LIHOP, MIHOP or Neither poll.

[bobthedrummer]

Just curious tonight.

[medeak]

1. IHOP n/t

[JohnOneillsMemory]

63. Examine Operation Vigilant Warrior and you can't conclude other than MIHOP

http://www.oilempire.us/wargames.html

http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/cia-simulation.htm

On 9/11 the CIA and NORAD were running a live simulation of multiple hijacked planes crashing into buildings.

Even the AP ran a small 'gee-what a coincidence'-story on Aug.22, 2002 which you can read at the above websites.

There are also interesting articles about 'exercises' being used to cover for real military actions.

1)Pavlov discovered that you could program minds with repeated cause-and-effect experiences. But he accidentally learned something even more interesting when his lab flooded and killed many of his test dogs. He learned that trauma could erase the old programming to make room for new programming.

2)FDR let Pearl Harbor happen because he was surrounded by fascists at home (look up the DuPont coup of 1934) and overseas while the American public was vehemently isolationist and wanted to never hear of war or Europe ever again because of the horrors of WWI. The US had cracked the Japanese Navy codes and cut off oil supplies to Japan to force an attack. It was the only way for FDR to arouse the American people in less than one day to do an about face into fighting fascism. This is all documented except for a few very key US intelligence reports from 1941 that are STILL classified to this day.

3)With the world's supplies of oil running low (look up Peak Oil), the neocons decided to move into the middle east and occupy the oil spigot that fuels our entire society. But they needed to undue the previous programming story that the US was peaceful and 'better' than the Soviet Union because of treaties, civil rights, law and order, and other 'luxuries' of 'democracy.' They are attempting to permanently occupy the middle east oil regions which is why they are preparing us for permanent war.

4)So they disabled US air cover by scheduling Operation Vigilant Warrior manuevers that put test blips on FAA screens and sent miltary planes away from the northeast air corridor to allow the 'hijacked' (?)planes to crash on target and thus reprogram the American public to overtly invade countries and give up their Bill of Rights for a false sense of security which I characterize as 'Operation Global Lynching.'

THERE IS NO OTHER EXPLANATION FOR KNOWN FACTS. MIHOP.

[Octafish]

87. As for Rationale, Google: "Operation NORTHWOODS"

Uncle Sam's righteous wing has long-seen the value in sacrificing a few citizens small lives for a higher good, their own empowerment or enrichment, fer instance. President John F. Kennedy so loathed this plan he fired its lead author - Army General Lyman L Lemnitzer, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

(We all know what happened to him. And JFKs death was used as a pretext to invade Cuba.)

April 30, 2001

Pentagon Proposed Pretexts
for Cuba Invasion in 1962

In his new exposé of the National Security Agency entitled Body of Secrets, author James Bamford highlights  a set of proposals on Cuba by the Joint Chiefs of Staff codenamed OPERATION NORTHWOODS.  This document, titled “Justification for U.S. Military Intervention in Cuba” was provided by the JCS to Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara on March 13, 1962, as the key component of Northwoods.  Written in response to a request from the Chief of the Cuba Project, Col. Edward Lansdale, the Top Secret memorandum describes U.S. plans to covertly engineer various pretexts that would justify a U.S. invasion of Cuba.  These proposals - part of a secret anti-Castro program known as Operation Mongoose - included staging the assassinations of Cubans living in the United States, developing a fake “Communist Cuban terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington,” including “sink a boatload of Cuban refugees (real or simulated),” faking a Cuban airforce attack on a civilian jetliner, and concocting a “Remember the Maine” incident by blowing up a U.S. ship in Cuban waters and then blaming the incident on Cuban sabotage.  Bamford himself writes that Operation Northwoods “may be the most corrupt plan ever created by the U.S. government.”

SOURCE w LINK to PDF of Plan...

http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/

[Birthmark]

2. Aesop

[miss_kitty]

3. BunnyHOP

[Buck Rabbit]

75. I'll be your huckleberry, Miss Kitty.

Hop ... hop ... hop ...

[gandalf]

4. Certainly MIHOP

And I'm sure bololaredrh will agree.

[readmoreoften]

5. SOCKHOP

In 2000 the PNAC wrote in their position papers that what we needed was a 'new pearl harbor'. One year later they got lucky. Maybe it wasn't MIHOP or LIHOP. Maybe it was just the power of prayer.

[Swamp Rat]

6. They fucking DID it.

After all, they're killing thousands of children right now. I'd like to see folks try to prove they DIDN'T do it.

[gandalf]

7. You would like to see folks...?

Do you really? Then go the 9/11 forum and read the posts of Lared, RH (Ron Harvey), boloboffin, mercutioATC (or so).

It seems to be their (excessive) free-time occupation to aggressively "debunk" conspiracy theories regarding 9/11.

[Swamp Rat]

10. Nein, danke

Sie sind Scheißeköpfe.

Nacht :boring:

[gandalf]

11. Da hast Du vollkommen recht!

[Sterling]

23. But they do it so poorly.

And usually resort to personal insults in an effort to get the thread locked so no one can read it.


I can't see myself spending that kind of time trying to prove people I thought were crazy that they were wrong. I wonder what the motive is?

[gandalf]

44. Motive? I often wondered

If I believed the official theory, I would perhaps do some posts accordingly, but not hundreds. As "my theory" would be supported by every official voice and all the mainstream media, I would think, let these crackpot conspiracy theorists alone, they annoy me, but cannot do much harm. But why invests hundreds of hours each year trying to convince the last dissident???

You should have got an interesting PM, I gues...

[charlie]

8. Blitzkrieg Bop

is more like it. I still smell the stink of guilt wafting from Bushco.

[bobthedrummer]

9. Sleepless kick.

:dem::kick:

[tom_paine]

12. I voted LIHOP even though Bin Laden's pro-Bush campaign commercial

at the very end of October suggests a closer link for certain.

As I always like to say: If Bin Laden isn't a Bush Employee his actions are indistinguishable from what they'd be if he was.

[AntiCoup2K4]

39. There's no question that he was a Bush employee at one time.

Only a question of when - or if - that employment ended.

[ixat]

90. "If Bin Laden isn't a Bush Employee,

his actions are indistinguishable from what they'd be if he was."

Brilliant and very true.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

13. MIHOP from week 1

[bobthedrummer]

14. Lunchtime kick.

:dem::kick:

[skippythwndrdog]

15. Neither.

Need more be said?

[bobthedrummer]

16. LIHOP leads this unscientific DU poll alone. Who's to say any more?

[Sterling]

22. Well obviously yes.

50% percent of NYers think it was an inside job. When you have this kind of disconnect with the official story the media has been selling hard for three years it is a sign people feel they cannot trust our leaders to not murder us.

