What is your take on the Panama Invasion vote?

[wuushew]

Is okay to invade a country illegally, then remove a man who we put in power in the first place all in the name of fighting drugs?


Statement of Purpose: To provide authority for the President to use the armed forces of the United States to secure the removal of General Manuel Antonio Noriega from his illegal control of the Republic of Panama.




Grouped By Vote Position YEAs ---74
Adams (D-WA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bentsen (D-TX)

Biden (D-DE)

Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Boren (D-OK)
Boschwitz (R-MN)
Bradley (D-NJ)
Breaux (D-LA)
Bryan (D-NV)
Bumpers (D-AR)
Burdick (D-ND)
Burns (R-MT)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Coats (R-IN)
Cochran (R-MS)
Cohen (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Cranston (D-CA)
Danforth (R-MO)

Daschle (D-SD)

DeConcini (D-AZ)
Dixon (D-IL)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Durenberger (R-MN)
Exon (D-NE)
Ford (D-KY)
Fowler (D-GA)
Glenn (D-OH)

Gore (D-TN)

Gorton (R-WA)
Grassley (R-IA)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatfield (R-OR)
Heinz (R-PA)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (R-VT)
Johnston (D-LA)
Kassebaum (R-KS)

Kennedy (D-MA)

Kerrey (D-NE)

Kerry (D-MA)

Kohl (D-WI)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Lugar (R-IN)
Matsunaga (D-HI)
McCain (R-AZ)
Metzenbaum (D-OH)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Mitchell (D-ME)
Moynihan (D-NY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nunn (D-GA)
Packwood (R-OR)
Pell (D-RI)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Riegle (D-MI)
Robb (D-VA)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Roth (R-DE)
Rudman (R-NH)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Sasser (D-TN)
Simon (D-IL)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Warner (R-VA)
Wirth (D-CO)

NAYs ---25
Armstrong (R-CO)
D'Amato (R-NY)
Dole (R-KS)
Garn (R-UT)

Graham (D-FL)

Gramm (R-TX)
Hatch (R-UT)
Heflin (D-AL)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Humphrey (R-NH)
Kasten (R-WI))

Lieberman (D-CT)

Lott (R-MS)
Mack (R-FL)
McClure (R-ID)
McConnell (R-KY)
Nickles (R-OK)

[damnraddem]

1. The Panama invasion was as wrong as the Iraq invasion.

In both cases, former buddies of the U.S. were removed when they fell out with the U.S. In both cases, they were as tyrranical while buddy-buddy with the U.S. as they were afterwards -- what changed was their relationship with the U.S. And they both got Bushwhacked.

[On the Road]

2. That's An Interesting Bipartisan Mixture

both on the Nay and Yea.

Yea:
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (R-VT)
Leahy (D-VT)
Mikulski (D-MD)

Nay:

D'Amato (R-NY)
Dole (R-KS)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)

Hard to sort this one out.

[StandWatie]

3. it was stupid..

Those votes don't suprise me in the slightest, most of these people were all for funding terrorists in Central and South America and have a seat in hell waiting for them.

[Abe Linkman]

4. What is it you're trying to get at? Invading a sovereign nation is...

OK if you're what Chomsky calls "the biggest terrorist country on Earth." The overwhelming majority of our politicians approved of it, and so did a whole host of other special interests...including the Ochoa family, other Drug "Lords," and Noriega's lawyer (Frank Rubino) is greatful for the opportunity$ to represent Manuel.

[Cocoa]

5. I thought Poppy went without Congress

I thought "Operation Just Because" was carried out under the War Powers Act.

When was that vote, and was it really to "provide authority" or was it just one of those non-binding resolutions that don't affect what actually happens?

[DrFunkenstein]

6. Booty From The Kerry Committee

"I have nothing against him other than his illegal activities."

- John Poindexter to Oliver North.





<>

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB2/nsaebb2.htm#3

[Octafish]

7. Was Dean against that, too?

Strange. I don't recall hearing Dean stating his opposition.

Kerry, if that's who you're trying to slam here, was on record as stating that Manuel Noriega was responsible for importing tons of cocaine into the USA. He learned about it while investigating the Bank of Credit and Commerce International (BCCI) — the corrupt bank used by narcotraffickers like Pablo Escobar, terrorists like Abu Nidhal, Robert Gates' CIA, the KGB, and Iran-Contra straw boss, Ollie North.

Don't take my word for it. Use GOOGLE.

[Abe Linkman]

So, invasions in the name of drug fighting are OK in your book?

Not mine. If that's the case, other countries would be justified in invading or attacking the U.S. - which has a long history of involvement in the drug trade.

[Octafish]

10. No, they are not.

And if you'd read or remembered any of my posts on this subject you would know my thoughts on Operation Just Cause. The deaths of any person in the war on drugs is an irreplaceable loss for the universe. The loss of thousands of innocents in Panama is an incredible crime against humanity.

BTW: Kerry, for reasons he knows best, decided giving Poppy authority was the best way to stop the thug, Noriega. Kerry also did all he could to stop Bush and Reagan from conducting their illegal wars in Central America. To keep it simple and perhaps more memorable, here's a picture:



Shortly after taking office in 1985, Kerry and Senator Tom Harkin of Iowa went on a fact-finding trip to Nicaragua, where they met with Daniel Ortega (right) and other Sandinistas. The trip was criticized when the Sandinistas cemented ties with Moscow.

Globe File Photo

[wuushew]

8. Panama was/is a sovereign country

shouldn't such issues be disscussed at the U.N. and not viewed as an extension of US drug policy?



And I am not slamming Kerry, as you see Al Gore voted to invade as well.

[Cocoa]

11. Bush did not consult Congress on Panama

at least that's what this person says:

http://www.geocities.com/way_leroy/ProConVolTwoIssueOnePage6.html

In defending his action in ordering the Panama invasion without prior congressional approval, President Bush maintained that it was his constitutional duty as President and Commander-in-Chief to handle matters pertaining to U.S. national security and military operations--and to handle those matters in such manner as he deemed necessary and appropriate, unimpeded by the provisions of the War Powers Act. Bush called attention to the fact that, throughout American history, presidents have found it necessary to send U.S. troops into foreign hostilities without first obtaining the approval of Congress. He insisted that, when the U.S.A. faces a serious threat to its national security, the President has the constitutional authority and responsibility to take swift and decisive action, even in the absence of clear statutory support.

[wuushew]

12. What was passed in the senate then? S.1711 Oct. 5 1989

Several months before the Dec. 20 Invasion by Grand Master Bush

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm.cfm?congress=101&session=1&vote=00228

Was it a blank check the same as the Iraq blank check?

[Cocoa]

13. thanks for the link

but it's not really a vote for the invasion, is it?

There was a lot of diplomatic activity in the months before that invasion, and when Poppy invaded he did it without Congress.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

9. And who did Noriega work for?

And who was CiC for the invasion?

More empowerment of BFEE despite claims to the contrary.