Ladies and Gentlemen, there is a revolution in the air...

[kentuck]

It's right here amongst us. People are pissed off. They see no alternatives being offered by the Party of our choice. We do not yet know what form the revolution will take but we know that it will not bend any farther to the status quo. People are pissed off at the theft of our electoral system. People are pissed off at the failure of our Party to address it appropriately. People are pissed off at those that want to go moderate and try to appeal to the majority in the next election. For these folks, there is no "next" election. This was the last election. We're just waiting to see what form the revolt will take...

[nadinbrzezinski]

1. You feel it too?

True story, last time I felt this electricity in the air was on a cold night in Tijuana, right before I got into the car to go home...

Suddenly the lights went out (Car hit main transformer barely 500 meters away)

Before I could say anything, or even drive out of the parking lot, we were in the midst of a riot

I don't think this will take that form, but I feel the same electricity...

Hey at least tonight, or any night, I don't have the watch.

(Oh and I was just your lowly medic... volunteer medic, I swear they did not pay me enough for that shit, hold it they did not pay me)

[havocmom]

8. We had a fiber optic cable cut not far from town. Very rural area, miles

from anywhere. Anyway, noticed no internet this afternoon. Well, it happens once in awhile. But then heard others asking about it. OK, so not just our computer. Then heard cell phones not working. Tried to call long distance (which is anywhere beyond 4 blocks) and nada.

So, I know there is roadwork and accidents happen, but still, there was a level of panic I could not quite overcome. What if.... What is happening out there... God, it was a long few hours til we got the line restored and I knew you were all still out there.

I have the sincere belief that the big blackout will come and I won't know what is going on out there across the nation. It terrifies me. I do not want to be the last one to get the memo. May get some carrier pigeons and see if Hey Hey can get news to me when the shit hit the fan in the US. Figure the DUers in Canada will be better informed than I will.

Glad you are all out there and OK. Really did worry just a bit that the lock-down had started tonight. I tend not to panic, but really think something is coming.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. trst me that night I had to take command of the whole mess

I had permision to go home early... had things to do next morning... as in a paper.

Well I got out of the car, got the radio on Tac 1, the police frequency, realized what was going on and started giving orders to all my crews to keep them safe, and do our job.

I had no time to be afraid... now six hours later after the whole mess was over, an ambulance (that did not obey orders) was stoned and they were lucky to get out with bumps and bruises and several major stores were looted... I had time to start to feel very cold.

Now some things YOU SHOULD take... the net will go down but not radio... have a short wave radio. I usually say buy American, not in this case, Grundig, preferally the one taht can be used sans batteries. You will be able to know what is going on with short wave

Oh and get supplies for a week of living on your own...

[Stephanie]

30. What are you guys talking about? There was a blackout?

Riots? Where are you? What happened?

[nadinbrzezinski]

42. two very separate incidents that happened years ago

or a weak ago, related to car accidents

The first one, I was a medic on duty in Tijuana, car crashed against the transformer and half the city lost power... before you could say riot, we had one... it has been a good oh seven years since that riot happened, and no it was never present in any news paper... it would have made the papers these days, in Mexico, ironically.

My counterpart is talking of the cable being cut and him \her loosing access to the net and him \her fearing loosing contact and the boot coming down.

Feeling better now? Sorry for scaring you

[Stephanie]

51. yes, feeling better, thanks

There have been so many disasters since 2000 that I come to expect them. The NYC blackout last year was sort of a joke if you weren't in the Northeast, but WOW that was a big deal. Had it gone on another 24 hours forget about it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

55. I was in cleveland for that party

I know it was fun. (NOT)

The part htat was funny, I know find any humor where I can, we were there for my niece's bat mitzvah... and well hotel had a small probolem wiht water and oh well, toilets... we told them to grab water from pool for that... seems they were more concerned of a pool to cool people down than the possible health hazard of many a loo not working.

I thought it was funny.

We got water from store, and some other stuff, and I had flashlight and radio with me...

Oh and after ten years in EMS my sense of humor is quirky at best, my hubby is just the same, twenty in the service.

[Gman]

24. Maybe we should all go back and read up on the Y2K survival stuff

We all laughted at the wingers that bought that stuff. But now, it just might come in handy, and soon.

[nadinbrzezinski]

26. yep, though you can count on DHS and their lies

this is how you shoudl prepare for an attack...

Ok, ok, do get the plastic though, good for improvised shelter and I cannot say enough about duck tape... notice not the same reasons that DHS pushes it on us, OK.

[walldude]

35. And stock lots of water and some cash.

these are all just good suggestions even when things are um.. normal. It never hurts to be prepared. Victims of natural disasters can attest to that. Oh and I laughed my ass off at some of the DHS suggestions. It reminded me of the 50's when they wanted you to hide under your desk if an Atomic Bomb went off...

