I want to know how people (especially Jews) feel about this

[PotatoBoy]

Associating Bush with the nazis... or, visually associating him with the nazis (putting a swastika near or in his name). Do you feel this is offensive to the Jewish people? Or do you feel Bush deserves such demoralization and the presence of the swastika in the context of Bush is not offensive?

Thanks for your input..much appreciated.

[BayCityProgressive]

1. well Hitler

Didnt only target Jews. Priests, religious minorities, gypsies, homosexuals, communists ect were all targets.

[The Zanti Regent]

2. Hitler is alive and well.

and he has morphed Swastikas into crosses.

[Pachamama]

3. Wrong - he's morphed swastikas into "W"'s....n/t

[sunnybrook]

4. I am not Jewish

but I think that for instance bumper stickers that use a swastika for the s in his name... are not likely to influence people to be against Bush because to most people that seems extreme. I know that I heard of elder Jews who said they were offended by Seinfeld's use of the character the "Soup Nazi," because they felt that it totally minimized nazism and was disrespectful to Holocaust survivors. It degrades an experience that was far, far worse. It distracts from the true message about all of the terrible things that Bush has done to compare him to Hitler.

[zacho]

5. Don't bother

It just gets the Republican base thinking we are crazy. Dom't rasise it to that level of attack.

But if you do want to end anti-semitism abroad tell them that Jews voted Bush out of office with nearly 80%.

[rockymountaindem]

6. Well...

to be honest, I see what people are getting at. However, as a Jew I have to admit I feel a strange sense of security from the Fundies. I know they can't touch me, as a direct result of my religion and heritage. This is because of their beliefs about what God promised to Abraham, and their beliefs about the end of the world. That doesn't mean they've tricked me into thinking they actually appreciate us for who we are, as many Jews seem to believe.

That being said, I do think the swastika being associated with Bush is kind of offensive. What Hitler did was motivated by some unique and very bizarre ideas. When you look at the long history of anti-Semitism and those who perpetrated it, most fall into two categories:

1. Religious fanatics. Tomas de Torquemada would be one of these.

2. Politicians and conquerors. This group includes the Romans, Bogdan Chelnitzky and people like King Edward III of England who expelled the Jews because he was so indebted to Jewish moneylenders.

Hitler did what he did as a result of a complex web of personal, political and pseudo-religious motives. Furthermore, Nazism was not your run-of-the-mill fascist movement. Other fascists did not use race and ethnicity as a basis for their system. Franco, Mussolini, Perron and others didn't target people because of their religion or ethnic heritage.

If you were going to tie Bush to fascism, I think the Fasces would be a more accurate symbol.

[Pachamama]

7. My Grandparents escaped the Nazi's...they are no longer alive, but I'm

certain as I am that the planet is round, not flat, that they would have seen a clear association and similarity of Bush and the Neo-cons with the Nazi Party. They were Catholic Academics from Southern Germany (Bavaria) and my Great Uncle was killed for questioning the nazis....I think that the similarities are frightening...

[henslee]

8. As a jew who's lost many relatives in the ovens, I think any pic of Bush

without a swastika feels wrong. In fact, I'm going to hit the newstand tonight with my sharpie.

[Bonobo]

9. Nope. Doesn't offend me. He is a fascist.

Fascism
n.
often Fascism
a. A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.

b. A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.

[PotatoBoy]

10. Thanks for your replies..appreciate it

The reason I was asking is because I was selling a bumper sticker that had "BUSH" on it with a swastika instead of the S. I got an email from someone from this forum (could've been a freeper..could've been a true DU'er, not sure) telling me that equating Bush with the nazis is non-productive.

My gut reaction was basically "too bad.. I think team Bush is a bunch of fascists." However, I got to thinking more..and realized that the symbology could be offensive especially to Jewish people. And yes, I realize Hitler was a supremacist in general..but you have to admit, the most damage he did was to the Jews.

Anyway, I'm taking the product off my store. I want to slap Bushies in the face with my designs...not offend people who don't deserve it. Thanks for your responses.

[henslee]

11. off topic... Q: How did Hitler tie his shoes? A: In little knotzies.

Sorry, but never get many chances to use that one.

[Maiden England]

12. I'm Jewish, and I think that these associations should be encouraged

I think its not only important to remember our history but to recognise that history loves to repeat itself. We shouldn't ever be so arrogant to think it can't happen here. I think that right now we stand at a crossroads, this country is teetering on the edge of following down the road that led Germany to Nazi led fascism. If I as a Jew am not the target of the hate of ruling party, that does not excuse me from standing shoulder to shoulder with those that are. How many times did my ancestors cry out for help in Nazi Germany, only to have backs turned to them in their hour of need. If the target this time is the GLBT community, Muslims, or Liberals, whoever it may be, it becomes my fight too. We are living in potentially dangerous times, a potential embezzelment of the election, a leader with ultimate arrogance and religious fervor, a media controlled by the government, and a population easily blinkered from the truth, and terrorised into inaction. We cannot ignore the dangerous parallels with the middle of the last century. We do so at our utmost risk.
Having said that, if using the swastika to represent Bush** draws conclusions in the mind of the reader, then all power to it. As long as he is being challenged, and held accountable we can perhaps avoid going down a dangerous path to fascism. I have no problems with that. I hope that this is all an exaggeration, a folly, that this will never happen in the USA, but I remain vigilant of where we are headed and reminders like seeing a swastika are an excellent insurance policy against the slippery slope.

[pdxmike]

13. over the top

OK. I can answer this. I'm a Jew. I hate Bush. I despise Bush. I hate everything he does and stands for. The Republican party has morphed into a breeding ground for flat-earth, holy-roller knuckle-draggers that hope to drag us back into the middle ages. But is he Hitler? No. And throwing around that type of rhetoric doesn't help us.

[GarySeven]

14. I just spoke with Jesus ...

Had an awfully hard time explaining it to him. Seems he never heard of a G.W. Bush.

[Blaq Dem]

15. Bush family is already associated with the NAZI's

The Bush family fortune came about through doing business with Hitler. Here's a link you can go to to read more about it:

http://www.truthout.com/docs_03/101903I.shtml

[villager]

16. as a Jewish Sunday school teacher...

...I think it's never too early to sound the alarms about theocratic fascists...

they're going after the gays now...

does anyone believe the Jews aren't on that list? Along with the "artists," the "feminists," etc.?

[Danmel]

17. Bush & Nazis

I am the daughter of a Holocaust survivor- I am named for his sister who was killed in Auschwitz. Every family member of my generation is named for someone who was killed by the Nazis.

I hate * as much as anyone- I think he is evil and sociopathic- I think this country could slide into fascism very easily- the Republican party marches in lock step, the "folks" at Abu Ghraib were following orders, McCain fellates a man who denigrated his family, it is sickening.

That said- I do think using a swastika is over the top. It is a very potent symbol- and it creates an very strong emotional reaction that I think would not serve the cause well- it will just make people think we are over reacting and make us look silly.

Just my two cents.

[DuaneBidoux]

18. Call it like it is: Christo-Facism

[Baja Margie]

19. It is entirely

appropriate.

Sieg Heil Bush !