Watching the "Hour Of Power" Christian ministry , the show revolved

[Demonaut]

around "tithing" and the last two months of donation shortfalls, is this common among ministries? they were actually implying that tithing should come before paying bills....these christians may be hurting financially but tithing is more important than covering your electricty bill or the minimums of your credit cards Wtf:wtf:

[supernova]

1. Yep,

The group mentality is quite strong, at times sacrificing the individual. That's one thing I have a problem with church at times. I struggle against it.

IIRC, "tithing: = 10% of your income.

I give some to my church, but there are also causes that I support in the community. I have no idea how much it all ads up to.

[kcwayne]

2. Falwell and Robertson's investments are more important than food

for you family. Without the cash inflow from tithing, Robertson can't buy more gold mines in Africa and pay off dictators, and both of their portfolio's have been taking a hit from the decline of the dollar.

The fundies view tithing as a primary obligation. And they are fools being fleeced like sheep.

[alfredo]

18. years ago Falwell sent lawyers to Kentucky to see if state law

would allow him to seize estates from contributors who died. If you gave on a monthly basis, they wanted the contribution contract to stay in effect even after the contributor died.

[alvis]

3. From Reverend Lovejoy

"And once again tithing is 10% off the top. That's gross income, not net. Please people, don't force us to audit. Now I'm going to pass this around a second time. Brother Ned, you'll do the honors."

- Reverend Lovejoy

[LizW]

4. I was always taught that tithing comes before EVERYTHING

Taxes, bills, all of it.

The "modern" way of doing it, at least in the last few churches I've attended is to sign a "pledge" at the beginning of the year, and make monthly or weekly payments toward fulfilling that pledge.

[immoderate]

6. God has expensive tastes.

Suckers.:P

--IMM

[Cobalt Violet]

5. The Asswipes haven't figured out that good jobs = more money.

Are the people on the recieving end of the outsourced jobs really going to give anything to the "Hour of Power"?

[Old and In the Way]

7. Anyone know what the ROI is on this tithing investment?

Do these guys offer a prospectus? Really, this is the slickest con game going.....and it has been around as long as man has wondered about the afterlife.

[in_cog_ni_to]

8. You would think the idiots would have learned something by seeing

how Jim and Tammy Baker used their donated funds. Do they not remember a damn thing? Does Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson live in poverty in order to help their "flock?" No, they don't. I wonder if Falwell and Robertson let their bills go unpaid? Remember Jimmy Swaggart? Sheesh. Swaggart said: "I'm trying to find the correct name for it ... this utter absolute, asinine, idiotic stupidity of men marrying men. ... I've never seen a man in my life I wanted to marry. And I'm gonna be blunt and plain; if one ever looks at me like that, I'm gonna kill him and tell God he died." Before that he CRIED about getting caught with a prostitute. :eyes:

The LAST place I would give my money is to some "Christian Ministry." :eyes: I sure as hell wouldn't forgo paying my bills for those thieves.

[Tomee450]

19. It seems to be

just a racket. When I was growing up, tithing was rarely spoken of and when it was it was usually a voluntary thing. There was no demand that you tithe. Now in some churches, members can't even hold office unless they tithe. And what bugs me is that the money often not used to help the needy members of the church. Sometimes a pastor will arrive at a church with virtually nothing but a few years later is living quite a wealthy lifestyle. In some instances poor people are being suckered into giving their money to the church but when they become needy, the church is not there for them. Some of the televangelist have million dollar homes and airplanes. I have never understood how people who claim to be men of God can live so lavishly while members of their church barely eke out a living.

[havocmom]

9. Way back when my daughter was little, she decided to attend Sunday

School at the church across the road. We encouraged her curiosity, tempered with critical thought, and supported her decision. One week they had the 6 year olds all sign their pledge cards and turn them in.

Many weeks later, she got the chicken pox. She has the worst bout with them I had ever seen. Only way she could get any sleep was in treated bathwater. I would sit by the tub, hold her face out of the water just enough to make sure she could breath and keep the water warm. She had pox sores down her ears! She was exhausted and slow to get healthy again no matter what the doctors suggested.

