History of U.S. = left wingers defeating right wingers

[SilasSoule]

I ran across this at http://www.evilgopbastards.com

"Since the New Deal, Republicans have been on the wrong side of every issue of concern to ordinary Americans; Social Security, the war in Vietnam, equal rights, civil liberties, church- state separation, consumer issues, public education, reproductive freedom, national health care, labor issues, gun policy, campaign-finance reform, the environment and tax fairness. No political party could remain so consistently wrong by accident. The only rational conclusion is that, despite their cynical "family values" propaganda, the Republican Party is a criminal conspiracy to betray the interests of the American people in favor of plutocratic and corporate interests, and absolutist religious groups."

Shall we discuss??

[LearnedHand]

1. As much as I'd like to believe this is the reason...

...I am always a bit suspicious of "this, therefore that" thinking (i.e., "the only rational conclusion is ... criminal conspiracy....") -- even when it's something that I believe emotionally.

I'm not an historian by any stretch of the imagination, but I'd at least LIKE to believe the Republican party genuinely disagreed with the idea of a strong central government and favored more the idea of strong states rights and a hands-off central government.

[enki23]

6. it's not a "this therefore that" proposal

it's a "it is this, and isn't this simply another name for that?" proposal. political parties *are* conspiracies. they are chaired by unelected leaders. they meet in secret. they *have* secrets. each has the goal of affecting, often controlling the government. they often engage in nefarious, even outright criminal activity to further these aims. their membership is based on loyalty to specific causes and/or personalities. i could go on all night.

hell, they're the *prototypical* conspiracies, or would be if they were less obnoxious.

as for criminal... the word doesn't mean much when applied to those who control the law and its enforcement. criminal? no. almost completely at odds with everything that might be fair, compassionate, decent in the world? absolutely. i'd say evil, if i believed in it. but i don't. they're just... opposed to most everything that might improve life on this planet for the poorest 99% on it.

that, and they're a sad mixture of cynical rich assholes and fucking moron assholes. but that's so obvious it hardly bears mentioning.

[Solon]

8. Conspiring to win votes, perhaps?

I agree that the idea that a political party is a conspiracy in and of itself is somewhat extreme. They do, for now at least, have to curry the vote of the majority in most elections. They have to present thier ideas openly for public consumption, only when they change positions so radically after winning could it be considered untenable and conspiracle (My word :)) Bush has misrepresented precisely WHAT he stood for, along with stealing an election, I could see why some would think of the Repubs as a conspiracy. I don't agree entirely, though I do think they planned, ahead of time, to win at any cost in the 2000 "election". Who stormed the courthouse? Wasn't Republican "lay-persons" but "hired" stalwarts, thugs. That is more the behavior of a totalitarian party than anything democratic.

[Terwilliger]

7. So, Republicans are basically Democrats with different issues

*GASP* !

[Solon]

2. Why not go back further?

Liberals have been on the correct side of the issue since at least the Renaissance. Historically, what was put forward first by foward-thinkers (Liberals) eventually became law and accepted. You know what the saying is "The liberal of today is next-century's conservative." The whole idea of basic human rights was a liberal idea, hell the conservative position of the time was aristocratic privelege. Not much changes in that regard, eh?

[w4rma]

3. The Republican Party leadership only cares about power for the powerful

The issues they take are always in response to whatever the Democratic Party takes. The Republican Party leadership only cares about these issues as a wedge for anyone who isn't in the uppermost 1% wealthiest Americans.

This is my observation.

[knight_of_the_star]

4. That is not entirely accurate

It wasn't until Richard Nixon that the GOP of today began to evolve. At first it was very similar to the ideas of Teddy Roosevelt coupled with some traditional American stances: big business is good so long as it is not destructive, personal freedoms, isolationism, smaller government, that whole deal. Nixon started the sharp turn towards reactionary philosophy by essentailly using race-baiting to crack open the solid south in 1968. He followed up on that in '72 by claiming he spoke for the "silent majority." He laid the groundwork for the GOP of today by starting the exploit the backlash America was having against the extreme ends of the various liberal movements. Ronnie Ray further harped on this gap by pandering the Xian fundies and "traditional values" to expand on this reaction against the radical left. The Republican party of the early 1900s was similar to the Libertarian Party is now, and it was pretty much the same way ideologically up until the 1970s-1980s, when the entire country was turned upside down in the aftermath of the 60s. Barry Goldwater, who was an old-time Republican, has been quoted more than a few times coming out openly against the Religious Right, saying that the GOP was not the party it used to or should be.

[Solon]

5. True and False

Starting when the Republicans first came into the Presidency, 1860 to reconstruction, the party positions were almost reverse of today. The liberals were Republicans, conservatives were Democratic. For myself, I was talking about progressives of all stripes regardless of party. Liberals of their age, many would be considered borderline fascists in today's political world, however, they did move the world forward, and we should pick up the torch and carry on the tradition of open-mindedness and fairness, as well as freedom for ALL.