[nadinbrzezinski]

39. I have training in Hazmat and other things, got it well before

it was chic... you can imagine how much I was chuckling

Before teh war started, I was on a damn island (hawaii) I stocked up on canned goods et al... and trust me it was a good idea.

Oh and no spam YUK!

[alittlelark]

61. Booze and pot are better than cash in bad times.

Cash could mean as much as Confederate currency.

But H2O, lots of it.

[helnwhls]

71. EAT THE RICH

[ChiciB1]

100. And You Can Grow...

Some of that stuff!!

[havocmom]

2. look east. Look at the Ukraine! Look at all those people in the streets

My god, what is wrong with us here? How can we not see the state of disrepair the nation is in?

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. People are still waiting for the system to work

I say it will not, but then again I was a cynic because of Mexican elections...

When people finally realize it ain't gonna self correct... my hubby keeps reminding me... this is VERY NEW for Middle Murica

[jdj]

5. we don't have to piss in the dirt? we still have jobs and food

the water isn't on full boil yet? who knows?

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. that too

see above on riot. Those people were cold, hungry and had nothing else to loose....

[AuntieM1957]

25. What's your point

you pretty much described the lives of about 20% of the people I know.

I work for a transportation company - and we employ a lot of low wage earners - they work two jobs - and a lot don't have health coverage.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. Yes but the misery index has not reached the point yet

when most people in this country have anything to win by revolting.

When we reach that point you will be talking of 50% or more of the population at large... in social science it is called a misery index breaching the 80%... I'd say we are not there yet... we will, but not there yet

The last time this country got close was 1929, piece of trivia, you do know that 1932 was the highest polling numbers for the United States Communist Party... you think that was coincidence?

[underseasurveyor]

46. I hate to say it but I think Nadin's pretty close.

In the past we've always had a 'last minute save' but I don't see a 'last minute save' coming this time. We just might have to depend on ourselves for a while, not waiting for or expecting a leader or help to emerge, at least not right away.
It'll be by our own wits at the git-go so being as prepared as one can be is never a bad thing. Then if the worst doesn't happen? Great, none the worse for wear. But if you're not prepared?
Aside from some of Nadin's survival equipment suggestions I always strongly suggest buying seeds.

[helnwhls]

70. YOU have food YOU have a job

why would any one else want to complain?

EDIT: EAT THE RICH

[helnwhls]

22. YOU have a job, YOU have food

so why would anyone else complain?

[Carla in Ca]

78. I just read the same thing on another site!

Kos or Americablog has a pic of 200,000 in Ukraine and the story says why wasn't there a sea of blue in Washington?!

Off topic...For whatever good it will do, we are buying a safe and pulling out 1/2 our savings to put in it. Not panicked, just cautious.

EDIT: Here is the pic, Ukraine

[bush_is_wacko]

102. What a beautiful sight!

When are we going to create one here? Looks a little like Washinton, don't you think?

[Downtown Hound]

3. Can't come a minute too soon for my taste

And I feel it too. We threw everything we had into this last election, only to watch it taken right out from under our noses again. We tried doing it the "right" way. Only the right way is fixed. It's time for a revolution. I'm ready.

[pa28]

7. I'm ready too.

I just wish I felt it around me. Hopefully I'm the exception but the vast majority of people I encounter on a daily basis have no clue what happened on the 2nd and only a vague indication where it might take us. I think they would be more upset if "desperate housewives" got cancelled.

[Downtown Hound]

15. Something's going to happen

But not right away I feel. Right now, people are sort of in a daze. No one really knows what to do. Mark my words, that will change. There is an untapped powder keg of rage in this country felt by millions and millions of people. That will come out, sooner or later.

[ilovenicepeople]

65. It's almost like theres some sinister mind control that people are under?

I wonder? Why do they call them TV programs anyways?:dunce: :boring:

[seabeyond]

6. with ya kentuck

just generally over all pissed off

and i am such a nice and loving person too, bah hahahha

[Leilani]

9. The problem is that a Revolution needs Leaders

& I don't see any Leaders running around.

For me, this is why I'm angry. I feel like we did as much as grass roots can do to effect change, but at SOME point, someone has to step up to the plate.

And I'm not a revolutionary...I'm just someone who cares a lot about my country, & thinks things have run amuck.

[kentuck]

14. You are a revolutionay !

If you're someone "who cares a lot about my country, & thinks things have run amuck", then you are indeed a revolutionary. And a revolutionary is always in the minority. A revolutionary does not fight for his Party, he fights for something much larger and greater.

[Leilani]

21. LOL, Kentuck, if you knew me, I'm the least likely Revolutionary!

And I am not tied to party...I care about people doing the right thing for their country & their fellow citizens.

I have started working on some ideas which I will post in several days. Things I have been thinking about for a long time. Ideas which seem so obvious, yet I see no one in power discussing.

This election was the most active I have ever been, & I know most DUers feel that way. But it wasn't enough...we're missing something.