I would say that deserves some serious discussion based on that alone.
You also find after looking at the facts closely the official story is full of some serious holes.

[EnfantTerrible]

40. "50% of New Yorkers?"

I live in NYC and have neither heard nor felt that statistic. I'm not saying that it isn't true... I'm just wondering why I've felt so alone?

[readmoreoften]

56. Yeah 50% of NYers

Actually, it was a Zogby poll. 50% of Nyers believe that the administration had prior knowledge.

[EnfantTerrible]

65. I got to get out more

:smoke:

[LifeDuringWartime]

89. NYS or NYC

?

[RedCloud]

17. How he hid those first three days after...

Making sure nobody was none the wiser...

No talk about the other towers collapsing yet not hit by planes.

No reconnaissance planes sent to confirm hijacking.

Pentagon twiddling its thumbs for more than an hour, then gets hit!

Sept. 10th, Halliburton gets anti-terrorist contract.

Greg Palast set to prove Florida 2000 vote deprived about 250,000 voters of the right to vote. I think this was slated for Sept. 12th.

Victims' families given huge cash amounts if they promise not to sue.
But money was freely donated without such Bushist stipulations.

Gag order on well-informed people who can prove differently.

Grandpappy Prescott used Jewish prison labor at Auschwitz.
Pappy Bush on Oct. 18, 1980 met with Iranian terrorists to ask them not to release the hostages until after the elections in return for arms. Treason runs strong in the Bush family.

[wordout]

18. MIHOP

many other countries knew and LIHOP

[megatherium]

19. never attribute to malice

that which can be explained by incompetence.

And these guys aren't the sharpest tools in the shed, are they?

[Minstrel Boy]

20. Attributing 9/11 to imcompetence

doesn't explain the concurrent drills and simulations that morning that effected a stand down of the air force. There are at least five we know of. One was a NORAD live-fly simulation of hijackings on the Eastern seaboard that confused the radar picture. Another exercise saw that the bulk of available interceptors had been sent to the West Coast and Northern Canada. Another Pentagon-CIA drill the morning of 9/11 actually simulated the crash of an airplane into a building. Then there was the FEMA anti-terrorist simulation for New York City, that had ready a disaster centre for the city larger and better equipped than the one lost in WTC 7, set up in lower Manhattan on Sept 11 and ready to receive victims.

There are many more incidents like these. Some could be coincidence, but surely not all. You can see what I mean by looking here:
http://rigorousintuition.blogspot.com/2004/08/coincidence-theorists-guide-to-911.html

"these guys aren't the sharpest tools in the shed, are they?"

"These guys" have stolen three straight elections.

[gordianot]

25. Bush is perfect for the real powers and handlers.

Some pretty sharp tools found one of the dullest tools they could find as a cover. They make it happen ** follows along.

[Octafish]

84. Satan's Monkey.

Oops. Meant "lower caste."



You hit the chimp on the sloping forehead, gordo. Regarding pre-knowledge, it wouldn't be hard to keep him in the dark. The guy went to the G8 summit in Genoa and slept offshore in July while the Italians set up SAM batteries around the conference. The guy had Ashcraft stop flying commercial because the gov heard about Osama and the airplanes. The guy took August off in muggy Texas of all places. Then the crazy monkey had the CIA director standing in front of him with his hair on fire and he STILL DIDN'T GET IT.

It takes a certain genius to be that stupid. They don't just fall out of trees. They live there.

[Aries]

35. Exactly...the war games are critical

As I said in my recent (published) letter to the editor:

On July 21 of this year, National Public Radio broadcast a message promoting its coverage of the release of The 9/11 Commission Report: Final Report of the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States. It stated that on September 11, 2001, there were war games being run by NORAD involving the hijacking of airliners, and it included a recorded conversation between a NORAD employee and an FAA air traffic controller, in which the NORAD employee, in reference to the first hijacking, asked “Is this real or simulated?” He was told that it was, in fact, real. Amazingly, the only reference to the war games during the 9/11 Commission hearings or in its report was by audience members who interrupted the final day of its proceedings, demanding an answer to their questions.

At least four war game exercises involving simulated air attacks took place on September 11, 2001. Clearly, terrorist attacks such as occurred that day would benefit from the confusion caused by simultaneous war games with similar characteristics. Assuming that the hijackers would use such an opportunity, it appears that they were able to do so either 1) by an amazing stroke of luck, or 2) by having been informed of plans for the war games. A logical investigative goal would be to determine if the latter was the case, and if so, who provided that information. Unfortunately, the 9/11 Commission Report ignores the question of what affect ongoing war games may have had on the defense against the terrorist attacks, not to mention whether and how information about them might have been obtained by the attackers. The report, written in the style of a fictional thriller, appears to have a very limited relationship to the truth of what happened on that day.

[Fusions_Minion]

72. "ready to receive victims"..

"Mass decontamination practices, still a bit shaky when described in January/February 2000 edition, are now well in place. They were used in earnest in New Jersey on 9/11 when over 10,000 people making their way from Manhattan on foot and by ferry were decontaminated"
http://www.hazmatmag.com/issues/ISarticle.asp?id=77237&story_id=138849154736&issue=12012002&PC=&RType=

Over 10 thousand are decontaminated on the same day that Ft. Monmouth and (most likely) FEMA are running a decontamination drill in Jersey. How "timely".

[Goldmund]

26. If these guys are dumb, then we're dumber.

Where are we, and where are they?

[gordianot]

28. Agreed

We are getting what we deserve. We do not even know or admit who "they" are.

[megatherium]

94. I still don't buy a conspiracy.

But it's clear these pricks showed no lack of alacrity to take advantage of 9/11.

And you're right, they do have a certain feral craftiness. But I don't believe we can describe brazen greed as intelligence: we went from a 500 billion annual surplus to a 500 billion deficit in four years, and we are in a ruinous war that no one with a clue thinks we can win. These dumb bastards will crash and burn before too long. Perhaps when they engineer a draft.

If LIHOP or MIHOP were true, when will they do another one? They need one to bring back the draft -- without a lot more troops, they can't hope to prevail in Iraq, and they can forget about Iran.

[PurityOfEssence]

21. LIHOP lite

I think they got all grumbly when the Taliban went for the Argentine deal, and deliberately let down their guard, thinking it would be something bad, but not REALLY bad. Their actions on the 11th and 12th reek of people who thought they'd screwed up, but then they recovered and realized that it was even better than they could have hoped for.

