educate, support, and grow support. Screw the national party leadership, they haven't done the job.
We're pissed
We're motivated
We have the power to do it

[chiburb]

7. Ah! We refuse to throw out the GLBTs and the Women, so lets point fingers

at the consultants and pundits. You don't name them so I can't argue with you, all I can do is note yet another "divide and conquer" post.

Thanks.

[LTRS]

12. If they cave on judges without a fight....

they have thrown out the GLBTs and the women. And I have named them. Check out talkingpointsmemo.com. He is basically saying the same thing I am hearing.

[chiburb]

17. And you can't name them because?

And WHO said Dem senators were caving on judges? Can you nama anyone on ANY subject?

[sangh0]

22. LTRS is a master at quoting "unnamed" sources

Supposedly, he's a BMOC who's given thousands and thousands of dollars and has had dinner with John Edwards

[chiburb]

26. At what point is it futile to challenge these types of posts?

Maybe if we didn't reply they'd sink like stones?

Oh well, at least you and I get to kiss NSMA's ass!! And I'm holding her to it!

[sangh0]

29. Never futile.

DUers can be slow, but the get the point eventually.

And you better let go of her. I want my turn

[WCGreen]

36. Shit I had dinner with Al Gore a couple of years

back and I still think these pundits and consultants are full of it....

It's just like in the private sector. Consultants come in and tell everyone what "has" to be done in order to succeed and the whoooshh they are gone, never having to suffer the effects of their bullshit....

We might as well be taking advice form Tony Roberts or reading the MBA book of the day......

fuck em all....

[nostamj]

9. "change the 60 vote fillibuster rule" shit!

that will KILL Senator BYRD.

sickening!

[sangh0]

13. Has anyone else ever noticed

that when the media cites "unnamed" Dem sources, it's a Dem repeating a puke talking point, and when the media cites an "unnamed" puke source, it's a puke repeating puke talking points?

If yes, do you also ignore these anonymous reports?

[Eloriel]

19. No, because

the Dems are increasingly talking Repug talking points quite on their own.

[sangh0]

25. I'm still waiting for proof of your latest lie

(about how DUers are claiming the Kerry is doing something about the vote fraud) so I won't bother asking you for any proof.

I might as well ask a Fundie for proof that the Bible is God's word.

[Kat45]

15. I wanna be a pundit!

I've always wondered, how does one become a pundit? I think I'd be a good pundit--where do I apply? :-)

[demgrrrll]

32. Yea me too. I could get on the tee vee and pontificate. Bush blows!

Really. We won't give him squat. How am I doin?

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. Jon Stewart already fielded an answer to your question.

Yes. The pundits are a BIG part of the problem. They're like fish wives just spouting off any crap they want.

[Eloriel]

18. Well, that's precisely why Bush & Cheney talked up "mandate"

despite the fact that they clearly do NOT have one (and in fact lost THIS time too). They know what they're doing and don't mind throwing their weight around a little or a lot; our side doesn't and are terrified of just exercising what little power they have left. Our side can roll over and play dead or they can fight. They're choosing the easy and spineless -- and horrifically dangerous (for democracy) -- way to cope with this. I've come to expect no less from them.

[Radical Activist]

20. The DNC should refuse to hire anyone who has never

lived in the south or midwest. That would solve a lot of our problems.

[Sara Beverley]

23. It's not up to them. It's up to the Dems in Congress!! They had better

fight. I don't give a damn about "looking bad" and Bush has no "mandate." Looking bad might be just what we need. Haven't we learned that there is no appeasing the RW?

[KittyWampus]

24. I Personally Think Your Entire Post Is A Load Of Made Up Crap

if it isn't, then post some actual quotes from some actual people.

[ethereal]

30. Google is your friend . .

with five seconds of effort, you'd have found this:

"Now, it looks like the Bush Brain Trust may try to end the filibuster that keeps Owen’s future up in the air. It works like this. Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist attempts to gradually lower from 60 to 51 the votes needed to end a filibuster. That fails, because it requires 60 votes to change a Senate rule and the Republicans have only 50. Then Vice President Cheney rules on a constitutional point of order that 51 votes can end a filibuster of nominations. The Senate parliamentarian, appointed by Republicans, upholds his ruling. The filibuster blocking Priscilla Owen is ended. (And the road is cleared for the right-wing Supreme Court justices Bush will appoint later in his first term.) It would be quite an end to a Senate procedure in effect since George Washington held office."

http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/30/news-dubose.php

[regnaD kciN]

34. My only comment on that scenario...

...is that if Cheney, on his own authority, had the power to change the cloture rules, they would have done so immediately after the 2002 elections, when they regained their Senate majority.

And, to confirm this, I can't help but notice that the article you quote, containing the prediction in question, is actually from early 2003. Obviously, the prediction didn't come to pass.

[LTRS]

35. Here you go - it is exactly what I am hearing as well

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2004_10_31.php#003940

[mmonk]

31. If that happens

my family may as well leave. ADA and IDEA will probably be gone.

[crispini]

37. The Dem pundits and consultants

can KISS MY PASTY WHITE ASS!!!!!!!

I've HAD IT with our democratic leadership. The only person who I'm paying any attention to any more is Howard Dean. They keep this shit up, I'm becoming a Green.