We need some sort of outline, goal, project,.....whatever, for change.

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. tsk, tsk, go over to the economic activism board

You will find ideas on how to generally speaking have fun with the system....

Oh and they make sense, given teh comming depresion... then you will SEE LEADERS, and not the lilly ones we have right at the moment.

;-)

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. Ok, ok this may scare you a bit

WE ARE THOSE LEADERS... every time we talk to a neighboor we are those leaders, every time we listen, we are those leaders... every time we DO SOMETHING we are those leaders. We are on the leading edge of this movement... and it is just starting.

[m berst]

41. yes

The movement is paralyzed until and unless we come to the realization that we are it. We are what we are looking for, waiting for and hoping for.

[bush_is_wacko]

98. I agree w/ you but...

Even revolutionaries can be frightened and need a little direction and commradery to bring out the best in them. Do you think any one individual ever made a change on his own? They all had a little help from their freinds!

[m berst]

38. disagree

We destroy our leaders. Mention any name here and the attacks start.

We need followers.

There are a ton of leaders right here at DU, but when they step forward they are nitpicked, their ideas subjected to intense and often unfriendly analysis, attempts are made to discredit them, they are harassed and driven to distraction.

There is too much of the savior complex IMHO - "is Dean our savior? Is Clark? Is Kerry" And when a "nobody" here tries to step into leadership, they are attacked for being a nobody. Problem is, most of us are nobodies, and the "somebodies" don't give a rat's ass about us regardless of which party they are in or whether they are liberal or conservative.

What do "leaders" have that we here don't? Celebrity and access to media. Both can be easily overcome. Celebrity is fool's gold anyway. Access to media just means access to the people. We have access to the people everyday without the media. We make our own celebrities if we choose to do so. If we SAY they are celebrities and act as though they were, they will be eventually. We don't need corporations, or the DNC, to give their stamp of approval.

Sam Adams wasn't a celebrity and he didn't have access, but he got the job done. What he did have were followers who weren't looking for a savior or a celebrity.

on edit - added a missing word

[nadinbrzezinski]

43. ok two people who have already emerged

Bev Harris

Hedda Foil

More will emerge and they will emerge from here

Right now I am concentrating on local action... again this is how the movement will be built and how it has always been built... and yes I am a cynic...

[Leilani]

54. I don't know, I agree with some of your ideas

like people can be negative, people get attacked here, etc, that's all true.

But it's a lot easier to be positive when things are going your way.
Before the Republicans became a majority, their interparty wars were infamous. Hell, they got entire delegations kicked out of conventions.

If you have lots of anger & frustration, there's a reason for it. People are mad, sad, confused. The grassroots did the best job of getting active ever. The party united behind Kerry in a way I have never seen...there was nary a word of disagreement. All kerry's primary opponents supported him & campaigned hard for him, some more than others. And for the FIRST time, we were financially competitive.

Now a majority of people disagreed with Bush policies, yet he won . Why? This is the question people are grappling with. People are doing lots of work on BBV, & that's wonderful...that work needs to be done. But we all know the election will not be overturned. And that leaves us where?



Maybe you don't feel adrift. Fine. But many here do. The Savior Complex? Some people are looking forward because they don't want to deal with the present. Some are looking for someone to give voice to their frustration.

I don't understand your theory on celebrity, or what that has to do with anything.

But, finally, this is a discussion board. People will post what they will post. Maybe you don't like it, maybe at times I don't like it. But that's what a discussion board is for. I know that DU saved my sanity when I found it. And if I didn't like it here, I'd leave. I like the exchange of ideas. And I try to avoid posters or posts I don't agree with.

[nadinbrzezinski]

58. his point and mine is

that those leaders are US... you and me

I know hard to see it, especially see yourself as a leader.

See any social movement starts small and this time it is not the DNC who will lead you out of the wilderness

Some history may be in order, the party, no party has led us out of the widlerness. Most poltiticos get behind a movement ARFTER that movment becomes self sustaining and they have well... no choice

I will give you an example... you know when was the last time the Democrats were truly in a minorty and a progressive movement emerged?

Ok lets list the ways....

1960s civil rights, MLK was NOT a democrat, but a civil rights worker... the leading edge of his movement, the movement he led, started with people like Rosa Parks in the 1950s and people choosing their fights.

Next time, going backwards... FDR... well you DO Know who was the third highest polling party in 1932? The Communist Party of the United States.

Then go back to the 1880s when the Democrats got behind the progresive movement of the era....

And so it goes...

By the way Lincoln and the GOP got behind the anti slavery movement in the 1850s, we know where that led, and that was NOT a major policy decision.

Now we are the leaders of this modern movement. It is NOT the DNC... it is us. They will get behind us, once they have no choice or we will see the donkey disapear and be replaced by another party.... I cannot see into the future, but there is an earthquake coming and you and I are at that leasding edge.