The problem with conspiracy theories is that everyone always thinks they had to be carefully plotted from the ground up, which stretches credulity. That's why I say LIHOP lite: many conspiracies are opportunism of the moment based on circumstances and/or the work of others, and that doesn't necessitate a huge net of conspirators, gobs of money or anything else that's difficult to conceal.

[frank frankly]

24. MIHOP

it took me awhile to admit it.

[ocean girl]

27. I was in complete delusion until I found cooperativeresearch.org

and started reading the timelines.

Also, I am psychic and there is absolutely NO DOUBT in my mind that it was MIHOP.

And if they will kill Americans, they will do anything.

Anything.

[Endangered Specie]

62. "I am psychic"

Well that there settles it folks! :eyes:

[DemonFighterLives]

29. LIHOP turned MIHOP

This criminal element in control of the US knows no low too low to stoop below.

[leesa]

30. Without a doubt, they made it happen.

[found object]

31. Cheney HMIHOP

helped make it happen on purpose.

[Swamp Rat]

33. Nice variation on a theme

[Octafish]

32. MIHOP for me. But either way, they benefitted.

Here's the short story:

At the Genoa G8 summit of July 2001, Bush refused to sleep at a hotel and cowered aboard a US warship offshore. Italy had been warned Osama bin Laden planned to hijack and airplane and crash it into the conference.

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/Hatfield-R-091901/hatfield-r-091901.html


That same month Crisco Johnny Ashcan stops flying commercial.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml


In August, Bush goes on a month-long vacation to his stinking pigfarm.

The FBI, CIA, NSA, INS and every body with a dot to connect brings it to the unelected moron who refuses to take action.

Then 9-11 happened.

Sorry, bobthedrummer. Brain running out of seratonin...must conk out. Must conk out. must... Dai---sy. Daaaai---sy. Wh-hh-h--h-...Hello, Bob!

[seemslikeadream]

38. Buzzy Krongard

SUPPRESSED DETAILS OF CRIMINAL INSIDER TRADING LEAD DIRECTLY INTO THE CIA's HIGHEST RANKS

CIA EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR "BUZZY" KRONGARD MANAGED FIRM THAT HANDLED "PUT" OPTIONS ON UAL

by
Michael C. Ruppert

FTW, October 9, 2001 - Although uniformly ignored by the mainstream U.S. media, there is abundant and clear evidence that a number of transactions in financial markets indicated specific (criminal) foreknowledge of the September 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. In the case of at least one of these trades -- which has left a $2.5 million prize unclaimed -- the firm used to place the "put options" on United Airlines stock was, until 1998, managed by the man who is now in the number three Executive Director position at the Central Intelligence Agency. Until 1997 A.B. "Buzzy" Krongard had been Chairman of the investment bank A.B. Brown. A.B. Brown was acquired by Banker's Trust in 1997. Krongard then became, as part of the merger, Vice Chairman of Banker's Trust-AB Brown, one of 20 major U.S. banks named by Senator Carl Levin this year as being connected to money laundering. Krongard's last position at Banker's Trust (BT) was to oversee "private client relations." In this capacity he had direct hands-on relations with some of the wealthiest people in the world in a kind of specialized banking operation that has been identified by the U.S. Senate and other investigators as being closely connected to the laundering of drug money.

Krongard (re?) joined the CIA in 1998 as counsel to CIA Director George Tenet. He was promoted to CIA Executive Director by President Bush in March of this year. BT was acquired by Deutsche Bank in 1999. The combined firm is the single largest bank in Europe. And, as we shall see, Deutsche Bank played several key roles in events connected to the September 11 attacks.
more
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/10_09_01_krongard.html

WEDDINGS/CELEBRATIONS; Cheryl Gordon, A. B. Krongard

Published: August 1, 2004, Sunday
Cheryl Gordon, an investment executive, and A. B. Krongard, the executive director of the Central Intelligence Agency, were married yesterday at Mr. Krongard's home in Lutherville, Md. The Rev. William P. Baxter Jr., an Episcopal priest, officiated.
Mrs. Krongard, 48, is a senior executive for strategic planning at Apollo Management, an investment firm in New York. She is a trustee of Mount Sinai Hospital and a board member of Citymeals-on-Wheels. She graduated from Iowa State University and is on the board of its foundation. She is a daughter of Gloria Gruetzmacher of Des Moines and James Gruetzmacher of Marshalltown, Iowa. The bride, who was a widow, was married to Edward S. Gordon, the late New York real estate executive.
Mr. Krongard, who is 67 and is known as Buzzy, became the executive director of the C.I.A. in March 2001. He joined the agency in February 1998 as counselor to its director in McLean, Va. Previously, he was a chairman and chief executive of Alex.Brown & Sons, the Baltimore investment banking firm, and a vice chairman of Bankers Trust, which purchased Alex .Brown. Mr. Krongard is on the board of Johns Hopkins Medicine, which oversees Johns Hopkins Medical School, Johns Hopkins Hospital and the Johns Hopkins Health System, and is the vice chairman of the health system board. He graduated from Princeton and received a law degree from the University of Maryland. He is a son of Rita Krongard of Baltimore and the late Harry Krongard.
Mr. Krongard was a widower; his wife was Patricia Lion Krongard.
Published: 08 - 01 - 2004 , Late Edition - Final , Section 9 , Column 1 , Page 11

[Octafish]

70. Smirko was warned.

Bush and 9-11: Compelling Evidence for Complicity

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=780909

But nothing this hack writes can compare with...

Bush knew. Now, do you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=995140

Wow.



In doing my mental Christmas shopping, I saw this and thought of seemslikeadream.

[seemslikeadream]

74. Rookie In Command Of National Mil. Command Ops Center On 9/11

Rear Admiral (Select) Charles J. Leidig, Jr.

Nat. Military Command Center ops director asked newly-qualified substitute on Sept. 10 to stand his watch at 8:30 am on Sept. 11


WASHINGTON -- June 17, 2004 Posted 11:45 pm -- Tom Flocco.com -- According to the personal written statement of Navy Captain Charles J. Leidig, Jr., entered into the record during today’s hearings before the National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States, Leidig revealed that on September 10 he was asked by Brigadier General Montague Winfield to stand a portion of his duty as Deputy Director for Operations for the National Military Command Center (NMCC), which would require supervision and operation of all necessary communications as watch commander.

...

The National Transportation and Safety Board auditorium had been quiet until an individual stood up and repeatedly questioned why the Commission was not addressing the issue of 9-11 war games--specifically Operation Vigilant Guardian--wherein fighters were already in the air during the attacks, some just minutes away from New York City. The legitimate questions were ignored and the petitioner was removed by secret service and FBI agents.

