DISCUSS: Republicans cause abortion

[JohnnyCougar]

Republicans = Poverty
Poverty = Abortions
Therefore:
Republicans = Abortion

The statistics don't lie.
http://www.baptiststandard.com/postnuke/index.php?module=htmlpages&func=display&pid=2458&print=1

[Dastard Stepchild]

1. The guy's end quote is kinda humorous...

In an interview, he reiterated that view, saying: "What I'm interested in is decreasing the number of abortions. I'm not interested in blame. But really, let's not have all of these babies aborted."


Ya know... really...

[Sapphocrat]

2. No, but...

...they certainly are poster children for retroactive abortion.

[liberalfrombirth]

3. Thanks for the smile

.

[NVMojo]

4. maybe they are failed abortions.

[ClassWarrior]

5. Check out this one...

Against Abortion? Vote Kerry.

Huhhhh???

http://www.thedailycitizen.com/articles/2004/10/28/news/opinion/opiniontaylor.txt

NGU.

[booley]

6. Not to sound cynical but could the dems use this?

As a wedge issue.

IF years of republican (and by perception Conservative Christian) misleadership isn't stopping abortions, then that leaves us with an opening on the dem side.

The trick is that we are pro-choice and not about to sell out our own principals. we can't outlaw abortion or make it inaccesable. But I don't think we have too.

Consider this, very few Americans want totally unrestricted access to abortion. When phrased that way, few Americans think that is right. BUT similarily very few americans wants to outlaw abortions either. The majority of Americans are on the opposite side of the religous right. It''s just like many of us, they have some squeamishness about it. espeically after hearing the fundies talk about partial birth abortions and being to think that all abortions involves sucking out an infants brain with a needle. (Hell, if that was what it really was, I wouldn't support it. either.)

So consider this arguement... The republicans have shown themselves to be irresponable not just on the economy but on values as well, becuase they have let thier own rhetoric and greed get in the way of reducing abortions. They may want to outlaw abortions, but that will just lead to making abortions unsafe, not uncommon ( I think I read somewhere that the fifties had a number of illegal abortions and deaths becuase of it)
Under Clinton, we had a reduction in abortions. We also had prosperity for more then the wealthy. we also had comprehensive sex ed. Economic Justice is Moral. Full Education is Moral. Both lead to our kids being able to make more responsable choices. So by backing Shrub who has led us into massive debt and tried to make our kids ignorant about sexual responsibility, he has weakened the moral foundations of this country.

And of course, this means keeping abortion as a practice legal since outlawing it would only drive the problem underground and thus make it dangerouse and even more numerous)

We can outlaw abortions. or we reduce abortions until one day we live in a society they are unneeded.

Bit one does not lead to the another. In fact they are mutually exclusive.

what do you guys think? I know this would never work on the radicals that won't be happy until every women is barefoot in the kitchen and gays aren't even mentioned in polite company. But that still leaves plenty of others. Catholics, for instance, aren't just pro-life. Many are also PRO-Social Justice..something they ain't going to ever get with the current crop of cons.

[ClassWarrior]

7. But they don't really want a total ban on abortion.

The GOP corporate manipulators want to be AGAINST abortion, but they don't want to DO anything about it, because then "the magic single issue voters" go away. That's why they say they're going to overturn Roe vs. Wade, then Arlen Spectre comes out and says they'd better not, then he retreats... It's all bread and circuses for the masses. They want the fight, because it distracts us from them filling their pockets with our blood.

NGU.

[booley]

9. Ahh, but this isn't aimed at the GOP leaders

it's aimed at thie rbase that really do beleive that republicans want to ban abortion to stop it. It's the perception that matters...

What I am saying here is two fold...

1. Abortion will always be an issue so we need some kind of strategy on it anyway to try to defuse it so it can't keep being used against us? Since it's "values" that the GOP uses ot justify thier position, it's thier "values" we need to attack.

and 2. by taking the values label for ourselves, we at worst, weaken on of thier major strengths, attacking pro-choice as immoral. Suddenly the GOP can't just play the games you described but they will have all these pro-lifers in thier base going,"Wait a minute, maybe the repubs really don't care about stopping abortions". They will have to suddenly defend thier REAL RECORD and be put on the defensive. it will unlikly swing any voters immediatly, but as it exposes the GOP's hyppocrasy for even it's cause of "values", it will weaken them and plant a seed that will lead to new swing voters.

becuase as I said, if we get pro-lifers beleiving that the key to stopping abortions is economic justice and education, they are on OUR SIDE!

We need to think in the long term. We have been trounced by this too often.,

[JohnnyCougar]

8. Exactly. Poverty is our wedge issue.

And it's growing. The effects of this will be twofold. We neutralize abortion and we use poverty to lure poor rural Christians and Catholics that are interested in fighting poverty as well.

We should have been doing this years ago.