[Leilani]

68. I know, & I agree with you.

My reply was to m berst.

[m berst]

89. thanks

I appreciate your response and you make many good points. Yes, people are adrift.

The things you said about the campaign and the things that went right - there can be only one of two conclusions IMHO - either everything we ever knew about politics, and all of the history of elections in this country, are completely wrong, or Bush did not in fact win. Regardless of which of those two conclusions people believe, the result was stunning and radical.

The Democratic party did everything that historically worked and from every indication this should have been a big win. So either the Democratic party as presently constituted is dead - since everything that should have worked did and yet didn't, and everything that won in the past failed this time for some mysterious reason - or democracy itself is dead.

The election was stolen - in which case all bets are off - or everything that the Democratic party has been doing is wrong - in which case all bets are off.

By the wisdom of all previous experience it is not possible to have that kind of turnout in Democratic districts and lose. It is not possibleto have that number of new registrations and lose. It is not possible to have those exit poll numbers and lose. It is not possible to be up against an incumbent with those kind of approval ratings and lose.

So we may differ in our opinions as to what actually happened, but there is no escaping the conclusion that something very strange and radical happened.

[bush_is_wacko]

99. My thoughts exactly

Leaders need followers. And followers need someone to lead them. Our founding fathers knew this. They also knew that real leaders cannot be publicized until the revolution is well under way, with lots of followers behind it!

[Occulus]

45. I would lead.

If I could ever get two or more of us to agree on ANY tactics at all.

That's our problem... too many people with too many good ideas. Many of which are good ideas, but.... just too damn many chiefs in the lodge.

Nonetheless, I think I'm angry enough to lead. Anger, resolution, and heart are what is needed. I think I could provide all three.

But then, we all think that. It's part of our problem.

[nadinbrzezinski]

59. start LOCALLY

all movements are built locally, and use plenty of shoe leather

[janx]

80. ...and hope!

;-)

[m berst]

60. it gets made too complex

Clarity of purpose and a tighter focus on goals will eventually come. The only question is how much suffering lies between now and then. The sooner people get clear, the less suffering for all. The longer it takes, the higher the price will eventually be. Right now the best thing we can do is to hasten the process by which people become aware and alarmed.

[bush_is_wacko]

101. No...

I don't want to "lead" not that I minimize my thoughts or anything, but I am decendant of someone who knew how to voice an opinion and let others lead that opinion forward. I would like nothing better than to follow his example. I just haven't found the person willing to lead me!

[rman]

84. not necessarily

People are already turning away from the mainstream media, turning away from corporations - all without a central leadership.
Next maybe people will turn away from our supposed political leaders. The only thing that's needed is that enough people have a sense they are not alone in this. That is mainly a matter of communication, which is where the internet comes in handy. Also ideas and information found on the internet are ever more finding it's way in the non-connected part of the population.

I think there is a real possibility that many local initiatives will arise, all these initiatives will have the same basic motivation, with local coordination and inter-local communication, but without one single central leadership. The lack of a central command will be one of our strengths, since it makes it near impossible to infiltrate and corrupt any such revolution.

[graywarrior]

11. It can't happen soon enough for me

I listened to a group of dems tonight discuss uniting with mod repubs, moving on, blah blah.

People are pissed. People are still wound up from canvassing neighborhoods, working for an election and finding out maybe it was stolen again. You can't ask these people to unite. They want to ignite and set things afire.

Sign me up for the revolution. I'm tired of playing nice.

[knowbody0]

12. think about it

the election distracted us from the situation in iraq. now the fraud distracts us from george's fast forward mandate. we instinctively wait for proof of fraud while our constitution is being voided, knowing we need to act, not knowing how to attack. our brothers and sisters across the sea hold a history of thousands of years and react immediately. hundreds of thousands in the streets demanding truth while their fake leader swears himself in with his right hand on the bible.
yeah, we need to collect this frustrated energy and focus on revolution.

[Demonaut]

13. not for me, if you can't beat em, join em

just kidding..........fuck em

[seabeyond]

29. lol lol i waited and waited

and thought, is he for real

then scrolled down.

funny you

[bling bling]

17. I hope you're right. n/t

[RagingInMiami]

20. Just like the chimp says

"you're either with us or you're against us."

[AuntieM1957]

27. Is that the same chimp that can't

zip his fly?

[movonne]

19. Well I hope something happens...If our money keeps going down

I think then we might have lots of pissed off people including the ones that voted for bush. Our country has been taken over and is becoming a dictatorship and I don't see the people pissed off enough to do anything about it. We also have to get some real Democrats into offices and get back to liberal ways.. I do not want repug light.. We will probably have to sink lower before this happens.

[linazelle]

31. So I'm at the grocery store for Thanksgiving menu items...

One woman catches my attention. She's stalled in the middle of the aisle with an empty cart and a handFULL of coupons which she thumbs through feverishly. It was so obvious she could not buy much of anything and wasn't budging until she could coupon her selections. It took all my self control not to tap her on the shoulder and ask who she voted for.