Commissioner John Lehman offered that while Air Force Generals Richard Meyers, Ralph Eberhart and Larry Arnold (Ret.) had been questioned, no one had asked any questions of the "only sailor in the group," Captain Leidig.

Lehman asked Leidig about the controlled phone bridges or conferences held during the attacks, which the Captain confirmed were classified and secure phone lines while also indicating that "the President can be included" in such teleconferences.

...

Immediately at the close of testimony by Myers, Eberhart, Arnold and Leidig, this writer quickly walked to the head table to individually question Leidig before his aides could escort him from the auditorium. The Air Force generals had left quickly.

When asked "Can you tell me the approximate time when you commenced your supervision of the phone bridges," Leidig told TomFlocco.com, "You’ll have to look in the records and Commission staff statements. I can’t recall the time."

...

All of which raises questions regarding why the experienced Winfield left his watch after the attacks had begun, what prompted Winfield to request Leidig to assume his watch the next morning, why Winfield chose 8:30 am to have Leidig relieve him, why the Commission never addressed these issues, and whether Winfield had access to intelligence from the CIA and FBI which foretold a "spectacular attack, designed to inflict mass casualties against U.S. facilities or interests. Attack preparations have been made. Attack will occur with little or no warning." (CIA Intelligence Report for White House, July 5, 2001--60+ days prior to 9-11, Newsweek, 5-1-2003 / The Hill, 5-1-2003)


http://www.tomflocco.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=65


Rear Admiral (Select) Charles J. Leidig, Jr.
United States Navy
Commandant of Midshipmen
United States Naval Academy

Rear Admiral (Select) Leidig became the 80th Commandant of Midshipmen in September 2003. He graduated with distinction from the U.S. Naval Academy in 1978 with a Bachelor of Science in Mathematics.
His operational tours include service in both attack and ballistic missile submarines. He served as Reactor Controls Assistant and Communications Officer on USS Henry L. Stimson (SSBN 655), as Engineer Officer on USS Sam Rayburn (SSBN 635), as Navigation and Operations Officer on USS Stonewall Jackson (SSBN 634), and as Executive Officer on USS Pogy (SSN 647).

His command tours include service as Commanding Officer of USS Cavalla (SSN 684) from 1994-1997, where he led the Navy’s first unclassified science mission to the Arctic Ocean, and twice deployed to the western Pacific. Under his command Cavalla set the Pacific Fleet endurance record of 63 consecutive days of Arctic under-ice operations, earned two Meritorious Unit Commendations and in 1996 was awarded the Navy Battle Efficiency ‘E’, Engineering Excellence ‘E’, and Tactical Operations Excellence ‘T’. He subsequently served as Commander, Submarine Development Squadron Five from 1999-2001 where he was the operational commander for the Navy’s Deep Submergence Program and the Tactical Development Authority for the Submarine Force’s off-hull sensors, Arctic warfare and submarine rescue and escape programs.

Rear Adm. (Sel.) Leidig’s staff assignments include service as an instructor at the U.S. Naval Academy, as Material Officer on the staff of Submarine Squadron Eleven, as Senior Member of the Nuclear Propulsion Examining Board for Commander-in-Chief, U.S. Atlantic Fleet and on the Joint Staff as Assistant Deputy Director for Regional Operations in the Operations Directorate and as Executive Assistant to the Director of the Joint Staff. He served as the Deputy Commandant of Midshipmen from June to September 2003.

Rear Adm. (Sel.) Leidig received the David Lloyd Leadership Award and the L.Y. Spear Award upon completion of the Submarine Officer Advanced Course in 1985. He earned a Master's Degree in National Security and Strategic Studies from the Naval War College, graduating with distinction in 1994, and subsequently completed the National Security Management Program at the Syracuse University Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs in 2001.

Rear Adm. (Sel.) Leidig has been awarded the Defense Superior Service Medal, the Legion of Merit (two awards), the Meritorious Service Medal (two awards), the Joint Service Commendation Medal, the Navy Commendation Medal (four awards), and the Navy Achievement Medal along with other unit and service awards.

http://www.chinfo.navy.mil/navpalib/people/flags/biogra... ....

[Octafish]

80. College. Can't beat it.

The crook bush should try it some time.

SOURCE:

http://people.cornell.edu/pages/hhh3/9-11.html

The three websites below are great sources of information regarding the attacks of 9-11-01 that you won't find in the mainstream corporate owned and censored right wing media.

http://www.septembereleventh.org/

http://globalresearch.ca

http://whatreallyhappened.com/

WSWS : News & Analysis : North America


Cantor-Fitzgerald, Port Authority sue Saudis

September 11-the official story and the bottom line

By Bill Van Auken
16 September 2004

EXCERPT...

The Port Authority’s announcement on the lawsuit came close on the heels of renewed charges by Florida Senator Bob Graham that the Bush administration orchestrated a cover-up of Saudi involvement in the September 11 attacks.

SNIP...

Graham’s charges focus on the extraordinary record of Nawaf al-Hazmi and Khalid al-Mihdhar, who were identified as hijackers of American Airlines Flight 77, which crashed into the Pentagon. Both men were Saudi nationals, as were 13 others of the 19 hijackers.

SNIP...

Nonetheless, after the meeting, al-Hazmi and al-Mihdhar were allowed to fly to the US using their own passports and visas issued by US consular authorities in Saudi Arabia. While the CIA knew of their presence in the country, it did not inform the Federal Bureau of Investigation, according to the FBI. (The CIA disputes this claim, maintaining that it did alert the FBI.) Nor did the CIA inform immigration authorities. The two were placed on a terrorist watch list only a few weeks before the September 11 attacks. In subsequent testimony, intelligence and security officials claimed they had, by that time, “lost track” of the known Al Qaeda operatives.

After landing in Los Angeles in January 2000, al-Hazmi and al-Mihdhar were met by Omar al-Bayoumi, an employee of the Saudi civil aviation authority. US investigators have concluded that al-Bayoumi was a Saudi intelligence agent. Al-Bayoumi invited the pair to move to San Diego, where he found them an apartment, provided them with money and helped enroll them in flight school.

It has been reported that al-Bayoumi served as conduit for thousands of dollars in funding for the future hijackers sent by Princess Haifa, the wife of Prince Bandar, the Saudi ambassador to the US and a close confidante of the Bush family. Al-Bayoumi’s monthly paycheck as a contractor for Saudi civil aviation—for which he did no discernable work—rose from $465 to $3,700 after he began assisting the two Al Qaeda operatives.

CONTINUED...



The rarest of jewels, seemslikeadream is one of those people with two good sides.

[seemslikeadream]

85. Octafish take this will you

Take another little piece of my heart now, baby.