Anyway, she missed going to Sunday School (right across the road, remember) for two weeks. Monday after the second missed Sunday, I got a call from the church. They were concerned. My daughter had failed to put her pledge money in an envelope and turn it over to her Sunday School teacher for two weeks in a row! They went on to lecture me about the importance of instilling a sense of responsibility in my child and making sure she ALWAYS FULFILLS her obligation to the church (they did not say GOD, they said CHURCH).

Being a pretty careful and serious parental unit, I was so royally pissed I did something out of character for me, I lied. "She died" I responded flatly and hung up. Since they had not noticed her absence, only the missing pledge, I figured it wouldn't trouble them much. I was right, no one walked across the road to see if we needed some love, support, brotherhood, or a Christian burial for a child. And they never recognized her coming and going in the house right across the road from them once she was well.

Fuck 'em. Give your money where you know it does some real good. Some churches do that. Some do not. But give wisely. My mom used to make groceries appear on the doorstep of people who were having a tough time. She was making a buck and hour and parenting us without help. She taught good tithing practices and showed us how to eliminate double-talking middle men. Good works need doin. But you have an obligation to make sure they get done and not just talked about by the guy sending the plate around.

[Alpharetta]

10. In defense of tithing

I feel bad for people who don't recognize the value of tithing.

Yes, it gets a bad rap. Some call it a con. Plenty of ministers are into personal enrichment and personal empowerment. Trust is often betrayed. We read the stories and we hear them. Some are disgusting, like diamond encrusted dog collars for the minister's dog. And stupid ministers who say God wants them to have a white Rolls Royce.

There's plenty to ridicule about tithing.

Visitors to churches can get turned off by the call for giving.

Despite all the possible negative, I am a christian liberal who respects the idea of tithing and if I fail to meet my tithe, I know there's a depth of my relationship with God that I have failed to enjoy.

Think about the joy of Christmas. Part of that joy is the presents. Whether you enjoy giving presents as opposed to receiving them, that says a lot about you as a person. It's a lot like sex. The joy is in the giving.

Tithing is acknowledgment that you are not separate from God and you are not separate from man. To separate yourself is to refuse to commune. If you don't acknowledge our connection to each other, you banish yourself to an empty existence.

I could say more, but I hope that's enough.

[Raenelle]

11. I agree with you Alpharetta

I've always used the 10% gross rule as a way to measure if I was giving back proportionately to what I'd received--gratitude, duty, repayment, and even just magical thinking (God abhors a vacuum). But not to a Church--I give my money and time to protect democracy.

[autorank]

12. "God told Abraham, kill me a son."

Let's get serious here. Both evangelical AND mainstream Christianity endorse the obscene notion that if God tells you to go to some mountain or other venue and knife your son, you should obey. This is f'ing crackhead material. Tithing, Christian love, etc. is all a ruse to cover up the pagan aspects of Christianity as it's been shoved down our throat. It has little to nothing to do with Jesus, the wisdom teacher and social revolutionary. It's all about being crazy enough to believe their crap. I hope they all go broke.

[leesa]

13. They have been pulling that scam for as long as I can remember.

Donations are down!! You MUST send money today or I won't be able to give you this blessing of me trying to rip you off.

They are con artists. Every one of them, including Billy Graham, probably the smoothest criminal of all.

[Tomee450]

20. Right !!!!

Remember Oral Roberts? He begged people to send in money and claimed he would die if he did not received it.

[SoCalDem]

14. Yes..because Jesus LOVES you, but HE has expenses too

and if he's hard up, he's too worried to answer your prayers:)

[justgamma]

15. I watched one gospel show

the preacher was crawling around on all fours on a bed full of letters. He was yelling at all the people who couldn't afford to send him money. Telling them to gather pop cans and send the money to him and they would get rich. It was absolutely sickening. Wish I could remember his name.

I think giving to your own local church is different that than giving to these charlatans.

[proud patriot]

16. I'm reminded of QueensRyche's lyrics

"the Lord our father loves you, reach deep into
your hearts and pocketbooks and take his hand."

[Viva_La_Revolution]

17. That's what we were taught growing up....

and that was a Lutheran church...

[Cleita]

21. I have never seen any of those shows do anything

but beg for money about 90% of the time they are on the air. They also lay a really big guilt trip on the gullible with it too. These people are nothing but carnival grifter and that's an insult to carnival grifters, who are at least honest about what they are doing.

[carrowsboy]

22. you know what they say...

A fool & his $$$ are soon parted.