Another woman is picking up meat and appears very puzzled. There's a sale sign for steak. She can't figure out why the sirloins don't have the posted sale price. I show her the cheap round steak she can afford to buy. She moves on.

I posted a thread over the weekend about ice cream. Love 31 flavors. Got into the car and drove to one location--closed. And not for the day either. Drove Sunday to another area no longer thinking about ice cream but seeing a second closed 31 flavors.

This is in Milwaukee where most of the people don't seem to be exactly well off if you know what I mean.

But even in Chicago where I hail from, people are not shopping! When they do, they are not buying very much. Stores are closing.

We know the economy is sinking--all we are not being told is how much and how fast. I've done my own research. Inventories are way down and have been for several years. Here's my theory: the revolution will be sparked by women can no longer afford to go to the malls. You know, hell hath no fury and all that jazz...:D

[nadinbrzezinski]

62. I went over to the Swap Meet the other day

Sunday...

The place was EMPTY

I managed to find what I needed, a blanket, and my hubby's gift, for our aniversary.... (made by a craftsman who happens to be a democrat, that thing about economic what have you)

but I see this as well.

The other day I bought a vet dinner... and the man had no medical care. Bad Diabetes out of control

Last Christmas I bought another homeless man dinner...

It has gotten bad, really bad

[MatrixEscape]

32. How about something along these lines to kick things off?

Neo's promise to the Matrix:

"I know you're out there, I can feel you now, I know that you're afraid. You're afraid of us, you're afraid of change. I don't know the future, I didn't come here to tell you how this is going to end. I came here to tell you how this is going to begin.

I'm going to hang up this phone, and then I'm going to show these people what you don't want them to see. I'm going to show them a world without you, a world without rules and controls, and boundaries, a world where anything is possible. Where we go from there, is a choice I leave to you."

[Stinky The Clown]

33. We ain't there yet. Metaphorically, you need to lose 70% of your hair

before your baldness is noticeable.

[Mick Knox]

34. I get so sick of this BS

There is no revolution.. people are not pissed off, they are apathetic. VERY FEW are pissed off. Probably the closest we came in the 20th Century was Vietnam, and we aint even close to that yet. There arent even any decent protests; let alone revolution.

Lucky for us, because we would be slaughtered.

Keep dreaming though - it aint happening except in your mind.

[MatrixEscape]

36. Well if it is happening in our minds ...

then the mind is the first thing we need to free.

Thanks for making that point!

[Mick Knox]

37. LOL true!

Free your mind, your ass will follow!

[kentuck]

48. All ideas begin with a single thought...

and all actions begin with the idea....One must learn to crawl before they walk... :)

[dpibel]

47. Actually

I think we came a lot closer just before FDR was elected. The New Deal wasn't about some righteous notion of doing the right thing. It was about figuring out about the minimum that had to happen to keep the whole thing from melting down.

According to Paul Krugman, economic crisis is not a matter of if, it's a matter of when. And I see no reason to believe that the people are going to be nearly as polite and docile as they were in the 30s.

But I've said for a long time that when the economy suffers its inevitable meltdown, the American people will demand fascism. I see nothing in current events to make me change that opinion. Sure, you and I won't demand that. But an overwhelming majority, including a lot of folks who voted against Boosh, will.

But, hey, my prophecy and a buck will get you a cup of mediocre coffee.

[Mick Knox]

52. You may be right about that!

There was definately serious unrest. I was thinking in terms of overt action; but you bring up a great point.

[m berst]

56. that proves nothing

It is always "a very few" that are pissed off. But don't listen to me - who am I after all? Just some dumb DU poster. I mentioned Sam Adams, so I will cite his words on these subjects.

On the "very few" objection -

"It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds"

On the task we are called to do -

"We are obliged at this time to struggle, with all the Powers with which the Constitution hath furnished us, in Defence of our Rights; to prevent the most valuable of our Liberties from being wrested from us, by the subtle Machinations, and daring Encroachments of wicked Ministers."

On how he succeeded and what we can do -

"A true patriot would keep the attention of his fellow citizens awake to their grievances, and not allow them to rest till the causes of their just complaints are removed. Our ship is in the hands of pilots who are steering directly under full sail to a rock. The whole crew may see this course to violate our liberties in full view if they look the right way."

On the uselessness of waiting for our leaders to do anything for us -

"For my own Part, I pay very little Regard to Addresses to Great Men: Whenever they appear to be but the Breath of Flattery, they must be offensive to the Ears of any Man who has the Feelings of Truth and Sincerity in his own Breast."

On answering charges of "tin foil" and "conspiracy theory" -

"Has there not for a long time past been reason to apprehend the designs of a restless faction to oppress the nation; and the more easily to affect their purposes, to render the king's government obnoxious, and if possible put an end to a family which has heretofore supported the rights of the nation, its happiness and grandeur?"