[bobthedrummer]

88. Good catch there, SLAD.

:hi:

[bobthedrummer]

34. Interesting that 80% of respondents are in LIHOP/MIHOP groups

That's how it is with this War President's administration.
:grr::mad::puke::argh::nuke:

[Skidmore]

36. Does it matter?

Letting it happen is only one word away from making it happen. That it happened at all is a crime, particularly if * and his stooges had information that should have been acted on to prevent 9/11.

[sweetheart]

37. 2000 coup ->MIHOP, 911->LIHOP, 2004 election fraud -> MIHOP

I presume your poll is for 9/11... but just as well it could
be about the last poll.

[JohnyCanuck]

41. Catalyst for Perpetual War

Inside the Clouds of 9/11

Catalyst for Perpetual War

Manuel Valenzuela

<snip>

It is inside the clouds of 9/11 that the most successful psychological warfare technique ever devised by man can be seen for what it is, namely, the devastatingly successful mechanism by which an entire nation was transformed from placid isolationists going about their daily god-fearing lives into blood-thirsty seekers of vengeance and gluttonous purveyors of human malice. The genius of those exploiters of 9/11, with its horrific mass death and carnage, its violent destruction of buildings and human life, was in bombarding American citizens, through the television and using the mouths of media lackeys, with ceaseless images of what transpired that day along with voices of vengeance, hatred and war, thereby shaking the foundations of reality and the constructs of security hundreds of millions believed themselves to live under.

Suddenly a new reality emerged and fear, that most controlling emotion in the human animal, that passion clouding the mind and our logical, analytical thinking, was unleashed throughout the nation. Insecurity blanketed the country as images of falling buildings and crashing airlines paralyzed an entire populace. Our world came crashing down along with the World Trade Center, and in its debris-filled clouds did we find ourselves in, not knowing what to make of what had without notice transpired, not understanding the violence we had just witnessed, not comprehending a world gone mad. Our fear blinded us, and immediately rage and hatred permeated from our pores. We are but animal primates, after all, and our emotions began to control our thinking human brain.

<snip>

Almost immediately, the seeds of blame were sowed onto a population needing an enemy and scapegoat from which to focus its collective wrath. Rather quickly and conveniently Muslims were blamed without a single investigation or an act of prudence. Arab names immediately appeared on passenger manifests, impossible to find passports were suddenly said found in the remains of the World Trade Center, parked cars containing copies of the Koran along with flying instructions in Arabic were quickly discovered, images of dancing Palestinians made the airwaves, even though the images were of children recorded months before, ambiguous video of hijackers at so-called airports circulated, and all around, the corporate media, with its many Zionist interests lurking freely, besieged our conscious with Arab bogeymen and Muslim motives, immediately finding itself an enemy to castigate and blame.

It all fell into place like a jigsaw puzzle, all too soon, all too convenient, all too surreal and all seemingly pre-arranged, as if scapegoats had already been decided upon to validate already predetermined wars in the Middle East. Yet we never wondered, we never questioned how everything had come to be so expeditiously. Hypnotized to the images of that malicious day we remained, immersed by fear and hatred and rage and calls for vengeance. We fell into the trap of a new Pearl Harbor, the interests that be had what they wanted, a militarized, paralyzed and vengeance mobilized citizenry, ready to believe anything, ready to unleash war on America’s new enemy. The barrage was ceaseless, the drums of war now beat strongly, before the American people knew it, those responsible for 9/11 had been chosen. The wheels had been set in motion.

www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7398.htm

[seemslikeadream]

42. Full Criminal Investigation of September 11th Attacks

9/11 Victims to Deliver Complaint to NY Attorney General Calling for Full Criminal Investigation of September 11th Attacks

Wed Oct 27,11:10 AM ET

A coalition of 9/11 victim family members, survivors and advocacy groups will deliver a formal complaint requesting a new criminal investigation of 9/11 events to New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer this Thursday following a 2:00 PM press conference outside the Equitable Building (corner of Nassau and Cedar Streets). The Complaint petitions the Attorney General to launch an independent in-depth criminal and civil probe of evidence suggesting grave official misconduct including criminal negligence, criminal facilitation, and accessorial abetment of murder, insider trading, obstruction of justice, and other violations of New York law.

The Complaint asks the Attorney General to seek justice for 9/11 crimes by applying New York State law to recover damages incurred by state and local governments from corporations and individuals whose conduct furthered the criminal conspiracy. The Complainants, including victim family member Bob McIlvaine who lost his son, maintain that few if any of these charges or supporting evidence were adequately investigated by the 2002 Joint Intelligence Inquiry or the 9/11 Commission which released its final report last July.

"For many New Yorkers, AG Spitzer is the last hope for finding the truth about what happened on 9/11 and enforcing the law." noted spokesperson David Kubiak. "Because administration officials have classified evidence under the "state secrets" doctrine, preempting local probes and obstructing official inquiries, there has been no comprehensive, credible independent investigation of the attacks. The Attorney General clearly has jurisdiction if he chooses to assert it. Given the scale of 9/11 carnage, incalculable damages suffered and evidence covered-up or ignored, his constituents are now telling him that he must. Fifteen New York legislators have stepped up to endorse this demand so we're at a very remarkable choice point in 9/11 history."

Although the Complaint follows years of independent investigation and research, its legal form was triggered by three recent developments: 1) the failure of the Kean Commission Report to provide a credible explanation of the 9/11 attacks, to hold anyone accountable, or answer most of the questions posed by the 9/11 Family Steering Committee (note 1); 2) the August 31st Zogby 9/11 poll (note 2) which showed that nearly half of New Yorkers believe government officials were "consciously" complicit in the attacks, and that two-thirds want a new investigation; and 3) the testimony and evidence put forth at the September 9, 2004 9/11 Citizens' Commission hearings in Manhattan, organized by the watchdog and activist groups 9/11 CitizensWatch and 911truth.org.

The Complaint is preceded by today's release of the "9/11 Statement," a call for new investigations signed by over 100 American opinion leaders including three third-party presidential candidates, a former U.S. Ambassador, a New York firemen, professors, theologians and forty 9/11 families.