On speculation as to who are friends and enemies in high places in the DNC and media might or might not be -

"It has become of late so fashionable for some persons to make their addresses to every one whom they call a great man, that one can hardly look upon them as the genuine marks of respect to any one who is really a good man. Their addresses seem to spring altogether from political views; and without the least regard to the character or merit of the persons whom they profess to compliment in them."

On the consequences of our failing to act at this time -

"If the people have put it in the power of a wicked and corrupt ministry to make themselves absolute lords and tyrants over them by means of a standing army, we may at present pity them under the misfortune; but future historians will record the story with astonishment and indignation, and posterity, who will share in the fatal effects of their folly and treachery, will accuse them."

On the charge that our efforts will be futile and are unrealistic -

"I Believe that no people ever yet groaned under the heavy yoke of slavery, but when they deserv'd it. This may be called a severe censure upon by far the greatest part of the nations in the world who are involv'd in the misery of servitude: But however they may be thought by some to deserve commiseration, the censure is just. The truth is, All might be free if they valued freedom, and defended it as they ought."

You are free to be as "sick" as you like of "this BS" - I choose to be inspired and motivated.

"Oppression stalk'd at large and pour'd abroad
Her unrelenting Train; Informers - Spies -
Hateful Projectors of aggrieving Schemes
To sell the starving many to the few,
And drain a thousand Ways th' exhausted Land...
And on the venal Bench
Instead of Justice, Party held the Scale,
And Violence the Sword."

[Mick Knox]

57. I'm thinking its the odor of burning hemp in the air

but I could be wrong.

[m berst]

64. that is insulting eom

.

[Beam Me Up]

76. Great quotes, m best

Thanks for putting them together.

[Wiley50]

106. " And if all of this shall fail

I make some really wicked beer"-Samuel Adams


And He does too.

Happy Holiday!

Wiley

[jdots]

66. We have to study what they have done and how

that is hard to do,but figure it this way,if they did it we can do it better.Every dupe can be un-duped,every Murdock can become a human.

[masaka___]

86. We can piss people off...

All they need is some education. My preferred method is freewayblogging and posting signs in conspicuous places, and there is a dual purpose to this.

The first is to expose the corruption and trust in the inherent goodwill of humanity to see things for what they are.

The second is to instill COURAGE into the people, so that they too may begin to take action.

[canuckforpeace]

40. I think you're right

There have been other threads today calling people out and I think folks are just sick and tired of waiting for the leaders to do something. They're realizing that it's got to start with them and they're feeling like they're ready start.

[Occulus]

49. DU = FISHBOWL

We need to take our anger off this board and into the real world.

[kentuck]

50. FISHBOWL= ROADMAP

Because anger must be directed. Otherwise, it is destructive. There are only thoughts and ideas here but they are important in their own way.

[Occulus]

90. Oh, you're right, of course

but trying to organize us here seems a bit like trying to herd cats at times.

Nothing against the people here, but I'm just sayin'....

[kentuck]

44. The only question is : what form does it take?

How do we get the people to understand what is happening and how do we get their support? I think a lot is tied to economics. The very air we breathe is tied to economics, as some great man once said. And how long will this economy stand up under the great stress it is now enduring?

[GetTheRightVote]

53. I am ready to do something for my country & its people

I am well off but I also see what is happening with so many in this country, yet they do not seem to understand they have a choice more so then they realize, why do people give up hoping so easily, give up believing they too can make a difference ??

[m berst]

63. great work as always kentuck

"How do we...."

Simplify it.

The country is being destroyed.

We need to save it.

The details can be worked out later - and much more easily and much more in our favor - if we first rally around saving the Constitution and the country. We don't so much need to persuade people to the liberal cause as we need to restore the democratic society within which liberal causes and values have a chance of being heard and succeeding. The Republicans haven't beaten us on the issues. They have destroyed the context within which any issues can be discussed and understood. They haven't remade the country and government along different ideological lines, they have destroyed the country so that ideology is irrelevant.

[kentuck]

67. Well said, m berst....

We are not simply fighting for a political Party - we are fighting for our country and our Constitution. It is more important than a political Party. Before anything can grow, the seed must be planted. The "revolution" must be in the minds of the citizens. We must educate and teach first. That is the first step in the "revolution", in my opinion.

[nadinbrzezinski]

69. listening to Bernie Ward

Education yes it is the first step to class consciousness... yes scary I am listening on the radio to... MARX

[Jose Diablo]

83. Actually before planting any seed

the field must be burned, to clear the weeds. The problem with revolutions is there no way to predict the outcome. Revolutions are chaotic. During the destruction of the previous cycle of creation to make way for the new, all structures of stability are removed. What emerges after the destruction is not predictable.

The threat of destruction is generally enough to bring the wayward leaders back to focusing on the real needs of governance and that would be the needs of the people.