The "9/11 Statement" and Spitzer Complaint will be available one half hour prior to the 2 p.m. Thursday press conference at the northwest corner of Cedar and Nassau Streets (NE corner of Equitable Building). The 9/11 Statement will be posted at 911truth.org from 2 p.m. today. The Spitzer Complaint will be posted at http://www.justicefor911.org following the Thursday press conference. Further details to follow.
---
(1) http://www.911independentcommission.org/questions.html

(2) http://www.zogby.com/search/ReadNews.dbm?ID=855

http://www.usnewswire.com /
/© 2004 U.S. Newswire 202-347-2770/


http://www.justicefor911.org /

[Blue_Tires]

43. lol...been awhile since we had one of these polls

dead even so far

[welshTerrier2]

45. my dad (83) is skeptical of mihop because ...

he just can't believe anyone would intentionally kill that many people ...

my response to this is that I don't think those who planned 9/11 expected the towers to come down ... i think they planned for the likely deaths of those on the planes and those on a few floors near the impact ...

the point is, i don't think the "they wouldn't have killed that many" argument is necessarily valid ...

this is a mihop situation ... i measure its likelihood based on the absolute political gains the republicans made as a result of the incident ... bush went from being a bumbling fool to being the great savior ... benefit does not necessarily prove guilt; but it does make for a pretty good suspect ...

[RBHam]

46. The towers were imploded...

A letter questioning the common theory that fuel fires caused steel beams in the Twin Towers to buckle and therefore set off the WTC collapses was sent yesterday by Kevin Ryan to Frank Gayle of the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST).

Ryan directs Environmental Health Laboratories and is one of 23 directors at Underwriters Laboratories. UL, the product-compliance and testing giant, certified the steel components used in the construction of the World Trade Center towers. Statements that fires weakened the steel certified by UL are obviously of concern to the company.

For more than two years, NIST has been studying how the trade center was built and why it fell. A draft of its final report is due in January.

911Truth.org called Ryan's office several times today. In one of the follow-up calls, we received assurances from UL operators that Ryan was aware of our efforts to determine whether the letter was genuine. He later called back and confirmed his authorship.

911Truth.org is publishing Ryan's letter today at http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20041112144051451

Ryan raises disturbing questions, pointing out that steel recovered from the towers later tested up to its certified standard (i.e., it should have easily withstood the fuel fires without buckling). A chemist by profession, Ryan said he took this unusual step in the hope of receiving a public response from Gayle.

Given how the aftermath of September 11 has changed the world, Ryan said, everyone needs to know the full truth of what really happened on that day. He added that he considers Gayle to be a good scientist and an honest person.

Meanwhile, the New York Times reports today that the NIST team under Gayle is planning to hold some of its deliberations on the WTC collapse in secret ...

This is a big story: If the long-standing story that fuel fires caused the WTC collapse is as self-evidently false as Ryan claims, why are experts still pushing it on TV? And what caused the collapse?

http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20041112144051451

[welshTerrier2]

48. i've been following that story ...

not sure what to make of it ... there have been reports of explosions in the basements of the towers before they were hit with airliners ... of course, if they were taken down by implosion, why add the planes to the mix ??

also, if the implosion theories are true, was it not the case (and didn't we see this on tv?) that each floor, from the top down, "pancaked" onto the floor below? would this pattern be consistent with explosions from below? i'm not discounting any of the current theories ... i'm just not drawing any conclusions yet ...

[Chovexani]

MIHOP for sure

They had direct ties to the one who did it...they stood to gain financially and politically from it...and they tried to block the investigation at every turn. And we know they have no problems with killing people, they are repeat offenders.

If this was an episode of Law & Order, Jack McCoy would have all these bastards behind bars.

[eagler]

47. I used to think LIHOP but now

MIHOP.

[PATRICK]

49. Does it matter?

The culpability is so great that both apply if not in intent and planning then in set direction and agenda priority. They planned that such was inevitable and an opportunity more than a disaster to expend more efforts to avoid. In fact it was preferable then(and more during the past four years but too bad it DIDN'T happen).

The last thought, the lack of any homeland incident of a democracy destroying magnitude makes MIHOP less and less likely. That is not how they have been operating on all other occasions. They wait for the predictable and are ready to exploit. they don't seem to care much who can figure it out because LIHOP leaves very little culpable trail. If they planned the Iraq war a little more hands off like that things might be going better for them. But that war was MIHOP from the get go because THAT was the major agenda item. Terrorism was just an opportunity making device.

Funny, one can prove MIHOP for the Iraq War but wee focus on the 911 incident instead, as if they could microplan such a scheme when they grossly handled the Iraq planning. All the faults of a damaged goods security and political system with no press scrutiny, etc. can be simply gathered together by a formative incident. Wagons circled. Blame spread out and dissipated. Secrets muddled and buried. What Bushco made happen was the possibility and most especially the AFTERMATH of 911.

Meanwhile all the terror alerets showed that at opportune moments Bushco could have expected some beneficial sequel to 911 but it never happened. they gamed the fear of course, but sometimes it seemed they were very ready too capitalize on more- and still are. And still are.

The single issue for me, and I think the timelines lend some suspicion there, is that knowledge of the attacks MIGHT have been so particular that Bush dawdled to give the attackers time to behead the Congress which was not the radical rubber stamp it still is becoming now. That is such a gross example of LIHOP as to make the other theories pale in comparison. Only an accidental delay of the last plane possibly saved
the government from being shifted to the shadow government and then to GOP governor and Cheney appointed young cronies heady with Bush support and 911 Guilianiism. You have to admit it has been very messy and dissent prone these past four years despite Bush getting mostly his own way.

Someone explained targeting DC. Who would take out a monument? Pentagon takes one plane. A certain attack on the Capitol might take two if the Washington Memorial needs to be cleared out of the way. Did the Pentagon plane dawdle or circle the Capitol area?

Meanwhile the planning of missions by Cheney etc. left the national defenses down. LIHOP again possibly.

The actual loss of life really did not seem to surprise or affect the Bush team. they were focused on response. Boy were they ready for THAT. Check mainly not for evidence under wraps but for OTHER behavior consistent with the behavior surrounding 911. Then it becomes easy to credibly theorize how and why they reacted. It almost is a conditioned set of behaviors, very easily carried out.

[m berst]

51. we don't know

Good post, Patrick. The answer to many of the questions surrounding the attacks is, of course, that we don't know with any certainty.

The question then becomes how will know? I would say that the more interest there is in the subject, and the more responsible and serious the people are who are interested, the more likely we are to ever know the truth. Then the question becomes what will support and encourage interest? Will more interest be generated by repeating MIHOP again and again and then attempting to prove this to people? Or will more interest in 9-11 - as well as about the war in Iraq and the election problems - be generated by asking questions and allowing people to come to their own conclusions?

What we DO know about this administration is chilling enough without trying to "solve" the whole mess by putting a catchy but unsupportable MIHOP label on it. The MIHOP label makes all discussion of it at risk, since all people have to do to avoid the whole subject is to reject the MIHOP conclusion and they can ignore or dismiss everything about it.