However, with this batch of leaders we have now, they probably believe they could somehow personally profit from what they have been setting up. These people are no more than thugs and hoodlums in fancy suits.

During the end of the destruction, new leaders will emerge. It is impossible to predict who they will be or how it would work out. It could be better or it could be much worse, but it will be different. In all probability, those that can bear the most force will emerge as leaders. In the end, force will bring about the new level of stability.

I don't think a full blown revolution is in anybodies best interest. But once they start, even small ones, things can get out of hand. Then again, it was not "we the people" that started all this crap, it was the leaders that decided to steal their way to power that have brought us to this point. I would strongly urge those punks in Washington, to just declare there are problems with the election and do this once again, honestly this time.

They won't do this though. I am sure they think they can prevail. After all, what are the people compared to all those uniforms they see as they have their parades and ceremonies. They do not see where the power really lays.

Maybe it IS time, to just burn it down and start again.

[kentuck]

88. I don't think we should think of it in terms of Che Guevara or destruction

We are not the types to lead a violent revolution. Anyway, we would probably only end up dead and of no use to anyone. It must be a different type of "revolution" - not one in the traditional sense. It must be a revolution of ideas and instruction...To burn a field to clear for planting is not a destructive process. It is not analogous to burning down a city. We are in the Age of Information. We must believe in the power of ideas.

[m berst]

91. maybe it is Bush who is burning it down

Good points, and well said. I think of the movement that is coming as one of rebuilding and restoring, not burning and tearing down. The revolution is already happening - a gang of ruthless men are destroying our country to augment their own power and wealth. The Bush administration program is a radical and revolutionary break with the past, don't you think?

I think of the movement as resistance, not revolution, to be followed by restoration of our Constitution and representative democracy and the rebuilding of our communities, our economy, and our society.

[kentuck]

97. We are the resistance ??

Interesting....

[KnowerOfLogic]

73. Secession - it's the only answer. I have argued with religious

fundamentalists for years, and i can tell you that no amount of reason will sway these people; they cannot be reached. And even those who are somewhat moderate are still suceptible to emotional appeals and appeals to prejudice and such that the Bushists have refined into an art form. I see no way to combat this; and unfortunately before there would be any nationwide revolt things would have to get much much worse economically (and i suppose "on the bright side," they probably will); so that leaves it to the blue states to spearhead something before this country sees something like pre-war nazi germany. Off the subject, just watched Grapes of Wrath (Henry Fonda 1940) the other night; it was eerily reminiscent of the economic desperation and crooked corporations/government running the show now. Check it out! (or read the book).

[bush_is_wacko]

104. So true...

We are headed for the same type of depression. I see the sesperation in peoples eyes as well. Public school cafeterias are seeing massive amounts of children on free and reduced lunch. Far more homeless, and nearly homeless children. It is really sad. Maybe this time we won't allow the greedy to overun the gov't with more get rich quick schemes.

[leanin_green]

95. WHAT IF THEY HAD A SALE AND NOBODY CAME?

Let's stop feeding the machine!

[bush_is_wacko]

103. Truthfully...

A collapse of the economy is a good thing. It will prove to the non-believers their way doesn't work! I think it will take a major collapse in the worldwide economy for people to realize we need to change. If you haven't already read Ishmael. Daniel Quinn is the author. "Changed minds, can change the world."

[I_Love_Oregon]

72. Newbie...first post

Hello everyone. This is my first post and I want to say hello to all of you.

I've been reader of DU for many months now, and I must say, the reading is always enjoyable. The average "DU'er" seems to be a very interesting, and informed person. I look forward to getting to know you better now that I have access to a computer.

[nadinbrzezinski]

74. welcome

grab a seat

:hi: :hi: :hi:

Here is a virtual cup of java

:donut:

Enjoy your stay

[I_Love_Oregon]

75. Thanks for the brew

I appreciate the welcome!

[ever_green]

77. I think you're right. I for one won't be duped again.

It's spreading, and when America's economy collapses, people will see.

[Beam Me Up]

79. "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible...

make violent revolution inevitable.

I posted this quote yesterday as a tribute to JFK and because I, too, am feeling this "something" in the air. Didn't get a lot of responses to it so I bring it to everyone's attention here. The original thread ended up with a couple more quoetes:

I never realized Kennedy was so dangerous to the establishment.
-- Statement made in Oliver Stone's film JFK by New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison.

... the words of the late John F. Kennedy come back to haunt us. Five years ago he said, "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable." Increasingly, by choice or by accident, this is the role our nation has taken -- the role of those who make peaceful revolution impossible by refusing to give up the privileges and the pleasures that come from the immense profits of overseas investment.
-- Martin Luther King, 1967

[leftofthedial]

81. I have spoken with at least 500 people about the "election" since Nov 2

I have encountered exactly ONE person who admits to voting for the bushturd.

I have a fair number of progressive friends, but my profession puts me in contact with a wide sample of the general population.

I live in a state that allegedly went for the bushturd 52 - 47.

With each passing day, the "election" results are fishier and fishier to me.

[Beam Me Up]

82. A Revolutionary Situation

1968 was a year of great unrest around the world and due to the strikes and demonstrations and violence some mistook it for signs of the emergence of a revolutionary consciousness. They were wrong.

A real revolution will come when a "critical mass" of people--not only in the United States but around the world--have sufficiently roused themselves from the sleep of the day-to-day and have educated themselves and their brothers and sisters of every age and description sufficiently to FEEL the need to stand in direct opposition and RESIST with all their minds, hearts and bodies the immoral and unethical tyranny that has formed around us.

At this moment the edifice of False Democracy is crumbling. Day by day more and more people are seeing the criminals and traitors who occupy the highest offices of this nation for precisely what they are. We need to reach out to these people. We need to continue giving them information that they don't get anywhere else. We need to keep talking with them and encouraging them to talk with others.

It might be helpful to consider that from a certain perspective it could be said that these criminals and traitors have painted themselves into a corner. They have betrayed a sacred trust; they have exploited the structures of power within the National Security State to bring death and destruction upon citizens of our nation; they have used this tragedy to launch an immoral and illegal war against a sovereign nation and are getting ready to do both yet again; they have encouraged brutality and profligacy among members of our armed services; they have wrecked our economy; they have stolen three elections and they have pinned the justification for their existence upon a hypocritical moral superiority.

The remarkable thing is, as unbelievable as it may seem, everything I've just said is absolutely true. This means that EVIDENCE of this infamy exists on all counts and already is in the hands of many. Understand what I am saying: This evidence has a potential force far greater than a single nuclear weapon. It has the potential force to bring down not only the edifice of the Federal government, but potentially to expose the National Security State itself.

Tigers do not like corners, even if they've arrived in them by their own doings.

How much longer do you think they can keep a lid on this? Already the cracks are showing. The media has been told to not report on them as "a matter of national security" and, indeed, that could well be the case. This Situation, though by no means complete, is far closer to a truly Revolutionary one than anything ever before seen in my lifetime. One thing is certain: Soon, and possibly very soon, the social, political and economic stresses under which we live will begin to snap and unravel. The infrastructure for authoritarian rule has been put in place. The question is, will we go along with them, or will we RESIST?

[Thoth]

92. RESIST! n/t

[robbedvoter]

85. yeah. Unfortunately , it's in Ukraine. here, we watch "Survivor"

[BonjourUSA]

87. You're absolutely right. But the Democrates must ask themselves why

with 15 million of new voters Bush wins the election. Why lies, threatened liberty, a crazy war with thousands casualties, a likely economic drowning, the growing of the crazy religious feeling.... nothing changes anything but only the need of having "values". Why some years earlier, a president had to justify himself in front of the world for a private sweet cuddle. Why years ealier a president had to resign because he had spied the oppositon party..... Peccadillos if we compare all that with Bush's behavior. If you don't answer "why" you will lose the next elections.

Or pehaps the USA are not yours anymore and for ever.

[Beam Me Up]

93. .

[shesemsmom]

94. I feel it also

I'm already to sign up and hit the road.I'm sick of being held hostage by machines and worrying about those that the government has cast aside to fend for themselves. I Tired of the cutting of funds to schools and planned parenthood and other agency's that provide assistance. Tell me......when does the revolution start and when I ready to go...........

[Oak2004]

105. Come to DU for inspiration and networking: organize locally

The Continental Congress wasn't where it all started. The Continental Congress was where it ended. It started with local committees of correspondence.

A great way to connect to warm, non-virtual bodies is meetup.com. Find relevant topics, then go look for like-minded warm bodies.

In most groups of warm bodies, leaders naturally emerge. A leader, the real thing, is someone willing to work harder than others, who takes the initiative, and who encourages others to work together. A good leader combines these traits with concern for others and good judgement. Lots of people you'd never think have leadership abilities have the stuff of great leaders -- your fully qualified local leader could well turn out to be a homeless single mom, or a high school dropout who works at the sanitation department, just as readily as it could be the sociology professor from the nearby college.

Then plan resistance. Educate people who have access only to the major media through the use of media we can access (leaflets, posters, public access TV, etc.) and through workshops and meetings, march, rally, canvass, boycott, run candidates and take control of your local government (or even community association) if you can (it's not enough to be a "Democrat" anymore -- it's essential to be a democrat). Do whatever else it takes.

So make local connections, ASAP (as in the next week or two). Take the lead locally if you have the skills, or assist the most qualified leader to emerge locally.

[Wiley50]

96. It's about time

But I think we need to face the reality of what it is that we are overthrowing.
May I suggest this link?

http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/BAK411A.html

Viva La Revolucion!