That said, I believe that it was MIHOP, but there is no sense in running around selling that idea and shooting myself in the foot. More to the point, I believe that the people in this administration are morally capable of MIHOP - and in a way that is more damning of them than MIHOP theories are.

[GreenPartyVoter]

50. Post-Op Photo Opp

-----------------------------------
Would Jesus love a liberal? You bet!
http://timeforachange.bluelemur.com/

[LunaC]

52. Anyone doubting MIHOP needs to read this link....

It spells it ALL out!

PNAC 101 - Rise of the Neocons
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2137401

For those too lazy or busy to click the link, consider that nobody has yet to offer a plausible explanation for the following sequence of events:

In May 2001 the U.S. State Department met with Iran, German and Italian officials to discuss Afghanistan. It was decided that the ruling Taliban would be toppled and a "broad-based government" would control the country so a gas pipeline could be built there.

http://fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/7969.pdf.
http://www.gasandoil.com/goc/features/fex20867.htm


Even as plans were being made to remove the Taliban rulers from power, Colin Powell announced a $43 million "gift" to Afghanistan.

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/editorials/la-091701scheer.column
http://www.cato.org/dailys/08-02-02.html


Meanwhile, the U.S. Embassy in the UAE received a call that Bin Laden supporters were in the U.S. planning attacks with explosives. It was rumored that Bin Laden was interested in hijacking U.S. aircraft.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/images/04/10/whitehouse.pdf


In June 2001 the decades-old procedure for a quick response by the nation’s air defense was changed. NORAD’s military commanders could no longer issue the command to launch fighter jets because approval had to be sought from the civilian Defense Secretary, Donald Rumsfeld.

http://www.9-11commission.gov/hearings/hearing7/for_the_record_ashley.pdf


In July 2001, the private plot formulated in May for toppling the Taliban was divulged during the G8 summit in Genoa, Italy. Immediately after the conference, American, Russian, German and Pakistani officials secretly met in Berlin to finalize the strategy for military strikes against the Taliban, scheduled to begin before mid-October 2001

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/1550366.stm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,556254,00.html
http://www.gasandoil.com/goc/features/fex20867.htm


In September 2001 the "catastrophic and catalyzing" modern-day Pearl Harbor envisioned years earlier by the White House members of the PNAC came to pass when the WTC and Pentagon were attacked with U.S. aircraft as Rumsfeld sat passive and unresponsive. Immediately, the finger of blame was pointed at Osama bin Laden, a former CIA operative with ties to Afghanistan. Suddenly, the U.S. "gift" of $43 million to the Taliban in May was cast in a new light. Coincidentally, Pakistan had participated in the plan to attack Afghanistan and the chief of Pakistan's Inter Service Intelligence (ISI) agency was later linked to a 911 hijacker after wiring him $100,00 just days before the WTC fell. Pakistan's ISI also had a long-standing working relationship with the CIA.

http://cryptome.org/rad.htm
http://www.observer.com/pages/story.asp?ID=8830
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO109C.html
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/uncomp/articleshow?msid=1454238160
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1266317,00.html


In October 2001, with flags waving, crowds cheering, and anthems playing, the "War On Terror" and the hunt for Osama began when Afghanistan was attacked right on schedule of July's secret meeting


Shorrtly afterwards, public focus was diverted to Iraq while the OSP maneuvered in the background. You already know the rest of the story.

[Octafish]

86. You forgot Poland!.... I mean "Italy!"

Osama bin Cheney targeted the G8 summit with a hijacked airliner. That's why the Italians placed SAMs all around the city and Bush slept offshore aboard a US warship. BUSH KNEW AND THE HE HID. HE DID NOTHING TO STOP THE ATTACKS. That's the same as making it happen, in my book...



Bin Laden: Believed to have a network of guerrillas

Plot to assassinate Bush - reports

July 9, 2001 Posted: 9:23 AM EDT (1323 GMT)

MOSCOW, Russia -- Osama bin Laden has threatened to assassinate U.S. President George W. Bush at a G8 meeting in Italy, the head of Russia's Federal Bodyguard Service has said, according to reports.

The Associated Press said Yevgeny Murov was quoted by Itar-Tass news agency as saying: "Bin Laden is threatening the American president, but we know what international terrorism is today and therefore all the bodyguard units concerned are preparing for this.

"We view the threats as totally serious, but hope that with joint efforts we can solve all the problems."

The Group of Eight summit is meeting between July 20-22 in Genoa, Italy. Leaders from Britain, Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Russia and the United States are expected to attend the summit.

SOURCE:

http://archives.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/europe/06/20/russia.binladen/


G8 summit may have been Bin Laden target

Rory Carroll in Rome, Jon Henley in Paris and Brian Whitaker
Thursday September 27, 2001
The Guardian

Two months before the attacks on New York and Washington, Osama bin Laden may have been contemplating an aerial attack against world leaders assembled in Genoa for a G8 summit.

Rumours that the terrorist suspect planned to pack an aircraft with explosives and launch it at the Ducal palace containing George Bush have been given weight by the president of Egypt, Hosni Mubarak.

He said Islamist suicide pilots were originally intended to launch an attack on the Italian riviera.

"On June 13 of this year, we learned of a communique from Bin Laden saying he wanted to assassinate Mr Bush and other G8 heads of state during their summit in Italy. It was a well-known piece of in formation," said President Mubarak.

CONTINUED…

http://www.guardian.co.uk/waronterror/story/0,1361,558918,00.html


Mubarak aware of threat to Bush at Genoa

Tuesday, September 25, 2001 at 09:30 JST
PARIS — Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak said on Monday he had heard of threats by Osama bin Laden last June to kill President George W Bush and other world leaders at a summit of top industrialised nations in Genoa, Italy.

"On June 13 of this year, we learned of a communique from bin Laden saying he wanted to assassinate George W Bush and other G-8 heads of state during their summit in Italy," Mubarak, in Paris on the first leg of a European trip, said in an interview with France 3 television.

"It was well known piece of information," Mubarak said, according to a French language interpretation of his remarks broadcast by France 3.

SNIP...

"Bin Laden is threatening the American president, but we know what international terrorism is today and therefore all the bodyguard units concerned are preparing for this," said Murov, whose official title is head of the Federal Bodyguard Service.

SNIP...

Murov said he and some of his men had flown to Genoa for consultations with other countries' bodyguard services ahead of the summit.

GOOGLE Archive:

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:-QXYiv3h7RYJ:www.japantoday.com/gidx/news84890.html+genoa+bin+laden&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

[UpsideDownFlag]

53. HOPONPOP? im all about that. nt

[PROGRESSIVE1]

54. LIHOP

[Walt Starr]

55. LIHTI

Let It Happen Through Incompetence

[GreenPartyVoter]

58. Does that rhyme with mai-tai?

[Buddyblazon]

57. LIHOP...MIHOP?

Sorry...but I don't know what that means. To my best estimate (or guess)...Let It Happen On Purpose...Made It Happen On Purpose?

Am I correct?

[JohnyCanuck]

59. Yes. n/t

[madbelgiancow]

60. "only users registered before the poll was posted can reply"

the DU said.

LOL!

Smart thinking guys. I was gonna go LIHOP.

[Endangered Specie]

61. Neither... EIHOP

Exploited it Heinously on Purpose.

edit: Must we rehash this again, its been debunked, move on.

[Minstrel Boy]

66. "its been debunked, move on."

"It's been debunked"?

Isn't such a pronouncement usually accompanied by a Snopes link?

"Move on"?

80% say, You talkin' to me?

Here, you may find this useful:
The Coincidence Theorists Guide to 9/11.

[Endangered Specie]

67. Would you prefer links to the ASCE?

80% in an unscientific poll... wow, not that it matters if it were scientific or not a majority does not = right.

[Minstrel Boy]

71. Oh, so the American Society of Civil Engineers

explains Sibel Edmonds' gag order; NORAD's live-fly simulation of hijackings on 9/11; the Pentagon's simulation of a plane crashing into a government building on 9/11; FEMA's arrival in lower Manhattan for an anti-terror drill the day before 9/11; the CIA's funnelling al Qaeda operatives through the Jeddah visa bureau for training in the US, the hijackers' training at US airforce bases; the FBI’s Radical Fundamentalist Unit frustrating the requests of field officers to investigate flight schools; the urgent, senior and unheeded warnings from the governments of Germany, France, Great Britain, Russia, Egypt, Israel, Morocco, Afghanistan and others; the protected drug-running through Atta's Florida flight school, and his active participation; the sudden cancellation of commercial flights on the evening of Sept 10 by Pentagon brass; the insider trading -

sorry, my wrist is cramping.

But thank you. I had no idea. I'll now flush my mind of such silliness.

An unscientific poll, certainly. But 80% matters when you tell them to "move on." Which was the point of my remark. Which, alas, you missed.

[BareskinMatt]

64. mihop

just don't ask me to prove it.

[Darranar]

68. Convinced of neither. n/t

[Cuban_Liberal]

69. Neither.

Too bad 'sheer stupidity and appaling neglience' wasn't offered as a choice...

[T Town Jake]

96. Agreed...that would have been my choice, too...

...had the poster thought to offer it, not all of this repeatedly discredited LIHOP/MIHOP horseshit. They didn't, so I had to vote "Neither." Sheer stupidity and appalling negligence on the part of the administration is precisely what it was - which is bad enough in and of itself.

[nemo137]

73. LIHTGI

Let It Happen Through Gross Incompotence.

[Buck Rabbit]

76. Cheney LIHOP, but * not trusted and kept put of loop. n/t

[madbelgiancow]

91. I fully agree

that's my take on the deer in the headlights look when Bush was at Booker Elementary reading My Pet Goat.

He IS the Pet Goat.

[bobbieinok]

77. go back and forth between LIHOP and MIHOP

[Radical Activist]

78. I still like pancakes

Long unexplained acronyms are fun.

[A Simple Game]

79. Both,

to me LIHOP=MIHOP.

If you knowingly allow a crime to be committed, in my mind, it is the same as making it happen.

Ignorance and or ineptitude are not excuses in any court of law that I know of.

[NoSheep]

81. Please tell me what the initials stand for

[bobthedrummer]

82. In regards to the 9/11 attacks: Let it happen on purpose/LIHOP; Made it

happen on purpose/MIHOP.

[NoSheep]

83. Thanks! whew!

[Octafish]

92. Smirko knows no decency or shame. Bush is a CROOK.

He's also criminally insane. By his actions, it's apparent he has limited consciousness and zero conscience . Some diagnose his as a "psychopathic personality." Whatever, George W Bush is a perfect fascist.

How Bush Hit the 'Trifecta' on 9/11--and the Public Lost Big-Time

It is sickening to contemplate an administration intentionally looking the other way while terrorists scheme so that whatever havoc they wreak can provide cover for the president to raid Social Security.

by Brad Carlton

Bush, in the weeks before September 11, pledged to honor the sanctity of the Social Security lockbox except in the event of recession, war, or a national emergency. But after "everything changed" on 9/11, he reportedly gloated to his budget director, Mitch Daniels, "Lucky me--I hit the trifecta!" At the time, this comment (a variation of which is being recycled for laughs at current GOP fundraisers) seemed merely offensive. But in light of revelations that Bush's August 6 briefing memo was titled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike U.S.," Bush's "luck" and weird prescience are worth more than passing scrutiny.

Whenever someone is suspected of a crime, investigators look for a motive in addition to actual proof of guilt to determine, a posteriori, whether there was malice aforethought. In cases of criminal negligence, motive must also be deduced, a priori, to answer the question: were preventive failures due to craftiness or mere cluelessness?

The serial apologists of the Bush Is Not Stupid crowd are rather incongruously opting for the latter, this in the wake of the scandal about pre-9/11 failures to issue precisely the kinds of public warnings and security directives that accompanied the also "non-specific" Y2K threats. For now, it is difficult to say who knew what when because the administration is not exactly being forthcoming, preferring instead to use the scandal as an excuse to broaden the FBI's snoop powers. However: there was a potential motive for the administration to sit on perceived terrorist threats.

Think back to the days before 9/11. The topic on everyone's lips (Condit aside) was: what will happen when budget realities force Bush to raid Social Security? He had explicitly promised during his campaign to establish a contingency fund for severe emergencies that would keep Social Security untouched. But the economy was tanking and the costs of the tax cut made the raid inevitable. Even Daniels acknowledged that the government would be forced to tap Social Security to the tune of $14 billion to fund pending legislation. Strangely, Bush kept insisting, "We can work together to avoid dipping into Social Security." But, beginning August 24, he gave himself an escape clause: "I've said that the only reason we should use Social Security funds is in case of an economic recession or war." (Three days earlier he had said that there should be "special consideration" in the budget for these contingencies. Otherwise, this was completely new rhetoric.)

CONTINUED...

http://www.baltimorechronicle.com/trifecta_jun02.shtml

[number6]

93. MIHOP

former LIHOP gone MIHOP ....

[fujiyama]

95. Somewhere

in between the complete incompetance and LIHOP.

Make no mistake about it. Whether they did it or not, they're still covering up a lot.